Household Charge Mega-Thread [Part 2] *Poll Reset*

alastair

demanufactured wrote: »

So niether you or dv can tell me what local services i get if i pay the HHC.

You get the same local services as you got beforehand. No treats for you!

Ghandee

dvpower wrote: »

... and then, as if by magic, the deficit will disappear and we'll all live happily ever after.

Or......

We get a Govt who'll actually get a debt write off (that didnt belong to the public) thus resulting in a deficit that would be at the very least servicable?

Notice you didnt challenge the inevitable change of Govt notion btw.
Kudos on that one.

alastair

Ghandee wrote: »

Only someone deluding themselves that FG/Lab will hold on to power at the next G.E is the one living in 'lollipop land' Allistair.

You know it, and so do the rest of the blueshirts....

They've definitely shown time and time again that theyre here for a good time, not a long time.

I'm delighted you think there's any combination of coalition that is going to forego building a sustainable tax base - and won't want to slap late tax penalties on your arse. Like I say - lollipop land.

kr7

dvpower wrote: »

... and then, as if by magic, the deficit will disappear and we'll all live happily ever after.

The deficit will disappear in a few years, sure it's down to 8% now according to tonight's news.

dvpower

Ghandee wrote: »

Or......

We get a Govt who'll actually get a debt write off (that didnt belong to the public) thus resulting in a deficit that would be at the very least servicable?

Notice you didnt challenge the inevitable change of Govt notion btw.
Kudos on that one.

You don't know what the deficit is, do you?

Ghandee

alastair wrote: »

I'm betting Muirhevnamor - sure it's all Northern Bank Note cash economy there.

From the Argus (hi!)

What a statement.

I would expect noting more from an Orange Order supporter in fairness.

(we both know what this is in refrence to Alastair, dont we?)

tayto lover

dvpower wrote: »

Tilting at windmills there.

It becomes embarrassing watching F.G. bend over all the time while the troika ride them.
The party of promises and all that :rolleyes:

kr7

alastair wrote: »

I'm delighted you think there's any combination of coalition that is going to forego building a sustainable tax base - and won't want to slap late tax penalties on your arse. Like I say - lollipop land.

Is that where your pixies live?

demanufactured

alastair wrote: »

You get the same local services as you got beforehand. No treats for you!

So I dont get anything then

I think ill keep my 100 euro...or donate it to a charity.

Ghandee

dvpower wrote: »

You don't know what the deficit is, do you?

No sir, I most definitely do not. :cool:

alastair

kr7 wrote: »

Is that where your pixies live?

I only learned of the pixies when you railed against the injustice of a welfare system supported by private individuals. Until then I thought they were fictional!

tayto lover

Ghandee wrote: »

What a statement.

I would expect noting more from an Orange Order supporter in fairness.

(we both know what this is in refrence to Alastair, dont we?)

I see the good old F.G. council have decided to backtrack with the bicycle lanes in Chapel Street. More F.G. wastage.

Ghandee

demanufactured wrote: »

So I dont get anything then

I think ill keep my 100 euro...or donate it to a charity.

That'll be 800 in total savings.

100 this year, 700 next

alastair

demanufactured wrote: »

So I dont get anything then

I think ill keep my 100 euro...or donate it to a charity.

Put it in a post office account - you'll need to generate some interest for the late penalties.

kr7

Ghandee wrote: »

That'll be 800 in total savings.

100 this year, 700 next

That'll cover a nice week in the sun.
God knows we could all do with one.

Fecking rain!!!

dvpower

tayto lover wrote: »

I see the good old F.G. council have decided to backtrack with the bicycle lanes in Chapel Street. More F.G. wastage.

They've done what now?:mad:

To the barricades..

dvpower

alastair wrote: »

Put it in a post office account - you'll need to generate some interest for the late penalties.

Not a post office account - that's state savings. The post office might hand it over to their blueshirt masters.

Ghandee

dvpower wrote: »

Not a post office account - that's state savings. The post office might hand it over to their blueshirt masters.

Or buy a silk tie for the post master and the mail man.

Izzy Skint

dvpower wrote: »

So you think that intimidating the families of TDs is a valid tactic?

so do you think loud mouth Phil threatening elderly people with court is a valid tactic ?

dvpower

Izzy Skint wrote: »

so do you think loud mouth Phil threatening elderly people with court is a valid tactic ?

