Yes Kenny Dalglish and Liverpool are done. MOD POST #425 *ALL READ*

G.K.

G.K. wrote: »

now hold on. These guys weren't world beaters at pool but they did their job. Not duds whatsoever.

Arbeloa - 120 apps for Real Madrid since he left. What a dud .

What's wrong with people

Xavi6

Disappointing news to wake up to

Sgt Pepper 64

Xavi6 wrote: »

Disappointing news to wake up to

I know, and Crouchys not going to the euros either!

jank

LOL, I wonder how KK's ego is today!

Pighead

rarnes1 wrote: »

Arbeloa - 120 apps for Real Madrid since he left. What a dud .

What's wrong with people

People aren't saying he was a dud at Real Madrid. They're saying he was a dud at Liverpool. Think there were plenty of Liverpool fans who thought he was found wanting and wasn't good enough to warrant a starting place every week.

Al Capwned

SirDelboy18 wrote: »

Martin O' Neill seems made for it.

No.

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

If this is to bring in Benitez / AVB / etc then fine
If this is to bring in Martinez / Lambert / etc then it is a terrible decision, and no quarter will be given by me to poor performances / results next season

Benitez would be a step backward.
AVB - ?
Martinez - possibly
Lambert - No.

Oranage2 wrote: »

Reina? yes.
Skrtel? Possibly.
Suerez? Probably.
Lucas? No!

Reina No, not on this season.
Skrtel - Never rated him
Suarez - brilliant in patches, poor in patches
Lucas - yes.


Liverpool need to make a forward step, not sideways or backwards. Benitez is backwards., Dlaglish WAS backwards,. AVB would be sideways imo,

Martinez, Lambert - would much prefer Martinezif i were a liverpool fan.



Who's next manager? Who knows..................

Lamper.sffc

Lambert would be a great step in the right direction for liverpool. most teams outside the top four would not be considering Lambert but liverpool have to realise they are no longer top four (not even close) Lambert may be the guy to bring them back.

On a side note, I would bet that if liverpool had of kept Hodgson they would have finished aboved kenny this season.

seanwhite20

Can't believe the amount of ****e managers being talked about as serious contenders..If our ambition has gotten this low just demote us to the championship now....

_blank_

AVB would be a ridiculous appointment.

He was pretty much sacked because he lost the dressing room at Chelsea, and the players wouldn't perofrm for him.

The reason for that is because of one "Mr Club" centre half, and another mid-30s England Midfielder needed to be managed out of the team.

It would be pretty much the same project at Liverpool over the next 2-3 years, with the added pressure of either trying to win a trophy to appease the fans, or getting a team from 8th to 4th, which is no mean feat as we know.

daithijjj

jank wrote: »

LOL, I wonder how KK's ego is today!

Most times ive crossed you on this forum have been objectionable experiences so i will cut to the chase and keep it decent.

He is probably gutted, alot of fans gutted for him. We (lfc) dont want this merry go round manager sh1te. The man spent 15 years at the club and won 32 trophies, he will be ok, thanks for your concern.

JimsAlterEgo

Des wrote: »

AVB would be a ridiculous appointment.

He was pretty much sacked because he lost the dressing room at Chelsea, and the players wouldn't perofrm for him.

The reason for that is because of one "Mr Club" centre half, and another mid-30s England Midfielder needed to be managed out of the team.

It would be pretty much the same project at Liverpool over the next 2-3 years, with the added pressure of either trying to win a trophy to appease the fans, or getting a team from 8th to 4th, which is no mean feat as we know.

totally agree, new man need to be strong mentally and make some tough changes. He showed he wasnt capable of it.

Happy Monday

daithijjj wrote: »

Most times ive crossed you on this forum have been objectionable experiences so i will cut to the chase and keep it decent.

He is probably gutted, alot of fans gutted for him. We (lfc) dont want this merry go round manager sh1te. The man spent 15 years at the club and won 32 trophies, he will be ok, thanks for your concern.

But let's not forget that Kenny is the architect of his own demise.
Given a pot of someone else's cash he wasted it on donkies.
Let's not blame the owners.
What were they meant to do?

daithijjj

Happy Monday wrote: »

But let's not forget that Kenny is the architect of his own demise.
Given a pot of someone else's cash he wasted it on donkies.
Let's not blame the owners.
What were they meant to do?

