Household Charge Mega-Thread [Part 2] *Poll Reset*

Hijpo

donalg1 wrote: »

Could very well be the case Europe wanted a property tax so now we are getting one. And if they want to set the rate they probably will hopefully the govt will have some say in the limit but I won't be surprised if they don't.

Although if Europe say 0.5% and the govt introduce it at 0.25% they will no doubt lawd it about as a victory.

unless enda said "yeah, you see, we dont actually have a database of properties and there owners, so heres what well do, charge them to give us there details, then tell them the property tax is about 300 a year. Then when we actually implement it hit them for the 0.5%"

Ghandee

donalg1 wrote: »

Apparently ncdadam was Gerry777 he reregged as ncdadam and this was after he had reregged as kr7 but was caught and banned for this so regged as ncdadam.

So it went Gerry, to kr to ncd.

Was wondering why he wanted to attack every one of my posts so badly now I know.

Are you serious?

How'd you hear/find out that?

tayto lover

donalg1 wrote: »

Apparently ncdadam was Gerry777 he reregged as ncdadam and this was after he had reregged as kr7 but was caught and banned for this so regged as ncdadam.

So it went Gerry, to kr to ncd.

Was wondering why he wanted to attack every one of my posts so badly now I know.

How can you say that donalg1?

Chucky the tree

It's all here. Surprised they let him back.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056776525

Ghandee

Whoa.

He had me fooled.

Le_Dieux

Ghandee wrote: »

Are you serious?

How'd you hear/find out that?

Yes, I also would like to know how You come to that conclusion?

tayto lover

Ghandee wrote: »

Whoa.

He had me fooled.

Me too but how did donalg1 know all about it?

Le_Dieux

Ghandee wrote: »

Whoa.

He had me fooled.

And me! He even used another christian name when we pm'd each other...feel like a goon now:-(

I'm not too long on Boards, and am probably green behind the ears when compared to the number of posts some of You have submitted. Can anyone tell me why ncd actually got banned? On this thread I mean - I don't want to stand on the wrong toes and get myself banned:pac:

Also, I was running our RA website and had access to the ISPN number of anyone we wanted to register twice ( sh1tstirrers etc). I would assume the Mods on Boards also have access to this ISPN number also, for duplicity of accounts?

donalg1

Ghandee wrote: »

donalg1 wrote: »

Apparently ncdadam was Gerry777 he reregged as ncdadam and this was after he had reregged as kr7 but was caught and banned for this so regged as ncdadam.

So it went Gerry, to kr to ncd.

Was wondering why he wanted to attack every one of my posts so badly now I know.

Are you serious?

How'd you hear/find out that?

My stupid fingers hit the wrong thread on.my phone and I ended up in a prison forum (didn't even know there was any) and it was Gerry asking for his ban to be lifted and saying he had been banned for reregging as kr7 and the mod asked had he any others and he said ncd was another one.

Link

I'm still on my phone so don't know if the link will work will try fix it on the laptop later but you might be able to copy and paste it to your address bar.

//* edit *//

Just saw chucky posted the actual working link

donalg1

Le_Dieux wrote: »

Ghandee wrote: »

Whoa.

He had me fooled.

And me! He even used another christian name when we pm'd each other...feel like a goon now:-(

I'm not too long on Boards, and am probably green behind the ears when compared to the number of posts some of You have submitted. Can anyone tell me why ncd actually got banned? On this thread I mean - I don't want to stand on the wrong toes and get myself banned:pac:

Also, I was running our RA website and had access to the ISPN number of anyone we wanted to register twice ( sh1tstirrers etc). I would assume the Mods on Boards also have access to this ISPN number also, for duplicity of accounts?

I assume he was found to have reregged again which is a big no no.

Am Chile

Is there anyone on here living in Donegal ? there,s 30.000 warning letters being sent out in Donegal.

Donegal
County Council is to issue letters to more than 30,000 households throughout the
county advising them of their liability to pay the Household Charge this week.


