Ireland Tour to New Zealand 2012 Discussion thread

jm08

Seph503 wrote: »

I think people's main "complaint" if you like is the fact that Dave Kearney was involved in 6N matchday squad and has now been leap-frogged and generally speaking most can't understand why or how.

Might be just as simple that they are bringing one or two young players for the experience (who won't get gametime). Dave Kearney got a bit of that in the 6Ns, Zebo now, and it could be Gilroy's turn in the autumn. Factor in that its a very depleted Ulster team going down to NZ and considering that Paddy Jackson was withdrawn by Ulster from the U20s, it might be a case that Ulster have requested to keep as many players as possible at home so that they can get a decent rest and prepare with their new coach for the next season. Gilroy, for a very young player has played a lot of big games this season.

Apart from being a good try scorer, Zebo is pretty good in claiming restarts (in the Northampton match he reclaimed 2/3 which led to trys). Not too sure how good in the air Gilroy is as well - we'll be missing a Bowe/Shaggy type player on this trip and Zebo is the closest to them in style.

CIARAN_BOYLE

totallegend wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/0531/1224316989266.html


Eh? Do we not play in New Zealand every 2-3 years?? Am I missing something?

A 10 year tour schedule was announced recently. We wont be going back to NZ for a test series for the rest of it
By memory I think our schedule is
2013 North America
2014 Argentina
2015 RWC no summer tours
2016 South Africa
2017 Japan
2018 Australia
2019 RWC No Summer Tours
2020 Argentina
2021 Pacific Islands
2022 Australia
2023 RWC No Summer Tours

From there who knows but it could be another year or two before travel to NZ after that

fitz

Declan Kidney wrote:

It’s brilliant. It’s like bungee jumping. It’s the best place to go. It’ll be 12 years before any goes again (sic).
For some of us it will be the only time we tour New Zealand in our careers. Imagine going through your career without doing that. Simon is the youngest at 21. If he is still there at 33 he’ll be doing well. Gee, not to go down there would like having a hole in your CV.

Yeah, imagine that Deccie...imagine how terrible it would be to miss out on such a great opportunity. Even worse if that opportunity was denied to you because of incompetent selection by a coach who's way out of his depth and sounds like the village idiot every time he opens his mouth.

Way to rub salt in the wounds of the deserving players you're leaving behind.
Clown. :mad:

Kilkenny14

This is the last Irish tour to New Zealand for 12 years so Ciaran's right; enjoy while it's on.

Otacon

twinytwo wrote: »

yes but he only plays well when munster are on top... ie the second game against northampton. He was so out of his dept playing for the wolfhounds it was hilarious. Young kearney however, while he dosent dosent have the try scoring record has been far superior this season. He should be going to NZ.

Zebo cant defend end of.... against the ABS we are going to have a bad enough time without ferris, bowe and poc. the last thing we need if he plays is jane/dagg/kahui etc ghosting past him like he isnt even there.

At the end of the day if we want a chance of winning, eveyone needs to defend like demons.... push come to shove sexton darcy drico trimble earls kearney etc can all do this Zebo cannot

Three points

• While Kearney was superior in the WH game, Zebo was not 'out of his depth'. He had a good game but was simply outshone by Kearney.
• Zebo can defend. He has done so for most of the season at Munster. He does make mistakes but Kearney/Gilroy are also susceptible to this.
• Zebo will not be playing the ABs, unless there are at least two injuries to the backline. And even then, I highly doubt the inclusion of Gilroy/Kearney instead of him in such a case would win us the match.

totallegend

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

A 10 year tour schedule was announced recently. We wont be going back to NZ for a test series for the rest of it

Hadn't heard that at all, thanks. So Kidney isn't gone totally doolally, then.

Fishooks12

Kilkenny14 wrote: »

This is the last Irish tour to New Zealand for 12 years so Ciaran's right; enjoy while it's on.

