Household Charge Mega-Thread [Part 2] *Poll Reset*

darkhorse

dvpower wrote: »

The IMF also make it clear (as recently as yesterday) that any alternative proposal would need some of the attributes of a property tax e.g. broadens the tax base, predictable income stream etc.

I was just trying to remember where I heard these words before. Then it came back to me. It was to do with the property boom. Predictable alright.
So, I wonder how long the forthcoming predictable income stream will last, given that a big percentage of a lot of peoples income has already been sucked from us, with a lot more to come, apparently.


Simply raising the same amount of money elsewhere would not be enough, despite what some of the less informed often say around here.

If, in your vocabulary, the less informed means people struggling to feed their family after bills are paid, I have to admit that I am one of the less informed.

ncdadam

darkhorse wrote: »

If, in your vocabulary, the less informed means people struggling to feed their family after bills are paid, I have to admit that I am one of the less informed.

I think he means less privileged.

darkhorse

dvpower wrote: »

Or they could look at both inflated salaries and tax evaders.

What tax would that be.

ncdadam

darkhorse wrote: »

What tax would that be.

Who's evading tax now?

Ghandee

dxhound2005 wrote: »

That letter is from someone who calls themselves Cottage Economist and lists their interests as: :Sustainability,self sufficiency, economy.

I don't give much for their chances of sustainability or self sufficiency or holding on to any form of private property if they genuinely couldn't come up with €100 between January and April or €111 between January and July.

This post its from someone calling themselves dxhound2005 (original post deleted though:rolleyes:)

Originally Posted by dxhound2005

And in other news Paddy Powers profits up 20% after increasing 50% last year. This should enable their top brass to continue paying themselves many multiples of what the Taoiseach gets. But they surely deserve it for parting people some of whom can't or won't pay €100 HHC from their cash in the pursuit of mostly futile aims. Paddy Power to run the country. .

You're economic ideas are less than perfect too you see.

Am Chile

The highest earning County Councillor in Kildare last week defended his salary after an article in the Irish Independent revealed that County Kildare's part time politicians collectively earned €805,975 in a single year"

His response? "We are worth it"...

Sorry for the poor quality. I hope it's clear enough for everyone to read, your household tax at work cuz they think they re worth it.

Hijpo

Am Chile wrote: »

The highest earning County Councillor in Kildare last week defended his salary after an article in the Irish Independent revealed that County Kildare's part time politicians collectively earned €805,975 in a single year"

His response? "We are worth it"...

Sorry for the poor quality. I hope it's clear enough for everyone to read, your household tax at work cuz they think they re worth it.

So, the fact that working home owners get f*ck all back (compared to LA tennants and long term social welfare recipients) from paying there taxes and HHC and maintaning there own house, is one to assume we are worth f*ck all?

darkhorse

Ghandee wrote: »

They're at it again.

The IMF once again are looking towards those at the bottom, while those at the top are left to fatten up. (county managers on more than some prime ministers ffs)

If you're a minimum wage worker, your earnings are in the line of fire next.



http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/imf-targets-minimum-wage-for-employment-driven-recovery-207136.html

I can see blood about to erupt on our streets.

I hope I'm wrong though.

Where you looking at the evening news, G. The Taoiseach gave a lovely speech, to the effect that nothing is going to deflect the govt. from their budgetary target. This guy reminds of Lord Farquaad, ya know the fella from the Shrek film. Every time I hear him make any sort of a comment, I can just imagine the words "Some of you may die, but that is a risk that I am willing to take", come out of his mouth.
As for his sidekick, his speil on the news was, "We have tough decisions to make". Well excuse meeeeee, but the reality is that it is the low and middle class is the ones that have tough decisions to to make, whether to pay for heating or some other mundane bill, or whether to feed ones family substancially. Now, before somebody that is more informed than me comes back with any rhetoric, think of this, the president of a certain university told the indo. yesterday that he is struggling on €232,000.00. How about earning 15 times less that. If it was'nt so serious, it id be funny, wha ya think, G.:)

Am Chile

Ghandee wrote: »

They're at it again.

The IMF once again are looking towards those at the bottom, while those at the top are left to fatten up. (county managers on more than some prime ministers ffs)

If you're a minimum wage worker, your earnings are in the line of fire next.



http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/imf-targets-minimum-wage-for-employment-driven-recovery-207136.html

I can see blood about to erupt on our streets.

I hope I'm wrong though.

Well over a year ago one evening out in the pub with a few mates, footage of riots in Greece was shown on the news on the big screen in the pub-one mate whos in the Irish army was telling me they re expecting riots at some stage here, he went on to say around summer 2010 they were doing riot training exercises, he was the inside of a big army warehouse that was full of newly purchased riot gear/equipment-bottom line he was saying they are expecting riots sooner or later and they have being trained to deal with riots breaking out.

Le_Dieux

jetfiremuck wrote: »

Ffs the gov are part of the Troika and are in meetings with them.. Its a dog and pony show thats all it is... The gov as a whole will never do without simple as that.

