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does sport science make us slower ???

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    #122
    dna_leri
    Registered Users Posts: 2,623 ✭✭✭dna_leri


    peter kern wrote: »
    many ways lead to rome.......


    the artist plans too but says rest weeks are taken when they need to happen not when they are planned.
    I dont see periodisation structures as art or sciece , the art and science is to decide whats right for the athlete......what outcome is desired, the distance,what level the athlete is at.eg for an beginner Ironman reversed periodisation is hardly ever the best.

    .

    The science should tell you what's best for most athletes, the art is adapting that to the individual athlete.


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    #123
    Zuppy
    Registered Users Posts: 872 ✭✭✭Zuppy


    http://www.irishsportscouncil.ie/News_Events/Latest_News/2008_Archive/RESEARCH_Research_uncovers_performance_environment_in_elite_Irish_sport.html

    2008 is the only study the Sport council had in relation to the UK one and it only came up with 75% of athletes had or were getting a post leaving cert qualification.


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    #124
    peter kern
    Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    Determination to win was identified as the number one factor which helps elite athletes achieve in sport by respondents (94.5%) notably followed by enjoyment of the sport (92.7%). Public perception of your sport (45.5%) was identified as the top negative factor influencing performance followed by the selection process in your sport (30.9%) alongside the ability to balance lifestyle/sport (30.9%). The study is due for publication in mid march.


    interesting findings.

    Ps I have really no idea how serious the article used today was

    ps. I think its fair to say that TI believes education is part of an elite athlete


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    #125
    sconhome
    Registered Users Posts: 5,468 ✭✭✭sconhome


    Zuppy wrote: »
    http://www.irishsportscouncil.ie/News_Events/Latest_News/2008_Archive/RESEARCH_Research_uncovers_performance_environment_in_elite_Irish_sport.html

    2008 is the only study the Sport council had in relation to the UK one and it only came up with 75% of athletes had or were getting a post leaving cert qualification.

    Is the correlation to be drawn more clear if you consider if from the point of view of high achievement and determination to succeed?

    The same determination to achieve athletic goals being from the same / similar pot of determination that leads to business / academic success. Not saying that all successful athletes are geniuses but if opportunity arises the potential is there.


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    #126
    Zuppy
    Registered Users Posts: 872 ✭✭✭Zuppy


    amphkingwest wrote: »
    Is the correlation to be drawn more clear if you consider if from the point of view of high achievement and determination to succeed?

    The same determination to achieve athletic goals being from the same / similar pot of determination that leads to business / academic success. Not saying that all successful athletes are geniuses but if opportunity arises the potential is there.

    I am not sure but judging from the UK link on the last page, your schooling and socio-economic factors play a huge role.

    Socio-economic factors will always play a role in what I like to term 'money' sports. Any sport that has a large expense factor (triathlon, sailing, horse riding etc) or has a logistical obstacles such as snow sports while living in Ireland, will always have a smaller pool of athletes to draw from and exclude those without the means.

    I would be interested to read more on the influence of parents in elite athletes though. And how we can change this to achieve more success at international level.


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    #127
    Notwitch
    Registered Users Posts: 157 ✭✭Notwitch


    http://blog.quarq.com/analysis-of-jordan-rapps-ironman-texas-perfor

    A review of Rapss use of his PM during his recent texas win.


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    #128
    peter kern
    Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    that would be a good first post how science can improve performance.
    i watched that race in full and it was a class performance.


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    #129
    LCD
    Registered Users Posts: 1,123 ✭✭✭LCD


    Good interview on IM Talk with Mat Steinmetz about work he did with Graig Alexander. Much like British Cycling looked at all the tiny margins that when added up make a big difference.

    Also one thing that wasn't mentioned so far in this debate was wind tunnels, which I presume everyone would class as Sports Science.


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    #130
    peter kern
    Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    did he also talk about his self admitted f up with miranda?


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    #131
    LCD
    Registered Users Posts: 1,123 ✭✭✭LCD


    Why not go & listen before assuming the negative in everything?


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    #132
    peter kern
    Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    some people are good in marketing ;-)
    and he is one of the best in that
    and for that i will listen as i am sure i can learn ;-)


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    #133
    peter kern
    Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    btw you know his business partner is craigs and dibs marketing agent ?


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    #134
    peter kern
    Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    liam what did I tell you 2 weeks ago without any science ? ;-)
    one dosnt need to see data to know that you have exactly the same issue great steady state lost threshold. all your short races show that.


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    #135
    Briando
    Registered Users Posts: 691 ✭✭✭Briando


    tunney wrote: »
    I heard the only reason he won it the seventh time was because he had a Polar RX5.