I'd say we won't want another one after this tbh

irishbucsfan

Otacon wrote: »

twinytwo wrote: »

yes but he only plays well when munster are on top... ie the second game against northampton. He was so out of his dept playing for the wolfhounds it was hilarious. Young kearney however, while he dosent dosent have the try scoring record has been far superior this season. He should be going to NZ.

Zebo cant defend end of.... against the ABS we are going to have a bad enough time without ferris, bowe and poc. the last thing we need if he plays is jane/dagg/kahui etc ghosting past him like he isnt even there.

At the end of the day if we want a chance of winning, eveyone needs to defend like demons.... push come to shove sexton darcy drico trimble earls kearney etc can all do this Zebo cannot

Three points

• While Kearney was superior in the WH game, Zebo was not 'out of his depth'. He had a good game but was simply outshone by Kearney.
• Zebo can defend. He has done so for most of the season at Munster. He does make mistakes but Kearney/Gilroy are also susceptible to this.
• Zebo will not be playing the ABs, unless there are at least two injuries to the backline. And even then, I highly doubt the inclusion of Gilroy/Kearney instead of him in such a case would win us the match.

I remember Zebo doing 2 things in that Wolfhounds game. Missing an easy tackle and completely messing up when retrieving the ball from a kick under no pressure on our 5 meter line. He was poor that day, probably our worst performer apart from Keatley who had a real mare with his passing. Kearney was probably our best.

Zebo makes more defensive mistakes than any of the three. So by comparison to the other options he does have a poor defense.

I agree with your last point. He's not going to play, he's worth his place on the tour. So are Gilroy and Kearney.

Podge_irl

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

A 10 year tour schedule was announced recently. We wont be going back to NZ for a test series for the rest of it
By memory I think our schedule is
2013 North America
2014 Argentina
2015 RWC no summer tours
2016 South Africa
2017 Japan
2018 Australia
2019 RWC No Summer Tours
2020 Argentina
2021 Pacific Islands
2022 Australia
2023 RWC No Summer Tours

From there who knows but it could be another year or two before travel to NZ after that

That's kind of disappointing. Maybe they can squeeze in a single test during the PI tour or something. The more we play NZ the better really.

irishbucsfan

Podge_irl wrote: »

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

A 10 year tour schedule was announced recently. We wont be going back to NZ for a test series for the rest of it
By memory I think our schedule is
2013 North America
2014 Argentina
2015 RWC no summer tours
2016 South Africa
2017 Japan
2018 Australia
2019 RWC No Summer Tours
2020 Argentina
2021 Pacific Islands
2022 Australia
2023 RWC No Summer Tours

From there who knows but it could be another year or two before travel to NZ after that

That's kind of disappointing. Maybe they can squeeze in a single test during the PI tour or something. The more we play NZ the better really.

PI tour is on during the Lions next SA Tour. Maybe we could play the maoris but even then I don't think our second string would be up to it.

irishbucsfan

I don't think that's disappointing tbh. Our real full strength tours are against Argentina, South Africa and Australia... All of them are "Championship" teams.

Summer tours are anti climactic to me. Our players are hurt and theirs are rusty.

profitius

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

A 10 year tour schedule was announced recently. We wont be going back to NZ for a test series for the rest of it
By memory I think our schedule is
2013 North America
2014 Argentina
2015 RWC no summer tours
2016 South Africa
2017 Japan
2018 Australia
2019 RWC No Summer Tours
2020 Argentina
2021 Pacific Islands
2022 Australia
2023 RWC No Summer Tours

From there who knows but it could be another year or two before travel to NZ after that

Bad timing so. Ireland would be in a much better position to win in a few seasons.

Quint2010

POC ruled out

Teferi

We'll still play NZ in the Autumn Internationals so not really bothered by the tours tbh. Delighted to see we are doing North America and Japan.

irishbucsfan

Teferi wrote: »

We'll still play NZ in the Autumn Internationals so not really bothered by the tours tbh. Delighted to see we are doing North America and Japan.