The
letter reminds householders that this is a self declaration charge which was
introduced under the Local Government (Household Charge) Act 2011 and that late
payments continue to incur penalties and interest fees on an ongoing monthly
basis.

http://www.donegaldaily.com/2012/10/11/council-to-blitz-donegal-households-with-30000-demand-letters/

Le_Dieux

Am Chile wrote: »

Is there anyone on here living in Donegal ? there,s 30.000 warning letters being sent out in Donegal.


http://www.donegaldaily.com/2012/10/11/council-to-blitz-donegal-households-with-30000-demand-letters/[/QUOTE]

Some very interesting comments by the Donegal Folk on that site.

Ghandee

Am Chile wrote: »

Is there anyone on here living in Donegal ? there,s 30.000 warning letters being sent out in Donegal.


http://www.donegaldaily.com/2012/10/11/council-to-blitz-donegal-households-with-30000-demand-letters/

http://www.donegaldaily.com/2012/10/12/throw-the-30000-demand-letters-in-the-bin-advises-councillor/

Le_Dieux

I know this is not directly related to the HHC but...........

We built a super highway named the M9 - toll free also:pac: - and it opened, what, 2 years ago? Today I hear the the traffic reports on RTE 1 that the highway is closed from Paulstown to Kilkenny South for ROADWORKS!!! A stretch of road only 2 years old????

WTF is going on? Surely someone's head should roll over this.

Is it any wonder this country is fcuked???

donalg1

Le_Dieux wrote: »

I know this is not directly related to the HHC but...........

We built a super highway named the M9 - toll free also:pac: - and it opened, what, 2 years ago? Today I hear the the traffic reports on RTE 1 that the highway is closed from Paulstown to Kilkenny South for ROADWORKS!!! A stretch of road only 2 years old????

WTF is going on? Surely someone's head should roll over this.

Is it any wonder this country is fcuked???

Well which company built the road or are they even in business any more the way things are these days id say they are gone bust.

Le_Dieux

donalg1 wrote: »

Well which company built the road or are they even in business any more the way things are these days id say they are gone bust.

I don't see the relevance of your comment donalg. The road works are only on one side of the highway - surely the same company built both sides?, & is there until November 2.

I was in Dun Laoghaire today, and spent the guts of 90 minutes from Monkstown, to a customer in George's St. DL ( I was with the customer for only 5 minutes) and to get back to Monkstown, all because of roadworks.

The infrastructure is falling apart all over the joint. I suppose this is all because of 'lack of funds' due to the HHC non-payments?

donalg1

Le_Dieux wrote: »

donalg1 wrote: »

Well which company built the road or are they even in business any more the way things are these days id say they are gone bust.

I don't see the relevance of your comment donalg. The road works are only on one side of the highway - surely the same company built both sides?, & is there until November 2.

I was in Dun Laoghaire today, and spent the guts of 90 minutes from Monkstown, to a customer in George's St. DL ( I was with the customer for only 5 minutes) and to get back to Monkstown, all because of roadworks.

The infrastructure is falling apart all over the joint. I suppose this is all because of 'lack of funds' due to the HHC non-payments?

Id imagine the road was poorly built if it needs repairs after two years I assumed that was the point of your post you said heads should roll I only ask who built the road so who should be held to account for its poor construction.

Complaining about poor infrastructure and then complaining about roadworks in the same post is a tad silly. Roadworks are generally happening to fix the poor infrastructure.

Le_Dieux

donalg1 wrote: »

Id imagine the road was poorly built if it needs repairs after two years I assumed that was the point of your post you said heads should roll I only ask who built the road so who should be held to account for its poor construction.

Complaining about poor infrastructure and then complaining about roadworks in the same post is a tad silly. Roadworks are generally happening to fix the poor infrastructure.

