Chelsea Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2012/2013

GavRedKing

If RDM loses to Juventus and City it could easily see talk of his exit escalate.

We've two huge games back to back and while they may not be must win they're certainly games we cannot lose.

Tubbs4

Hope tomorrow RDM drops both Torres and Luiz. Luiz has great moments but too many silly errors.

Sgt Pepper 64

GavRedKing wrote: »

If RDM loses to Juventus and City it could easily see talk of his exit escalate.

We've two huge games back to back and while they may not be must win they're certainly games we cannot lose.

Wow, werent we saying the exact same thing LAST November?

GavRedKing

The Mail are starting the fire under RDM early.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2234917/Roberto-Di-Matteo-fighting-Chelsea-job-Petr-Cech-involved-dressing-room-bust-up.html

GavRedKing

Sgt Pepper 64 wrote: »

Wow, werent we saying the exact same thing LAST November?

November is the traditonal time for change of managers, think its the time a manager is must likely to be sacked, have to try and find a stat on that.

GavRedKing

Here comes Hansen's take on things. :rolleyes:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/chelsea/9686715/Chelsea-under-manager-Roberto-Di-Matteo-are-like-Arsenal-winning-nothing-other-than-admirers.html

solarith

GavRedKing wrote: »

Here comes Hansen's take on things. :rolleyes:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/chelsea/9686715/Chelsea-under-manager-Roberto-Di-Matteo-are-like-Arsenal-winning-nothing-other-than-admirers.html

He's right.

GavRedKing

solarith wrote: »

He's right.

Disagree, he said Oscar,Hazard, Mata dont go chasing the ball. Has he ever seen the amount of work Mata does going the other way? Of the 3 only Hazard has a lack of disicpline about his defensive duties.

He also mentioned Ramires as a holding midfielder, wriong again, Ramires is a box to box player and that his role in the team, when he can he breaks forward but often covers the most ground and attempts more then most, throwing tackles in.

Hansen comapred us at the moment to Arsenal which is very far from the mark but he also said Barca and City are the only teams to mix attack and defence well but goes on to say Barca haven't a good defence but hunt the ball well, great insight into the Barca philosphy by Hansen.

MaroonAndGreen

RDM shouldnt be sacked, hes doing well.. its been a tough period and we are coming to the end of it with the 2 games against Juve and City!

Keep the faith in him

GavRedKing

MaroonAndGreen wrote: »

RDM shouldnt be sacked, hes doing well.. its been a tough period and we are coming to the end of it with the 2 games against Juve and City!

Keep the faith in him

Edit : Its a tough period that he hasnt done well enough in, dropping points to Liverpool and losing to Utd & WBA isnt good enough considering 2 of those 3 games were at home.

I think he will be gone either during this season or in the summer.

Look at it through Roman's POV, he expects massive returns on his investment in a short amount of time and in a way RDM delivered that for the first 2 1/2 months, but since early October the team hasn't really kicked on the way they should.

I dont want him sacked but its going to happen reagrdless.

Crann na Beatha

This post has been deleted.

GavRedKing

Phoenix wrote: »

What ya think Gav?blowing "a bust up" out of all proportion?surely not:pac:

These incidents when reported are always blown out of all proportions.

Its only right a manager and players would have a go after such a lack lusture display.

If they didnt I'd be worried.

Caveman1

opr wrote: »

Young kid named Jeremie Boga came on for Chelsea u21's against Liverpool at half time today and scored two goals. Looks a serious talent and completely changed the game. Amazed to find out afterwards he's only 15. Keep an eye on him.

Opr

The kid definitely has the talent to become a top player, hopefully he fulfills his potential unlike a certain Mr Gael Kakuta .

Caveman1

I can't believe some peoples reaction to the dip in from.

The reality is, this season was always going to be a transitional year, with the amount of new players brought in plus the fact we're slowly edging out the likes of Lamps & JT, what are people ecxpecting?

We're right up there at the top of the table, still have a great chance of qualifying for the KO stages of the CL, still in the Capitol One cup and still have the World club championship to play.

IMO Chelsea have obviously spoiled us fans with the way they started, but did anyine seriously think that we'd go through the whole season without a bad patch ?

Talk of RDM getting the axe is exactly whats wrong with the club IMO, United's defeat at the weekend was a worse result yet you dont see their fans asking for Fergie to be sacked, completey ott reaction.

Crann na Beatha

This post has been deleted.