Kenny is not the architect of his own demise. When all the figures are totted up, Kenny spent or invested in the team, the sum of about 30 mil net, yea, i said it, net spend. But feck it, you cant say that without a facepalm or two from someone but you have to use it to compare your investment with competitors. The next man will get the same amount as it is becoming clearer what they are prepared to spend. How many managers have got to 2 cup finals in 1 season and lost their job in football history?

Chelsea have spent over 130 mil net in the last 2 years. Its not a dig, just a simple fact. I dont want to go deep into figures and stuff, what alot of fans want is simple continuity and direction, if people are happy to live in a football existence where its CL or bust in 12 months, we might as well scout out our next manager for his appointment after the new guy. Keep him on standby, thats a great gas altogether, really makes you feel part of something organic and built naturally over time *sarcasm*.

Renn

daithijjj wrote: »

Kenny is not the architect of his own demise. When all the figures are totted up, Kenny spent or invested in the team, the sum of about 30 mil net, yea, i said it, net spend. But feck it, you cant say that without a facepalm or two from someone but you have to use it to compare your investment with competitors. The next man will get the same amount as it is becoming clearer what they are prepared to spend. How many managers have got to 2 cup finals in 1 season and lost their job in football history?

Chelsea have spent over 130 mil net in the last 2 years. Its not a dig, just a simple fact. I dont want to go deep into figures and stuff, what alot of fans want is simple continuity and direction, if people are happy to live in a football existence where its CL or bust in 12 months, we might as well scout out our next manager for his appointment after the new guy. Keep him on standby, thats a great gas altogether, really makes you feel part of something organic and built naturally over time *sarcasm*.

cson

daithijjj wrote: »

Kenny is not the architect of his own demise. When all the figures are totted up, Kenny spent or invested in the team, the sum of about 30 mil net, yea, i said it, net spend. But feck it, you cant say that without a facepalm or two from someone but you have to use it to compare your investment with competitors. The next man will get the same amount as it is becoming clearer what they are prepared to spend. How many managers have got to 2 cup finals in 1 season and lost their job in football history?

On the subject of net spend; Wenger spent -£20m last year losing a Captain and an influential player in the progress and still managed 3rd place. Domestic Cup finals aren't where its at anymore; there's just too much money in the Champions League nowadays to spend too much time out of it.

Morzadec

rarnes1 wrote: »

Arbeloa - 120 apps for Real Madrid since he left. What a dud .

What's wrong with people

Pighead wrote: »

People aren't saying he was a dud at Real Madrid. They're saying he was a dud at Liverpool. Think there were plenty of Liverpool fans who thought he was found wanting and wasn't good enough to warrant a starting place every week.

Arbeloa was signed for 4 million euro (I would guess that was about £3m, probably even under that).

He was a very solid player in possession for us, linking up well with Kuyt and gerrard on the right-side and was defensively solid (kept a Messi very quiet on his debut in the Nou Camp). He didn't offer the attacking threat that a modern wing/full-back needs in a 4-2-3-1 formation, but he was a very consistent defender and had a good couple of years at Liverpool.

For the fee he was signed for he was an excellent purchase. Unfortunately these type of bargain-buys were the type that Rafa was forced into all too often at Liverpool, and almost all managers tend to get more misses than hits when they shop in the bargain basement, even Fergie.

Arbeloa was certainly a successful purchase though, if we can make some shrewd buys like him to fill some problem areas in the squad this summer I'll be delighted

daithijjj

cson wrote: »

On the subject of net spend; Wenger spent -£20m last year losing a Captain and an influential player in the progress and still managed 3rd place. Domestic Cup finals aren't where its at anymore; there's just too much money in the Champions League nowadays to spend too much time out of it.

Arsenal fan?. Im not having a dig at anyone or any club just to say that first.

Give me your gut feelings on the night you lost in the San Siro this year?. I listened to talksport that night and for 2 hours, Arsenal fans to a man wanted Wenger out and to spend money. Cant remember the name of the big German for the life of me right now but his injury saved Arsenal.......i jest, i really do.

Look, Wenger is an RVP away from catstrophe in most peoples opinions, it could be argued, RVP has been Arsenal's season. Im not having a dig, he has been out of this world and Arsenal scrapped 3rd.

