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Household Charge Mega-Thread [Part 2] *Poll Reset*

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    #4982
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    dvpower wrote: »
    Where in the world are there services provided that aren't paid for?

    Clearly only those states where pixies support the welfare system overhead. That's Iceland, isn't it?


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    #4983
    kr7
    Closed Accounts Posts: 747 ✭✭✭kr7


    dvpower wrote: »
    Where in the world are there services provided that aren't paid for?

    Where did I say services shouldn't be paid for?


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    #4984
    kr7
    Closed Accounts Posts: 747 ✭✭✭kr7


    We really should invest more in our educational programmes.

    The last 3 or 4 replies to points I raised show that we're failing miserably.

    dv, alastair and donal, you guys are so angry with people with another viewpoint that the lack of even a basic comprehension of a different way of doing things is frightening.

    I fear for the future of my country.

    There's not much point in even trying to engage.


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    #4985
    demanufactured
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,756 ✭✭✭demanufactured


    alastair wrote: »
    Yes - and I didn't pretend that the Poll Tax revenues were destined for anywhere other than the local authorities. We're not talking about the Poll Tax though - we're talking about the fact that the HHC is 100% for local authority funding - as laid down in law. Whether you choose to believe it, or not.

    Please provide concrete proof that the HHC is to pay for local services.


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    #4986
    kr7
    Closed Accounts Posts: 747 ✭✭✭kr7


    demanufactured wrote: »
    Please provide concrete proof that the HHC is to pay for local services.

    He can't.


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    #4987
    demanufactured
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,756 ✭✭✭demanufactured


    kr7 wrote: »
    He can't.

    Exactly.


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    #4988
    kr7
    Closed Accounts Posts: 747 ✭✭✭kr7


    They're private messaging each other now to work out how to reply to our posts.


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    #4989
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    kr7 wrote: »
    We really should invest more in our educational programmes.

    No argument there - you've demonstrated a serious critical faculty deficit.

    kr7 wrote: »
    The last 3 or 4 replies to points I raised show that we're failing miserably.

    dv, alastair and donal, you guys are so angry with people with another viewpoint that the lack of even a basic comprehension of a different way of doing things is frightening.

    I fear for the future of my country.

    There's not much point in even trying to engage.

    Not when you can just wheel out the same old nonsense (I won't have to pay, It's not going to local authorities et al - you know - drivel?)

    I'm not remotely angry though - clowns are funny.


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    #4990
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    demanufactured wrote: »
    Please provide concrete proof that the HHC is to pay for local services.

    I've posted the link to the legislation more than once - feel free to, you know, read it?


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    #4991
    kr7
    Closed Accounts Posts: 747 ✭✭✭kr7


    alastair wrote: »
    No argument there - you've demonstrated a serious critical faculty deficit.




    Not when you can just wheel out the same old nonsense (I won't have to pay, It's not going to local authorities et al - you know - drivel?)

    I'm not remotely angry though - clowns are funny.

    I see you got banned before for these type of posts.
    Won't be long now.


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    #4992
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    kr7 wrote: »
    I see you got banned before for these type of posts.
    Won't be long now.

    You'd love to be left alone to spout more nonsense about the tax, wouldn't you. :D


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    #4993
    kr7
    Closed Accounts Posts: 747 ✭✭✭kr7


    alastair wrote: »
    You'd love to be left alone to spout more nonsense about the charge, wouldn't you. :D

    FYP


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    #4994
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    kr7 wrote: »
    FYP

    Like I say - I do love a clown.


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    #4995
    kr7
    Closed Accounts Posts: 747 ✭✭✭kr7


    alastair wrote: »
    Like I say - I do love a clown.

    Just stop muddying the waters.
    Your quick enough to post links to the legislation yourself.

    It's a HOUSEHOLD CHARGE not a HOUSEHOLD TAX.

    Next year it will be a PROPERTY TAX.

    Carry on.....


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    #4996
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    alastair wrote: »
    Like I say - I do love a clown.

    Does your mrs know about him?


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    #4997
    demanufactured
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,756 ✭✭✭demanufactured


    alastair wrote: »
    I've posted the link to the legislation more than once - feel free to, you know, read it?

    Just because its in legislation doesnt mean its true you know....
    You shouldnt be ao guillable.


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    #4998
    humanji
    Registered Users Posts: 19,976 ✭✭✭✭humanji


    Enough with the childish bickering and name calling!


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    #4999
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    demanufactured wrote: »
    Just because its in legislation doesnt mean its true you know....
    You shouldnt be ao guillable.

