What should Apple do with iTunes?

Sad Professor

iTunes was great in the beginning, but it's starting to show its age now. Windows users complain about it endlessly. And even for Mac users, it's probably a little user unfriendly for anyone new to it. Apple have tacked too many new features onto it over years without really evolving the application.

One idea is for them to break it up into separate applications, like it is on iOS, i.e. Music, iTunes Store, Video, etc. I suspect they probably would have done this on the Mac ages ago except they have the Windows version to consider, and breaking the app up there isn't really an option.

Any other thoughts on iTunes and how Apple could improve it? Or do you think it's fine as it is?

opinion guy

Double tap to the chest. And head just to be sure.

Colonel Panic

They should at least have stuff like Home Sharing and iOS syncing run as some background tasks so you don't need to launch iTunes to do it. (The same goes for iPhone sharing too, if that floats your boat).

In fact, iOS syncing should be moved out of iTunes completely, much like the Windows Phone Connector on the App Store, but for iOS devices. I don't think breaking these features out matter, even considering the Windows iTunes situation.

I think as a music player, iTunes is fine to use, if a little sluggish even on monster Macs when scrolling through tiles of large libraries. All I would add is the means to enqueue songs to a temporary playlist.

opinion guy

To be fair as a Music player/media player its fine.

Its the syncing for all apps through itunes for your devices that drives me nuts. I want to be able to drag and drop files to a folder in finder and have them sync. As many people do -driving dropboxes popularity I'd say!

So I don't know - have maybe folders that sync for each app. Some won't like that of course but you could use Appstore as a overlay to do what itunes does currently as wel for those not happy with dragging and dropping files. Appstore seems a more natural place for it I would say

conor.hogan.2

On Windows it is bad but on OSX I have absolutely no problem with it.

But I only use it as a media player (music, video, podcasts and store) and not for syncing apps to any iOS device.

Sad Professor

The thing that really annoys me about it as a music player is that the sidebar is cluttered up with non-music player stuff. See below:



Films, TV programmes, Books, Apps, Radio, Store, iTunes Store, Ping, Devices, Genius, etc, etc. Most of this can't be hidden and it really gets in the way when I'm trying add tracks to my playlists because I have to keep scrolling up and down the bloody sidebar. And this is on a 24-inch screen. It must be a nightmare on a Macbook display.

conor.hogan.2

Devices can be collapsed. Select tracks, right click and add to playlist is quicker than drag and drop.

You can toggle all lists on or off in the settings.

13" MBP pro and I have no problem with it. It depends though, if you had more playlists and used the movies, tv shows and apps then it would get crowded on the screen.

Sad Professor

conor.hogan.2 wrote: »

Select tracks, right click and add to playlist is quicker than drag and drop.

That would be faster alright, but I hate contextual menus, especially cluttered ones like in iTunes. I prefer drag and drop and keyboard shortcuts. Messing around in menus is something I associate with Windows.

You can toggle all lists on or off in the settings.

13" MBP pro and I have no problem with it. It depends though, if you had more playlists and used the movies, tv shows and apps then it would get crowded on the screen.

I don't want to hide all those things permanently though. I do use most of them. And I have a lot of playlists. It would easier if they were in a separate app, or if they used the right sidebar or something.

conor.hogan.2

Well you can drag and drop it is just slower and keyboard shortcuts would not make sense when adding a selection to 1 of possibly many playlists.

Separating out those into a separate app would go against what Apple is all about though?

Having to go one place for music, another for Audiobooks, another for radio and another for iOS syncing?

Sad Professor

No, audiobooks and radio would be in with Music. The main thing is that iOS syncing would be a separate app, similar to iSync (which is now gone).

Here's how I would split it up:

1) Music - a music/audio player app with a browser; how iTunes/SoundJam was originally.
2) Video - video player and library; combine with Quicktime, which is basically sitting there doing nothing these days anyway.
3) iSync - for all iDevice syncing/backups etc and for managing iCloud settings.
4) iTunes Store - a separate app that would automatically add new tracks to your library

This is basically how it is in iOS anyway. Apple already split the old iPod app into two separate apps a while ago, so I don't see why they would be opposed to this.

conor.hogan.2

I wouldn't mind that but a lot of people sync music, audiobooks etc to their iOS device too so they would have to use more than 1 app which is not very Apple-y.

Splitting itunes into 3/4 pieces is very not Apple. In fact that is like what I do with my Android phones.

DubDJ

I wouldn't really like the idea of iTunes split up into lots of apps. I like having it as the centre of all my devices. Maybe if they took the player feature from it I wouldn't mind too much. And had all download, syncing devices, as one program. And the iTunes player as another.

Sad Professor

conor.hogan.2 wrote: »

I wouldn't mind that but a lot of people sync music, audiobooks etc to their iOS device too so they would have to use more than 1 app which is not very Apple-y.

Splitting itunes into 3/4 pieces is very not Apple. In fact that is like what I do with my Android phones.