GavRedKing

Fergie has a track record of producing even when the squad isnt the best and has earned himself the odd defeat to the lower tems, it always happens to Utd but then they'll beat all their main title contenders and fellow top 6 teams which sets Fergie aside from all in the league.

RDM has yet to convince me he has the tactical judgement to mix it against the bigger teams and different approaches to the game they employ.

Caveman1

Phoenix wrote: »

Who is asking for RDM to be sacked?

Nobody, I said talk of him being sacked.

Caveman1

GavRedKing wrote: »

Fergie has a track record of producing even when the squad isnt the best and has earned himself the odd defeat to the lower tems, it always happens to Utd but then they'll beat all their main title contenders and fellow top 6 teams which sets Fergie aside from all in the league.

RDM has yet to convince me he has the tactical judgement to mix it against the bigger teams and different approaches to the game they employ.

True but had fergie not have been given the time at United after his dodgy start then he wouldn't be where he is today.

I thought RDM made a mistake changing the team up against WBA but in fairness to him, the team needs to be rotated to keep players fresh.

Also in regards to his tactics, I will never put those into question after last seasons performances againt Barca, he gets a lifetime pass for that masterclass :pac:

MaroonAndGreen

There is talk of Mourinho returning to Chelsea too..

Apparently his daughter will be at college in London, just 6 miles from Stamford Bridge, next September.

More talk of the end of RDM...

If we win the league he will still probably get the sack!

We are going through too many managers in such a short time..

GavRedKing

I agree Caveman, but the days of Fergie getting what, nearly 3 years to win something have well gone.

Unless you're an instant success any owner will be looking for the best candidate to take the hot seat.

We should have never sacked José and after that we should have never sacked Carlo.

RDM will always go down as the first Chelsea manager to win the European Cup but with Roman wanting Pep he could easily be sacked for having a poor run of games or getting knocked out of the UCL.

I think he will be sacked if we dont go through in the UCL and I can see why Roman would do that TBH.

geeky

GavRedKing wrote: »

I agree Caveman, but the days of Fergie getting what, nearly 3 years to win something have well gone.

Amen. Invoking Fergie's early years is, IMO, the football equivalent of Godwinning.

I don't want Di Matteo to be sacked, but this is when we'll get to see what he's really made of. He did really well at West Brom before the team got into a funk, and he couldn't get them out of it.

Also finally ready to give up on Torres. MOTD's highlights package didn't feature him on the ball once, which says quite a bit. RTE said they couldn't put together a piece on Torres, he was that out of things.

solarith

GavRedKing wrote: »

Disagree, he said Oscar,Hazard, Mata dont go chasing the ball. Has he ever seen the amount of work Mata does going the other way? Of the 3 only Hazard has a lack of disicpline about his defensive duties.

He also mentioned Ramires as a holding midfielder, wriong again, Ramires is a box to box player and that his role in the team, when he can he breaks forward but often covers the most ground and attempts more then most, throwing tackles in.

Hansen comapred us at the moment to Arsenal which is very far from the mark but he also said Barca and City are the only teams to mix attack and defence well but goes on to say Barca haven't a good defence but hunt the ball well, great insight into the Barca philosphy by Hansen.

So he's almost right. Agreed that Mata works hard. But out of our top 4, only Mata actually works hard off the ball.

Ramires, in the formation we play *should* be a holding midfielder, but because he attacks so much and doesn't get back quick enough when the play breaks down, we've only one midfielder in a defensive position and only one of the most advanced 5 working hard to get the ball back.


// edit

I was also a staunt defender of Torres, at the beginning of the season he worked hard like he a had a point to prove. He got a goal here and there but was generally very good in build up, working hard and linking with players. Now he seems disinterested and almost arrogant.

GavRedKing

geeky wrote: »

Amen. Invoking Fergie's early years is, IMO, the football equivalent of Godwinning.

I don't want Di Matteo to be sacked, but this is when we'll get to see what he's really made of. He did really well at West Brom before the team got into a funk, and he couldn't get them out of it.

Also finally ready to give up on Torres. MOTD's highlights package didn't feature him on the ball once, which says quite a bit. RTE said they couldn't put together a piece on Torres, he was that out of things.

Yup and I think if we lose to Juventus and City and dont make the K/O stage of the UCL we can kiss goodbye to RDM.

I honestly dont think RD is good enough and is reguarly found out against our biggest competitors as he has a piss poor record against the big teams.

He made a good start by beating Arsenal & Spurs but hes drawn at home to Liverpool & Juventus from winning positions and lost to Utd.

I streamed the game from just passed the first goal but couldnt see anything from Torres of note but Myhill did make 2 good saves that kept WBA in the lead.