Yes.

demanufactured

dvpower wrote: »

Yes.

Nice.

kr7

dvpower wrote: »

Yes.

Sounds about right from you dv.

Says it all about the pro taxers really!

bgrizzley

on the subject of numbers of people paying, i was just looking at an article here about the nppr
http://namawinelake.wordpress.com/2012/04/24/number-of-private-landlords-owning-over-100-homes-apiece-leaps-by-nearly-50-in-two-years/

From the graph at the start of that article i would reckon that you could knock off 157k people from the government figures on payment.
(thats guessing that all the nppr people paid as they might have assumed they were prolly the first database to be chased).

counting the properties as people was a nice little massage.

dvpower

kr7 wrote: »

Sounds about right from you dv.

Says it all about the pro taxers really!

Democracy and the rule of law?

dxhound2005

bgrizzley wrote: »

on the subject of numbers of people paying, i was just looking at an article here about the nppr
http://namawinelake.wordpress.com/2012/04/24/number-of-private-landlords-owning-over-100-homes-apiece-leaps-by-nearly-50-in-two-years/

From the graph at the start of that article i would reckon that you could knock off 157k people from the government figures on payment.
(thats guessing that all the nppr people paid as they might have assumed they were prolly the first database to be chased).

counting the properties as people was a nice little massage.

10000 have registered and presumably paid since the letters were sent out. That amounts to an extra €140,000 paid over by people who could have kept that money for themselves by paying on time. The target set by the government was €161 million equating to 1.61 million properties not 1.61 million people. They already knew that people with two properties or more had paid the NPPR for 339,000 of these in 2011.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0719/1224320381158.html

Hijpo

dvpower wrote: »

kr7 wrote: »

Sounds about right from you dv.

Says it all about the pro taxers really!

Democracy and the rule of law?

the law! the law! the law!

i hope you cross the road in the designated areas at all times dv, its the law.

Izzy Skint

**** ATTENTION ALL PRO HHC / PROP. TAX POSTERS *****

ie. DV, ALASTAIR, DOESNOTCOMPUTE, SOULGUY, VLADAMIR and a few others.
please answer the following questions YES or NO.... just list 1 - 10 and your answer , hope that is not too confusing ......this is my second time posting them !

1. are Irish politicians / public sector workers paid more than in the UK ?
2. are Irish public sector pensions higher than those in the UK ?
3. do Irish workers pay higher rates of tax than those in the UK ?
4. is the general cost of living in Ireland higher than in the UK ?
5. is the VAT rate in Ireland higher than the UK ?
6. are public services in UK better than in Ireland ?
7. are childcare costs in Ireland higher than in the UK ?
8. is VRT applied to cars in the UK ?
9. are welfare payments, rent allowances etc. higher in Ireland than in the UK ?
10. do you think there is more political / public accountability in the UK than Ireland?


I am making these comparisons just to highlight how much we are being totally and utterly screwed in this banana republic, we are getting the sh*t end of the stick in every way in this country, as I have said, if we had all or even just some of what they have in UK in this country, eg. lower cost of living, then maybe many more would pay this tax...but not when we are getting f*cked from every angle ....considering the above list I think the government need their f*cking heads examined if they think they can impose further taxes and charges on people..... do they think we will all just bend over and take it because we have ' a deal with the troika' ?...or because other countries have a property tax so we must ?.....bullsh*t I say.


ALASTAIR, you sort of replied with the following ...
"You do know that you aren't obliged to get involved with VRT at all? You can buy a car from an Irish dealer, or just buy second-hand?

You might also consider that taxes are higher in the UK than here, and that council taxes are generally higher than the mooted property tax bands that we'll be getting soon enough.

Finally - if you don't like the levels of pay, pensions, welfare, etc applicable in this state - then vote for a candidate that intends to change them - that's what representational democracy is about. Avoiding paying your taxes isn't the mechanism for broad brushstroke societal whinging."

my reply....
I wanted you to answer yes or no ! ..... tax is NOT higher in UK than here, the tax bands are wider in the UK.....if we had the same cost of living as in the UK we could all easily pay the property tax, what I could save with a lower cost of living would probably pay any property tax many times over...you have to pay VRT if you buy a new car, a second hand car has the vrt costs already 'built in'.....I will vote for political change but I feel this country needs a lot more fundamental changes than just a change of government...... I haven't avoiding paying my taxes, I just didn't pay my household charge, it's not a tax until next year ....there you go saying 'whinging' again, grow up mate, is that the best you can counteract my queries with ????

