Israel's unhealthy neurosis will make our lives a misery

Wild Bill

Einhard wrote: »

Hate those sarky :rolleyes: faces more than I hate these threads to be honest...

So much hatred :cool:

Wild Bill

Paddy looks in the mirror :rolleyes:

paddyandy wrote: »

Grayson; That is about the sum of what most of boards activity is about .An Ego Trip for little people who have managed to acquire and figure out how to use a computer and have lot's of fun like ten year olds ......and do it sometimes using serious ongoing issues .

Nodin

paddyandy wrote: »

key in 'arabs have nothing to offer ' on utube . Go on give yourself a treat .

paddyandy wrote:

Grayson; That is about the sum of what most of boards activity is about .An Ego Trip for little people who have managed to acquire and figure out how to use a computer and have lot's of fun like ten year olds ......and do it sometimes using serious ongoing issues

A man whose coherent posts are notable solely by virtue of their scarcity denigrates an entire people and boards users in general....

Grayson

Nodin wrote: »

A man whose coherent posts are notable solely by virtue of their scarcity denigrates an entire people and boards users in general....

An entire people??

Nodin

Grayson wrote: »

An entire people??

What would you call it then? Because it doesn't look like hes being complimentary.

paddyandy wrote:

key in 'arabs have nothing to offer ' on utube . Go on give yourself a treat

Grayson

I thought you were talking about me. That was my ego kicking in

Nodin

Grayson wrote: »

I thought you were talking about me. That was my ego kicking in

I see why you'd think that though. I edited the post there to make it clearer.

cyberhog

Israel's unhealthy neurosis is costing jobs in Europe.

Operations at a Peugeot auto plant in northeastern France have been suspended until at least September because of the lack of spare parts from Iran, union officials said on Thursday.

...

Management from PSA Peugeot Citroen last week put 220 employees at its Vesoul factory in partial redundancy for the month of April due to a slowdown caused by blocked shipments from Iran.

This latest decision will require redeploying another 300 workers and the axeing of 300 part-time jobs, a CGT union source said.

http://www.expatica.com/fr/news/french-news/peugeot-factory-hit-by-iran-sanctions-fallout_219890.html

czx

RichieC wrote: »

Iran have indeed signed the NPT.

Their supreme leader also issued a fatwa against nuclear weapons and has repeatedly came out against their production on moral, religious and tactical grounds. Though it is deemed unimportant by western media and goes unreported.

For good reason and long may it continue.

czx

marcsignal wrote: »

Just that their scaremongering in the US Senate, could lead to yet another conflict in the ME, when in reality, they are whinging about the Iranians doing, exactly what they were doing themselves in the 1980's.

kettle, pot, black ??




Don't know if Iran is a member, so can't comment.

Best solution, imo, is NO nukes in the ME, full stop.

Well done, captain obvious. Check back in when you have a grasp on reality.

cyberhog

czx wrote: »

For good reason and long may it continue.

I'm not sure what good reason you think there is to ignore Khamenei but it's clear The White House is treating his message seriously.

President Obama has signaled Iran that the United States would accept an Iranian civilian nuclear program if Supreme Leader Ali Khamenei can back up his recent public claim that his nation “will never pursue nuclear weapons.”

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/obamas-signal-to-iran/2012/04/05/gIQApVLDyS_story.html

DEFTLEFTHAND

Just as Nostradamus predicted, the war to end all wars will come from the east and a certain race of troublesome people will be at the epicentre.

Chuck Stone

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Just as Nostradamus predicted, the war to end all wars will come from the east and a certain race of troublesome people will be at the epicentre.

That's a Mount Rushmore proportioned facepalm sculpture for you, son.

DEFTLEFTHAND

Chuck Stone wrote: »

That's a Mount Rushmore proportioned facepalm sculpture for you, son.

Did I give any opinion? I'm just relaying the prophecy my friend.

Ellian

czx wrote: »

For good reason and long may it continue.

I don't understand your logic here. Khamenei says that nuclear weapons are completely at odds with his understanding of Islam. It is good to ignore it because

(a) it goes against the popular perception of Iran's intention towards nuclear capability.

(b) you think he is lying, it is propoganda and he should not be given a platform to spout his lies.

If (a) then I think it very definitely should be given coverage, and if (b) then I would rather it were aired and let people reach that conclusion themselves. (Or show the statement and then have some back and forth analysis of his statement and it's veracity)

There may be a (c) that I have not considered. Can you please elaborate.

Capt'n Midnight

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Just as Nostradamus predicted, the war to end all wars will come from the east and a certain race of troublesome people will be at the epicentre.
...
Did I give any opinion? I'm just relaying the prophecy my friend.

