how to start an electrical business

michaelkerry

Hi. Could anyone help. I want to start my own electrical business as got left go from my employer a year ago and can't get work. I am fully qualified electrican and got quotes for public liability insurance and got enquired about the business tax etc. But i have being asking around is it through that now you have to get every small job certed, eg change light switch etc or what. Is it expensive to register with recci etc.

paddymick

michaelkerry wrote: »

Hi. Could anyone help. I want to start my own electrical business as got left go from my employer a year ago and can't get work. I am fully qualified electrican and got quotes for public liability insurance and got enquired about the business tax etc. But i have being asking around is it through that now you have to get every small job certed, eg change light switch etc or what. Is it expensive to register with recci etc.

You dont have to cert every little job..
I dont know about reci but ECSSA membership is €260 a year once you have insurance.

But a bit of advice, If you think it is hard to get employed as an electrician you are going to find it even harder to get work as a self employed electrician.

Think hard about investing your money on whats needed to become self employed unless you have some guaranteed work to cover the next few months atleast.

Its certainly not all its made out to be working for yourself,The next person to say to me "ah sure your loaded because you work for yourself" is going to get a smack..

Its very tough out there and only getting tougher.

There are already some threads here on the subject you should go read them..

Good luck whatever you do..

bertie1

paddymick wrote: »

You dont have to cert every little job..
I dont know about reci but ECSSA membership is €260 a year once you have insurance.

But a bit of advice, If you think it is hard to get employed as an electrician you are going to find it even harder to get work as a self employed electrician.

Think hard about investing your money on whats needed to become self employed unless you have some guaranteed work to cover the next few months atleast.

Its certainly not all its made out to be working for yourself,The next person to say to me "ah sure your loaded because you work for yourself" is going to get a smack..




Its very tough out there and only getting tougher.

There are already some threads here on the subject you should go read them..

Good luck whatever you do..

Actually you do have to cert everyting you do, different cert for one socket , light, shower etc.

You need to speak to an accountant, you have to make provision for premlimary tax, & other hidden costs you don't normally think about . Once you go self employed , you cannot sign on the week you have no work & while you are paying PRSI etc as sef employed you have no entitlements .

Public liabaility insurance is approx 450 for the year , I agree you need some sort of a contract/ guaranteed work to make it worth your while.
You won't be able to do the jobs as cheaply as somebody not registered becuase the overheads & hidden costs will come into play.

2011

Been there, done that and would not fancy doing it again.

By attempting to comply with the regulations you have out priced yourself on many jobs.

Be prepared to do quite a bit of work that you will only get partially paid for if you get paid at all.

There are some well established small electrical contractors out there doing well, but they are few and far between.

If you can't get work as an electrician this should be an indication that your timing is poor.

.G.

Be crazy to start on your own now unless you have a guaranteed contract somewhere or something

If you really want to though there are schemes going that allow you to draw down your dole for one year while your business gets off the ground.

Talk to your local office about it or citizens advice

meercat

2011 wrote: »

By attempting to comply with the regulations you have out priced yourself on many jobs.

Be prepared to do quite a bit of work that you will only get partially paid for if you get paid at all.

There are some well established small electrical contractors out there doing well, but they are few and far between.

If you can't get work as an electrician this should be an indication that your timing is poor.

Very well put

agree with 2011 and superg on this one

i think the current climate is too bad to set up on your own unless you have a regular client
there really is no new work out there and what is there is being undercut,which makes it near impossible to comply with current regulations

dont want to be too negative though so if your happy to give it a go ,the very best of luck

2011

Here is an interesting thread where people discuss what they are willing to pay per day for different tradesmen including electricians. As you can see some people are not willing to pay enough for the tradesmen to pay legitimate rates, tax and diesel.

I hate to be so negative, and wish michaelkerry the very best of luck with whatever he/she decides.

2011

Post 6 on the same thread from a carpenter, 091chippy is shocking

i charge €150 incuding vat @ 13.5% but the price of diesel that will have go up soon

By charging €150 per day once VAT is removed that is €132.16
If he is charging VAT I assume he is issuing a receipt and is therefor legit.

After expenses (van, insurance, tools, accountant, etc..) this would reduce to no more than €100 I would guess.

Then there is tax to be paid :eek:

michaelkerry

i know a lot of people think im mad starting a business (friends etc) but the way im looking at it im in 188 a week on dole so iv nothing to loose. im not going to be giving up a good job or anything to start a new business. does anyone know what the story with reci or ECSSA in regarding certs. if i register with say ecssa and only doing small jobs like eg adding lights sockets etc, not full wiring of houses do you still have to cert each job and if you do how much is one of these certs and who certs/checks it. thanks

johnnyjb

Im not trying to stop you achieving your goals or anything of that nature but if you cant get work why on earth are you cutting yourself off from the safety blanket of social welfare ?