Caveman1

hopefully Torres is part of a swap deal for Falcao and thats the reason he doesn't seem interested anymore

amiable

I heard that Henry Winter was suggesting earlier on Talksport radio that Torres would thrive again if he returned to Liverpool.

Sgt Pepper 64

solarith wrote: »

So he's almost right. Agreed that Mata works hard. But out of our top 4, only Mata actually works hard off the ball.

Ramires, in the formation we play *should* be a holding midfielder, but because he attacks so much and doesn't get back quick enough when the play breaks down, we've only one midfielder in a defensive position and only one of the most advanced 5 working hard to get the ball back.


// edit

I was also a staunt defender of Torres, at the beginning of the season he worked hard like he a had a point to prove. He got a goal here and there but was generally very good in build up, working hard and linking with players. Now he seems disinterested and almost arrogant.

I dont think he's disinterested or arrogant.
He's just not making the right types of runs and his movement to get into scoring positions is poor. When ever he receives the ball he looks immediately to pass it out wide????!!!!
Danny, on the other hand, got himself into some great positions and linked up well. He just couldnt finish.
But if he keeps doing that, he will score.
I've said it before but, Danny and Torres is chalk and cheese. Torres seems only to wait for a certain type of ball and is very one dimensional, whereas Danny actively hunts down the ball and will run at people, sometimes he is too selfish and should lay it off, so we need a combination of the two!

GavRedKing

amiable wrote: »

I heard that Henry Winter was suggesting earlier on Talksport radio that Torres would thrive again if he returned to Liverpool.

Be a waste of money for Liverpool IMO.

Not when Suarez is banging them in at the moment.

Caveman1

amiable wrote: »

I heard that Henry Winter was suggesting earlier on Talksport radio that Torres would thrive again if he returned to Liverpool.

IMO Torres is no longer a threat in the PL, I think Spain or USA will be his next destination. He was an absolute class act for Liverpool, those days are long behind him now though, unfortunately.

amiable

GavRedKing wrote: »

Be a waste of money for Liverpool IMO.

Not when Suarez is banging them in at the moment.

The original plan was to pair Suarez with Torres so it's hard to know.
Surely Chelsea's ''problems'' are more than Torres not firing?
Same old story for the last couple of years IMO. Chelsea always seems to hit a slump for some reason. Even before Torres arrived.

amiable

Caveman1 wrote: »

IMO Torres is no longer a threat in the PL, I think Spain or USA will be his next destination. He was an absolute class act for Liverpool, those days are long behind him now though, unfortunately.

You don't just lose what he had. There's more to it IMO.

If he went to where Rafa turns up again I'd say he would get him firing again. All speculation of course

amiable

Liverpool might be willing to take him on loan

EdenHazard

Oh you do, look at Michael Owen.

amiable

EdenHazard wrote: »

Oh you do, look at Michael Owen.

I could give you examples of plenty of other players that have found their true form too.
Michael Owen has suffered from injuries but when he does play he is generally good for a goal.
He had the best goals/mins on the pitch ration in Spain at one stage while at Madrid.
Michael Owen is a bad example IMO as his talent has actually rarely been in doubt. His fitness has though.

Caveman1

amiable wrote: »

You don't just lose what he had. There's more to it IMO.

If he went to where Rafa turns up again I'd say he would get him firing again. All speculation of course

Well as the saying goes form is temporary and class is permanent, but look at Heskey he's banging them in over in Australia but he just cant cut it at the top, same applies to Nando IMO, It would be in both the clubs and Torres interest to send him back to Athletico and we take Falcao. Seems to most logical solution.

amiable

Caveman1 wrote: »

Well as the saying goes form is temporary and class is permanent, but look at Heskey he's banging them in over in Australia but he just cant cut it at the top, same applies to Nando IMO, It would be in both the clubs and Torres interest to send him back to Athletico and we take Falcao. Seems to most logical solution.

That's some crazy logic you have there comparing him to Heskey who is probably 35 and was never ever in the same league as Torres in the first place.

But then go on to say send him to a lower level such as A Madrid is silly. They are near the top of La Liga and gave Chelsea a spanking already this season.

Hypothetically what happens if Chelsea go and splash the cash on Falcao?
Does that sort all of the ''problems''?

Perhaps you seem eager to go back to Spain because it would pain you to see him return to scoring with another English club?

GavRedKing

amiable wrote: »

The original plan was to pair Suarez with Torres so it's hard to know.
Surely Chelsea's ''problems'' are more than Torres not firing?
Same old story for the last couple of years IMO. Chelsea always seems to hit a slump for some reason. Even before Torres arrived.

