White spot - Ram chiclids

buzz

Just noticed one of my German Ram chiclids very close to top of tank, and a swollen white lip, followed by a few white spots on his gills:(
I have a male and a female, and both of them have the white spots...

Only thing added to the tank recently was my 2 plecos and a few small african dwarf frogs, but they all look fine:o

I cant quarantine as I dont have a 2nd filter or heater..
I have a bottle of Interpet Anti whitespot which worked on goldfish, will this work
I removed the carbon filters and added 1ml per 10L

See pics attached... The female looks to be eating fine, and swiming around..
the male ate fine at 6pm and I didnt notice anything strange about his behavour until 10pm.. and he looks to be going downhill quickly...

How long does this anti white spot usually take to kick in?

Sleepy

Whitespot medication can only kill the parasites in their development stage when they're hatched from their eggs and swimming in the water (where they burrow into your fish).

Something like eSHa 2000 can help your fish heal their wounds from the parasites that have burrowed into them whilst their EXIT product would kill the parasites in the water stage. I'm not familiar with the Interpet product but AFAIK, most white spot treatments are based on malachyte green.

It's often recommended to raise the temperature of the tank to as close to 30 degrees as your fish will tolerate when you have whitespot as this speeds up the Ich parasite's lifecycle and makes them more susceptible to the treatment. From past experience, you need to medicate for at least a week but effectively keep treating the tank until a couple of days after you see the last spot on one of your fish.

Upping the frequency of your water changes can help considerably too, as using a gravel siphon can help remove some of the Ich larvae/eggs from your gravel. Remember to add back in any treatment you syphon out though.

Depending on how effective your anti-whitespot medication is, I've discovered there's a form of whitespot in Irish fish shops which is resistant to the medication and I had to treat with salt. It's a more risky response since not all fish can tolerate salinity in the water but worth googling to learn more about it in case the Interpet medication isn't having any effect after a week or so.

I'd also recommend eSHa 2000 as a general purpose treatment to help your fish recover from this after you've successfully cleared the Ich. They came in on one of your new pleco's or frogs which is why you need to be so careful when examining stock in the pet shops.

Good luck with the treatment, I've usually lost at least one fish when I've had an Ich outbreak and, from what I've read, it's pretty much par for the course: unfortunately by the time most of us realise we've an infestation in the tank it's often too late for some of the weaker fish.

buzz

Thanks for that sleepy.

Unfortunately the male died. Im gutted.
The female has signs of whitespot but nothing on her mouth, just the gills.

The spot had spread and covered his mouth and he died.

So the treatment will kill parasites in the water, but spots on the fish I read burst and attach to other passing fish, will the treatment kill the parasites to avoid spread of infection?

Very interesting point about the tempeture of the water and the life cycle of the parasite, Ill do that straight away.

Regarding the water change, I have a gravel siphon..
So I should change 20% / 25% water every few days and replace with fresh conditioned water? Should I add the anti whitespot to the water I am changing before putting in the tank, or put it in and treat the total volume of water?

Thanks again for your advice
Cian

Sleepy

The spots on the fish are burrowed in Ich parasites, these cast spores into the water where they find somewhere (usually your gravel) to gestate, once gestated they then swim in the water seeking a host (this is when the medication kills them), if they find a host, the cycle starts again.

Raise water temperature gradually, you don't want to shock the fish, maybe 1 degree per day (making sure to not go above the highest temperature tolerance of the lowest tolerant fish).

What size is the tank? When I was hit I did 10% water change per day, treating the fresh water before adding it to the tank. That was an 180l tank though, with a smaller tank I'd be inclined to reduce the percentage a little (don't want to cause a new cycle in the tank by taking out too much good bacteria).

buzz

Sleepy wrote: »

The spots on the fish are burrowed in Ich parasites, these cast spores into the water where they find somewhere (usually your gravel) to gestate, once gestated they then swim in the water seeking a host (this is when the medication kills them), if they find a host, the cycle starts again.

Raise water temperature gradually, you don't want to shock the fish, maybe 1 degree per day (making sure to not go above the highest temperature tolerance of the lowest tolerant fish).

So I should start by siphoning gravel bit by bit. The problem is that using the gravel siphon it only takes about 45 seconds to fill a 25L drum, and my tank is 125L:eek:

Sleepy wrote: »

with a smaller tank I'd be inclined to reduce the percentage a little (don't want to cause a new cycle in the tank by taking out too much good bacteria).

This may be the problem as to why it happened...

Basically I had changed substrate in the tank, and by the time I got my water back in and filter and heater running, it was 24 hours. Then a day later I put fish in, and the nitrite and nitrate went through the roof.. I did 20L water change per day to bring the levels back down (as I think cycle had started again and bacteria died).. Levels are spot on now so I added the 2 plecos and 3 frogs, and already had 2 ram chiclids and 1 dwarf gourami. I dont want to change too much water but now I feel that I dont have much choice..

Sleepy

buzz wrote: »

So I should start by siphoning gravel bit by bit. The problem is that using the gravel siphon it only takes about 45 seconds to fill a 25L drum, and my tank is 125L:eek:

You should be able to slow the siphon with a clip on the tubing

This may be the problem as to why it happened...

Basically I had changed substrate in the tank, and by the time I got my water back in and filter and heater running, it was 24 hours. Then a day later I put fish in, and the nitrite and nitrate went through the roof.. I did 20L water change per day to bring the levels back down (as I think cycle had started again and bacteria died).. Levels are spot on now so I added the 2 plecos and 3 frogs, and already had 2 ram chiclids and 1 dwarf gourami. I dont want to change too much water but now I feel that I dont have much choice..

It may have weakened your fish but the parasites can't survive without a host or come from nowhere so they either came in the water the additional fish were in, or already burrowed into the fish.

A single ich spot on a fish can create loads of parasites in a tank environment.

buzz

Sleepy wrote: »

You should be able to slow the siphon with a clip on the tubing

Now that is thinking:P

Ok really appreciate your help mate.

I know what I have to do now;)