Arsene is going to have to spend at some point, he was hanging by a thread that night of the San Siro.

Will I Amnt

Morzadec wrote: »

Arbeloa was certainly a successful purchase though, if we can make some shrewd buys like him to fill some problem areas in the squad this summer I'll be delighted

Arbeloa was not a success at Liverpool and to say he wasn't a dud because he did well at another club is stupid.
The likes of Veron,Forlan and Shevchenko are regularly labelled duds for United and Chelsea respectively and it's hard to argue against it.The fact that they were world class at other clubs is irrelevant

Happy Monday

daithijjj wrote: »

Arsenal fan?. Im not having a dig at anyone or any club just to say that first.

Give me your gut feelings on the night you lost in the San Siro this year?. I listened to talksport that night and for 2 hours, Arsenal fans to a man wanted Wenger out and to spend money. Cant remember the name of the big German for the life of me right now but his injury saved Arsenal.......i jest, i really do.

Look, Wenger is an RVP away from catstrophe in most peoples opinions, it could be argued, RVP has been Arsenal's season. Im not having a dig, he has been out of this world and Arsenal scrapped 3rd.

Arsene is going to have to spend at some point, he was hanging by a thread that night of the San Siro.

As a LFC fan can I say that you're being very unfair on Arsene and far too fair on Kenny.

What we would give for a man like Arsene?

DoctorGonzo08

daithijjj wrote: »

Kenny is not the architect of his own demise. When all the figures are totted up, Kenny spent or invested in the team, the sum of about 30 mil net, yea, i said it, net spend. But feck it, you cant say that without a facepalm or two from someone but you have to use it to compare your investment with competitors. The next man will get the same amount as it is becoming clearer what they are prepared to spend. How many managers have got to 2 cup finals in 1 season and lost their job in football history?

Chelsea have spent over 130 mil net in the last 2 years. Its not a dig, just a simple fact. I dont want to go deep into figures and stuff, what alot of fans want is simple continuity and direction, if people are happy to live in a football existence where its CL or bust in 12 months, we might as well scout out our next manager for his appointment after the new guy. Keep him on standby, thats a great gas altogether, really makes you feel part of something organic and built naturally over time *sarcasm*.

Avram Grant off the top of my head, and he finished 2nd in the league. This net spend is nonsenese tbh. You spend money you expect success, not to go backwards. If Chelsea, or City have a clear out this summer will their 'net spend' be discussed? No, they will still have spent big. Kenny was just too long out of the game and he had come into a tough position. After Rafa, they appointed Hodgson who wasn't the right person for the job. Kenny came in and was given money to throw at the problem, which made things worse. He bought players without thinking how they fit into his team, failed to play them in their correct positions and obviously did nothing in preparing them for smaller games.

daithijjj

cambo2008 wrote: »

Arbeloa was not a success at Liverpool and to say he wasn't a dud because he did well at another club is stupid.
The likes of Veron,Forlan and Shevchenko are regularly labelled duds for United and Chelsea respectively and it's hard to argue against it.The fact that they were world class at other clubs is irrelevant

Arbeloa is well down the list of players who were good signings but he cost 3 mil quid or something mid season, could play left or right back. He was a little loose on occasions but he was solid enough overall. He was no dud, he was more suited to playing teams in Europe, he looked after Messi well enough at Camp Nou. For a modest purchase at that price he did fine. What Carragher did to him at West Brom was a disgrace. Perhaps had a dose of the 'Reyeslike' homesickness near the end but you have that, made a modest profit on the player.

Will I Amnt

daithijjj wrote: »

I listened to talksport that night and for 2 hours, Arsenal fans to a man wanted Wenger out and to spend money.

That's not a very good gauge in fairness.
Pissed off people looking for a rant are far more likely to ring up those shows to complain.

Pighead

Morzadec wrote: »

Arbeloa was signed for 4 million euro (I would guess that was about £3m, probably even under that).

He was a very solid player in possession for us, linking up well with Kuyt and gerrard on the right-side and was defensively solid (kept a Messi very quiet on his debut in the Nou Camp). He didn't offer the attacking threat that a modern wing/full-back needs in a 4-2-3-1 formation, but he was a very consistent defender and had a good couple of years at Liverpool.