Please indicate which quatrain you are referring to


otherwise we'll have to assume you are just parroting someone else's - probably biased - interpretation. Because let's face it even French speakers have problems with the bad French Nostrodamus used

Oh yeah , war from the east, pretty safe bet , Barbarian hordes, Mongols, Russians, Chinese, India, Ottomans expecially in the 16th century when land to the west was still a trade secret


http://www.propheties.it/no/nostradamus.html

Wild Bill

Just as Nostradamus predicted, the war to end all wars will come from the east and a certain race of troublesome people will be at the epicentre.

So, the Americans are going to launch a preemptive strike on China?

I just knew it! :mad:

DEFTLEFTHAND

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Please indicate which quatrain you are referring to


otherwise we'll have to assume you are just parroting someone else's - probably biased - interpretation. Because let's face it even French speakers have problems with the bad French Nostrodamus used

Oh yeah , war from the east, pretty safe bet , Barbarian hordes, Mongols, Russians, Chinese, India, Ottomans expecially in the 16th century when land to the west was still a trade secret


http://www.propheties.it/no/nostradamus.html

I know Nostrodamus is open to wide interpretation, Don't shoot the messenger they may be some truth in this, the world's end could very well centre around those problem people.

paddyandy

Many peoples could be described as troublesome depending on who is writing the history .....Did'nt we have that title for centuries .?..A war to end all wars was supposed to have been the ww1 but it was'nt .On a dark night the shadows can take many shapes of ones own choosing ...joining up the dots with a bit of clever psychology ....gypsy tent .

RMD

There is so much ignorance surrounding this subject it's outstanding. I'm not some conspiracy theory nut but the majority of information provided by Western media is false or biased. They'll happily slap Ahmadinejad's latest nonsensical rant all over the headlines yet wont tell you how little power he actually possesses and how the Supreme Leader (the real top dog) issued a Fatwa against nuclear arms.

Ahmadinejad's view on nuclear arms is about as effective within Iran as Michael Higgins saying he'd like Ireland to develop nuclear arms.

bnt

RichieC wrote: »

Iran have indeed signed the NPT.

Their supreme leader also issued a fatwa against nuclear weapons and has repeatedly came out against their production on moral, religious and tactical grounds. Though it is deemed unimportant by western media and goes unreported.

I saw it reported (e.g. here), but so what? In a Theocracy such as Iran, there are no "checks and balances" on law. There is no real separation of religion and state, or legislation and state, despite the existence of the puppet parliament. A Fatwa issued today can be countermanded by another Fatwa tomorrow. The Fatwa is basically an expression of Khamanei's opinion, and he won't be around forever.

I have been critical of Israel's policies e.g. towards Palestine, but the existential threat they are under is not imaginary. It's not paranoia if they really are out to get you.

old_aussie

Just keep pumping the narcotis into iran till they give oil to score.

Jaafa

bnt wrote: »

I saw it reported (e.g. here), but so what? In a Theocracy such as Iran, there are no "checks and balances" on law. There is no real separation of religion and state, or legislation and state, despite the existence of the puppet parliament. A Fatwa issued today can be countermanded by another Fatwa tomorrow. The Fatwa is basically an expression of Khamanei's opinion, and he won't be around forever.

I have been critical of Israel's policies e.g. towards Palestine, but the existential threat they are under is not imaginary. It's not paranoia if they really are out to get you.

The Ayatollah is the supreme leader, when he issues a fatwa in a theocracy such as Iran, it is law. No one can issue 'counter fatwas' against it, and even if they did no one would pay attention to it. Only he can withdraw the fatwa and as such, if he dies before that happens then the fatwa becomes essentially permanent.

They cannot make an excuse to go against this fatwa later on, to do so would undermine the entire basis under-which the Islamic Republic was founded. It would be the equivalent of the US making some excuse to change to a one party system.

No matter what the excuse people would lose all faith in the political structure and you can bet a second revolution would be on the way.

This is not some personal speculative analysis of the situation, this is common knowledge for anyone who knows the first thing about how the political structure in Iran works.

cyberhog

RMD wrote: »

Ahmadinejad's view on nuclear arms is about as effective within Iran as Michael Higgins saying he'd like Ireland to develop nuclear arms.

let's be clear, Ahmadinejad is not and never has been in favour of nuclear weapons.

2006

"Nuclear weapons have no place in Iran's defense doctrine and Iran is not a threat to any country..."

"You must know that, because of our beliefs and our religion...[w]e are against the atomic bomb."