    It's there in black and white in a legal binding document - and consequently any variance from the law is open to appeal by any citizen or opposition TD who wants to make political waves - of course that doesn't mean it's true. :rolleyes:


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    #5000
    dvpower
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,183 ✭✭✭dvpower


    demanufactured wrote: »
    Please provide concrete proof that the HHC is to pay for local services.
    demanufactured wrote: »
    Just because its in legislation doesnt mean its true you know....
    You shouldnt be ao guillable.

    What kind of concrete proof would satisy you if you don't even accept the actual legislation as proof? :confused:


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    #5001
    Hijpo
    Registered Users Posts: 3,824 ✭✭✭Hijpo


    alastair wrote: »
    Well - did you have a problem when the Health levy became the Universal Social Charge, and did you believe either of them wasn't a tax? I really don't care what they call it tbh.

    With new legislation, they could do whatever they liked - but keep in mind it's being ushered in primarily on the back of the commitment made to the troika. And there's no benefit (to sneaky government ministers) to not earmarking it all for local authorities - it's only a minor percentage of LA funding, so the larger lump of central revenue would be much handier to divert to Viagra, or wealthy LA tenants, or whatever the latest red herring might be.

    I still dont know what that USC is for and why it was changed from a health levy. What did the health levy pay for? why change the name? what does the USC pay for that the health levy didnt??
    :confused:

    but if its not ring fenced, the property tax doesnt necessarily have to go to LA's then. Im not saying ministers will benefit from it but were being told that services need to be paid for so they are bringing in new taxes, but if we pay the tax for a service and it goes towards some thing else then whats the point?

    all seems like smoke and mirrors to me

    name changes here, new tax there.......


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    #5002
    demanufactured
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,756 ✭✭✭demanufactured


    dvpower wrote: »
    What kind of concrete proof would satisy you if you don't even accept the actual legislation as proof? :confused:

    Someone to show me the services I will avail of.


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    #5003
    Hijpo
    Registered Users Posts: 3,824 ✭✭✭Hijpo


    demanufactured wrote: »
    Just because its in legislation doesnt mean its true you know....
    You shouldnt be ao guillable.

    oh its in the legislation, the legislation for the HHC.
    Not thelegislation for the property tax. thats why they are getting everyone to sign up and then change the name of it so they can change the legislation.


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    #5004
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    Hijpo wrote: »
    but if its not ring fenced, the property tax doesnt necessarily have to go to LA's then.

    It is and does.
    The banded property tax that's yet to be implemented will be, and will.


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    #5005
    dvpower
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,183 ✭✭✭dvpower


    kr7 wrote: »
    In any 'normal' society, one would fix the problems with a service before expecting to be paid for it.
    dvpower wrote: »
    Where in the world are there services provided that aren't paid for?
    kr7 wrote: »
    Where did I say services shouldn't be paid for?
    :confused:


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    #5006
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    Hijpo wrote: »
    oh its in the legislation, the legislation for the HHC.
    Not thelegislation for the property tax. thats why they are getting everyone to sign up and then change the name of it so they can change the legislation.

    And all the local authorities are in on it. Shh! Keep it to yourself!


  • Options
    #5007
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    demanufactured wrote: »
    Someone to show me the services I will avail of.

    Shift goalposts much?


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    #5008
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,766 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    kr7 wrote: »
    Charge dodger, get it right:rolleyes:

    I'm just like Alaister :D


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    #5009
    dvpower
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,183 ✭✭✭dvpower


    dvpower wrote: »
    What kind of concrete proof would satisy you if you don't even accept the actual legislation as proof? :confused:
    demanufactured wrote: »
    Someone to show me the services I will avail of.
    What kind of response is that?

    What proof would satisy you?


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    #5010
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    kr7 wrote: »
    Just stop muddying the waters.
    Your quick enough to post links to the legislation yourself.

    It's a HOUSEHOLD CHARGE not a HOUSEHOLD TAX.

    Next year it will be a PROPERTY TAX.

    Carry on.....
    The EU/IMF Programme of Financial Support for Ireland commits the Government to the introduction of a property tax for 2012

    This is 2012, we're adhering to the terms of the programme, and we have a property tax in operation.


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    #5011
    kr7
    Closed Accounts Posts: 747 ✭✭✭kr7


    dvpower wrote: »
    What kind of concrete proof would satisy you if you don't even accept the actual legislation as proof? :confused:

    There was a lot of legislation around banking and the banking regulator, equally there was a lot of legislation around the planning laws.

    Just because something is legislated for doesn't mean what's in that legislation is put into effect.


This discussion has been closed.
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