And also sinking some cash ( or getting credit) setting up a business in a very very bad economic climate ?

If you go for it i wish ya the best of luck but you wont get any praise from the welfare office if you go back cap in hand looking for assistance.

2011

michaelkerry wrote: »

i know a lot of people think im mad starting a business (friends etc) but the way im looking at it im in 188 a week on dole so iv nothing to loose.

I would not say nothing to loose. Fair play for having a "can do attitude".
I hope it works for you.

does anyone know what the story with reci or ECSSA in regarding certs

Yes, join and certify your own work.

if i register with say ecssa and only doing small jobs like eg adding lights sockets etc, not full wiring of houses do you still have to cert each job and if you do how much is one of these certs and who certs/checks it. thanks

You must certify everything.
Best thing to do is phone the ECSSA and talk to them.
The certs themselves are not that expensive. Everything that you must do to certify will push up the price. Such as insurance, test equipment, time and complying with the regulations.

Max_Charger

michaelkerry wrote: »

i know a lot of people think im mad starting a business (friends etc) but the way im looking at it im in 188 a week on dole so iv nothing to loose. im not going to be giving up a good job or anything to start a new business. does anyone know what the story with reci or ECSSA in regarding certs. if i register with say ecssa and only doing small jobs like eg adding lights sockets etc, not full wiring of houses do you still have to cert each job and if you do how much is one of these certs and who certs/checks it. thanks

A book of 10 minor work certs to buy off Reci is around €70.
Have you any client base at all Michael or are you completely starting from scratch?

michaelkerry

Max_Charger wrote: »

A book of 10 minor work certs to buy off Reci is around €70.
Have you any client base at all Michael or are you completely starting from scratch?

i have being doing odd job here and there, but have turned away a lot of work because not registered and not worth risk without insurance. do you if ill have to get courses done before reci allow me to register and is the test equipment expensive to buy

Max_Charger

michaelkerry wrote: »

i have being doing odd job here and there, but have turned away a lot of work because not registered and not worth risk without insurance. do you if ill have to get courses done before reci allow me to register and is the test equipment expensive to buy

Ya Reci will require one of their "in house" training courses to do certs,dont think its compulsory yet, open to correction on this but i think its every 3 years it has to be done? Its been described to me "about as informative as a Fas safe pass course" :rolleyes: Costs €120. Test equipment could be anything from €500 to sky's the limit. Our Robin meters cost the bones of €1000.

michaelkerry

Max_Charger wrote: »

michaelkerry wrote: »

i have being doing odd job here and there, but have turned away a lot of work because not registered and not worth risk without insurance. do you if ill have to get courses done before reci allow me to register and is the test equipment expensive to buy

Ya Reci will require one of their "in house" training courses to do certs,dont think its compulsory yet, open to correction on this but i think its every 3 years it has to be done? Its been described to me "about as informative as a Fas safe pass course" :rolleyes: Costs €120. Test equipment could be anything from €500 to sky's the limit. Our Robin meters cost the bones of €1000.

I didn't think test equipment would be that much.can borrowed equipment be used eg borrow my old bosses equipment. Or is there websites that u know of that sell the new/ second hand

kieran24883

michaelkerry wrote: »

Hi. Could anyone help. I want to start my own electrical business as got left go from my employer a year ago and can't get work. I am fully qualified electrican and got quotes for public liability insurance and got enquired about the business tax etc. But i have being asking around is it through that now you have to get every small job certed, eg change light switch etc or what. Is it expensive to register with recci etc.

you need to look in to the back to work scheme, if you qualify you can keep your dole for a year and 75% for the second year to help you get set up.
you obviousely will need insurance before you start, as regards certs, to hell with certs for small jobs, they are never requested, and are not required, i issued one cert for a fuseboard change over in the last ten years. obviousely certs are required where the esb need to be involved
recci membership is about 450 a year

2011

kieran24883 wrote: »

as regards certs, to hell with certs for small jobs, they are never requested, and are not required, i issued one cert for a fuseboard change over in the last ten years. obviousely certs are required where the esb need to be involved
recci membership is about 450 a year

Yes, certs. are often not requested.

But they are required.

kieran24883

if they are not requested they are not required, is what i was trying to say, dont worry about certing small jobs as you will probably never be asked

paddymick

Realistically nobody is going to cert every little job they do.

Can anyone in here seriously hand on heart say that they do it.