Suarez wouldnt really need Torres IMO. Although it would give Liverpool a new edge having Surez roaming all around while still have a CF in the box to work off Surez's good work.

We have problems all around IMO.

Bertrand is nowhere near Cole's level and anyone suggesting otherwise is mistaken, himself and Paddy Van Aanholt may be come decent back up but they dont have the ability to replace Cole like for like.

At CB we cant pick a stable pairing. Either its Cahill/JT or JT/Luiz, Cahill/Luiz, despite winning us a UCL isnt going to work out.

Azp/Ivan are decent options at RB.

Mikel/Ramires no problems there except depth, Romeu isnt good enough.

Moses/Hazard/Mata/Oscar no problems unless 2 or more of them are out they'll be missed.

Danny/Torres not good enough long term options.

The system isnt the ebst setup either IMO. It borrows much from AVB's from last year it just drops the high line.

While its good going forward, defending its let down by the players that get caught up field and our slow back 5 is exposed. Realistically only Ramires, if you consider we start with Ivan Luiz/Cahill JT Cole Mikel Ramires has any real pace to get at people, Cahill/Luiz arent slow by any means but they should be tackling out the field and our back four is usually all over the place so better communication is needed also.

Sgt Pepper 64

Caveman1 wrote: »

Well as the saying goes form is temporary and class is permanent, but look at Heskey he's banging them in over in Australia but he just cant cut it at the top, same applies to Nando IMO, It would be in both the clubs and Torres interest to send him back to Athletico and we take Falcao. Seems to most logical solution.

problem is that they are second in the league, 5 clear of Real, so they could get the riches of the Champions league if they keep going.
Falcao is a big part of that. If we offer this alleged "buyout" clause, it woul d be interesting to see what they do. Take it and spend 20 million on another striker?
The other problem in our search for a striker, is that EVERY club is looking for the same thing. Young, consistant, no cup tied and cheapish striker!
Its the holy grail for manchester, liverpool etc etc

Caveman1

amiable wrote: »

That's some crazy logic you have there comparing him to Heskey who is probably 35 and was never ever in the same league as Torres in the first place.

But then go on to say send him to a lower level such as A Madrid is silly. They are near the top of La Liga and gave Chelsea a spanking already this season.

Hypothetically what happens if Chelsea go and splash the cash on Falcao?
Does that sort all of the ''problems''?

Perhaps you seem eager to go back to Spain because it would pain you to see him return to scoring with another English club?

I could care less if Torres was to go to another PL team, if he cant score goals with the service of Mata, Hazard, Oscar then he's not going to do it with any other PL team IMO.


Athletico beating Chelsea doesn't mean that La Liga is a better league, IMO strikers would have an easier time in La Liga than in the PL. thats why I think Torres might rekindle a bit of form over there.

GavRedKing

amiable wrote: »

That's some crazy logic you have there comparing him to Heskey who is probably 35 and was never ever in the same league as Torres in the first place.

But then go on to say send him to a lower level such as A Madrid is silly. They are near the top of La Liga and gave Chelsea a spanking already this season.

Hypothetically what happens if Chelsea go and splash the cash on Falcao?
Does that sort all of the ''problems''?

Perhaps you seem eager to go back to Spain because it would pain you to see him return to scoring with another English club?

It all depends of we go through in the UCL.

If we get knocked out of the UCL in the group stages we'll lose out big time on the UCL pay out and that will effect the cash flow which in turn will effect the F.F.P which will dictate how much we spend as its a huge source of revenue for Chelsea.

If we dont go through in the UCL RDM WILL be sacked and we may not go for Falcao unless Roman can bank on the new manager getting us to at least 4th and I can only see Roman trusting Pep with that task.

amiable

Caveman1 wrote: »

I could care less if Torres was to go to another PL team, if he cant score goals with the service of Mata, Hazard, Oscar then he's not going to do it with any other PL team IMO.


Athletico beating Chelsea doesn't mean that La Liga is a better league, IMO strikers would have an easier time in La Liga than in the PL. thats why I think Torres might rekindle a bit of form over there.

I didn't say you do care if he goes to another English team.
I also didn't say that because Atletico Madrid gave Chelsea a spanking means La Liga is a better league.
To suggest he'd have it easier in La Liga is silly IMO. La Liga is a terrific and tough league.
If Torres was to return there and rediscover his form I would suggest the main reason is probably because he would be back home.
I'm still surprised at the comparison to Emile Heskey.