For the fee he was signed for he was an excellent purchase. Unfortunately these type of bargain-buys were the type that Rafa was forced into all too often at Liverpool, and almost all managers tend to get more misses than hits when they shop in the bargain basement, even Fergie.

Arbeloa was certainly a successful purchase though, if we can make some shrewd buys like him to fill some problem areas in the squad this summer I'll be delighted

I think the fact Arbeloa has done pretty well since he left Liverpool has clouded the memories of some Liverpool fans who were pretty underwhelmed with him at the time.

He was regularly castigated on these boards for his inability to cross or attack in general and for a lot of his time at Liverpool fans regularly claimed that Finnan was a better option.

Happy Monday

DoctorGonzo08 wrote: »

Avram Grant off the top of my head, and he finished 2nd in the league. This net spend is nonsenese tbh. You spend money you expect success, not to go backwards. If Chelsea, or City have a clear out this summer will their 'net spend' be discussed? No, they will still have spent big. Kenny was just too long out of the game and he had come into a tough position. After Rafa, they appointed Hodgson who wasn't the right person for the job. Kenny came in and was given money to throw at the problem, which made things worse. He bought players without thinking how they fit into his team, failed to play them in their correct positions and obviously did nothing in preparing them for smaller games.

They didn't appoint Hodgson.
They arrived with Hodgson in play.
They brought Kenny in.
Gave him huge support.
He fcuked up.
They sacked him on fair grounds.
New man will clear out some dead wood and rebuild from next year.
Let's not hear more defence of Kenneth at this time please.

Will I Amnt

daithijjj wrote: »

Arbeloa is well down the list of players who were good signings but he cost 3 mil quid or something mid season, could play left or right back. He was a little loose on occasions but he was solid enough overall. He was no dud, he was more suited to playing teams in Europe, he looked after Messi well enough at Camp Nou. For a modest purchase at that price he did fine. What Carragher did to him at West Brom was a disgrace. Perhaps had a dose of the 'Reyeslike' homesickness near the end but you have that, made a modest profit on the player.

Fair point,my gripe was with using his Madrid career to say he wasn't a dud.I don't feel he was a dud or a success.

DoctorGonzo08

Happy Monday wrote: »

They didn't appoint Hodgson.
They arrived with Hodgson in play.
They brought Kenny in.
Gave him huge support.
He fcuked up.
They sacked him on fair grounds.
New man will clear out some dead wood and rebuild from next year.
Let's not hear more defence of Kenneth at this time please.

The 'They' I'm refferring to is Liverpool as in the club not the owners. And I'm in no way defending Kenny as he was an obvious disaster.

amiable

cambo2008 wrote: »

Fair point,my gripe was with using his Madrid career to say he wasn't a dud.I don't feel he was a dud or a success.

Just to help prove your point, Real Madrid signed Julien Faubert :eek:

daithijjj

DoctorGonzo08 wrote: »

Avram Grant off the top of my head, and he finished 2nd in the league. This net spend is nonsenese tbh. You spend money you expect success, not to go backwards. If Chelsea, or City have a clear out this summer will their 'net spend' be discussed? No, they will still have spent big. Kenny was just too long out of the game and he had come into a tough position. After Rafa, they appointed Hodgson who wasn't the right person for the job. Kenny came in and was given money to throw at the problem, which made things worse. He bought players without thinking how they fit into his team, failed to play them in their correct positions and obviously did nothing in preparing them for smaller games.

Net spend is not irrelevant, as much as people dont like talking about it. Clearouts are different depending on the club, LFC have sold players to Barca/Real/Chelsea in the last 2 years, top class players for massive money, who will United and Chelsea sell for big funds?. Chelsea and City have invested in the team in the last 12 months without major sales, LFC have invested a large proportion of sales money, its ludicrous to compare anyone to City in the last while, they lost 190 mil last year.

The too long out of the game excuse is lazy. Read on people close to the situation and they will give you the opposite view. The rest of your critique is badly wrong. Sure he made a mistake or two, not signing another striker option is the main one. Not preparing his team? meh, not even going to entertain that.

inforfun

Dont know how much in a hurry Liverpool is with getting a new manager but Bert van Marwijk wouldnt be a too bad shout.

