Advice for the cost of new build 2012

Nryan82

Oh, new build on site, it's not possible to build that pic u sent as an extension to the side as I wudnt have the room, but I thinkin could he do that over the kitchen as it is now?..let's hope so.:)

archtech

Nryan82 wrote: »

.I've a.ready got another quote from another Builder with what I have.

that's a dangerous game getting another builder to price off another builders plans. Its all the more reason to get an independent professional that way you have no ties to any one individual builder when it comes to construction.

Arch tect...(I take it by ur username u are an architect?) so I understand ur prob annoyed or frustrated with me doing this through a builder, which I can understand.

I'm an architectural technologist actually, but that doesn't really matter, what I'm doing is sharing my experience as a designer.

Can u explain a few things to me though. First of all U said "if i use my kitchen at all"....OF COURSE im goin to be using my kitchen!!!!...who doesnt use a kitchen...Why do u think I will hate my kitchen? I have work space also on the right hand side of it and the table is not nessicarly going to be where it is on the kitchen, my builder just put things in to show me what I COULD do. I can have an island there if I want when it's done and have a nice fold away table below it. It's all up to me but I dnt think I'll hate it. I have googled many 'one wall' kitchens and have seen fabulous ones. I think nearly 15 ft wide is plenty big but of course if I had more room I would go wider.

A lot of alteration projects I've been involved in, have revolved around poorly designed kitchen spaces in the first place. The layout as shown in terms of amount of kitchen unit works, however with the table in the middle of between both sets of units, the design is disjointed and the table will end up as an island unit. You will struggle to accommodate a "one" wall kitchen and island unit and table in the width you have. To illustrate. The Kitchen wall counter unit in 2' ( more if american style fridge is been accommodated) you need ideally a minimum of 4' between the wall units and an island unit. Your Island unit will be 3' give or take, which leaves in the order 6' to fit a table and circulation space either side of the table. A typical table is in the order of 2.5' wide so not a whole lot left... its beginning to feel like a poorly designed developer semi-d.

I don't have a huge site, in fact it's very small if u saw it so I'm tryin to get in the best I can.

All the more reason to get a good designer, a good designer will full fill your brief and work within the constrains of the site.

What mm should the external walls be? I can say this to him once I know?

That depends on the overall strategy to achieve compliance with Part L of the building regulations. Heating systems, renewables, air tightness, thermal bridging are just a few things that have an impact on how much or how little insulation you require to achieve compliance. What I would say the better you insulate the less it will cost to heat the house long term. I normally aim for a u-value of 0.15w/m2k in walls, (which would normally require a wall thickness of in the order of 450-500mm but that's dependent on a number of factors).

I assume so the BER test should be done or has to be done before any building takes place ya?

By law you only need a BER on completion/occupation of the house, until you are buying a house off the plans. However that said with the current Part L, it is advisable to have the house evaluated in DEAP (that's the BER software) to ensure the design can achieve compliance.

And can yu tell me exactly what is wrong with the downstairs toilet?.

Its dimensions appear to be insufficient nor it the layout ideal.

At the end of the day its your choice what you do but remember experience = knowledge learnt from (others) mistakes.

muffler

Couple of points:

As pointed out the ground floor wc in its present layout will not comply with Part M
The external walls are wrong thickness to comply with Part L.
Id suggest taking a foot of the width of the front hall and landing and add to rooms either side.

Is your builder/designer competent in designing and constructing in accordance with the building regulations? Is he in a position to issue all relevant certs at the end of the job?

One strong recommendation is to ensure that the builder does not recommend or engage the arch/engineer/technician who will be inspecting the works.

As others have said its in your own interest to employ someone who has the expertise in both design and ensuring compliance with building regs.

Nryan82

i am getting my own engineer muffler to look at my plans and also to sign off. he is not familar with my builder at all. i don't understand what you mean when u say "comply with part M ? what is part M?. and that the walla are not thick enough to comply with part L ?. What is part L?. Sorry im not up to date with the lingo!!!...i have already made the hall narrower to make my living area wider. dont think i can go any more but i think 15 ft is wide enough no?. I have been in downstairs toilets ALOT smaller than my one..i still dont see the problem with it or its layout.

sydthebeat

And can yu tell me exactly what is wrong with the downstairs toilet?.

1. a wheelchair user cannot enter it and close the door behind them, the door swing doesnt allow this

2. a wheelchair user cannot enter and dismount from the wheelchair sideways onto the toliet.. .the layout doesnt allow for this. There needs to be a 750 x 1200 clear space adjacent to the toilet.

the room needs to be a minimum of 1400 deep;
the toilet pan should be against the back wall;
a 750 x 1200 space should be adjacent to it, in front of the door.
the door should open out into the hall.

edit: if you have been in smaller its most probably because either
(a) the regs didnt apply at the time of build
(b) the floor area is small enough to warrant a smaller wc. (under 45 sq m)
(c) someone didnt know what they were supposed to do



