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EV owner gathering - Sandyford
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04-04-2012 2:37pm#1I just thought I'd share some pictures that were taken when a few EV owners met up in Sandyford Luas P+R on Saturday just gone. They have 3 X dual charging posts in one car park and another has 1 X dual charging post, so we thought it was a good place to meet and say hello in person.
We had 5 Nissan's and one BMW EV. I enjoyed seeing 5 Leaf's in one place, but I think for me and everyone else the BMW EV was the most interesting car there!
One of the guys there is doing 110km each way on his daily commute and absolutely loves his car. He also keeps a blog, some might find it an interesting read
http://selfficiency.wordpress.com/
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RoverJames wrote: »I'm sure there's a thread or a link to the build of that BMW on here somewhere
Yes there is, the owner has a few hundred posts on Boards. Nice guy and he did a great job on the conversion of that BMW. Slightly envious that I wouldn't have the knowledge and skills to do what he has done.0 -
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Isn't a Leaf quieter than an equivalent ICE?
I'm not talking about the comfort, more like you see a road closed sign and you can't drive around it becuase it adds KM's to your journey
52000km / year in a Leaf, wonder how long it takes to go from 100% range down to 80% and you lose your ability to get to work on one charge.
My current car is far cheaper to run than a leaf.0 -
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keithclancy wrote: »I'm not talking about the comfort, more like you see a road closed sign and you can't drive around it becuase it adds KM's to your journey
52000km / year in a Leaf, wonder how long it takes to go from 100% range down to 80% and you lose your ability to get to work on one charge.
My current car is far cheaper to run than a leaf.
The Leaf was available in Japan a good bit earlier than the rest of the world. I have heard one owner in Japan has already reached 250,000 kilometers on their Leaf by averaging 6 X fast charges per day. The car and battery were still going fine of course, the degradation I wasn't told except that it was what they expected. But to be honest that does seem reassuring to me as fast charging with 50kW is the hardest on the battery, doing it six times per day and still reaching 250,000 kilometers seems alright to me.
Some of the owners I know have started getting their Leaf's serviced now as well. Some of them have asked to be shown the reading on the battery capacity the diagnostic comes back with. So far there has been zero degradation with the highest mileage I know about personally being 25,000 kilometers in the first year.
The person in question has about 3 fast chargers along his route that he could use if he had to divert. The AA also carry 4kWh packs to charge you at the side of the road. I guess it would also depend on where the road was closed and how much of diversion a person had to take. No one I know is running into these issues though and the charging network becomes more extensive month after month.0 -
Sesshoumaru wrote: »so we thought it was a good place to meet and say hello in person.
How did you say hello in person if you all wore white bags on your heads?0 -
Matt Simis wrote: »How did you say hello in person if you all wore white bags on your heads?
We only put them on when we were taking pictures
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galvo_clare wrote: »My problem with electric cars is that the charging point seems to be at the front in most cases. Is the charging lead long enough to allow you to reverse into a space?
Shouldn't there be at least the option of a charging point at the rear of the car?
The BMW EV had a charging port on the front and the back. But yeah the cable that comes with the Leaf is very long, I think it would let you reverse in and stretch the cable around comfortably. I think the Renault Fluence ZE has two charging ports, one on each side as opposed to front or back. So it should also charge comfortably parked either way. If that's your only major gripe, I think you should go out and test drive one today
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I've driven the Leaf and enjoyed it but living in the Wesht means it's not a runner as yet.Sesshoumaru wrote: »The BMW EV had a charging port on the front and the back. But yeah the cable that comes with the Leaf is very long, I think it would let you reverse in and stretch the cable around comfortably. I think the Renault Fluence ZE has two charging ports, one on each side as opposed to front or back. So it should also charge comfortably parked either way. If that's your only major gripe, I think you should go out and test drive one today0 -
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RoverJames wrote: »I'm sure there's a thread or a link to the build of that BMW on here somewhere
Anyone have a link to that? Can't seem to find it searching...0 -
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keithclancy wrote: »
My current car is far cheaper to run than a leaf.
Isnt motor tax and fuel really expensive in Holland? Unless you've taken the engine out and push it verywhere I dont see how it's possible.
I'm goign to guess your figures are based on using depreciation on a car you bought for €1000 thats finished depreciating Vs buyign a brand new Leaf? If so that a large amount of number fudging and not as simple as is made out with a short staement that its cheaper to tun than a leaf.
If you could take a brand new €30k Leaf and any new €30k ICE car and run it cheaper I'd be interested to see how.Sesshoumaru wrote: »
I'd say you'd get an interestign reaction from the first Gard that spots that in the back if you drove around without the parcel shelf. :-)0 -
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Guy:Incognito wrote: »I'd say you'd get an interestign reaction from the first Gard that spots that in the back if you drove around without the parcel shelf. :-)
I hadn't thought about that, but I think it's possible they might act first and ask questions later
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September1 wrote: »There are maybe in best case 200 EVs so 6 cars makes 3% of population, that would require 60.000 ICEs to make a comparable meet out of around 2m in Irish Republic.