I don't agree that spitting iTunes up would be not Apple-like. What about iWork or iLife? They aren't single apps.

DubDJ wrote: »

I wouldn't really like the idea of iTunes split up into lots of apps. I like having it as the centre of all my devices. Maybe if they took the player feature from it I wouldn't mind too much. And had all download, syncing devices, as one program. And the iTunes player as another.

That's pretty much what I said above. iSync or it's equivalent would manage all your device syncing. Music, films, books, apps, etc.

conor.hogan.2

iLife and iWorks is different. With iTunes they would be taking a solid single app and breaking it up and making things more fragmented which is not the direction Apple is taking.

Having a store separate from the player does not make a lot of sense even if the store adds music to the player.
Quicktime is still there and can be used separately if needs be.
iSync makes sense to be in an all encompassing iTunes app and is in fact one of the advantages of iDevices over Android devices.

jack presley

Sad Professor wrote: »

iTunes was great in the beginning, but it's starting to show its age now. Windows users complain about it endlessly. And even for Mac users, it's probably a little user unfriendly for anyone new to it. Apple have tacked too many new features onto it over years without really evolving the application.

One idea is for them to break it up into separate applications, like it is on iOS, i.e. Music, iTunes Store, Video, etc. I suspect they probably would have done this on the Mac ages ago except they have the Windows version to consider, and breaking the app up there isn't really an option.

Any other thoughts on iTunes and how Apple could improve it? Or do you think it's fine as it is?

Someone at MacWorld is thinking the same

http://www.macworld.com/article/1166274/itunes_time_to_right_the_syncing_ship.html

Freddie59

I used to absolutely HATE iTunes and its whole DRM sh!t. I still think it's very convoluted, and isn't a patch on the 'drag and drop' software from Creative.

I use it intermittently (I have an iPhone but don't use it for music) but sometimes I even prefer to go onto Windows on the mac and use Media Player.:o Old habits die hard.

But, since I got a Mac two years ago I've been using it more and am even starting to become familiar with it. I think if they could simplify it in some way it would help greatly. How? I dunno.

Sad Professor

conor.hogan.2 wrote: »

iLife and iWorks is different. With iTunes they would be taking a solid single app and breaking it up and making things more fragmented which is not the direction Apple is taking.

No, it's the same thing. Do you think Apple are going to combine iWork into a single app? Of course not. Apple's anti-fragmentation stance relates to hardware, not software. Otherwise they'd be combining everything into the one app.

Having a store separate from the player does not make a lot of sense even if the store adds music to the player.
Quicktime is still there and can be used separately if needs be.
iSync makes sense to be in an all encompassing iTunes app and is in fact one of the advantages of iDevices over Android devices.

The iTunes Store is separate in iOS, why not on the Mac as well? And Apple recently split the iPod app into Music and Video apps. Do you think this was a mistake? Apple are trying to make the Mac more user friendly for iOS users. Having separate Music, Video and iTunes Store apps would do that. The only thing preventing them from doing so is the Windows version of iTunes. But hopefully iCloud will reduce iOS users dependence on iTunes syncing and Apple won't have to worry about the Windows version.

jack presley wrote: »

Someone at MacWorld is thinking the same

http://www.macworld.com/article/1166274/itunes_time_to_right_the_syncing_ship.html

I was just reading that a minute ago actually. Although I started the thread before I saw it. It was the iTunes 10 discussion over at MacRumors that got me thinking about it.

jc84

http://www.techradar.com/news/internet/itunes-11-to-properly-embrace-icloud-and-ios-6-1075530

Hope they do a total revamp

conor.hogan.2

Sad Professor wrote: »

No, it's the same thing. Do you think Apple are going to combine iWork into a single app? Of course not. Apple's anti-fragmentation stance relates to hardware, not software. Otherwise they'd be combining everything into the one app.

The iTunes Store is separate in iOS, why not on the Mac as well? And Apple recently split the iPod app into Music and Video apps. Do you think this was a mistake? Apple are trying to make the Mac more user friendly for iOS users. Having separate Music, Video and iTunes Store apps would do that. The only thing preventing them from doing so is the Windows version of iTunes. But hopefully iCloud will reduce iOS users dependence on iTunes syncing and Apple won't have to worry about the Windows version.

I was just reading that a minute ago actually. Although I started the thread before I saw it. It was the iTunes 10 discussion over at MacRumors that got me thinking about it.

iTunes has always been one app. It has long been the hub for your media for mobile devices. It is a major advantage over Android.

I can see your point though they will probably do this, despite it not making things easier for a lot of users. Just more iOSification.

Having all my media in one app is very handy. Not a huge issue, but I don't see the sense in breaking it up.

silvine

I'd like it to improve how I access and find my media. It doesn't handle duplicates or the same tracks on different albums well. I find it quicker easier to find and play music on my iPhone than on my mac.