On the layout in general, its not very family friendly.
The living room is too small....compare it to the GF study
The living space off the kitchen is basically a corridor from the front door to the kitchen, you cant lay this out without thinking of people walking through it. The door to this space is too close to the stove in my opinion.
The kitchen doesn't reflect the picture that you've posted. Your room is way too narrow to be like this. I would estimate the picture is about 1.5 to 2.0 meters wider. In the picture the kitchen is more organised... the units and the island are located together. in the design, the units are spit across the room with a table between... not very user friendly at all.
It may make more sense to include an island and move the table towards the utility. this would allow you to move the access door to this space from its current location in the living space, to access direct into the kitchen. this allows you a more organised living space which isnt a corridor.

i dont understand why there is roof lights in the ff bathroom and ward. is there not enough height here for windows? If there is full height, then how do you open the roof light in the bathroom? remote control?

some door swings are weird, but thats just a drawing error i would think....

muffler

Nryan82 wrote: »

i am getting my own engineer muffler to look at my plans and also to sign off. he is not familar with my builder at all. i don't understand what you mean when u say "comply with part M ? what is part M?. and that the walla are not thick enough to comply with part L ?. What is part L?. Sorry im not up to date with the lingo!!!...i have already made the hall narrower to make my living area wider. dont think i can go any more but i think 15 ft is wide enough no?. I have been in downstairs toilets ALOT smaller than my one..i still dont see the problem with it or its layout.

You see the above comments are a good illustration of why you need a "professional" involved.

There are building regulations in this country. Not only does the house have to be built in accordance with those regulations but the design/plans/spec. will have to comply also.

Just to explain - the building regs are broken down into 12 separate categories from A - M so when you see someone say that a particular aspect of your house will not comply with Part L as an example then you need to familiarise yourself with what Part L is.

Have a look here

Nryan82

sydthebeat wrote: »

1. a wheelchair user cannot enter it and close the door behind them, the door swing doesnt allow this

2. a wheelchair user cannot enter and dismount from the wheelchair sideways onto the toliet.. .the layout doesnt allow for this. There needs to be a 750 x 1200 clear space adjacent to the toilet.

the room needs to be a minimum of 1400 deep;
the toilet pan should be against the back wall;
a 750 x 1200 space should be adjacent to it, in front of the door.
the door should open out into the hall.

edit: if you have been in smaller its most probably because either
(a) the regs didnt apply at the time of build
(b) the floor area is small enough to warrant a smaller wc. (under 45 sq m)
(c) someone didnt know what they were supposed to do



On the layout in general, its not very family friendly.
The living room is too small....compare it to the GF study
The living space off the kitchen is basically a corridor from the front door to the kitchen, you cant lay this out without thinking of people walking through it. The door to this space is too close to the stove in my opinion.
The kitchen doesn't reflect the picture that you've posted. Your room is way too narrow to be like this. I would estimate the picture is about 1.5 to 2.0 meters wider. In the picture the kitchen is more organised... the units and the island are located together. in the design, the units are spit across the room with a table between... not very user friendly at all.
It may make more sense to include an island and move the table towards the utility. this would allow you to move the access door to this space from its current location in the living space, to access direct into the kitchen. this allows you a more organised living space which isnt a corridor.

i dont understand why there is roof lights in the ff bathroom and ward. is there not enough height here for windows? If there is full height, then how do you open the roof light in the bathroom? remote control?

some door swings are weird, but thats just a drawing error i would think....

thats great info finally about the toilet..thats exactly what i was looking for..someone to explain why its not good. i will take note of all that and explain to my builder.thanks so much.
with regards to my smaller sittin room on the right, i wanted it nice and small, its basically just to ave another room for me and my friends to go or my boyfriend and his friends to go, once again, i don't have a lot of space on the site so am doin the best i can. i don't see my living area as a corridor to my kitchen. its goin to be a room of itself. i love the open plan idea and this is what it will be..not a corridor. i understand ye have yer opinions but in mine i dont feel it too be too narrow as i measured it myself and it seems to be wide enough, for me neway. once again the picture i put up ere is just a general idea. and in my opinion i think the kitchen in it is not at all long eough. there is hardly any work stop space if you zoom into it. i don't like it at all. in order to have my floor to ceiling windows lookin out over my garden and to gain sunlight this is the way the kitchen has to be be as i can't go around the corner or i cant have the long windows..simple as that. i wanted more worktop space ie. i have more worktop space adjacent to the kitchen.
the stove won't be beside the door, i can move it up further. my builder just put the bits n pieces in to make it look real. i dnt have to have anything where it is in the picture.
i ma havin a window in the upstairs toilet not a velux. thats another thing that has to be changed by the builder. once again my plans are a ROUGH idea.

Nryan82

also the other room will be a bedroom..not a study. ill have to put walkdrobes etc in there...thats why its bigger than the sitting room.

sydthebeat

Nryan82 wrote: »

i love the open plan idea and this is what it will be..not a corridor. i understand ye have yer opinions but in mine i dont feel it too be too narrow as i measured it myself and it seems to be wide enough, for me neway.

thats fine, i can only comment how i see it. It still means everyone who wants to go from the front door to the kitchen (probably the most used route) will be going through your living space.