He did sign a new contract with the Dutch FA recently but has a clause in there that if the right club comes, he can go. Liverpool is one of those clubs he does fancy
Certainly if the Euro's end in a disappointment i can see him leave the Dutch team.
And a group with Germany and Portugal is destined to end in a disaster.
Dutch teams (club and country) have a terrible record against Portuguese teams.

Going to take van marwijk @101

Will I Amnt

amiable wrote: »

Just to help prove your point, Real Madrid signed Julien Faubert :eek:

:eek: :eek:

amiable

inforfun wrote: »

Dont know how much in a hurry Liverpool is with getting a new manager but Bert van Marwijk wouldnt be a too bad shout.

He did sign a new contract with the Dutch FA recently but has a clause in there that if the right club comes, he can go. Liverpool is one of those clubs he does fancy
Certainly if the Euro's end in a disappointment i can see him leave the Dutch team.
And a group with Germany and Portugal is destined to end in a disaster.
Dutch teams (club and country) have a terrible record against Portuguese teams.

Going to take van marwijk @101

He's 59 and I get the feeling that the owners are looking for a younger manager

inforfun

At 59 he is probably "younger" in his head after managing the Dutch team the last 5 years than most 50 year olds who have been working at a high profile club for 5 years.

Van Marwijk did the groundwork for Dortmunds recent succes. When he took over he had to clear out players on high salaries and start with youth players (Sahin amongst others) because Dortmund was as good as bankrupt.

Not saying Liverpool is bankrupt but there is need for some serious cleaning there.

daithijjj

cambo2008 wrote: »

That's not a very good gauge in fairness.
Pissed off people looking for a rant are far more likely to ring up those shows to complain.

When you get 20 or 30 fans who say the same thing over and over, the majority being articulate people (im not joking), you tend to get a feel for what the majority feel regardless if they didnt phone in.

The truth behind Arsenal's money available isnt widely known, you read someone like David Conn in the Guardian or follow him on twitter (he is excellent) and you find out why Wenger had the summer he had, it isnt all rosy, CL football has prevented more microscopic questions from fans, lets talk in 12 months. Again, not a dig at anyone, i admire Arsenals ethic in alot of ways. But there are fundamental reasons why Arsenal's shopping has gone from building project to signing some older players. Wenger hasnt signed many players like Bennyoun or Arteta or the German in terms of age in the past, he has usually sold them.

counterlock

daithijjj wrote: »

Net spend is not irrelevant, as much as people dont like talking about it. Clearouts are different depending on the club, LFC have sold players to Barca/Real/Chelsea in the last 2 years, top class players for massive money, who will United and Chelsea sell for big funds?. Chelsea and City have invested in the team in the last 12 months without major sales, LFC have invested a large proportion of sales money, its ludicrous to compare anyone to City in the last while, they lost 190 mil last year.

One won the league, the other is in the CL final. They are buying talent in to reach their goals which has worked for them this season

I would rather see my team buying talented players than selling them to try to make the net spend look better.

DoctorGonzo08

daithijjj wrote: »

Net spend is not irrelevant, as much as people dont like talking about it. Clearouts are different depending on the club, LFC have sold players to Barca/Real/Chelsea in the last 2 years, top class players for massive money, who will United and Chelsea sell for big funds?. Chelsea and City have invested in the team in the last 12 months without major sales, LFC have invested a large proportion of sales money, its ludicrous to compare anyone to City in the last while, they lost 190 mil last year.

The too long out of the game excuse is lazy. Read on people close to the situation and they will give you the opposite view. The rest of your critique is badly wrong. Sure he made a mistake or two, not signing another striker option is the main one. Not preparing his team? meh, not even going to entertain that.

I will agree Net Spend is not irrelevant but I still don't think it is OK to justify wasting 100+ million, it is just trying to put a better spin on it.

What is wrong with my critique? Downing, left winger, one of the top assists last season. Dalglish thinks he is better suited as a right midfielder. Result 0 assists, 0 goals. Carroll, target man, showed great potential for Newcastle and England. Dalglish sees more to his game, lone striker, ball to feet or to chase, under no circumstances do you cross into him. Transfer strategy? Squad depth? Strengthen certain positions? No, buy English! That's inspiring. How did that work out? But it's the players fault 100% of course. At what stage does blind allegance give way to common sense? They team showed no consistancey against weaker opposition, but played well against big opponents? I would take this as the players lifting themselves for the big stage, which would imply Dalglish has no affect either way. I think you'll find he has made more than one or two mistakes. Sure there was an element of bad luck involved with Lucas going down and Gerrard injured at the start of the season, but compared that to Arsenal having 9 defenders out for the best part of 2 months, or Utd losing Vidic and Fletcher, yet they finish 2nd and 3rd.

