Ireland Tour to New Zealand 2012 Discussion thread

Ardillaun

armchaircoach wrote: »

So with Earls out we are calling up Duffy, but why. I don't want to get into bashing players, and I understand that Duffy is an integral part of connacht's team, but for me he's just not up to international standard.
This is rediculous that our entire strategy now has to revolve around the inability of a player to cover more than one position, but also the inability of management to recognise this and involve a different more versitile option (Gilroy, Baby Kearney)


(kearney is included in the above list but I under no circumstance think that he should have been left at home, just in there for fairness)

Hasn't D Kearney just had surgery for a groin problem or something? He's out of the mix anyway.

Klunk_NZ

Game 2 may not be a blowout, bad weather expected
http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/all-blacks/7082322/Weather-holds-key-to-All-Blacks-tactics

I would actually welcome bad weather to allow the allblacks to showcase how its done to Aussie.

Swiwi

wonton wrote: »

foolishly thought the last game would be on rte radio or newstalk, is there anywhere online you can listen to the game online ? ( as in can listen to it on my phone, but wont have laptop to search for links to watch it)

radiosport.co.nz will have live audio streaming

irishbucsfan

I don't think quicker ball or poor half back play is necessarilly the problem. In the beginning of the game we looked good heading up the field. It was just the poor decision to kick possession away (and keep it in field against a team with devastating open field runners!) that messed us up. I think the team were completely rattled after that.

I don't blame Murray for that decision, Reddan does it when playing for Ireland as well (and he's even worse at it!). Why on earth our coaches want to kick the ball to the All Blacks back 3 I'm not sure.

If we played the exact same attacking strategy as well as cutting the amount of opportunities we give them to attack us in transitional play we'd be a lot closer. If we did that with a first team available to us we'd push them all the way IMO.

a friend, talking about soccer yesterday said
"Jose Mourinho says that you can judge how good a team is by where everyone is positioned when they lose the ball"

I reckon you could apply this to rugby to a far greater magnitude. Leinster scored a couple of tries on turnover ball in a HEC final. Ulster were a good side, but when the ball was turned over, they weren't able to reform a line fast enough, or get back into the trenches.

Ireland were the exact same the other day, but as I've said before, it was basically a scratch team. I never expected us to gel immediately.

New Zealand, unlike us, were absolutely fantastic at getting back into regular patterns instantly on turnover ball (which we actually won a couple of times to be fair!). They had broken field runners galore that utterly destroyed us when they won possession back cheaply, or worse yet, were given it.

If we do employ a tactic of clearing kicks / box kicks / garryowens etc, we must be certain that we as an entire team are in the correct positions to chase, pressurise, or simply fill the gaps around us. I don't think the guys on the pitch knew enough about each other to do so, so I'm happy to forgive them that.

For the next test, please take one of these options

A - Stop kicking possession away altogether
B - Keep kicking possession, but ensure that we are defensively aligned and strong

or

C - Kick occasionally, when the time is right, and when we are defensively set.

Swiwi

Deleted User wrote: »

a friend, talking about soccer yesterday said
"Jose Mourinho says that you can judge how good a team is by where everyone is positioned when they lose the ball"

I reckon you could apply this to rugby to a far greater magnitude. Leinster scored a couple of tries on turnover ball in a HEC final. Ulster were a good side, but when the ball was turned over, they weren't able to reform a line fast enough, or get back into the trenches.

Ireland were the exact same the other day, but as I've said before, it was basically a scratch team. I never expected us to gel immediately.

New Zealand, unlike us, were absolutely fantastic at getting back into regular patterns instantly on turnover ball (which we actually won a couple of times to be fair!). They had broken field runners galore that utterly destroyed us when they won possession back cheaply, or worse yet, were given it.

If we do employ a tactic of clearing kicks / box kicks / garryowens etc, we must be certain that we as an entire team are in the correct positions to chase, pressurise, or simply fill the gaps around us. I don't think the guys on the pitch knew enough about each other to do so, so I'm happy to forgive them that.

For the next test, please take one of these options

A - Stop kicking possession away altogether
B - Keep kicking possession, but ensure that we are defensively aligned and strong

or

C - Kick occasionally, when the time is right, and when we are defensively set.

I think Ireland should give young Julian Savea a few up-and-unders (or Garryowens as you guys call them) with Kearney charging on thru.

irishbucsfan

Swiwi wrote: »

I think Ireland should give young Julian Savea a few up-and-unders (or Garryowens as you guys call them) with Kearney charging on thru.

Yeah I thought it was bizarre we didn't do this

Swiwi

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Yeah I thought it was bizarre we didn't do this

Lomu will not be remembered for his prowess under the high ball...

chippers

Swiwi wrote: »

I think Ireland should give young Julian Savea a few up-and-unders (or Garryowens as you guys call them) with Kearney charging on thru.

Why? Is he a bit of a dodgy catcher?

The less this man gets near the ball the better!

Swiwi

chippers wrote: »

Why? Is he a bit of a dodgy catcher?

The less this man gets near the ball the better!

I haven't seen that much of the Hurricanes this year, but I think he has been OK. But when you have a young (no doubt nervous) man on debut, and a player like Kearney, I think it is obligatory to give him at least one up-and-under early in the game, which if he spills and Ireland scores would ruin his confidence. But I agree with you, if you are going to do this, the quality of the Irish chasers must be good, otherwise Dagg & co will run it back with intent all day.