Am Chile

dvpower wrote: »

Pretty poor turnout at the big protest today. They managed to get a few thousand out on the streets at the start of the campaign. Now its down to under 400 (I'm sure the usual suspects will dispute the figure - you know the Irish Times will report what their political masters tell them to etc).

Campaign is dying a death.



http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2012/0718/breaking60.html


RBB was on top form 'though.
:pac:

Under 400 ? up a 1000 was there-our media playing down numbers at protests once again- as to why some people weren't there this post from someone last night will easily explain why a lot of people weren't there

'fraid not Am Chile, work is scarce and i have
it tomorrow.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=79783754&postcount=4890

Being a working day midweek wouldn.t have the same turnout as a weekend like the the weekend at the fine gael conference earlier this year-

Campaign is dying a death.

And you said in another post.

The IMF are today calling for a 'suitably high' property tax here.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=79799995&postcount=5081

I don't think its a dying slow death at all- I think the protests over the household tax-the mass protests at the fine gael conference' phil hogan getting mobbed by protesters at venues he went to is only a walk in the park compared to what they will face with their high property tax.

Also its a bit easy for certain town councils to ban posters advertising the protest march-doubt the same council banned yes campaign posters for the recent referendum or youth defence billboards.

Press statement: Campaign Against Household and Water Taxes (Wicklow)

Bray Town Council victimisation of anti household tax activists continues

€750 fine imposed on unemployed activist for defying undemocratic ban on posters for national protest

The decision by Bray Town Council to act on their threat to remove CAHWT posters advertising a national protest against the household tax and austerity taking place this evening at the Dáil is an assault of freedom of political expression.

Despite the fact that local unemployed activist Niamh McDonald sought council permission to put up the posters in good time and like previously received no official acknowledgement was returned on this occasion, once the posters were erected the council got in touch with Ms McDonald and demanded that they be taken down or the council would both remove them and fine her.

The CAHWT in Wicklow, with the endorsement of the National Events Committee made a stand to defend the right of freedom of expression and to not accept Bray Town Council's excessive interpretation of the Litter Act. The Council initially cited the fact that three posters for a different organisation for a prior event which Ms McDonald also happens to be involved with were not taken down in time. Then when challenged the Council changed their reason for the ban saying that public meetings may be advertised but not protests!

No other local authority applies this interpretation of the Litter Act. The Campaign has a legal opinion which refutes this arbitrary and vindictive approach by the Council. Ms McDonald, an unemployed former care worker, has now received a fine of €750 as her name and number were supplied to the Council in the original application to put up the posters.

Niamh McDonald after discussing the fine with campaign colleagues has decided not to pay this fine and she has the 100% backing of the CAHWT in Bray and beyond. If the fine is not paid a District Court Case will ensue at which there will be both a vigorous defence of the right to freedom of expression, arguments presented that Bray Town Council are exceeding their powers and most importantly a demonstration of people power solidarity with Niamh outside the Court.

These repressive measures by the council are further proof that the establishment have decisively lost the political argument over the household tax and feel themselves having to resort to strong arm tactics to quell the opposition.

A shameful attack on free speech and further proof the goverment are losing when they have to resort restricting free speech for views they don't agree with-whenever this girl may be brought to court for defending free speech I hope the wicklow campaign respond by putting pickets outside councilers homes that support this attack on free speech.

http://www.facebook.com/wicklownohouseholdtax

bgrizzley

Quote:
'fraid not Am Chile, work is scarce and i have
it tomorrow.

made a few quid too. the pro guys here will be delighted to know that most of it will be going to pay my council rates (which i have to admit i am 6 months behind on(esb comes first)).

still not paying groundrent on my house though..........

bgrizzley

dxhound2005 wrote: »

10000 have registered and presumably paid since the letters were sent out. That amounts to an extra €140,000 paid over by people who could have kept that money for themselves by paying on time. The target set by the government was €161 million equating to 1.61 million properties not 1.61 million people. They already knew that people with two properties or more had paid the NPPR for 339,000 of these in 2011.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0719/1224320381158.html

just trying to get a better idea of how many people have paid or not as opposed to how many properties which is more like 800k paid-700k not paid.
most ordinary people only have one house.

any better guesstimate?