Dalglish was a legend at liverpool as a player. He inherited an unbelievable team in the 80s and was very successful. 13 years out of the game, and being more a fan than a manager all point to the fact he was not the right person for the job.

Morzadec

Morzadec wrote: »

Arbeloa was signed for 4 million euro (I would guess that was about £3m, probably even under that).

He was a very solid player in possession for us, linking up well with Kuyt and gerrard on the right-side and was defensively solid (kept a Messi very quiet on his debut in the Nou Camp). He didn't offer the attacking threat that a modern wing/full-back needs in a 4-2-3-1 formation, but he was a very consistent defender and had a good couple of years at Liverpool.

For the fee he was signed for he was an excellent purchase. Unfortunately these type of bargain-buys were the type that Rafa was forced into all too often at Liverpool, and almost all managers tend to get more misses than hits when they shop in the bargain basement, even Fergie.

Arbeloa was certainly a successful purchase though, if we can make some shrewd buys like him to fill some problem areas in the squad this summer I'll be delighted

Pighead wrote: »

I think the fact Arbeloa has done pretty well since he left Liverpool has clouded the memories of some Liverpool fans who were pretty underwhelmed with him at the time.

He was regularly castigated on these boards for his inability to cross or attack in general and for a lot of his time at Liverpool fans regularly claimed that Finnan was a better option.

To be honest he hasn't really done that much better at Real Madrid. Yes he has won a lot of things but that's because he has been fortunate enough to play with a team of superstars. I don't think he's improved as a player since he's gone to Madrid.

Right-back is the position they are looking to strengthen in this summer and most Real Madrid fans believe Arbeloa is not good enough going forward (as you have stated Pighead), and to be honest I would agree that he's not good enough to be a regular starter for Real Madrid.

All I'm saying is, find me a better Right-Back for 4m euros. He was a cheap bit of business and he did well at Liverpool. He didn't offer much of an attacking threat no, (much like Enrique on the left-side now) but he was comfortable on the ball, kept possession well and was good defensively. For 4m euro he was not a dud by any means, if we got that level of consistency from all our cheap, bargain-basement signings we'd be happy.

But ideally players who cost 4m euros should be bought as squad players, not as starters

daithijjj

counterlock wrote: »

One won the league, the other is in the CL final. They are buying talent in to reach their goals which has worked for them this season

I would rather see my team buying talented players than selling them to try to make the net spend look better.

One almost bottled the league with a 190 mil loss on the books in 12 months and the other could be playing Europa league with Liverpool next year, whats your point?

Chelsea have invested more in their squad in the last 18 months than Liverpool have in 7 years, LFC made a profit on players circa summer 08 to Jan 11. I honestly dont know what you are getting at here, of course i would like Liverpool to buy talented players over selling, did i make a point saying i would not like this or something, this would make me insane if i didnt want this surely?. Im not even going to bring in the wages paid to City players.

daithijjj

DoctorGonzo08 wrote: »

I will agree Net Spend is not irrelevant but I still don't think it is OK to justify wasting 100+ million, it is just trying to put a better spin on it.

What is wrong with my critique? Downing, left winger, one of the top assists last season. Dalglish thinks he is better suited as a right midfielder. Result 0 assists, 0 goals. Carroll, target man, showed great potential for Newcastle and England. Dalglish sees more to his game, lone striker, ball to feet or to chase, under no circumstances do you cross into him. Transfer strategy? Squad depth? Strengthen certain positions? No, buy English! That's inspiring. How did that work out? But it's the players fault 100% of course. At what stage does blind allegance give way to common sense? They team showed no consistancey against weaker opposition, but played well against big opponents? I would take this as the players lifting themselves for the big stage, which would imply Dalglish has no affect either way. I think you'll find he has made more than one or two mistakes. Sure there was an element of bad luck involved with Lucas going down and Gerrard injured at the start of the season, but compared that to Arsenal having 9 defenders out for the best part of 2 months, or Utd losing Vidic and Fletcher, yet they finish 2nd and 3rd.