That's my point, we spend millions, perhaps billions, building these great roads, and within TWO years close them for repairs. I'm not blaming the govt. on this, but surely they should be seeking answers as to why - accountability.

Nah, instead rather go and spend thousands sending letters out trying to get a hundred quid off the people in the name of a HHC.

I also heard this week that each TD get 12 grand a year just to attend DE....I work approx. 10 hours a day and paid myself 12 grand for the whole of last year ( all I could afford )

Until this bunch ( I include the LOT, not just whose in power now) get their priorities right, this country will NEVER pull together - I know I won't until I see leadership/setting example FROM THE TOP!!!

Le_Dieux

donalg1 wrote: »

Id imagine the road was poorly built if it needs repairs after two years I assumed that was the point of your post you said heads should roll I only ask who built the road so who should be held to account for its poor construction.

Complaining about poor infrastructure and then complaining about roadworks in the same post is a tad silly. Roadworks are generally happening to fix the poor infrastructure.

Sorry Donal1, but in this case it seems the roadworks are happening because of roadworks - lack of accountability.

Fcuking disgraceful imho!

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056758838

Le_Dieux

I wrote ' I also heard this week that each TD get 12 grand a year just to attend DE '

Just wondering, does Wallace also get the 12g's?

Le_Dieux

Interview with Gilmore on RTE today: http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/1014/exchequer-deficit-deadline.html

So, we are saying Slan to the Troika in 14 months, why still go along with the Property Tax ( assuming it is ion place ) and water charge? After all, it IS them who are insisting we pay all these extra charges - at least thats what this damn govt would have us believe.

Am Chile

Page two of todays sunday times, a story that the new property tax levy is to be deducted at source from social welfare benifits.

darkhorse

Le_Dieux wrote: »

Interview with Gilmore on RTE today: http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/1014/exchequer-deficit-deadline.html

So, we are saying Slan to the Troika in 14 months, why still go along with the Property Tax ( assuming it is ion place ) and water charge? After all, it IS them who are insisting we pay all these extra charges - at least thats what this damn govt would have us believe.

Obviously, he knows something that we dont, if he says the troika will be gone in 14 months. As regards the property tax and water charge, it will look good on the governments cv that they can say, the troika told us to do it, as part of the bailout program.

Cantona's Collars

darkhorse wrote: »

Obviously, he knows something that we dont, if he says the troika will be gone in 14 months. As regards the property tax and water charge, it will look good on the governments cv that they can say, the troika told us to do it, as part of the bailout program.

We all know the govt. will use any excuse to gouge money from us.First they blamed FF,now it's the Troika next they'll find another excuse.

tayto lover

zerks wrote: »

We all know the govt. will use any excuse to gouge money from us.First they blamed FF,now it's the Troika next they'll find another excuse.

Didn't Kenny already tell the Europeans that "the Irish people went mad". That was about a week after he came on t.v. and told us "it wasn't your fault".

Ghandee

tayto lover wrote: »

Didn't Kenny already tell the Europeans that "the Irish people went mad". That was about a week after he came on t.v. and told us "it wasn't your fault".

Well he's consistent. I'll give him that. :rolleyes:

donalg1

Le_Dieux wrote: »

I wrote ' I also heard this week that each TD get 12 grand a year just to attend DE '

Just wondering, does Wallace also get the 12g's?

No doubt he gets it and laps it up too I'm sure. Heard today he sent out pink posters to his constituents apologising for his vat issues, what a load of crap. It was on fancy gloss paper too which I am sure he wasn't paying for.

tayto lover

donalg1 wrote: »

No doubt he gets it and laps it up too I'm sure. Heard today he sent out pink posters to his constituents apologising for his vat issues, what a load of crap. It was on fancy gloss paper too which I am sure he wasn't paying for.

Probably got it from one of the Healy-Rae crowd.

