Household Charge Mega-Thread [Part 2] *Poll Reset*

kr7

dvpower wrote: »

Can you point to the cuts in the MOU that the government have failed to implement?

I can yea, but I'll let you do your own homework. You seem to know the MOU inside out, god knows you quote the bits of it you like on here often enough.

kr7

alastair wrote: »

You don't have the same position.

You claim (;)) it's not a tax, and that you won't have to pay it. You've also got no case against it in terms of social justice.

Ah, I see.

Bruthal

alastair wrote: »

Because I was opposed to the poll tax. It was a protest. It's not too tricky to follow, is it?

Its a bit tricky to follow when you claim you did not pretend you would not have had to pay it in the end. Would not the idea of this protest you took part in against a tax you did not agree with, be to end up never having to pay it?

So saying you did not pretend you would not have to pay it, deserves a special rolleyes all of its own.

dvpower

Izzy Skint wrote: »

I don't believe they have mandated this, I think the govt. negotiated this out of them and then presented to the public the pretence that "we have no choice"......

Oh dear God.

alastair

kr7 wrote: »

You as well. Well done you. Monkey see, monkey do.

Care to point out any contradictions in my posts? And remind me which you're claiming today - you're fully tax complient, or you won't pay this tax?

kr7

alastair wrote: »

Care to point out any contradictions in my posts? And remind me which you're claiming today - you're fully tax complient, or you won't pay this charge?

Both.

dvpower

kr7 wrote: »

I can yea, but I'll let you do your own homework. You seem to know the MOU inside out, god knows you quote the bits of it you like on here often enough.

You can't because they don't exist.
Just last week the trioka confirmed that we were complying with the agreement.

Izzy Skint

alastair wrote: »

Reality calling!, reality calling!

what negotiations went on between the govt. and IMF to arrive at this deal ?...it is my belief that we were sold out again.

alastair

robbie7730 wrote: »

Its a bit tricky to follow when you claim you did not pretend you would not have had to pay it in the end. Would not the idea of this protest you took part in against a tax you did not agree with, be to end up never having to pay it?

So saying you did not pretend you would not have to pay it, deserves a special rolleyes all of its own.

Really? You can't follow this?

I was opposed to the poll tax.
I didn't pay it to register my opposition to it.
I didn't expect that this would lead to my not having to pay in the final analysis. I fully expected to have to pay the piper.

Let me know if you're not grasping any of that.

kr7

dvpower wrote: »

You can't because they don't exist.
Just last week the trioka confirmed that we were complying with the agreement.

Aren't we great.

10 out of 10, as the economy collapses even further and unemployment shoots through the roof.

It's working really well.

alastair

Izzy Skint wrote: »

it is my belief that we were sold out again.

More faith-based opinions.

alastair

kr7 wrote: »

Both.

Says it all really. Keep digging.

kr7

alastair wrote: »

Says it all really. Keep digging.

Thought you lads weren't permitted to break the sabbath , you should turn that computer off....:D


Anyway, time for lunch.

Ghandee

alastair wrote: »

BluntGuy wrote: »

No it isn't. There is a gap between what is spent on local services and the tax we pay to fund said social services, which is funded by borrowing. We're not even paying for them once, never-mind twice!

You'd think this would sink in at some point, wouldn't you?

Ah, but I thought that was the whole point of ME paying such high road tax, paying the tolls, paying oxygen to empty my bins, having to give doctor Kavanagh fifty euro for an appointment, and the chemist (a lucky dip) fee.

So, as Alastair said, 'I'm already paying for the services'

Then, I'm bridging the gap (shortfall) by paying for services on top,

So, now I'll pay a THIRD time?

(this is why its difficult to 'sink in')

When in a hole guys......

alastair

kr7 wrote: »

I can yea, but I'll let you do your own homework. You seem to know the MOU inside out, god knows you quote the bits of it you like on here often enough.

Heh. How embarressing.

Izzy Skint

dvpower wrote: »

Oh dear God.