Dalglish was a legend at liverpool as a player. He inherited an unbelievable team in the 80s and was very successful. 13 years out of the game, and being more a fan than a manager all point to the fact he was not the right person for the job.

You are talking gash bud, sorry.

I will let the 100 mil thing slide as i cant honestly be fked repeating myself.

In case it escaped your attention Downing got player of the year at Villa playing mostly right wing, not left wing, did you even watch any of Villa that year or is this mostly off the cuff stuff?.

Sure Carroll hasnt been a success, he is 22 and so is Henderson, they were bought with an element of playing them and improving them. Who are you to say they wont be great at 24?, how long did Nani take to bed in at United? 17mil quid on Anderson, who had the better season as individuals? Anderson or Henderson?. Its not as simple a tale as you seem to tell. If you are pinning success on buying young players you give them time.

I dont have time right now to go off on tangents about who missed who the most.

DoctorGonzo08

daithijjj wrote: »

You are talking gash bud, sorry.

I will let the 100 mil thing slide as i cant honestly be fked repeating myself.

In case it escaped your attention Downing got player of the year at Villa playing mostly right wing, not left wing, did you even watch any of Villa that year or is this mostly off the cuff stuff?.

Sure Carroll hasnt been a success, he is 22 and so is Henderson, they were bought with an element of playing them and improving them. Who are you to say they wont be great at 24?, how long did Nani take to bed in at United? 17mil quid on Anderson, who had the better season as individuals? Anderson or Henderson?. Its not as simple a tale as you seem to tell. If you are pinning success on buying young players you give them time.

I dont have time right now to go off on tangents about who missed who the most.

Na mate, you're alright. Because you haven't addressed anything I've said. Downing played left wing last year, with Young in the hole behind the striker. Albrighton was introduced on the right. Downing did play some time on the right but very small in comparison to his natural position.

Blah blah blah net spenbd blah blah blah. If I win 100 euro on the lottery and I buy gone off milk for 150 euro I may have a net loss of 50 euro but it doesn't change the fact that I blew 150 euro now does it?

With regard to the players potential etc I wasn't questioning. I was questioning why buy players and not play them in their position. My 100% players fault comment was sarcasm. I was implying the the manager has to accept responsibility. I actually think alot of Carroll and Henderson, and I think it is unfair the abuse they got this year because of Kenny's ineptness as a manager. Fair play to him though, bring talent up and go out of your way to make it more difficult for them.

But who am I to argue with you. I'm not a Liverpool fan, and I don't hold Dalglish in any kind of high regard. Personally I would have prefferred he stayed on and got them relegated, at least then he could say he achieved something.

counterlock

daithijjj wrote: »

One almost bottled the league with a 190 mil loss on the books in 12 months and the other could be playing Europa league with Liverpool next year, whats your point?

United were almost champions. Cardiff almost won the carling cup. Liverpool almost won the FA cup. It means nothing. My point is that net spend is meaningless, especially given the fact that Henderson and Downing look like they will never justify the prices paid for them.

daithijjj owning this thread :cool:

daithijjj

DoctorGonzo08 wrote: »

Na mate, you're alright. Because you haven't addressed anything I've said. Downing played left wing last year, with Young in the hole behind the striker. Albrighton was introduced on the right. Downing did play some time on the right but very small in comparison to his natural position.

Blah blah blah net spenbd blah blah blah. If I win 100 euro on the lottery and I buy gone off milk for 150 euro I may have a net loss of 50 euro but it doesn't change the fact that I blew 150 euro now does it?

With regard to the players potential etc I wasn't questioning. I was questioning why buy players and not play them in their position. My 100% players fault comment was sarcasm. I was implying the the manager has to accept responsibility. I actually think alot of Carroll and Henderson, and I think it is unfair the abuse they got this year because of Kenny's ineptness as a manager. Fair play to him though, bring talent up and go out of your way to make it more difficult for them.

But who am I to argue with you. I'm not a Liverpool fan, and I don't hold Dalglish in any kind of high regard. Personally I would have prefferred he stayed on and got them relegated, at least then he could say he achieved something.

Oh, you have gone a bit sour there near the end, nice. Gone off milk is about right.

