*Leaving Cert Applied Maths Thread*

Kakes

skyscraperblue wrote: »

We're a very small subject and so I think Applied Maths people should stick together, so here's a thread for us. Let's start with, are you taking Applied Maths inside or outside of school? and what questions are you covering?

As for me, I'm doing Applied Maths in school (one of only 2 girls' schools in the country to offer it ) but we are run simultaneously with LCVP and Careers, so we only get 3 classes a week. So my teacher has to teach a shorter course and so we aren't gonna get proper choice on the paper - she is only teaching Q1,2,3,4,5 and 10. So I'm teaching myself Q9 just out of terror!

How about you guys?

I think quite a few girls schools offer it actually. I do it in my school, and Mt Anville and Loreto both offer it as far as i know, thats just in my area.

skyscraperblue

It won't let me edit the first post anymore so for future reference, I was horrendously wrong about the only-two-girls-schools thing. Apparently there's tons. My bad!

Peregrine

Guys, sorry for digging up your zombie thread but I need some advice

I'm in 5th year now and I really love maths and physics but unfortunately I'm not like yous, I'm not brilliant at imaths(anymore) and I only got a C in JC.
I'm aiming for a B in HL Maths in the Leaving

I was thinking of doing Applied Maths but I'm not sure if I should. I'd have to do it by myself cos my school doesn't teach it and I'm not really good enough to learn it by myself.

Since some of yous studied Applied Maths by yourself, I wanted to ask, is it manageable?

IloveConverse

Hi guys,

Thinking about starting Applied Maths- I'm in fifth year and doing Physics and HL Maths.

The only problem is that I'm doing Physics by myself as an extra subject- doing Applied Maths would leave me with 9 subjects which is crazy.

I'd love to do Applied Maths with Physics/HL Maths as I'm thinking about doing Physics in college and love this area so much.

Would appreciate if you guys could give me some advice, thanks a mill. :cool:

amymak

Nimrod 7 wrote: »

Guys, sorry for digging up your zombie thread but I need some advice

I'm in 5th year now and I really love maths and physics but unfortunately I'm not like yous, I'm not brilliant at imaths(anymore) and I only got a C in JC.
I'm aiming for a B in HL Maths in the Leaving

I was thinking of doing Applied Maths but I'm not sure if I should. I'd have to do it by myself cos my school doesn't teach it and I'm not really good enough to learn it by myself.

Since some of yous studied Applied Maths by yourself, I wanted to ask, is it manageable?

To be honest, Applied Maths is a tough subject if maths isn't your thing, especially if you haven't got someone to explain the concepts to you.

However, if you genuinely love maths and the mechanics section in physics, then the hard work that would be necessary wouldn't seem difficult. The questions are fairly predictable, so if you do exam questions over and over, you could do fairly well in the exam even if you don't have a flair for it.

It's not an easy subject, but as long as that doesn't put you off, you should give it a go and see how you find it.

IloveConverse wrote: »

Hi guys,

Thinking about starting Applied Maths- I'm in fifth year and doing Physics and HL Maths.

The only problem is that I'm doing Physics by myself as an extra subject- doing Applied Maths would leave me with 9 subjects which is crazy.

I'd love to do Applied Maths with Physics/HL Maths as I'm thinking about doing Physics in college and love this area so much.

Would appreciate if you guys could give me some advice, thanks a mill. :cool:

9 subjects is an awful lot, so it all depends on your reasons for doing applied maths. If you're doing it for points, then I would leave it. Doing 9 subjects will just mean that all of them will suffer somewhat.
However, if you're doing it simply because you think it'll be of use in college, then I would encourage you to try it. I did applied maths outside school and in the end it didn't count for points. However, I don't regret doing it for one second, as it's of major benefit to me in mechanics in my engineering course. (However, I would do some reading on the course you're going for before you get in too deep with applied maths. As far as I know, they're generally very theoretical courses, so applied maths would be of little relevance.)

Peregrine

amymak wrote: »

To be honest, Applied Maths is a tough subject if maths isn't your thing, especially if you haven't got someone to explain the concepts to you.

However, if you genuinely love maths and the mechanics section in physics, then the hard work that would be necessary wouldn't seem difficult. The questions are fairly predictable, so if you do exam questions over and over, you could do fairly well in the exam even if you don't have a flair for it.