Let's put it another way: The Troika IS the government!:rolleyes:

Ghandee

darkhorse wrote: »

Where you looking at the evening news, G. The Taoiseach gave a lovely speech, to the effect that nothing is going to deflect the govt. from their budgetary target. This guy reminds of Lord Farquaad, ya know the fella from the Shrek film. Every time I hear him make any sort of a comment, I can just imagine the words "Some of you may die, but that is a risk that I am willing to take", come out of his mouth.
As for his sidekick, his speil on the news was, "We have tough decisions to make". Well excuse meeeeee, but the reality is that it is the low and middle class is the ones that have tough decisions to to make, whether to pay for heating or some other mundane bill, or whether to feed ones family substancially. Now, before somebody that is more informed than me comes back with any rhetoric, think of this, the president of a certain university told the indo. yesterday that he is struggling on €232,000.00. How about earning 15 times less that. If it was'nt so serious, it id be funny, wha ya think, G.:)

No, never seen the news yes evening unfortunately.

The world and his dog can see that austerity isn't working though, yet these clowns continue to tread down that path.

They want to snatch from the mouths of low and middle earners whilst they sit pretty at the top, govt refuses to introduce a third rate of tax to target high earners etc, govt ministers and county council managers, university chiefs, judges etc etc etc all fall into the suggested third tax bracket they refuse to endorse....... I wonder why?

As amchile has said, I think the country should brace itself for serious trouble on the streets, unfortunately for the IMF/Troika, and the sock puppets we have in govt, its the very people they continue to target repeatedly (low and middle earners) who make up the majority of the population. If their is an uprising, it will be a serious one.

The govt cannot continue to take the piss, continually cutting and slashing from the middle and the vulnerable of the country while they continue to waste millions, and rub it into the publics face.

Personally, I think its time the Irish took back Ireland, send the right message back to Europe that we're no-ones fools, and will be shafted no longer.

Interesting that not a single poster in support of the hhc or a property Tax leapt to the defence of the IMF's interest in cutting the minimum wage.

Why would that be do you think?

John_Rambo

Ghandee wrote: »

Interesting that not a single poster in support of the hhc or a property Tax leapt to the defence of the IMF's interest in cutting the minimum wage.

Why would that be do you think?

Because it's too high?

Ghandee

John_Rambo wrote: »

Because it's too high?

So let's slash it, bring it down so its almost on par with sw payments.

Great idea there Einstein.

That'll give the unemployed a real incentive to go do manual labour for 40+ hours a week, while they get a cheque at the end of it, which amounts to the same someone gets whose not worked that week?

Like I say, priorities all wrong.

dvpower

Ghandee wrote: »

So let's slash it, bring it down so its almost on par with sw payments.

Great idea there Einstein.

That'll give the unemployed a real incentive to go do manual labour for 40+ hours a week, while they get a cheque at the end of it, which amounts to the same someone gets whose not worked that week?

Like I say, priorities all wrong.

The IMF also want us to cut welfare, you'll be happy to know.

donalg1

ncdadam wrote: »

Or they could look at the wastage of funds on vanity projects and salary's as large as some country's prime ministers they pay their county managers.
But sure the ill's of the country are all down to people who won't pay their HHC.
LMAO!

Glad you find it funny I am sure those left without services wont be laughing when they need their house adjusted due to a disability. I think the cut in services is down to the lack of collection of the HHC so it will be those that havent paid that are to blame.

donalg1

Le_Dieux wrote: »

I wish to say something here. I am one of those who haven't paid, nor will I....eventually they will have to lock me up which will cost MONEY.

As for cuts in service - have really no idea where You are coming from here. I am in the Kildare CC jurisdiction, and I get practically NO service from KCC in our estate - bar the street lighting. We pay for our refuse collection, we pay to cut our grass.

Cuts in service mean that there will be less money for such things as housing grants for the elderly and grants for the disabled. I think they would take priority over your grass cutting all day every day. Do you actually think the County Council should pay to dispose of your waste, or they should come in and cut your grass? Seriously what planet are you living on?

Hijpo

donalg1 wrote: »

Glad you find it funny I am sure those left without services wont be laughing when they need their house adjusted due to a disability. I think the cut in services is down to the lack of collection of the HHC so it will be those that havent paid that are to blame.

If they collected ALL the HHC charges, would it have stopped services from being cut?

donalg1 wrote: »

Cuts in service mean that there will be less money for such things as housing grants for the elderly and grants for the disabled. I think they would take priority over your grass cutting all day every day. Do you actually think the County Council should pay to dispose of your waste, or they should come in and cut your grass? Seriously what planet are you living on?

I like that word priority

I also like the word essential

The problem here is the difference in value in which these two terms are held by each tier of society. Government officials think its important that they hold there think tank in a 5 star hotel, average home owners think its important to provide for there family in there own home, maintaned by themselves at there own cost, serial social welfare spoungers think its important not to get a job because why work for 39 hours and loose all benefits when its only worth an extra 100 quid.

Just to get back to the HHC shortfall being related to the cuts in services. Do you think the government, who has very little value for the citizens opinion, would stop councils or there own wastes to provide funds for these houses that need adjusting due to a disability?

mikom

donalg1 wrote: »

Cuts in service mean that there will be less money for such things as housing grants for the elderly and grants for the disabled. Seriously what planet are you living on?