Good point! That's a great meet.
This picture will have a nice flavour in a few years.
Most people don't realize it, but EVs are today what petrol cars were 110-120 years ago.
Back in the days, the first automobile drivers had the same range issue, and there were not many petrol stations around! Cars were slow and expensive, while with your good horse was faster and you could stop every few mile in a farm to feed him
History repeats itself and we should learn from that. Thanks to this crown of visionaries to be here to share that with us soon-or-later-followers 0 -
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And what? I dont get the point, car meets are about the interesting cars and people that attend and crucially the amount and variety. 5 very similar EVs isnt much of a meet. Maybe thats all that can be reasonably expected in Ireland, but why should anyone care about the % vs population... such a tweed jacket assessment.September1 wrote: »There are maybe in best case 200 EVs so 6 cars makes 3% of population, that would require 60.000 ICEs to make a comparable meet out of around 2m in Irish Republic.
So many ironies here in a short post. Let me see... are you aware that we had EVs at the dawn of the motor car 170years ago? Many of "the first automobile drivers" were EV drivers.Most people don't realize it, but EVs are today what petrol cars were 110-120 years ago.
Back in the days, the first automobile drivers had the same range issue, and there were not many petrol stations around! Cars were slow and expensive, while with your good horse was faster and you could stop every few mile in a farm to feed him
History repeats itself and we should learn from that. Thanks to this crown of visionaries to be here to share that with us soon-or-later-followers
The first widespread rollout, a "fleet of EV cars" was a taxi company in New York in 1897.
EV today are not what petrol cars were 120years ago at all, they have kept pace and unsurprisingly are exactly what they were to petrol cars then, inferior. They may get better, but right now, they are just not (in general applications). Current EVs are either the sum of 150years (birth of EV cars proper) or 60 years (renewed attempts to re-introduce) of design and evolution take your pick, not some turn of the 21st century unfledged technology.
To state "history repeats itself" as a proponent of EVs shows how tragically ignorant you are of transport history. If history repeats itself then what killed EVs then will kill them now: price of engine vs ICE, cost of fuel and crippling range problems.
I dont want to be overly down on EVs, but the tripe that surrounds them grates. They have an application in intra-metro transport (and at that in situations not served by public transport), but I for one would rather see dispersed populations than highly concentrated pop zones.0 -
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Poll it then?Without meaning to sound smart, i'd find both the Leaf and its owners far more interesting than most cars/owners. This is new & exciting stuff, to me at least.
I love technology, work in it everyday so perhaps Im tiring of it quicker, but the goals (frugality and dubious environment credentials) and achievements (travelling at 100kph on a motorway to assuredly get to the next charging point) are basically inverted from my own and I would consider myself an enthusiast. Once you get over the "your fuel is the same fuel as my Macbook uses" bit, the rest is shallow and deathly silent. Its like getting excited over the new Tiida or Fiesta.0 -
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Never mind the current goals and achievements, that's only marketing. Look instead at the innate qualities of EV. Endless torque, peerless refinement, these are qualities we struggle to get from a V12. I love fast cars too, but EV makes ICE look crude & dated. All we need now are better batteries.Matt Simis wrote: »Poll it then?
I love technology, work in it everyday so perhaps Im tiring of it quicker, but the goals (frugality and dubious environment credentials) and achievements (travelling at 100kph on a motorway to assuredly get to the next charging point) are basically inverted from my own and I would consider myself an enthusiast. Once you get over the "your fuel is the same fuel as my Macbook uses" bit, the rest is shallow and deathly silent. Its like getting excited over the new Tiida or Fiesta.0 -
Matt Simis wrote: »Poll it then?
I love technology...........
I agree wholeheartedly, I'm not into iphones and all that sort of electronic stuff but I like technology, I find EVs boring as feck.0 -
Never mind the current goals and achievements, that's only marketing. Look instead at the innate qualities of EV. Endless torque, peerless refinement, these are qualities we struggle to get from a V12. I love fast cars too, but EV makes ICE look crude & dated. All we need now are better batteries.
meh, when my V12 fires I need nothing more 0 -
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Eric Cartman wrote: »while its exciting to look at an electric car just to see how it ticks, the bmw is about the only interesting thing at that meet really , having 5-6 people standing around talking about how much money theyre all saving and sharing stories about trying to find a charging point within the range given on the display and when new charging points are opening and the glory of 3 phase electricity and all just regurgitating the same thing is not fun.
In the same way that an ICE car meet wouldnt be fun if everybody drove a new octavia, I have no doubt that EV meets will get better when theres more variety but the same cars with the same specs all under warranty so no talk to be had about modding / repairing doesnt sound very fun.