It's not an easy subject, but as long as that doesn't put you off, you should give it a go and see how you find it.

Thanks for replying

I'm not looking for an easy subject, I'm interested in it cos I truely enjoy Maths and Physics. I know that it won't be an easy subject to do on your own but if it's doable I want to try it.

My low grade in the Junior Cert was purely due to my lazyness(overcame it) and problems with time(we started in 2nd year) but I'm definite my C was a high C because my grades are usually 75%+ and I've never even got a C in a Maths test to be honest

I'm thinking of doing maths related courses in college so I won't be disapointed if I end up not doing well in Applied Maths by myself. If it goes well, I'll be happy with anything over a C3 in it because I know I'll just pass Art, one of the 6 HL subjects I'm doing now (OL Irish :rolleyes:)

cmcm9513

Hey, I am in sixth year and studying applied maths in school and our teacher said he will cover everything in the book except statics and hydrostatics. Has anyone covered these areas and what are they like difficulty wise ? I am considering teaching myself just so I'm covered if something goes wrong on the day .

Peregrine

cmcm9513 wrote: »

Hey, I am in sixth year and studying applied maths in school and our teacher said he will cover everything in the book except statics and hydrostatics. Has anyone covered these areas and what are they like difficulty wise ? I am considering teaching myself just so I'm covered if something goes wrong on the day .

What book are you using? When you say everything, how many chapters are we talking? :eek:

decisions

So what questions has everyone got covered?

Covered: 1,2,3,4,5,7,9 and almost 6.

cmcm9513

Nimrod 7 wrote: »

What book are you using? When you say everything, how many chapters are we talking? :eek:

Fundamental applied mathematics by Oliver Murphy first edition. 10 chapters haha . Everything except statics hydrostatics and rigid body rotation we have everything done except them three, shm and differential equations..

Peregrine

cmcm9513 wrote: »

Fundamental applied mathematics by Oliver Murphy first edition. 10 chapters haha . Everything except statics hydrostatics and rigid body rotation we have everything done except them three, shm and differential equations..

Ah I'm using the 2nd edition
I just started teaching myself(in 5th year) and I have most of Linear accelerated motion covered
Can someone tell me what the shorter questions are? Like the ones I can cover in one midterm or something. I'm not asking which one is easy

How does Project Maths affect Applied Mathematics? Like Vectors etc.

cmcm9513

Nimrod 7 wrote: »

Ah I'm using the 2nd edition
I just started teaching myself(in 5th year) and I have most of Linear accelerated motion covered
Can someone tell me what the shorter questions are? Like the ones I can cover in one midterm or something. I'm not asking which one is easy

How does Project Maths affect Applied Mathematics? Like Vectors etc.

Relative velocity by far the fastest covered and it can be easy a lot of the time ....as far as I know the only question affected is q10 the scraped integration from the question completely from what if heard.. ... if there were no vectors there would be no subject :L

Peregrine

cmcm9513 wrote: »

Relative velocity by far the fastest covered and it can be easy a lot of the time ....as far as I know the only question affected is q10 the scraped integration from the question completely from what if heard.. ... if there were no vectors there would be no subject :L

Yeah there was a circular about integration in Q10
So I have to learn vectors by myself eh? Hmm

JDOC1996

I'm interested in taking up applied maths.
How does it compare to the regular Higher level maths course?
Whats the best book, and what are the easiest/ fastest questions to cover?

cmcm9513

JDOC1996 wrote: »

I'm interested in taking up applied maths.
How does it compare to the regular Higher level maths course?
Whats the best book, and what are the easiest/ fastest questions to cover?

Its completely different to the maths course far more similar to the physics mechanism section just way harder .. makes mechanics in physics look like a joke if you do HL applied math... fundamental applied mathematics by Oliver Murphy I'm pretty sure its the only book ... most popular questions are 1,2,3,4,5 & 10

Peregrine

There are actually a few books out there. Fundamental Applied Mathematics would be the most common one, Kenvin Clonliffe's book is the second popular one

I'm thinking of starting a new thread with information and resources for Applied Maths in OP, anyone wanna help?

thisisadamh

I did Applied Maths for the LC. I would highly recommend doing it. Study questions 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 and 10. They are the easiest ones to do. Eircom Study Hub has good lectures on it, the book that has a picture of the Luas Bridge in Dundrum is also very good. If you do just one question from the papers a night, you will be sorted. Just keep doing questions, that is the key.

