Bullock with BVD....

cloudroost

I bought a bullock on march 5th and about 10 daya later noticed that he had a very bad scour (more water than anything...) which I didn't likethe look of... I called the vet out and he thought it might be salmonella and treated him, taking a blood sample to test for BVD just in case... (scour has subsequently cleared up and he seems ok since...)
I just got the call back from him and he says he is possitive for bvd and I need to head him for the factory... (I didn't get any more info as he got cut off)

Do I have any comeback on Mart/Seller?
Is there any compensation for bvd (I know there is 100 for calves, but I don't know of anything else) - I paid a lot for him, but I don't anticipate he will make much in the factory (He's very lean...)
- I only have a few bullocks, so I'm not particularly worried about passing it on - Would it be worth stuffing him for a few months or should I just take the hit now...

Any thoughts?

leg wax

first thing i prezume you have done is that you tested them all if its that serious.

cloudroost

The vet didn't think that testing them all was required (As I said he got cut off, so I'll need to get back to him...). The particular bullock was bought as a single animal, so I don't have any others from that herd.

49801

did the test confirm PI or just TI?

cloudroost

I don't know if he is PI or TI - Vet actually called home number and my wife took the call and pased on the information.
Given that he is talking about sending him to the factory, I'm assuming PI (although my knowledge about bvd is very limited...)
I'll get back on to the vet and get the full details...

49801

cloudroost wrote: »

I don't know if he is PI or TI - Vet actually called home number and my wife took the call and pased on the information.
Given that he is talking about sending him to the factory, I'm assuming PI (although my knowledge about bvd is very limited...)
I'll get back on to the vet and get the full details...

yes confirm with your vet.
if PI i think your stuffed AFAIK as you bought 'as-seen' in the mart.

If the animal came with a negative declaration form from the seller it would be a different story.

snowman707

what age is the animal

had he any pneumonia &/or bronchial symptoms

did you or the vet check his mouth and throat for mucosal lesions

cloudroost

Bullock is just over a year old. He doesn't have any lexions in his miouth (the vet checked). He had a slightly raised temp, but only slightly. He was slightly lame when I got him home from the mart, but I put that down to getting a bruise in the trailer (He isn't lame any more).
I got the full update last night - He is PI and the ver recommends the factory fro him straight away while he is worth something (If the factory will take him). Unfortunately, he is worth very little in my view as he is well grown but quite thin (Ideal for putting on weight over the summer as I thought...)
My dilema at the moment is whether to send him off straight away or try to put some condition on him for a month or two ... Looking at him this morning, he is the picture of health...

keep going

had a bought in pi last year and if he is scouring and not thriving you might be as well off getting rid as he will probilly die anyway.if he is sick at 12 months he wont see 18 months.on the other hand alot of pi s do fine provided they are not scouring and will fatten away grand.if its only bullocks you have it will make little difference to you.unless you can PROVE the owner knew he was a pi you have no case

49801

thats a shame..... only way to keep him and reasoning is a bit thin at best is in isolation... all the while risking infecting more cattle if they break out on you..... personally i'd get rid asap and cut your loss now! the first lost is the best loss and all that.

pakalasa

This case is just another example of how important it is to get rid of this bloody disease, for once and for all.

5live

If the result came back positive then it just states that he has active BVD virus in his system. It will take another test in a month to confirm that there is still active infection in the animal to confirm that he is a PI and not a TI. Isolate him and retest in a month as, from what you said about his condidion, you will not get much for him if you send him now. A month of good care and another test will make a huge difference to your return on him

PatQfarmer

5live wrote: »

If the result came back positive then it just states that he has active BVD virus in his system. It will take another test in a month to confirm that there is still active infection in the animal to confirm that he is a PI and not a TI. Isolate him and retest in a month as, from what you said about his condidion, you will not get much for him if you send him now. A month of good care and another test will make a huge difference to your return on him

I'd agree with that.
I know a lad who kept one he got (free) from a dairy herd, who didn't scour and he spent 2 years fattening it in isolation to send to factory.:D
If it's only beef you have, do the second test, then if he is still +, he is a PI not a TI. I'd get rid then if I had the choice. They are a nightmare the way they infect and depress/hold back other stock.

pakalasa

What is 'Isolation'. All it takes is one spec of sh1te on your boots and you'll spread it to the other cattle. Is it worth the hassle? Chances are, he'll just waste away anyway.

cloudroost

Thanks everybody for their feedback.
I think I know my options at this stage and will have to decide on which option to pick

5live

pakalasa wrote: »

What is 'Isolation'. All it takes is one spec of sh1te on your boots and you'll spread it to the other cattle. Is it worth the hassle? Chances are, he'll just waste away anyway.