I have gotten used to combating the myths surrounding the cars themselves, didn't think I'd have to talk about the owners
I guess the one thing I've noticed most owners have in common is that they are all technology enthusiasts to one degree or another. However all the EV owners I've met so far are generally all very different to one another and interesting in their own ways. Without going into all the details, they're quite a varied selection of people! In the same way that ICE owners at a meet-up might all stand around talking about how great their car sounds... EV owners will obviously have some discussion of cost savings... I can assure you though the scenario you imagined in your head didn't happen
Just an example of something we might talk about - Plans for battery packs once they do degrade to 80% capacity. Ideas put out there include installing it in your home and using it store night rate electricity and running your home during the day off that stored night rate electricity.
I suppose you might say that also covers cost saving, but just speaking for myself, the technical challenge of doing something like that is what interests me the most. Same way it was asked of the BMW owner how much the car cost to build, but most of us were simply more interested in the technical achievement.0 -
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Is it the concept of EV that you find boring, or just cars like the Leaf/Fluence?
I find the Leaf/Fluence etc absolutely depressingly soul destroying. Conceptually the concept of EVs and their inherent benefits that I think you already mentioned are appealing on paper but in practice I think even with perfect batteries they'd be rather sterile.
I can really appreciate technology in many applications, I worked in a place where the process started off with a single ovarian cell from a Chinese Hamster onto which a protein was injected, this was allowed grow/multiply into litres and litres of the stuff which was eventually injected to treat rheumatoid arthritis, I wasn't a fan of biology at school but thought that pretty funky.
Going to the other extreme I think a properly controlled and treated steam boiler can be interesting and almost an achievement when managed correctly to minimise water and fuel use while maximising steam output, I've messed about with lasers to try and use diffraction patterns off wire coils to investigate the regularity of the windings.
I like some statistical stuff even, EVs though, yuk.
I like the way an ICE is less refined when cold and gets oh so smooth as it heats up, an ICE seems almost alive imo 0 -
Eric Cartman wrote: », why do manufacturers feel the need to differenciate EV vehicles by making them look so ugly and different. You know somethings an electric car because it looks like one. The day they make something like a 7 series or a landcruiser in EV and it looks like an ICE car then they will be comparable. At the moment manufacturers seem to want to promote EV vehicles on paper , but make them as niche as possible in reality
Just because you say something doesnt make it true.
The Leaf fits in pretty semlessly with the styling of Nissan's range imo. I'm also failign to see how an electric Kangoo or Fluence looks any different to the ICE versions. Even the Tesla looks broadly the same as the Elise its based on.RoverJames wrote: »I find the Leaf/Fluence etc absolutely depressingly soul destroying.
It actually sound like you have your toys and your afraid someone is goign to come take them off you. The hatred and/or fear of Ev's on this forum is comign across as very narrow minded. You;d nearly swear some of you owned oil companies.
I'll probably never own one but I love the thought of them. I like that they exist.Technology and innovation is brilliant. Where would we be if everyoen decided wed advanced enough 100 years ago?0 -
I have to admit, that's a pretty good answer. Perhaps more applicable to classics than to everyday cars, though?RoverJames wrote: »I find the Leaf/Fluence etc absolutely depressingly soul destroying. Conceptually the concept of EVs and their inherent benefits that I think you already mentioned are appealing on paper but in practice I think even with perfect batteries they'd be rather sterile.
I can really appreciate technology in many applications, I worked in a place where the process started off with a single ovarian cell from a Chinese Hamster onto which a protein was injected, this was allowed grow/multiply into litres and litres of the stuff which was eventually injected to treat rheumatoid arthritis, I wasn't a fan of biology at school but thought that pretty funky.
Going to the other extreme I think a properly controlled and treated steam boiler can be interesting and almost an achievement when managed correctly to minimise water and fuel use while maximising steam output, I've messed about with lasers to try and use diffraction patterns off wire coils to investigate the regularity of the windings.
I like some statistical stuff even, EVs though, yuk.
I like the way an ICE is less refined when cold and gets oh so smooth as it heats up, an ICE seems almost alive imo0 -
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Eric Cartman wrote: »there have been a lot of advancments in ICE tech, but let me just pander to you, ok even if the drivetrain was all that, why do manufacturers feel the need to differenciate EV vehicles by making them look so ugly and different. You know somethings an electric car because it looks like one. The day they make something like a 7 series or a landcruiser in EV and it looks like an ICE car then they will be comparable. At the moment manufacturers seem to want to promote EV vehicles on paper , but make them as niche as possible in reality
No one notices my car is electric, unless they are aware specifically about the Nissan Leaf. I never get anyone coming over to ask about the car unless I'm plugging it in and it's blatantly obvious it's not a regular diesel / petrol car. When I'm plugging it in to a public charger you would get people coming over and asking about it, usually that's the only time!
My personal opinion of the cars styling is that it is nice. However it won't be long before the VW Golf electric and new Ford Focus electric are on the market. So if you want more mainstream styling you will have the choice!
http://www.autoevolution.com/news/volkswagen-golf-electric-to-use-e-golf-name-43425.html
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2012/mar/29/ford-focus-electric-dell-build?newsfeed=true
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