Eurovisionmad

Just to throw it out there there's also Applied Mathematic by Domminick Donnelly, I think it's fair good in fairness!

Integration is still there for the time being, however integrating by substitution is out.

I haven't decided what questions I'll do yet. I'm getting slightly worried as I did barely anything last year with applied Maths, but on a plus when I went back to Relative Velocity there recently it made more sense, everything else BETTER be like that when I go back over it!

Breloom

We've covered Hydrostatics, Differential Equations, Connected Particles, Projectiles and Collisions sofar.. I'm finding it fairly manageable.

We mostly use papers, we never use the book.

Peregrine

Breloom wrote: »

We've covered Hydrostatics, Differential Equations, Connected Particles, Projectiles and Collisions sofar.. I'm finding it fairly manageable.

We mostly use papers, we never use the book.

What year are you in?

How many questions will you all be doing?

YoursSincerely

Breloom wrote: »

We've covered Hydrostatics, Differential Equations, Connected Particles, Projectiles and Collisions sofar.. I'm finding it fairly manageable.

We mostly use papers, we never use the book.

Did ye do Projectiles without doing Accelerated linear motion first ?

rugrats

Should someone be worrying if they have only done mechanics and half of differentials two months into 6th year?

aarond280

can anyone tell me what to do in these : At 15.00 hours an aeroplane is 120km due east of a helicopter. The plane is flying in a direction west 30' south at a constant speed of 800km/h. The Helicopter has a max speed of 40km/h.

Find (a) the course for the closest aproach.
(b) the time that this event occurs.

Also another question:
A man swims at 4ms^-1 in still water. He swims across a river of width 120 metres. The river flows with a constant speed of 5ms^-1 parallel to the straight banks.
He wishes to cross by the shortest path.
Find a the direction he should take
b the time taken to cross the river by the shortest path.

Thanks

Just another question if two objects are to intercept what relationship is there ?

I posted thest up one Boards a couple of months ago amd go no reply so if anyone can tell me that would be great thanks

bpb101

aarond280 wrote: »

can anyone tell me what to do in these : At 15.00 hours an aeroplane is 120km due east of a helicopter. The plane is flying in a direction west 30' south at a constant speed of 800km/h. The Helicopter has a max speed of 40km/h.

Find (a) the course for the closest aproach.
(b) the time that this event occurs.

Also another question:
A man swims at 4ms^-1 in still water. He swims across a river of width 120 metres. The river flows with a constant speed of 5ms^-1 parallel to the straight banks.
He wishes to cross by the shortest path.
Find a the direction he should take
b the time taken to cross the river by the shortest path.

Thanks

Just another question if two objects are to intercept what relationship is there ?

I posted thest up one Boards a couple of months ago amd go no reply so if anyone can tell me that would be great thanks

what book and what chapter / page/question is it

aarond280

There not from a book its from last years mock, Debs I think, and if also you could answer this that would be great
Just another question if two objects are to intercept what relationship is there ?

Eurovisionmad

aarond280 wrote: »

can anyone tell me what to do in these : At 15.00 hours an aeroplane is 120km due east of a helicopter. The plane is flying in a direction west 30' south at a constant speed of 800km/h. The Helicopter has a max speed of 40km/h.

Find (a) the course for the closest aproach.
(b) the time that this event occurs.

Also another question:
A man swims at 4ms^-1 in still water. He swims across a river of width 120 metres. The river flows with a constant speed of 5ms^-1 parallel to the straight banks.
He wishes to cross by the shortest path.
Find a the direction he should take
b the time taken to cross the river by the shortest path.

Thanks

Just another question if two objects are to intercept what relationship is there ?

I posted thest up one Boards a couple of months ago amd go no reply so if anyone can tell me that would be great thanks

I'll get around to doing them later, I'm a bit busy right now, but if two objects are to collide the i direction should be parallel to the line between to two objects and the j direction must be equal, I know that's hard to understand without a diagram of some sort but I'll try explain better when I get to a proper computer later.

aarond280

Eurovisionmad wrote: »

I'll get around to doing them later, I'm a bit busy right now, but if two objects are to collide the i direction should be parallel to the line between to two objects and the j direction must be equal, I know that's hard to understand without a diagram of some sort but I'll try explain better when I get to a proper computer later.