BoardsMember

wonton wrote: »

foolishly thought the last game would be on rte radio or newstalk, is there anywhere online you can listen to the game online ? ( as in can listen to it on my phone, but wont have laptop to search for links to watch it)

It was on LongWave RTE if you have a wireless to hand

chippers

Swiwi wrote: »

I haven't seen that much of the Hurricanes this year, but I think he has been OK. But when you have a young (no doubt nervous) man on debut, and a player like Kearney, I think it is obligatory to give him at least one up-and-under early in the game, which if he spills and Ireland scores would ruin his confidence. But I agree with you, if you are going to do this, the quality of the Irish chasers must be good, otherwise Dagg & co will run it back with intent all day.

I agree he should have been tested in the first test to see how he would cope. In respect of the next test we should not be kicking to the All Blacks at all. They absolutely destroyed us in the backs whereas we coped well up front. It's not pretty rugby and people wont like it but if we are to be in anyway competitive we need to keep it in the forwards all day long. They are just way too good for us in the backs!

FireStart

wonton wrote: »

foolishly thought the last game would be on rte radio or newstalk, is there anywhere online you can listen to the game online ? ( as in can listen to it on my phone, but wont have laptop to search for links to watch it)

go online on RTE it on Radio 1 Extra

FireStart

chippers wrote: »

Why? Is he a bit of a dodgy catcher?

The less this man gets near the ball the better!

One of the commentators said that was his weakness last year under the high ball and he went away and worked on it

jacothelad

SomeFool wrote: »

I'm suprised he went for Duffy over Denis Hurley actually! :eek:

I'm really surprised that you're surprised apart from the fact that he plays for Munster. maybe that's a step too far even for Kidney. Why would you want to bring a really, really, really slow player to play against the very quick AB backs? Hurley has the turning circle of a cross channel ferry - and the same acceleration. Nice guy, decent Rabo12 player. Not a guy I'd ever want to see in green - unless it's for Connacht. It would mean we are really down to the bottom of the international 15 barrel..

Burgo

Dave Kearney would have been under consideration save for minor surgery.

“Dave certainly would have been in the mix but he underwent an operation a couple of weeks ago. I think in the groin/hip area.

“Pretty minor but obviously it would have ruled him out of the tour. It was micro surgery rather than a full operation.”

pretty disappointing for him, but if Dave was under consideration why would that not apply to Gilroy?

Burgo

Burgo wrote: »

pretty disappointing for him, but if Dave was under consideration why would that not apply to Gilroy?

Selection Policies:

You must be an outstanding contributor to your team for at least X seasons to be considered for selection.

Munster : 0.05
Leinster: 1
Ulster: 3
Connacht: 6

GerM

Burgo wrote: »

pretty disappointing for him, but if Dave was under consideration why would that not apply to Gilroy?

Gilroy doesn't cover full back.

thomond2006

GerM wrote: »

Gilroy doesn't cover full back.

He does, jacothelad could probably tell you more.

Burgo

GerM wrote: »

Gilroy doesn't cover full back.

Both himself and Dave do as far as I know.

GerM

He can play there if absolutely needed but has never started a single game there for Ulster. Can understand the mindset that he's not an option there if he has never even played a Pro12 game at 15. Last time he played there was in the JWC a year ago.

jacothelad

GerM wrote: »

He can play there if absolutely needed but has never started a single game there for Ulster. Can understand the mindset that he's not an option there if he has never even played a Pro12 game at 15. Last time he played there was in the JWC a year ago.

He probably would make a good full back. At the moment he isn't one. being a full back isn't excessively different from being a wing these days. Kearney is a fantastic full back and when he learns to pass after a great break he'll be even...err...fantasticer.

The best full backs in the world make it look effortless to be a full back.

That's because the very hardest part of being a full back is constant positioning. Girve was a master at it.

I don't like the idea of lampooning wingers with the 15 jersey unless they've had plenty of time at 15 tbh.

maddragon

Klunk_NZ wrote: »

Game 2 may not be a blowout, bad weather expected
http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/all-blacks/7082322/Weather-holds-key-to-All-Blacks-tactics

I would actually welcome bad weather to allow the allblacks to showcase how its done to Aussie.

Unless it's thick fog with visibility down to 3 or 4 metres, I don't think it will help Ireland much.

maddragon

Cancel my last. I just had a mental image of SBW appearing at speed out of the fog with ball in hand.

GerM

Deleted User wrote: »

The best full backs in the world make it look effortless to be a full back.

That's because the very hardest part of being a full back is constant positioning. Girve was a master at it.

I recall an interview with one of the coaches or players who was speaking about Girv. He used actually watch videos at length of opposition back three and outhalves in the lead up to identify their preferred kicking patterns, what areas of the field they put boot to ball in, which side they kicked to etc.

Fishooks12

Sexton and Healy now injury doubts. Jesus I'm dreading this game

Burgo

Fishooks12 wrote: »

Sexton and Healy now injury doubts. Jesus I'm dreading this game

Christ, who the hell is going to be left for the third test?

Monty Burnz

Fishooks12 wrote: »

Sexton and Healy now injury doubts. Jesus I'm dreading this game

Don't we have a young and exciting back-up to Sexton, a guy who has filled his boots ably in the past and has a knack for scoring tries?

Oh wait, they left him behind. ROG it is then. :mad:

irishbucsfan

Sexton injured?

Paddy Wallace brought out no doubt!