2007

Any party who uses national revenues to make a bomb, a nuclear bomb, will make a mistake. Because in political relations right now, the nuclear bomb is of no use....we don't need such weapons. In fact, we think that this is inhuman."

"Making nuclear, chemical and biological bombs and weapons of mass destruction is yet another result of the misuse of science and research by the big powers." ... "We do not believe in nuclear weapons, period. It goes against the whole grain of humanity."

2008

"Our position is very clear...We believe that a nuclear weapon has no use, obsolete. Anyone who has a nuclear weapons does not create any political advantage for themselves."

The production and the usage of nuclear weapons is one of the most abhorrent acts to our eyes."

2009

We don't need nuclear weapons. Without such weapons, we are very much able to defend ourselves...It's not a part of any – of our programs and plans."

"[W]e do not want to make a bomb...Our policy is transparent. If we wanted to make a bomb we would be brave enough to say so. When we say that we are not making one, we are not. We do not believe in it."

2010

"The nuclear bomb is a fire against humanity rather than a weapon for defense." He continued, "The possession of nuclear bombs is not a source of pride; it is rather disgusting and shameful.

"We are not seeking the bomb. We have no interest in it.

2011

"When we say we don't have any intention to build a bomb, we're honest and sincere. We believe that today if someone wants to build a bomb he's crazy and insane...An atomic bomb is against all humans."

We do not want nuclear weapons. We do not seek nuclear weapons. This is an inhumane weapon. Because of our beliefs we are against that.

"I've said many times we don't want a bomb and we are against any nuclear bombs."

http://www.wideasleepinamerica.com/2012/02/obama-lies-about-iranian-nuclear.html

Osama Bin Elmo

Israel try to tell other country around Israel what they do. Not exceptable!! Israel persecute muslims in gaza and steal land from others. Israel think they tell other people what to do and have no respect for muslim people. It is part world wide conspiracy too by zionist led campaign with Israel and America to weaken and wound Islamic world. Do not hear Israel deceit, Iran right to have bomb like any other country.

Toby Take a Bow

Osama Bin Elmo wrote: »

It is part world wide conspiracy too by zionist led campaign with Israel and America to weaken and wound Islamic world.

Ah, the worldwide Zionist conspiracy. When you're finished with your copy of The Protocols of the Elders of Zion, you might want to read a little about who wrote that book (you know: who really wrote that book).

It's funny how America are attempting to 'weaken and wound' the Islamic world while propping up the Saudi dynasty.

RichieC

Toby Take a Bow wrote: »

It's funny how America are attempting to 'weaken and wound' the Islamic world while propping up the Saudi dynasty.

What good for the Islamic world does propping up a brutal regime do? Without US support the Saudi regime wouldn't last a good piss.

Toby Take a Bow

RichieC wrote: »

What good for the Islamic world does propping up a brutal regime do? Without US support the Saudi regime wouldn't last a good piss.

I agree. However, it's not done to wound the Islamic world (whatever the 'Islamic world' is).

RichieC

Toby Take a Bow wrote: »

I agree. However, it's not done to wound the Islamic world (whatever the 'Islamic world' is).

It's certainly not done in their best interests, either.

Toby Take a Bow

RichieC wrote: »

It's certainly not done in their best interests, either.

Nope. It's done to further their own interests. However, believing that America is doing it to further a Zionist world-dominance conspiracy clouds the issue somewhat.

uncle_sam_ie

The question is will Russia and China allow the west to have control over Iran. They drew the line in the sand with Syria. Going to war with Iran could push a wider war with severe consequences for the rest of us. The Russian's aren't stupid and there're not buying the propaganda coming from the US and Israel.

Toby Take a Bow

uncle_sam_ie wrote: »

The Russian's aren't stupid and there're not buying the propaganda coming from the US and Israel.

The Russians have never bought 'western' propaganda. I think the shift has come now that the countries involved (Syria, Iran) are considered 'grey' areas in terms of perceptions of sphere of influence.

timesnap

Toby Take a Bow wrote: »

The Russians have never bought 'western' propaganda.

This is true they only bought Putins propaganda,as an ex KGB man he knows the value of propaganda more than most.
luckily the Russian people see through him now.

Wild Bill

timesnap wrote: »

luckily the Russian people see through him now.