We did North America during the last Lions and Japan during the Lions before that. So not really a departure there. I'd have liked to see a European tour tbh.

CIARAN_BOYLE

Podge_irl wrote: »

That's kind of disappointing. Maybe they can squeeze in a single test during the PI tour or something. The more we play NZ the better really.

Doubt it since it will be during a Lions year. Maybe we can squeez in an extra test in NZ while we are in Australia

Teferi wrote: »

We'll still play NZ in the Autumn Internationals so not really bothered by the tours tbh. Delighted to see we are doing North America and Japan.

Its not like the big teams would want us during a Lions year

profitius

Teferi wrote: »

We'll still play NZ in the Autumn Internationals so not really bothered by the tours tbh. Delighted to see we are doing North America and Japan.

Perfect time to give the main players a proper summer off as well, though some will be on the Lions tour next season.

Teferi

I know we done NA in 2009 but I just really like when established nations go play in places where they can spread the good word about rugby

bilston

irishbucsfan wrote: »

We did North America during the last Lions and Japan during the Lions before that. So not really a departure there. I'd have liked to see a European tour tbh.

I'd like to see us send a squad (maybe during a Lions tour) to play the likes of Romania, Georgia and Russia in Bucharest, Tblissi and Moscow. I'd expect us to win but it wouldn't be a walk in the park as we'd hopefully be missing 10-12 front line players with the Lions, so it would be a tough physical experience for our lads and looking at the bigger picture perhaps most importantly it would be great for rugby in Eastern Europe and Russia.

thomond2006

Paulie ruled out.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/18281143

Otacon

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I remember Zebo doing 2 things in that Wolfhounds game. Missing an easy tackle and completely messing up when retrieving the ball from a kick under no pressure on our 5 meter line. He was poor that day, probably our worst performer apart from Keatley who had a real mare with his passing. Kearney was probably our best.

Zebo makes more defensive mistakes than any of the three. So by comparison to the other options he does have a poor defense.

I agree with your last point. He's not going to play, he's worth his place on the tour. So are Gilroy and Kearney.

He was also involved in a number of breaks. He did not have a great day at the office but to say he was 'out of his depth' was well wide of the mark.

I agree his defense can be flaky but that can be coached. His line-running and finishing is much more difficult to teach.

Finally, I agree wholeheartedly that Kearney and Gilroy should go. I'm just not sure it would make a whole pile of difference either way. I'm more put out that Toner [25] isn't going yet DOC [33] and McCarthy [30] are.

durkadurka

thomond2006 wrote: »

Paulie ruled out.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/18281143

Bad for the tour. Good for Paulie. In terms of his career longevity it might not be such a bad thing .

Tox56

Will he now be able to use the "experience" card when starting DOC?

CiaranMT

Forces Deccie's hand w/reg to who to promote. Would love to see at least one Test where he partners Dryan with someone other than DOC.

Podge_irl

DOC/Ryan are almost certainly going to be the starting locks.

sydthebeat

the more i look at the squad the more i fear for the results.

Its very hard to pick any area where we could possibly have the upper hand on the AB's. If Ross' injury rules him out... *gulp*

Seph503

Tox56 wrote: »

Will he now be able to use the "experience" card when starting DOC?

Ah Tox don't say that! I'm trying my best to be optimistic about this tour's test team selection. Bad enough we had ROG in the Indo touting himself again to put pressure on DK, can't cope with DOC as well!

ray jay

CiaranMT wrote: »

Forces Deccie's hand w/reg to who to promote.

This is the silver lining on a very dark cloud. I just hope that the newer players who are used as replacements don't get blamed for our increasingly likely trio of losses.

.ak

I'm calling it now. Second test will be 47-21 to NZ.

Tox56

I say all 3 are moderate 10-15 point losses, not really threatening NZ, but not losing by enough to convince DK of changes.