Well if he was bought at the mart, the chances are that he picked up the infection there. The majority of PIs seem not to survive for much with a year and look stunted and are poor thrivers and generally wouldnt make it as far as being anyway ready for sale, as far as i can see from people that have had them.

And scouring within a short time of coming onto the farm seems to indicate that he was not long after picking up an infection, either at the mart or on the farm. Though the stress of sale might have brought on a relapse of BVD if he was a PI.

Waiting a month for a retest would be worth the risk compared with sending a TI to slaughter underfinished imo

49801

cloudroost wrote: »

I got the full update last night - He is PI and the ver recommends the factory fro him straight away )

5live wrote: »

If the result came back positive then it just states that he has active BVD virus in his system. It will take another test in a month to confirm that there is still active infection in the animal to confirm that he is a PI and not a TI. Isolate him and retest in a month as, from what you said about his condidion, you will not get much for him if you send him now. A month of good care and another test will make a huge difference to your return on him

The vet has confirmed PI:rolleyes:

snowman707

if you are positive he PI , get rid of him IMMEDIATELY

believe me I have been through the bvd/mucosal disease saga

5live

49801 wrote: »

The vet has confirmed PI:rolleyes:

On one test?:rolleyes:. Iirc it takes 2 tests to confirm PI. The first test confirms an activt BVD infection. The second test, if positive confirms an active BVD infection confirms PI, if negative confirms TI.

If TI, then why send an underfinished animal for slaughter. If all positive BVD tests confirm PI status then why do we have to do a repeat test on all positive BVD results under the BVD eradication scheme?

:rolleyes: back at ya;)

49801

5live wrote: »

On one test?:rolleyes:. Iirc it takes 2 tests to confirm PI. The first test confirms an activt BVD infection. The second test, if positive confirms an active BVD infection confirms PI, if negative confirms TI.

If TI, then why send an underfinished animal for slaughter. If all positive BVD tests confirm PI status then why do we have to do a repeat test on all positive BVD results under the BVD eradication scheme?

:rolleyes: back at ya;)

my understanding is the 2 test regime relates only to the ear tissue samples.
Only 1 blood test needed to confirm PI.... thats my understanding anyways:o.

cloudroost

The vet indicated to my wife that he was PI - Based on what has been said in this thread thus far, I'm not sure how he came to this conclusion on a single test...

snowman707

5live wrote: »

On one test?:rolleyes:. Iirc it takes 2 tests to confirm PI. The first test confirms an activt BVD infection. The second test, if positive confirms an active BVD infection confirms PI, if negative confirms TI.

If TI, then why send an underfinished animal for slaughter. If all positive BVD tests confirm PI status then why do we have to do a repeat test on all positive BVD results under the BVD eradication scheme?

:rolleyes: back at ya;)

we are talking about a yearling bullock here that's why I asked his age which hadn't been mentioned

Lizard_Moon

49801 wrote: »

my understanding is the 2 test regime relates only to the ear tissue samples.
Only 1 blood test needed to confirm PI.... thats my understanding anyways:o.

Two test needed to confirm PI regardless of the test used. You have to show it is a Persistent infection.

Farmer Pudsey

Lizard_Moon wrote: »

Two test needed to confirm PI regardless of the test used. You have to show it is a Persistent infection.

I'd have to agree as well it takes two tests to prove PI as the test they have only proves he has BVD you have to retest after a certain amount of time to prove he is PI. If we are right you would want to change your vet I see the same with calves vets are telling farmers to cull them straight away instead of isolation and retest. While BVD is an awful infection it is only transient in cattle unless they pick it up in the cows womb at a certain satge of the pregnancy or unless the cow is PI because of the aforementioned. I ring the vet and get him to explain how he is PI from one test. If he is PI isolate in a shed/pen and feed well for a week or two to see if he responds to it and if he will continue for 8-10 weeks and then sell

Going back to cows are vets geting farmers to test mothers of infected calves to see if they have BVD and thus are more than likly PI

5live

49801 wrote: »

my understanding is the 2 test regime relates only to the ear tissue samples.
Only 1 blood test needed to confirm PI.... thats my understanding anyways:o.

No afaik. The test will establish the presence of live virus. If the animal is PI then live virus will show up a month later. If the animal is TI then they will fight it off and form antibodies that will eliminate the live virus so when retested they will show no virus.

The same principle is used for both tests, blood and tissue testing