I guess that's why the recent elections and Western opinion polls (taken in Russia) give him 65% support :rolleyes:

Something most Western Regimes can only dream of.

timesnap

Wild Bill wrote: »

I guess that's why the recent elections and Western opinion polls (taken in Russia) give him 65% support

Putin had been president before for two terms.
under the Russian Constitution he could not run for a third consecutive term so a deal was done to put his puppet in the role of president to erm 'respect' the constitution.
He remained the president in all but name.
Big surprise his puppet pulled another surprise and chose not to run for a second term as President but was happy to run for PM,which in theory is a lower office..
Don't kid yourself,Putin has had the last word in Russia since Yeltsin went and now he still has.

I don't know where you were looking that you believe that if the election had been free and fair he would have got anything like 65%?
The election was rigged in the sense that his 'opponents' ran a non campaign but it could not actually be proven that it was rigged because he had 'opponents'.
Did you miss the vox pops before the election where ordinary Russians demonstrated their dwellings,no heat,buildings falling apart,mould,rubbish uncollected for months and so on......most of them said even under the Soviets they at least did not have to live with that amount of hardship.

Did you miss the unprecedented anger towards him on the streets of Russia.

I am sure you know that he closed down any TV channel that was critical of him,same with newspapers.
I am sure you know his genuine political opponents ended up in jail or fleeing the Country slowly but surely when he got comfy in the Presidents chair.
He is a Soviet and egocentric at heart,and always will be.

Wild Bill

timesnap wrote: »

I don't know where you were looking that you believe that if the election had been free and fair he would have got anything like 65%?

Opinon polls by Western pollsters gave him about 65% support before the vote; which is roughly what he got.

Live with it :cool:

In America hundreds of thousands of "Occupy Wall street" protesters on the streets don't amount to a hill of electoral beans.

Ditto with the anti-Putin protesters in Moscow.

timesnap

Wild Bill wrote: »

Opinon polls by Western pollsters gave him about 65% support before the vote; which is roughly what he got.

Live with it :cool:

He is NO democrat, live with it.:cool:

uncle_sam_ie

timesnap wrote: »

He is NO democrat, live with it.:cool:

That protest or CIA colour revolution was dangerous and wont work in Russia. Russia lost over 20 million dead in WW2. They know their history so, don't take them for fools.

marcsignal

czx wrote: »

Well done, captain obvious. Check back in when you have a grasp on reality.

wow!:eek: did you think up that rebuttal all by yourself ??

I bet ricky gervais is shitting in his pants right now.

Wild Bill

timesnap wrote: »

He is NO democrat, live with it.:cool:

Nobody said he was!

He was, however, as democratically elected as O'Bama, Enda Kenny or Le Midget Sarky :cool:

Reality bites

timesnap

uncle_sam_ie wrote: »

That protest or CIA colour revolution was dangerous and wont work in Russia. Russia lost over 20 million dead in WW2. They know their history so, don't take them for fools.

If by CIA revolution you mean that America tried to influence the result of the election,you may well be right,it would hardly be the first time it did with other Countries, personally i think they would prefer to stick with the 'divil they know'.
Putin certainly knew that focusing on interference by America perceived or real would get ordinary Russian people backs up and he played on their pride and patriotism.
They certainly do know their history,and what a shame that 20 million lost their lives in the fight against fascism only for the victory over the nazi's to lead to most of eastern Europe having to live under another form of tyranny for so long:(
Mr uncle_sam_ie, Tear down that wall that stops people seeing Putin for what he is.

Wild Bill wrote: »

Nobody said he was!

He did!:pac:

cyberhog

If you would like to read a more in-depth analysis of the point raised in the OP follow the link below.

Economic war led by Washington (and encouraged by Israel) will not take down the Iranian government or bring it to the bargaining table on its knees ready to surrender its nuclear program. It might, however, lead to actual armed conflict with incalculable consequences.

http://www.juancole.com/2012/04/washingtons-dangerous-blockade-of-iran-cole-at-tomdispatch.html

cyberhog

The head of Transneft thinks we are committing "hara-kiri" and I, for one, agree with him!

The head of Russian state monopoly “Transneft”, says compensating for the loss of Iranian supplies which the EU will not get because of the sanctions is almost unreal.

“It’s difficult to make up for this volume and imposing sanctions against Iran is like committing “hara-kiri” by the Europeans. And this policy of theirs can hardly be explained by common sense. It looks as an attempt not to be lagging behind a more powerful global player”, said Nikolay Tokarev.

http://rt.com/business/news/iran-oil-embargo-impose-sanctions-696/

paddyandy

There are possibly a hundred people in Ireland who understand the ME fully and that maybe too optimistic .We don't even understand our own history and if we do .....why the failure after blaming england and currently rome in the crosshairs after all these years .
We don't know and why ? We never cared enough is my view .