M7 - Naas/Newbridge Bypass Upgrade [Junction 9a now open]

benny79

SoupyNorman wrote: »

The real issue is not the 60kph limit, it's the barriers i.e. no hard shoulder. Any hint of a breakdown, accident = absolute standstill.

When traffic is flowing, 60kph is about all you can do anyway with the volume. Personally, I feel like people are making the speed limit out to be this horrendous thing when it's not that bad.

When all lanes re-open, time savings wont be massive (3-5mins?) but the daily consistency of journey time will/should improve.

Hopefully! if it doesnt ill be on suicide watch...lol..

Pablod

benny79 wrote: »

Hopefully! if it doesnt ill be on suicide watch...lol..

Ditto, the worst part about this whole upgrade (and its been mentioned by a few members already) is not the progress, its that it won't make much difference Dublin bound in mornings, main difference will be evening commutes outbound (hopefully).
Then with new estates being built in Naas, Kildare, Newbridge and Athy we'll be back to square one again in about a year... 😣

Surprise!

Induced demand actually is a real-world phenomenon and the only solution to increasing gridlock is to provide high quality realistic public transport.

Pablod

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Surprise!

Induced demand actually is a real-world phenomenon and the only solution to increasing gridlock is to provide high quality realistic public transport.

Totally agreed on the public transport.
Surprise? No, every dog on the street can see thats what will happen, unfortunately the issue is no future-planning/futute-proofing

MaceFace

I do wonder about the outbound improvement. I would guess the big issues are the on-ramp at Naas north having to join what is a 2-lane road. At rush hour, with a lot of traffic entering, it forces a lot of cars to move over and thus a big slowdown. From that point, cars behind slow down and cause a backlog and ahead, with only 2 lanes, it results in a lot of cars changing lane trying to race the traffic resulting in more braking incidents and thus contributing more to the slow down.
Another problem is that everyone seems to want to stay in the outside lane and that doesn't seem to change until the M9 split. This should hopefully sort that.

Hopefully, with 3 lanes, cars entering at different junctions should not impact all 3 lanes as middle lane hoggers will remain there and those cars that do 60 km/h whatever the limit will remain in the inside line.

So, it's not just the additional road capacity but traffic behaviour.

It's probably all nonsense though but I'm hoping...

Pablod

Pablod wrote: »

Totally agreed on the public transport.
Surprise? No, every dog on the street can see thats what will happen, unfortunately the issue is no future-planning/futute-proofing

You would be surprised how many people think road expansion will solve congestion and gridlock, including on this thread!

MaceFace

[Deleted User] wrote: »

You would be surprised how many people think road expansion will solve congestion and gridlock, including on this thread!

Not sure many think it will solve anything but surely more capacity is better than less capacity?

MaceFace

MaceFace wrote: »

surely more capacity is better than less capacity?

Not when increased capacity causes even more demand than the newly added capacity. It causes even worse congestion.

The N/M7 became a massive commuter corridor because high quality roads (that kept on getting upgraded) caused developers to build ever more housing estates for Dublin commuters at ludicrous distances from Dublin.

Developers will go with the easier and lower risk option of cheap landcosts in e.g. Ballyroan Co Laois for a commuter housing estate vs Newcastle, Leixlip, Dunboyne, the vast expanse of land beyond the airport etc etc.

Wait and see, you're already starting to see lots of new development spurred on by the prospect of the M7 upgrade and it's going to really take off as soon as the roadworks finish.

The M7 will be busier and slower than ever very soon despite the added capacity.

Chris_5339762

All true, sadly, but what I will say is that two two lane motorways (the M7 and M9) coming together into a two lane M7 which then expands to three lanes at the N7 part is just silly. Its never going to work. Similarly outbound, for the three lane N7 to narrow to a two lane M7 which then effectively becomes a four lane M7/M9 is just going to be a disaster. So the widening makes much more sense in that respect.

Planning in the Greater Dublin area, and in Ireland is general, is a topic of discussion in itself.

marno21

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

All true, sadly, but what I will say is that two two lane motorways (the M7 and M9) coming together into a two lane M7 which then expands to three lanes at the N7 part is just silly. Its never going to work. Similarly outbound, for the three lane N7 to narrow to a two lane M7 which then effectively becomes a four lane M7/M9 is just going to be a disaster. So the widening makes much more sense in that respect.

Planning in the Greater Dublin area, and in Ireland is general, is a topic of discussion in itself.

Indeed. The primary benefit from the inbound widening is safety benefit of less congestion along there. The congestion towards the M50 can be effectively managed using variable speed limits.

The outbound congestion, especially for M9 bound traffic, will be a significant improvement.

marno21

MOD:

The widening on the M7 is nearly finished, we've lived through 15 months of it so I think we can deal with one more month.