Am Chile

Le_Dieux wrote: »

Interview with Gilmore on RTE today: http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/1014/exchequer-deficit-deadline.html

So, we are saying Slan to the Troika in 14 months, why still go along with the Property Tax ( assuming it is ion place ) and water charge? After all, it IS them who are insisting we pay all these extra charges - at least thats what this damn govt would have us believe.

Sinn Fein, The Ula and even Fianna Fail have said on numerous occasions any taxation measures in the bailout programme can be switched for another taxation measure as long as the other measures raises same revenue-any decision to implement a property tax.water charge is this governments own decision-I was never a fan of John Gormley or the greens but I agree with his analysis he wrote about Irish Water how its a stepping stone to privatisation of water services, John is correct saying Irish Water is a brainchild of FG.

Establishing
Irish Water heralds its privatisation – John Gormley


Sep 10th, 2012 | By admin | Category: OPINIONS

While
the Green Party was in government it had a number of redline issues: key among
them were the refusal to contemplate a flat rate property tax for the primary
residence and a resistance to any movement towards the privatisation of water.
We now know that the government has made a dog’s dinner of the property tax but
there has been less scrutiny of the creation of Irish Water, the Fine Gael
brainchild. Most of the political comment from the opposition is focused on the
apparent unfairness of water charges and in particular the costs of installing
the water meters themselves. But they’ve managed to ignore the beast in the room
that consumes over 200 litres of water a day in the wild. Let me state it
bluntly: the creation of Irish Water is the first step in the privatisation of
water. No doubt about it. And we haven’t heard a squeak from the Labour mice,
except yet another flat denial from Eamon Gilmore.

Let’s
ask a number of pertinent questions, the questions that Labour haven’t asked or
simply don’t want to think about. Why are we setting up this new entity when
local authorities have managed successfully to provide water to the citizens,
albeit with a leaking pipe network due to lack of investment? It was because of
leaks that the local authorities themselves were the greatest advocates of
charges, knowing that extra investment was badly needed for the creaking system.
Fine Gael have made no secret that they intend to follow the British model, a
model which led inevitably to privatisation but was found wanting, as we know,
in Northern Ireland when many were left with no water during the cold snap. And
what about the loans from the National Pension Reserve Fund (NPRF)? How is the
loan from the NPRF to Irish Water secured. The Greens had proposed that the loan
should just be secured on future water charges, i.e. the NPRF would be able to
call on future water-charge revenues to ensure their loan was paid back.
However, government departments were suggesting that the loan would be secured
on the assets of the water service itself, raising the prospect that the entire
water system could be used as collateral for the loan.

As
the NPRF is part of the state, this obviously wouldn’t amount to privatisation,
but the move of transferring ownership of the water assets to Irish Water
suggests that Irish Water could in the future raise commercial capital using
these assets as collateral, which would mean that the water service could end up
in private hands by default. But it won’t be by default. Privatisation is fully
in keeping with the ideology of the Sate’s most right wing party, Fine Gael,
bolstered by their Blairite lackies in Labour. Even a cursory reading of their
own document provides a enough signposts towards privatization. This model
proposed is recognised in capital markets as the most attractive proposition to
lenders

and
is understood by investors who lend to the water sector in other countries.

A
key factor in evaluating the merits of the new operating model is the
possibility that the borrowings of Irish Water could be outside the General
Government Balance (GGB). Its capacity to borrow on the international markets
would be a key factor in enabling the company to become financially sustainable
and separate from the Government. It is proposed to transfer all infrastructure
to this new body and allow it to go to the market to borrow money using
Ireland’s water infrastructure as security. It is this drive to remove funding
of the water sector from the Government that is pushing water infrastructure
into the hands of private investors.

The
funding of water services is proposed ultimately to come from two sources, the
consumer and private investors. The current system requires €600million annually
in capital investment, with a backlog of €500million for essential projects
being experienced already. The significant level of investment required
indicates that majority control over water infrastructure would be wielded by
private investors should the Government pursue its plans.