Oh that would be brilliant Thank you !!

aarond280

Anyone able to do them

charlie1653

Does anyone one have solutions to the questions on the original book - fundamental applied mathematics by oliver Murphy ( brown cover )

Im stuck on 2 or 3 questions on ALM !
Would appreciate it guys .

Peregrine

charlie1653 wrote: »

Does anyone one have solutions to the questions on the original book - fundamental applied mathematics by oliver Murphy ( brown cover )

Im stuck on 2 or 3 questions on ALM !
Would appreciate it guys .

Which questions? I have all of A and B and majority of questions in C done out

charlie1653

Nimrod 7 wrote: »

Which questions? I have all of A and B and majority of questions in C done out

I've got most done too but em , question 20 part ii
Q22
And 23 maybe ?
Ex 2 C that is.

Peregrine

charlie1653 wrote: »

I've got most done too but em , question 20 part ii
Q22
And 23 maybe ?
Ex 2 C that is.

How ironic, 20 ii is where I stopped

There should really be solutions available for students, especially when a majority of the students teach themselves Applied Maths. I e-mailed Oliver Murphy, he replied telling me he's aware and he'll talk to folens blah blah blah and asked me if I wanted to buy solutions to the exam papers for a fiver or something :pac:

charlie1653

Did he say there's a problem with Folens dealing out the solutions or what ? My teacher has solutions but they don't look great , I'll ask him for them Monday , although that's our test day :L how recently did you ask Oliver ??
Yes he said that he sells all the exam papers for a tenner or something ? the solutions to the exam papers would be very good ! take him up on that I'd say ? I might email him .

Peregrine

charlie1653 wrote: »

Did he say there's a problem with Folens dealing out the solutions or what ? My teacher has solutions but they don't look great , I'll ask him for them Monday , although that's our test day :L how recently did you ask Oliver ??
Yes he said that he sells all the exam papers for a tenner or something ? the solutions to the exam papers would be very good ! take him up on that I'd say ? I might email him .

Afaik the solutions to the book are available online on folens' website but you have to be a teacher to log in(need roll no to create account, no real way to bypass it).

He said there are downsides to letting students access it but in my opinion that's not a reason to ignore the issue. It was only 3 or 4 weeks ago.
Solutions to the papers seem widely available on the internet than the book, if solutions can't be found there's always Marking Schemes.

WoolyAbyss

Can someone help me.I just bought fundamental applied maths 2nd edition today.which questions should I do? And how many 6, 7 or 8? Any help would be appreciated.
Im gonna try and teach myself

aarond280

WoolyAbyss wrote: »

Can someone help me.I just bought fundamental applied maths 2nd edition today.which questions should I do? And how many 6, 7 or 8? Any help would be appreciated.
Im gonna try and teach myself

What year are you in ? If you are in 5th, you should probably do at least 7 to cover you in case one of the questions you cover is horrible on the day, but if you have time, maybe an 8th question wouldn't be any harm.

WoolyAbyss

aarond280 wrote: »

What year are you in ? If you are in 5th, you should probably do at least 7 to cover you in case one of the questions you cover is horrible on the day, but if you have time, maybe an 8th question wouldn't be any harm.

Alright thanks im in fifth year.any idea on which questions I should do? I know most people do 1-5 and 10

Eurovisionmad

WoolyAbyss wrote: »

Alright thanks im in fifth year.any idea on which questions I should do? I know most people do 1-5 and 10

If you 'get' Hydrostatics Q9, it tends to be quite a doable easy question! Having said that from what I hear the book you have doesn't do hydrostatics very well, (I don't use that one myself but that is what I've been told about it!) but if you 'get it' it's an extremely easy question.

Also Q6 Circle and Simple Harmonic motion isn't the worst to have in backup either. I personally don't think it's as easy as Hydrostatics but it's a nice backup question all the same.

But certainly if you're aiming for high grades you need a backup question cause there's always going to be a bizarre quite tough question, like for example Q1 for the last few years has had a really tough part b, I suppose this is intentional because everyone does Q1 and they want to keep the marks down!

WoolyAbyss

Eurovisionmad wrote: »

If you 'get' Hydrostatics Q9, it tends to be quite a doable easy question! Having said that from what I hear the book you have doesn't do hydrostatics very well, (I don't use that one myself but that is what I've been told about it!) but if you 'get it' it's an extremely easy question.