Can we go back to discussing this scheme, its progress and not the following:

* Speed vans
* Work hours on the scheme
* The speed limit through the works
* Planning in Ireland

The first three topics have been done to death now and won't be changing no matter how much moaning goes on.

The last topic is for another thread

Thank you.

Cazale

Anyone know when they plan to erect the bridge at junction 9a? What timescale would it take to put up etc?

jmkennedyie

Cazale wrote: »

Anyone know when they plan to erect the bridge at junction 9a? What timescale would it take to put up etc?

I suspect this weekend or next. They have realigned mainline at bridge site, dodging the fresh scaffolding on middle pier.

Based on previous I expect notice to appear on http://www.m7upgrade.com first.

I expect 2 or three nights would do it. But then decking and surfacing and bollards maybe a month.

At North Liffey bridge site there is some progress: looks like a 14th beam delivered . Crane still there. Beams being prepped with formwork for overhangs etc. Dont think any installed yet.

_Kaiser_

marno21 wrote: »

Indeed. The primary benefit from the inbound widening is safety benefit of less congestion along there. The congestion towards the M50 can be effectively managed using variable speed limits.

The outbound congestion, especially for M9 bound traffic, will be a significant improvement.

This all remains to be seen - far from certain.

As it is, inbound traffic is often at a standstill in the mornings at junction 7. The road widening, while welcome and will give some improvement in the short term anyway, will only have the effect of getting traffic there quicker. You reference variable limits but that's pie in the sky stuff given how things move this country - these issues exist now, today!

Equally, while the outbound lane will help with the mess at Naas, a lot of this is down to driver behavior (people cutting in/out of the 2 lane section at the last moment) and I fully expect these issues to just shift down to the Carlow exit instead.

In any case, just as with the existing 3 lanes of the N7, M50, N2 etc, lane 1 will be underused or occupied by slow moving vehicles (whether legitimately restricted like trucks, or just dawdlers) and so the benefit will not be as dramatic as some seem to be expecting. "Ah but the gardai can enforce that" right... Because they do such a good job elsewhere as is (and are often the biggest offenders themselves!)

But, it's (almost, finally) done now anyway. I won't be surprised however when we're all back here next year or sooner talking about the ridiculous traffic again.

They should have spent the money on a motorway grade link to the M4 from Naas, or widening the N81 to take some of the pressure off, but maybe next time..

MaceFace

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

As it is, inbound traffic is often at a standstill in the mornings at junction 7. The road widening, while welcome and will give some improvement in the short term anyway, will only have the effect of getting traffic there quicker.

I don't think that will be the case. Today, lots of people are leaving for work much earlier than 18 months ago as they need to factor in the additional 15 minutes (or whatever it is for the individual) at the roadworks. When the road opens, they can go back to leaving 15 minutes later, getting to the next problem point (Jnct 7?) at the same time as they do today.

Pablod

Source: Kildare Nationalist FB

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M7 Naas Newbridge Bypass Upgrade
Traffic Diversions – Friday 12, Saturday 13 and Sunday 14 April
As part of the M7 Upgrade project and the construction of the new Osberstown Interchange, bridge beams are to be lifted into place across the M7 motorway at Junction 9a between junctions 9 (Naas North) and Junction 10 (Naas South)
These works will take place over the weekend of Friday 12, Saturday 13 & Sunday 14 April.
In order to safely carry out these works and maintain M7 mainline traffic in both directions traffic will be directed around the area of works via the newly constructed off/on slips of the new interchange.
This temporary arrangement will continue through until early Sunday 14 April until this stage of the bridge works are complete and the main carriageway has been cleared. It is expected that traffic will be returned to the mainline in both directions for 09.00hrs on Sunday subject to completion of all necessary activities.
A minimum of two lanes will be maintained during peak hours of 06.00hrs to 22.00hrs at all times.
Delays are expected.
Any inconvenience caused to the public is regretted

---

iseegirls

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Equally, while the outbound lane will help with the mess at Naas, a lot of this is down to driver behavior (people cutting in/out of the 2 lane section at the last moment) and I fully expect these issues to just shift down to the Carlow exit instead.

Unlike at the Naas exit, the M9 exit will not be used as a quick exit and re-enter back onto the M7. A lot of mess at Naas is the huge amount of traffic joining at Naas North going southbound. This won't be happening after M9 exit, and so the traffic shouldnt be at a standstill, which will lead cars to stay in their correct lanes coming up to the split (hopefully).