Who is going to do out paper work for changing a switch or adding a socket or other similar little jobs,I know I wouldnt and never have just like every electrician I know wouldnt or ever has.
I know quite a few contractors and we cant all be wrong.

They may be required under the "rules" and you can put it down to bad practice but until someone actually comes looking for them and enforces the rules nobody is going to fill out a declaration of compliance for small jobs.

Of course its good practice and the right way to do things but the OP has brought up the point of certing small jobs a couple of times so its obviously a major factor in his decission and being told he has to cert every little job might be off putting to him when its just not true in the reall world of an electrical contractor today..

I still would advice against investing in the whole self employed thing without having work lined up but if he goes for it more power to him and best of luck.

Jaysus the Bulmers is a fecker for talking all hours of the morning its after taking me 35 minutes to one finger type that I may get to bed:D

It would be nice not to get any bashing for telling how it really is:o
At the end of the day lets be realistic here boys....

2011

kieran24883 wrote: »

if they are not requested they are not required, is what i was trying to say, dont worry about certing small jobs as you will probably never be asked

Somehow I don't think RECI would agree with you.

This is back to the old chestnut of self regulation not working.

paddymick

2011 wrote: »

This is back to the old chestnut of self regulation not working.

Totally agree with you there 2011 and we dont need to get into that cat fight again.
I also think the process of getting registered is far to easy at the moment in this country.

I still stand by my previous post(which I still cant beleive I wrote a 4am:eek:) as that is just the way it is here at the moment.
And this has absolutely nothing to do with being a cowboy either so no need for anyone to make that petty comment.Someones work practices has nothing to do with this topic.

Again I am giving a straight answer to a straight question.
The question being do you need to cert every little job.
The answer like it or not at the moment with the way things are run is NO..

kieran24883

with recci you have to have your own test gear, with ecssa you can borrow a good pair, also with reci you must get it calibrated every year.
checked this out during the week

kieran24883

paddymick wrote: »

Totally agree with you there 2011 and we dont need to get into that cat fight again.
I also think the process of getting registered is far to easy at the moment in this country.

I still stand by my previous post(which I still cant beleive I wrote a 4am:eek:) as that is just the way it is here at the moment.
And this has absolutely nothing to do with being a cowboy either so no need for anyone to make that petty comment.Someones work practices has nothing to do with this topic.

Again I am giving a straight answer to a straight question.
The question being do you need to cert every little job.
The answer like it or not at the moment with the way things are run is NO..

totally agree with you paddymick, if its properly enforced we will all do it but until that day nobody will.
im sure "2011" that reci would disagree with me but thats the truth of the matter, everyone is out there do make money, im far from a cowboy, i ask all my customers to inspect my work before they pay me, but im not going to fill out certs for every small job just like every other contractor i know

2011

kieran24883 wrote: »

im far from a cowboy

I would not suggest that you are a cowboy.
I agree that many out there do not certify everything, but I know some that do.

However I am sure you would certify all work if all of your competitors did.

i ask all my customers to inspect my work before they pay me

Let's be honest here, if your customers had the skills required to properly inspect your work they would probably do the job themselves.

kieran24883

there is a huge difference between inspecting work and being able to do it, i like most electricians give the customer time to make sure they are happy with the job before i charge them. making sure everything is working properly, everything is exactly where they wanted, and left clean as i got it, i was not referring to anything technical

and yes i would gladly cert jobs if my competition was doing so,

2011

kieran24883 wrote: »

there is a huge difference between inspecting work and being able to do it,

True.
My point was that customers generally are not skilled enough to carry out the electrical tests required by the ETCI and RECI or ECSSA.

i was not referring to anything technical

I was.

Almost anything can be connected in such a way that it will work, look neat, pass a cursory inspection from someone that is not electrically trained yet be dangerous.

kieran24883

yeah agree with you, just saying its inspected to the best of their ability, its up to every electrician to work within the regulations.

if you need any help or advice setting up michaelkerry feel free to contact me directly.

best of luck in the future "2001" and "Paddymick" with yer work

2011

Thanks, best of luck to you too.
Keep posting, it's a good forum.

paddymick

kieran24883 wrote: »

best of luck in the future "2001" and "Paddymick" with yer work

"2001"..I didnt know your son was a sparks too 2011:D:D

Yeh cheers Kieran:)

kieran24883

ha ha typo well spotted paddymick

michaelkerry

hey lads thanks again for all your posts they very help full. il have to get on to RECI and ECSSA tomorrow and enquire about joining. it all money money. as for test equipment il have to see about borrowing or buying secound hand. thanks again lads