For a mac
app it's anything but minimalistic, as shown in Sad Prof's pic.. Itunes feels sluggish compared to other os x apps. I am not wild on all the extras like Ping and genius and having to use it to sort out my
iOS devices. I also think it should incorporate the likes of Hear or SRS iWow. They improve the mac's ****ty speakers.

Sad Professor

Taking Conor's advice, I removed most of things taking up space in the sidebar in Preferences. I also increased the text size and disabled things like checkboxes. Looks much better.

Sean Quagmire

Totally agree.
I was on itunes for a good 2 hours last night updating my albums and doing a bit of clean up - It really is not an intelligent or intuitive piece of software.

I uploaded a CD and it separated two songs from the album for no apparent reason (all 'info' was the same).

Deleting duplicates manually is ridiculous in this day and age.

The 'automatically add to itunes folder' does not work properly. it will not add some songs for no apparent reason and the iTunes folder system is all over the place. ever go into itunes folder and look at that mess? good god

and then you go onto your ipod touch and the system is brilliant, the complete opposite to itunes. The software has to change big time and it has to be more like it is on the IOS. (Yep I said it, there is actualy something from iOS i want on MAC :pac: )

Sean Quagmire

Sad Professor wrote: »

Taking Conor's advice, I removed most of things taking up space in the sidebar in Preferences. I also increased the text size and disabled things like checkboxes. Looks much better.

how are you finding itunes match?
i'd probably make good use out of it as I don't really purchase many albums from itunes so the fact that it can wirelessly push to all devices and pc's seems like a nice feature...in theory

Sad Professor

Sean Quagmire wrote: »

how are you finding itunes match?
i'd probably make good use out of it as I don't really purchase many albums from itunes so the fact that it can wirelessly push to all devices and pc's seems like a nice feature...in theory

It's good, but I'm not sure I'd recommend it at the moment. It only matched about two thirds of my library, the rest it wanted to upload. Albums are half-matched or not matched at all despite being in the iTunes Store. If songs are a second longer or shorter it won't match them. Apple have a lot of bugs to work out.

Like everything with Apple, I'm sure it will be great eventually. But the teething stage is painful.

jack presley

I wasn't happy with my iTunes in the cloud/ITunes match experience. I have a 16g iPhone but about 5 times that amount of music on my mac so set it all up thinking that it would only play stuff from the cloud if it wasn't on the device. I don't know if it was something I did wrong or what but it kept playing everything from the cloud even if the album was on the device so it was gobbling up my battery and probably my data allowance as well. So I turned it off and ended up resetting the phone

conor.hogan.2

Google "itunes dupe" for a script which goes through your itunes music and removes dupes. It works quite well.

The add to itunes folder option works flawlessly for me, coupled with the keep organized option.

mikemac1

Being the fussy type I insist on having the correct artwork on everything

This works perfectly with some podcasts but others you have to update them every day

Now I don't know if this is Apple or the uploader.
ESPN podcasts are perfect, RTÉ never work
I shouldn't have to download five or six podcasts from Pat Kenny show and then copy and paste the artwork, I think artwork is the correct name

If you don't listen to a podcast for a number of weeks it'll stop downloading them and you have to refresh.
I understand why it's there but it's a pain and I've never found an option to turn this off.

I have to say I'm not a lover of ITunes.

I only use it to rip CD's to Lossless these days.

I have a Linux server which I use for several tasks though for my Apple devices I use it as a Time Machine and I use Subsonic for Music which is brilliant, I can access my music collection anywhere on my Iphone or any device for that matter.

conor.hogan.2

mikemac1 wrote: »

ESPN podcasts are perfect, RTÉ never work
I shouldn't have to download five or six podcasts from Pat Kenny show and then copy and paste the artwork, I think artwork is the correct name

If you don't listen to a podcast for a number of weeks it'll stop downloading them and you have to refresh.
I understand why it's there but it's a pain and I've never found an option to turn this off.

This is RTÉs fault, none of my Podcasts have this issue (but they are mostly tech orientated podcasts where they are set up correctly by the provider)

I have never had the issue myself, but I offload my podcasts to my iPod regularly. I can see why they would do this as Apple loves these little interesting life saving annoyances they call features which I suppose work great for some users but are just very very annoying to others.

Telchak

I've found iTunes much worse since switching to Mac from Windows a few weeks ago.

I've about 5,500 songs and whenever a new song is starting, it takes 3 or 4 seconds for it to load. This is a big difference to Windows, and especially annoying when I'm trying to skip through shuffled songs to find something I want to listen to. In Windows this was always instantaneous, so I don't know if it's an issue with iTunes on Mac or just my computer (which is quite a powerful one).

conor.hogan.2

I would say that is a problem with your computer.

I have no lag in iTunes (13k+ music and various podcasts, audiobooks and some videos) and is definitely faster on the Mac when compared to Windows.

I mean no lag, even Safari gets laggy with several tabs but itunes flawlessly skips between a lot of audio and videos.