This one........

THE country's highest-paid Lord Mayor has volunteered to take a €9,000 pay cut -- but he will still earn more than the prime ministers of Israel, Sweden, Spain and even Russia.


The Lord Mayor of Cork, John Buttimer, has proposed taking the pay cut in light of the financial crisis now facing the city council.


The 10pc cut proposed will only impact on his €92,672 mayoral salary -- representing a reduction of €9,267.


However, in total he enjoys a salary and expenses package estimated to be worth almost €200,000.


As well as his mayoral salary, Mr Buttimer also gets the ordinary councillor payment of €16,724.


He also gets the use of a brand new Ford car, a driver, as well as travel expenses and entertainment budgets reported to be worth €80,000 in total.

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/mayor-takes-9000-pay-cut-but-still-earns-more-than-spanish-pm-3227277.html

donalg1

Hijpo wrote: »

If they collected ALL the HHC charges, would it have stopped services from being cut?

Who knows, although I am sure they wouldnt be able to cut them so easily, they now can blame the cut in services on the HHC. Plus if the HHC had been collected in full there would have been more money in the pot which would have lessened the cuts im sure.

I like that word priority

I also like the word essential

The problem here is the difference in value in which these two terms are held by each tier of society. Government officials think its important that they hold there think tank in a 5 star hotel, average home owners think its important to provide for there family in there own home, maintaned by themselves at there own cost, serial social welfare spoungers think its important not to get a job because why work for 39 hours and loose all benefits when its only worth an extra 100 quid.

Just to get back to the HHC shortfall being related to the cuts in services. Do you think the government, who has very little value for the citizens opinion, would stop councils or there own wastes to provide funds for these houses that need adjusting due to a disability?

I do believe the government are cutting these services due to a lack of collection of the HHC as some County Councils have said as much already.

donalg1

mikom wrote: »

This one........

Can you when quoting me ensure to quote me in full so as not to take what I said out of context please.

When I asked what planet he was living on, I was referring to the fact he expect his waste to be collected and disposed of for free by the Council as well as his grass being cut. But you know this as it is quite clear in the post you semi quoted and moved around.

mikom

donalg1 wrote: »

Can you when quoting me ensure to quote me in full so as not to take what I said out of context please.

Calm down dear

donalg1 wrote: »

I do believe the government are cutting these services due to a lack of collection of the HHC as some County Councils have said as much already.

And if they pissed on your back and told you it was raining you'd probably believe them as well.

Ghost Buster

donalg1 wrote: »

Who knows, although I am sure they wouldnt be able to cut them so easily, they now can blame the cut in services on the HHC. Plus if the HHC had been collected in full there would have been more money in the pot which would have lessened the cuts im sure.




I do believe the government are cutting these services due to a lack of collection of the HHC as some County Councils have said as much already.

Like wise if our leaders were not giving them selves and their fellow politicians and councillors many many multiples of the average wage there would be more money in the pot.
Which option do you advocate more and which should happen first:
(1) Take the money off the less well off and those who cannot afford it.
(2) Take the money off those who are awarding themselves wages higher than the leaders of many countries AND unvouched expenses and perks which come out of our taxes in the first place.

donalg1

mikom wrote: »

Calm down dear

Yeah well done, so I assume then you wont be misquoting me in future.

And I also assume you have nothing to say about the post you misquoted. But of course if you actually had something to contribute or something constructive to say you wouldnt have misquoted me in the first place.

And if they pissed on your back and told you it was raining you'd probably believe them as well.

I think it is quite clear that non payment of the HHC is going to have an affect on the amount of funding given to LA's this year. So again if you have an issue with cuts in services you should stay quiet about these until you pay your HHC.

mikom

donalg1 wrote: »

So again if you have an issue with cuts in services you should stay quiet about these until you pay your HHC.

Not happening.

donalg1

mikom wrote: »

Not happening.

Well accept the fact then that your non payment of the HHC is going to directly affect those in need of services.

Ghost Buster

donalg1 wrote: »

I think it is quite clear that non payment of the HHC is going to have an affect on the amount of funding given to LA's this year. So again if you have an issue with cuts in services you should stay quiet about these until you pay your HHC.

Tell me. If you had a child to whom you were giving money for clothes and school books and you found out that they were spending the money on sweeties and trips to the zoo with their mates would you give them more money just because they demanded it?

mikom

donalg1 wrote: »

Well accept the fact then that your non payment of the HHC is going to directly affect those in need of services.

Another line of shite you gobbled up.

Leslie91

Whatever about the way this Govt is going about correcting the deficit............... what's the latest on the non-payers? anybody been in court yet? anybody jailed?, what's happening?

Ghost Buster

donalg1 wrote: »

Well accept the fact then that your non payment of the HHC is going to directly affect those in need of services.

How about you accept the fact that the money is being mis spent by and on those who are responsible for its use.
Any chance?

donalg1

mikom wrote: »

Another line of shite you gobbled up.

Ha ok then mikom, you continue to believe what you want and I will believe what is actually happening.