Downing played a shedload on the right. I like Albrighton, i had him in my fantasy team last year but he played alot as sub and Downing played plenty on the right, when he was either not started, or before he came on and then moved, Downing even played centre mid at times in games that i watched.

Playing players out of position?, Henderson played on the right for Sunderland at times, he dovetailed a bit with Elmohamady there when required. He is a centre mid all day long and after Xmas he was played there more often than not, only filling in on the right when Kuyt wasnt fancied.

I totally missed where Carroll was deployed other than as striker. Im going to have to shape up as football fan of LFC.

Will I Amnt

rarnes1 wrote: »

daithijjj owning this thread :cool:

Because you agree with his views???
:cool: :rolleyes:

counterlock

cambo2008 wrote: »

UBecause you agree with his views???
:cool: :rolleyes:

No, its because he used the term 'gash' and 'can't be bothered' defending any of the points put to him
:rolleyes:

Pighead

Morzadec wrote: »

All I'm saying is, find me a better Right-Back for 4m euros. He was a cheap bit of business and he did well at Liverpool. He didn't offer much of an attacking threat no, (much like Enrique on the left-side now) but he was comfortable on the ball, kept possession well and was good defensively. For 4m euro he was not a dud by any means, if we got that level of consistency from all our cheap, bargain-basement signings we'd be happy.

But ideally players who cost 4m euros should be bought as squad players, not as starters

Yeah, that's probably a pretty fair summation of his time at Liverpool. I'll give you that one.

DoctorGonzo08

daithijjj wrote: »

Oh, you have gone a bit sour there near the end, nice. Gone off milk is about right.

Downing played a shedload on the right. I like Albrighton, i had him in my fantasy team last year but he played alot as sub and Downing played plenty on the right, when he was either not started, or before he came on and then moved, Downing even played centre mid at times in games that i watched.

Playing players out of position?, Henderson played on the right for Sunderland at times, he dovetailed a bit with Elmohamady there when required. He is a centre mid all day long and after Xmas he was played there more often than not, only filling in on the right when Kuyt wasnt fancied.

I totally missed where Carroll was deployed other than as striker. Im going to have to shape up as football fan of LFC.

Well with facts like this how can I argue? As for sour, you made my input in a debate personal, of course I will get a little miffed with this approach, especially when you don't have anything logical to argue against. You haven't made a valid point against the last couple of posts you have replied to. I understand you are a fan, and I understand you support Dalglish and will stand by him. Attacking other posters who are simply stating obvious points is just a little silly. I don't go into the LFC thread and post negative comments, but I take part in general topics such as this.

The facts are Dalglish has spent (net or otherwise) alot of money. He has gone backwards in the league and taken a huge step back from the top 4. He is further away from the CL than ever, which despite yours and his idea that the Carling Cup is more imortant, is a big deal, financially for your 'Net Spend' and for attracting top players.

Cyrus

DoctorGonzo08 wrote: »

Blah blah blah net spenbd blah blah blah. If I win 100 euro on the lottery and I buy gone off milk for 150 euro I may have a net loss of 50 euro but it doesn't change the fact that I blew 150 euro now does it?

Try this, if you sell 1 litre of milk for 1 euro and buy another for 1.50, what is the cost to you of having 1 litre of milk?

1.50 or 50 cent

counterlock

Cyrus wrote: »

Try this, if you sell 1 litre of milk for 1 euro and buy another for 1.50, what is the cost to you of having 1 litre of milk?

1.50 or 50 cent

What if 75% of the new milk was sour? How much would that cost you?

DoctorGonzo08

Cyrus wrote: »

Try this, if you sell 1 litre of milk for 1 euro and buy another for 1.50, what is the cost to you of having 1 litre of milk?

1.50 or 50 cent

That's actually very well put!

I agree the cost is 50 cent, and I understand the premise. What I am stating is that you still spend 1.50.

And also, what happens next, when you have to sell the 1.50 milk for 10 cent? 1.0 - 1.50 = (+.50). 1.50 - .10 = (-1.40)

In isolated transfers it is quite a significant figure, but take into account a wider scope and it can be interputed very differently.

Cyrus

counterlock wrote: »

What if 75% of the new milk was sour? How much would that cost you?

Nothing until you decide to sell it, its price obviously being impacted by the fact that its sour

unless of course potential purchasers require sour milk