MICKEYG

Pablod wrote: »

Source: Kildare Nationalist FB

---

M7 Naas Newbridge Bypass Upgrade
Traffic Diversions – Friday 12, Saturday 13 and Sunday 14 April
As part of the M7 Upgrade project and the construction of the new Osberstown Interchange, bridge beams are to be lifted into place across the M7 motorway at Junction 9a between junctions 9 (Naas North) and Junction 10 (Naas South)
These works will take place over the weekend of Friday 12, Saturday 13 & Sunday 14 April.
In order to safely carry out these works and maintain M7 mainline traffic in both directions traffic will be directed around the area of works via the newly constructed off/on slips of the new interchange.
This temporary arrangement will continue through until early Sunday 14 April until this stage of the bridge works are complete and the main carriageway has been cleared. It is expected that traffic will be returned to the mainline in both directions for 09.00hrs on Sunday subject to completion of all necessary activities.
A minimum of two lanes will be maintained during peak hours of 06.00hrs to 22.00hrs at all times.
Delays are expected.
Any inconvenience caused to the public is regretted

---

Any idea when on Friday this kicks off? I checked the website and no mention.

rameire

MICKEYG wrote: »

Any idea when on Friday this kicks off? I checked the website and no mention.

the standard for weekend work so far on this stretch is they start diversions around 10pm on the Friday.

In a move set to add further suffering to motorists on the State’s second busiest road – only Dublin’s M50 carries more traffic – Transport Infrastructure Ireland (TII) said “the contractor’s forecast completion date of end April/early May is considered optimistic by the [TII]site team”.

TII also warned “the removal of traffic management and speed restrictions are likely to occur on an incremental basis from the end of April, but could extend into August”.

From the Irish Times today.

Perhaps all the armchair experts who insisted it was on time and treated anyone who believed differently with disdain and condescension can take some time to reconsider their posting styles.

SoupyNorman

Deleted User wrote: »

From the Irish Times today.

Perhaps all the armchair experts who insisted it was on time and treated anyone who believed differently with disdain and condescension can take some time to reconsider their posting styles.

Such a terrible attitude, you seem to be reveling in the fact the opening will be later the scheduled?

I will say, of late everyone has been questioning whether the proposed April time frame was going to be met so I’m not really surprised that the target date wont be met.

Personally, not a big deal…the end is in sight and thats all that matters.

SoupyNorman

SoupyNorman wrote: »

Such a terrible attitude, you seem to be reveling in the fact the opening will be later the scheduled?

Could you please indicate where in my post suggests I'm revelling at the delay?

If not, an apology would be welcome and you should perhaps hold off commenting on users having terrible attitudes based on the attitude clearly displayed in your post.

This thread has had no shortages of posts dismissing people questioning finish times/apparent methods/etc because they're not road engineers or what have you, now that TII expects a significant delay in opening of 3 lanes (and knock on delay in removing speed restrictions) is an opportune time to point out that the decisions/reasoning of experts shouldn't be immune to criticism or questioning - excepting mod decisions obviously.

The fact that you've stated that what matters is that it finishes regardless of delays is quite telling.

Emme

[Deleted User] wrote: »

From the Irish Times today.

Perhaps all the armchair experts who insisted it was on time and treated anyone who believed differently with disdain and condescension can take some time to reconsider their posting styles.

The Civil engineers and shills from this thread are planning to march on the Irish Times offices so they can berate whoever wrote that piece today and tell them just how little they know

WishUWereHere

I heard on Nova today that some bloke named Morrissey ( I think He said He's from KCC ) was interviewed and a lot depends on the success of the bridge erection this weekend, and that the works will finish either May or June.

Certain people on here for a long while saying the roadworks will finish in March, now it's 2-3 months later

WishUWereHere

MICKEYG wrote: »

Any idea when on Friday this kicks off? I checked the website and no mention.

I read somewhere it starts at 21h00 tonight.

Davy

WishUWereHere wrote: »

I read somewhere it starts at 21h00 tonight.

Yeah from 9pm tonight to 9am Sunday between J9 and J10.
Both lanes are in operation from 6am to 10pm only.

harr

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/almost-14-000-speeding-fines-issued-as-m7-roadworks-continue-1.3858533

14,000 people caught spending since the temporary speed limit was put in place, a huge headache now for the courts.

beertons

Any work on the road yet tonight? Might go for a drive by when something's happening.

Damien360

harr wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/almost-14-000-speeding-fines-issued-as-m7-roadworks-continue-1.3858533

14,000 people caught spending since the temporary speed limit was put in place, a huge headache now for the courts.

Is there a longer delay than normal to get points and fine for the roadworks ? Definitely passed one and definitely over the limit (75 on speedo so well over) about 4 weeks ago and no sign of fine.

WishUWereHere

So much for March.............

https://www.kildarenow.com/news/end-april-finish-date-m7-roadworks-optimistic-transport-infrastructure-ireland/274808