Also Q6 Circle and Simple Harmonic motion isn't the worst to have in backup either. I personally don't think it's as easy as Hydrostatics but it's a nice backup question all the same.

But certainly if you're aiming for high grades you need a backup question cause there's always going to be a bizarre quite tough question, like for example Q1 for the last few years has had a really tough part b, I suppose this is intentional because everyone does Q1 and they want to keep the marks down!

thanks ill give hydrostatics ago

bpb101

Q10 with differentiation/integration is a good question as its the same every year. Were doing it at the moment 6th year ( hard for me as a haven't done integration in maths yet but...)

My maths teacher who done applied maths himself has advised me to do it as my first question.

carlos123455

bpb101 wrote: »

Q10 with differentiation/integration is a good question as its the same every year. Were doing it at the moment 6th year ( hard for me as a haven't done integration in maths yet but...)

My maths teacher who done applied maths himself has advised me to do it as my first question.

Have you seen the Q10 in the 2012 paper? I think it was a lot different to the past ones it involved much more thought.

Eurovisionmad

carlos123455 wrote: »

Have you seen the Q10 in the 2012 paper? I think it was a lot different to the past ones it involved much more thought.

I dunno though, it was still the same process as before.

That's the way Q10 is going, now that they can't ask integration by substitution they've severely narrowed the questions they can ask, expect more questions along those line is what my teacher has been telling me all year!

carlos123455

Fair enough. Our teacher is a bit odd, very old-fashioned. Did anyone do the applied maths mock yet? Mine is on Wednesday and I'm not really looking forward to it

aarond280

carlos123455 wrote: »

Fair enough. Our teacher is a bit odd, very old-fashioned. Did anyone do the applied maths mock yet? Mine is on Wednesday and I'm not really looking forward to it

Don't worry about the grade you get in it, its just an indeication on how much work you still have to do. And the mocks for applied maths can be pretty hard

bpb101

Eurovisionmad wrote: »

I dunno though, it was still the same process as before.

That's the way Q10 is going, now that they can't ask integration by substitution they've severely narrowed the questions they can ask, expect more questions along those line is what my teacher has been telling me all year!

what
why not???

EDIT - By god he right , were still doing it
http://www.education.ie/en/Circulars-and-Forms/Active-Circulars/cl0059_2011.pdf

decisions

If you go in to the applied maths teachers association website, in the newsletters or whatever they are called there are examples of new kinds of q's we could get. I would post links but I'm on my phone.

WoolyAbyss

Can anybody help me with a question im stuck on?
The driver of a car traveling at 20m/s sees a second car 120m in front, traveling in the same direction at a uniform speed of 8m/s
(i)what is the least uniform retardation that must be applied to the faster car so as to avoid a collision?
(ii)if the actual retardation is 1 m/s^2 calculate:
(a)the time interval in seconds for the faster car to reach a point 66m behind the slower car
(b)the shortest distance between the cars

I got part (i) the answer is 3/5 m/s^2
but part (ii) Im struggling with.
i got the answer for (a) by solving a quadratic equation but the other root is positive so I don't know how to eliminate it.I also don't see how there could be another root so i think my method is wrong for it.

bpb101

WoolyAbyss wrote: »

Can anybody help me with a question im stuck on?
The driver of a car traveling at 20m/s sees a second car 120m in front, traveling in the same direction at a uniform speed of 8m/s
(i)what is the least uniform retardation that must be applied to the faster car so as to avoid a collision?
(ii)if the actual retardation is 1 m/s^2 calculate:
(a)the time interval in seconds for the faster car to reach a point 66m behind the slower car
(b)the shortest distance between the cars

I got part (i) the answer is 3/5 m/s^2
but part (ii) Im struggling with.
i got the answer for (a) by solving a quadratic equation but the other root is positive so I don't know how to eliminate it.I also don't see how there could be another root so i think my method is wrong for it.

book?
chapter?
question number?

aarond280

is the time for part (a) 28.635 and the shortest distance 48 ?

WoolyAbyss

aarond280 wrote: »

is the time for part (a) 28.635 and the shortest distance 48 ?

Sorry I completely forgot I posted this since I managed to get it literally 2 minutes after I made my previous post. Part (a) was equal to 6 and (b) the shortest distance was 48m.
So you got part (b) right