The
report repeatedly states that the new model will drive efficiency. Any
reorganisation of the current system would improve efficiency – once there’s a
commitment to reinvest the money from charges back into the system. However,
once profit becomes the main motive, efficiency for the public good becomes
secondary. There are people in the Labour party who get this, but they remain
silent as their leaders take them into hostile territory for any self-respecting
socialist.

Recognising
these potential difficulties, the Green Party raised the prospect of protecting
our water resources from privatisation in the Constitution. Is it too much to
ask that Labour would include this idea in their deliberations in the
Constitutional Convention?

http://www.villagemagazine.ie/index.php/2012/09/establishing-irish-water-heralds-its-privatisation/
Labour have flip flopped on water charges.

The move by Environment Minister John Gormley to install a water meter in
every home in Ireland represents a retrograde step towards the introduction of a
regressive tax.


The Labour Party believes that water is a basic and fundamental need and
should not be treated like a market commodity. Many people, particularly the
very old and the very young are heavily reliant on water for their health and
wellbeing, and the notion of placing a charge on it, is objectionable.


The Labour Party abolished water charges when Brendan
Howlin was Environment Minister in the Rainbow Govt, 1996. We would oppose any
attempt to reverse that move.

http://www.labour.ie/press/listing/1260271868600677.html

Then Eamon Gilmore pledged the following on a property tax and a water charge.

THE man favoured to be the next Taoiseach has promised not to cut social
welfare or raise tax rates.





Instead Eamon Gilmore wants to tax the "high fliers" of the Celtic Tiger
economy in order to rebuild our shattered economy.





But at the same time he has promised:










Not to introduce a property tax on residential homes


He is prepared to back water charges provided they are metered

http://www.herald.ie/opinion/eamon-gilmore-the-man-behind-the-mask-2374050.html

Then labour changed their position on water charges yet again just before the last general election.

LABOUR leader Eamon Gilmore has done another election U-turn, this
time on his party's support for water charges.





In October, Mr Gilmore said he would back water
charges if meters were installed in every house. But Labour is now running
advertisements attacking Fine Gael's plans for water charges of up to €238
per family -- and is vowing to oppose any such measure.





Labour TD Brendan Howlin backed comments by Mr Gilmore
yesterday that the party would not support the installation of water meters in
the next government.





"We are not in favour of water charges, we don't believe in a flat rate and
you couldn't meter everybody within years," he said.

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/elections/confusion-as-gilmore-makes-uturn-on-water-charges-plan-2547351.html

Clip of Brendan Howlin on water charges pre election 29 seconds in.

At the next local elections Im predicting Labour will take a heavy hit like the green party,I expect Sinn Fein, The Ula and Independents will make gains at Labours expense-Given Fianna Fail have come out against a property tax,and septic tank charges,I predict Fianna Fail to win some Fine Gael seats at the local elections.

ilovesleep

Le_Dieux wrote: »

Nah, instead rather go and spend thousands sending letters out trying to get a hundred quid off the people in the name of a HHC.

I also heard this week that each TD get 12 grand a year just to attend DE....I work approx. 10 hours a day and paid myself 12 grand for the whole of last year ( all I could afford )

Until this bunch ( I include the LOT, not just whose in power now) get their priorities right, this country will NEVER pull together - I know I won't until I see leadership/setting example FROM THE TOP!!!

What?

12,000 just to go to Dail Eireann?
Just to go to work?

12,000 top of their pay?

I don't know anyone who gets a bonus for attending work.

How can they justify this with economy on its knees?


Ah sure they need it? Burton is looking at selling his 900k property for 300k. Huge NE there.

They have the cheek to say that we all partied and we all went mad. We all fcuking hell did not.

The ostrich Joan Burton was saying during the week that the basic sw rates won't be touched. So I'm guessing they are intending to look at the perks and other bits and pieces that people are entitled to claim eg household benefits package, travel pass.

Thats ok.
Will they be looking at the perks and bonuses and allowances that they grant themselves?