Caveman1

Sgt Pepper 64 wrote: »

problem is that they are second in the league, 5 clear of Real, so they could get the riches of the Champions league if they keep going.
Falcao is a big part of that. If we offer this alleged "buyout" clause, it woul d be interesting to see what they do. Take it and spend 20 million on another striker?
The other problem in our search for a striker, is that EVERY club is looking for the same thing. Young, consistant, no cup tied and cheapish striker!
Its the holy grail for manchester, liverpool etc etc

Obviously Athletico wouldn't like to loose Falcao, but there's nothing they could do if Chelsea meet his buy out clause. Although I'm sure it would ease their pain bringing Torres back plus 20mil or so.

GavRedKing

Caveman1 wrote: »

Obviously Athletico wouldn't like to loose Falcao, but there's nothing they could do if Chelsea meet his buy out clause. Although I'm sure it would ease their pain bringing Torres back plus 20mil or so.

Falcao could easily say he doesnt want a move and stay in Spain to see how Atletico do this year and IMO they'll get a UCL place in La Liga once they dont suffer injuries.

amiable

Caveman1 wrote: »

Obviously Athletico wouldn't like to loose Falcao, but there's nothing they could do if Chelsea meet his buy out clause. Although I'm sure it would ease their pain bringing Torres back plus 20mil or so.

There's where the problems start. Why would Atletico accept a player who is so out of form and almost 29 and by your calculations valued at £30million?
More crazy logic that Atletico Madrid would be willing to value Torres at that price IMO.

Caveman1

amiable wrote: »

I didn't say you do care if he goes to another English team.
I also didn't say that because Atletico Madrid gave Chelsea a spanking means La Liga is a better league.
To suggest he'd have it easier in La Liga is silly IMO. La Liga is a terrific and tough league.
If Torres was to return there and rediscover his form I would suggest the main reason is probably because he would be back home.
I'm still surprised at the comparison to Emile Heskey.

Ok grammar nazi, I wasn't actually comparing him to Heskey, I was using Heskey as an example. You said "You don't just loose what you had", I agreed with you as in Heskey was once a decent striker who was just not good enough anymore for the PL, but is good in a defferent league. a lot like Torres would be IMO.

GavRedKing

amiable wrote: »

There's where the problems start. Why would Atletico accept a player who is so out of form and almost 29 and by your calculations valued at £30million?
More crazy logic that Atletico Madrid would be willing to value Torres at that price IMO.

Torres + Courtois + Cash = Falcao?

Caveman1

GavRedKing wrote: »

Falcao could easily say he doesnt want a move and stay in Spain to see how Atletico do this year and IMO they'll get a UCL place in La Liga once they dont suffer injuries.

Of course Falcao might not even want to leave, IMO it seems like the deal would suit all parties involved. If Falcao was interested.

GavRedKing

Caveman1 wrote: »

Of course Falcao might not even want to leave, IMO it seems like the deal would suit all parties involved. If Falcao was interested.

Torres could also kick up stink as I cant see Atletico paying him what we do also I'd imagine Falcao is on big wages, north of €120K so theres a few reasons this might not happen even if its best for us, I cant see Atletico doing well out of it, they'll lose the worlds best CF and they wont replace him, soemtimes money isnt everything and I might be mistaken but I think Atletico are more financially secure then when they were a few years ago so they may tell us where to go.

amiable

Caveman1 wrote: »

Ok grammar nazi, I wasn't actually comparing him to Heskey, I was using Heskey as an example. You said "You don't just loose what you had", I agreed with you as in Heskey was once a decent striker who was just not good enough anymore for the PL, but is good in a defferent league. a lot like Torres would be IMO.

What grammar did I correct you on?

amiable

GavRedKing wrote: »

Torres could also kick up stink as I cant see Atletico paying him what we do also I'd imagine Falcao is on big wages, north of €120K so theres a few reasons this might not happen even if its best for us, I cant see Atletico doing well out of it, they'll lose the worlds best CF and they wont replace him, soemtimes money isnt everything and I might be mistaken but I think Atletico are more financially secure then when they were a few years ago so they may tell us where to go.

Atletico sometimes do pay good wages so I think your approx figures are right there.
He signed for a big transfer fee so it's likely a big wage came with it.:)

amiable

GavRedKing wrote: »

Torres + Courtois + Cash = Falcao?

Possibly but throwing players in to deals makes things complicated.
Agreeing the value of 3 players would be an awkward thing to work out but not impossible.