Nryan82 wrote: »

and in my opinion i think the kitchen in it is not at all long eough. there is hardly any work stop space if you zoom into it. i don't like it at all. in order to have my floor to ceiling windows lookin out over my garden and to gain sunlight this is the way the kitchen has to be be as i can't go around the corner or i cant have the long windows..simple as that. i wanted more worktop space ie. i have more worktop space adjacent to the kitchen.

well i wouldnt compromise here, id keep at the design until you get what you want.

Nryan82

Yes I understand that's what it will mean, but anyone who will be coming into my house would be goin into them two rooms regardless, and I love the open plan style so that's why I have it like that. Thanks for the advice though.and I will certainly stay goin until I get it right.

Nryan82

New build in sight wrote: »

You poor thing, I know exactly how you feel, but you must remember these are your first draft so it can be changed. Its good that you are askign for some advice, we first went for planning about 5 years ago and I am secretly happy we were refused as the plans that we have today completely differ from what we would of built back 5 years ago!

I'd love to see the plans you have today?..would u like to share them?

New build in sight

:eek:Are you crazy nryan! I am not as brave as you, I am happy with mine for now expcept for a few changes....
You will get there though, its great that youre getting all this advice before youre at our stage of trying to change things as the process is evolving..... at least you will be starting with a concrete idea of what you like. Can't be a bad thing

Nryan82

New build in sight wrote: »

:eek:Are you crazy nryan! I am not as brave as you, I am happy with mine for now expcept for a few changes....
You will get there though, its great that youre getting all this advice before youre at our stage of trying to change things as the process is evolving..... at least you will be starting with a concrete idea of what you like. Can't be a bad thing

God I don't no if I'm that brave, maybe I am, but I didn't realise der would so many things wrong with my plans and so many negative comments..:(...I no people are only trying to help but god a positive thought here and there wouldn't go astray....people are too negative these days...sad times eh?....like you commented earlier, I love my upstairs, my walkin wardrobe etc, but obviuosly no one else could see this...ahh well.!!!!...everyone to their own I suppose!!!!....maybe you could private mail me them?..up to you tho new build on site.:):)

I've thought hard and long about it all nite and I've decided I'm goin to bring my kitchen slightly around the corner, meaning less floor to window space, and not have more kitchen at the other side, ( not sure what I'll do with that space), but I will move my table maybe more over to that wall. I'm goin to ask my builder to make the room at least 2ft wider and 2ft longer. (I hope he won't add on more dosh)...
And the wc downstairs wheelchair accessible. Oh and I'm gonna out in a window in the kitchen, maybe above the sink, presses then will be along either side of this window. Hopefully this will work out.!!!!

Nryan82

On the layout in general, its not very family friendly. The door to this space is too close to the stove in my opinion.

some door swings are weird, but thats just a drawing error i would think....[/QUOTE]


Sydthebeat where would you suggest I put my stove?. It's something I'm trying to figure out also and yes all the door swings are not properly right yet. People are forgetting this is a rough plan. Thanks.:)

bryaj

Would you consider re-arranging the stairs/hallway to allow you to re-locate the door to the Living Area where the tv is shown.

Nryan82

Hi Bryaj , ya that sounds interesting. So I would be entering my open plan area between the two rooms?. It would proberly have to be a little more in the kitchen side or the living room side tho as from the picture i am havin a slight break between the two rooms, literally the wall coming in a bit rather than a complete flat wall throughout. But it's def something I could think about. I'm trying to think how I could change my stairs...hmmmmm

bryaj

Thus the need for an Architect/Architectural Technician/Technologist.

muffler

Nryan82 wrote: »

but I didn't realise der would so many things wrong with my plans and so many negative comments..:(...I no people are only trying to help but god a positive thought here and there wouldn't go astray....people are too negative these days...sad times eh?

You really shouldn't view the comments as being negative. Anything that has been posted here has been constructive and is meant to help you and certainly not hinder you.

There are comments suggesting on how the layout could be improved and its entirely your choice if you wish to take those comments on board. There are also comments regarding the building regulations but you should not ignore those.

But hey, its your house and if you're happy enough with it (subject to it being built in compliance with building rgs) then thats fine as it will be you living in it.

DOCARCH

Nryan82, you could try this: http://www.simonopendoor.ie/

E 50 (for charity) for a one hour consultation with an architect. You could get a lot of good advice/ideas in one hour. You could always bring your builder with you!

As Muffler said, there is nothing fundamentally 'wrong' with your plans (if you are generally happy with them) but there is certainly a lot of room for tweaking/improving the layout.

Another option would be to engage a good architcet/technician to do the basic plans for you, refine and finalise the design. Then if you feel your builder is up to speed on building regs, etc., let him take it from there. You mentioned E10k before, but for an architcet/technician just to do the design (or refine the existing design), the cost would be a fraction of this.

My personal opinion would be by not getting this input you will not be making the best of what will probably be the biggest investment of your life!