DV, classic remark....great debating skills being displayed here today...off out now to spend time with the family....may even spend some of my €100 hhc on ice cream for the kids...at least that would be money well spent :D:D

later all.........

kr7

alastair wrote: »

Heh. How embarressing.

alastair

Ghandee wrote: »

Ah, but I thought that was the whole point of ME paying such high road tax, posting the tolls, paying oxygen to empty my bins, having to give doctor Kavanagh fifty euro for an appointment, and the chemist (a lucky dip) fee.

So, as Alastair said, 'I'm already posting for the services'

Then, I'm bridging the gap (shortfall) by paying for services on top,

So, now I'll pay a THIRD time?

When in a hole guys......

You're not paying enough - that's where the deficit arises.. I'm still waiting for you to reposnd to my questions btw.

Ghandee

alastair wrote: »

You're not paying enough - that's where the deficit arises..

I'm paying more than enough, the deficit may be due to another reason altogether (were money needs to be stopped being wasted)

alastair wrote: »

I'm still waiting for you to reposnd to my questions btw.

You answered it for me.

Izzy Skint

alastair wrote: »

More faith-based opinions.

and your point is ???....nit picking the words people use ?....that's the best you lot can come up with? ...ha ha !....going out now...bye

dvpower

kr7 wrote: »

Aren't we great.

10 out of 10, as the economy collapses even further and unemployment shoots through the roof.

It's working really well.

So you were spoofing when you said the government has failed to implement MOU cuts.

Bruthal

alastair wrote: »

Really? You can't follow this?

I was opposed to the poll tax.

So you wanted it abolished

I didn't pay it to register my opposition to it.

So you wanted it abolished

I didn't expect that this would lead to my not having to pay in the final analysis. I fully expected to have to pay the piper.

So then, its ok for people not to pay this hhc, as a protest, once they believe they will end up paying in the end, but not if they believe they wont end up paying? In your final analysis.

Let me know if you're not grasping any of that

That`s some ego you have.

dvpower

Izzy Skint wrote: »

and your point is ???....nit picking the words people use ?......

Nit picking?
You think that it was the Government that forced the property tax on the trioka and not the other way around. And you believe this proposterious idea based on no evidence at all.

That is a faith based opinion.

alastair

Izzy Skint wrote: »

here Alastair....just for you...
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/finance/2011/0722/1224301110527.html

No - Dan O'Brien does not say that cuts alone are more effective than cuts and taxation increases. But here he is on that subject elsewhere:

Those who declare with infinite certainty that spending cuts and tax increases cannot work, or that there is no example of an economy cutting its way out of recession should take a closer look at the Baltics.

Bruthal

dvpower wrote: »

Nit picking?
You think that it was the Government that forced the property tax on the trioka and not the other way around.

Nothing is forced on the troika, its forced on the taxpayers of this country.

alastair

robbie7730 wrote: »

That`s some ego you have.

Not really - it was a simple enough statement. Not sure why you couldn't follow it.

alastair

Ghandee wrote: »

I'm paying more than enough, the deficit may be due to another reason altogether (were money needs to be stopped being wasted)

If there's a deficit - you're not paying enough. Our taxes are still lower than most european states - including the UK - low taxes/high deficit - no linkage there then?

I'm still waiting for you to respond to my questions btw.

BluntGuy

Ghandee wrote: »

A
So, as Alastair said, 'I'm already paying for the services'

As long as there is a gap between the spending on services and taxation allocated to fund said services, you are not paying for the services. This is not a difficult concept to grasp. It might be uncomfortable, but it is not difficult.

kr7 wrote: »

Both.

I'd be interested in your answer to this, which Ghandee avoided:

An honest question; what is the difference between you evading tax, and those who shuffle money offshore to evade paying tax? Do you think either is morally acceptable?

And yes not paying a tax that you are legally obliged to pay is tax evasion, and no I'm not interested in re-negotiating the meaning of the term. I'm just interested to know your answer to that.

Oh, also this question which you avoided:

What is your solution for addressing the shortfall between spending and taxation?

dvpower

robbie7730 wrote: »

Nothing is forced on the troika, its forced on the taxpayers of this country.

Dizzy believes that the government forced the trioka to put the property tax in the MOU.
I know, it's crazy, isn't it?

bgrizzley

...........