    Twas the EPO!


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    #136
    LCD
    Registered Users Posts: 1,123 ✭✭✭LCD


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4aBTRdc4xSo&feature=youtube_gdata_player

    This may gave this debate some new legs


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    #137
    peter kern
    Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    LCD wrote: »
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4aBTRdc4xSo&feature=youtube_gdata_player

    This may gave this debate some new legs
    V solid study on the other hand both styles produce olympic champs.....


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    #138
    tunney
    Registered Users Posts: 12,583 ✭✭✭✭tunney


    peter kern wrote: »
    V solid study on the other hand both styles produce olympic champs.....

    Also would have been more accurate as S-shape versus straight back. Saying "sculling" is a *little* misleading.


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    #139
    peter kern
    Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    tunney wrote: »
    Also would have been more accurate as S-shape versus straight back. Saying "sculling" is a *little* misleading.

    So are you saying sports science is not accurate ?????? ;-)


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    #140
    tunney
    Registered Users Posts: 12,583 ✭✭✭✭tunney


    peter kern wrote: »
    So are you saying sports science is not accurate ?????? ;-)

    I'm saying this particular clip is poorly scripted.


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    #141
    peter kern
    Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    So we had 1st 2nd 7th and 9th female in kilkee so here is some scientific testing how to get the guys fast ....

    ( they talk to much gear;-)


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    #142
    mloc123
    Registered Users Posts: 9,454 ✭✭✭mloc123


    peter kern wrote: »
    So we had 1st 2nd 7th and 9th female in kilkee so here is some scientific testing how to get the guys fast ....

    ( they talk to much gear;-)

    Suprised you got your head through the door there ;)


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    #143
    peter kern
    Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    mloc123 wrote: »
    Suprised you got your head through the door there ;)

    It was a tough night as we did some hydration testing ( all in the name of science of course;-)


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    #144
    tunney
    Registered Users Posts: 12,583 ✭✭✭✭tunney


    peter kern wrote: »
    So we had 1st 2nd 7th and 9th female in kilkee so here is some scientific testing how to get the guys fast ....

    ( they talk to much gear;-)

    is that a factor of the approach or the quality of field?


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    #145
    peter kern
    Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    Yes it totally is but were are your science athletes ;-)
    I am waiting for them Dave.
    talking is silver results are gold.


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    #146
    tunney
    Registered Users Posts: 12,583 ✭✭✭✭tunney


    peter kern wrote: »
    Yes it totally is but were are your science athletes ;-)
    I am waiting for them Dave.
    talking is silver results are gold.

    I've not clue where they are :) Maybe their GPS broke and they couldn't find Kilkee?


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    #147
    longshank
    Registered Users Posts: 249 ✭✭longshank


    "want to be an olympic champion choose your parents carefully" .....everything else, science, technology, socio-economic background etc etc is marginal...if you got a 1 litre engine there is only so much tuning up you can do..sports science has proven it!!!!


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    #148
    peter kern
    Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    the girl that won aksed me before the race if it was ok that she dosnt
    have a heart rate monitor, gps ( gladly I dont think she even knows power meter exist yet) I had to force her to buy a watch for swimming last year.
    All this stuff will come but it was not needed to get her 20 min faster compared to last year ( and this year the 2nd wave group got misdirected by a kajaker ( they only have to blame themselves) that was assumed to be a marshal. so its more a 23 min improvement in real terms.and it still showes with proper preperation we could have saved 3 min with out a penny being spend on gear ...........


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    #149
    bryangiggsy
    Registered Users Posts: 1,553 ✭✭✭bryangiggsy


    peter kern wrote: »
    So we had 1st 2nd 7th and 9th female in kilkee so here is some scientific testing how to get the guys fast ....

    ( they talk to much gear;-)


    You got a female athlete cult thing going on?

    Hail Peter Kern


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    #150
    tunney
    Registered Users Posts: 12,583 ✭✭✭✭tunney


    peter kern wrote: »
    the girl that won aksed me before the race if it was ok that she dosnt
    have a heart rate monitor, gps ( gladly I dont think she even knows power meter exist yet) I had to force her to buy a watch for swimming last year.
    All this stuff will come but it was not needed to get her 20 min faster compared to last year ( and this year the 2nd wave group got misdirected by a kajaker ( they only have to blame themselves) that was assumed to be a marshal. so its more a 23 min improvement in real terms.and it still showes with proper preperation we could have saved 3 min with out a penny being spend on gear ...........

    Gear != science


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    #151
    peter kern
    Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    and too much science can dilutes the focus on perfomance sometimes ;-)

    the argue here is and will always be is that most people spend so much time thinking about gear that they dont have time to focus on getting fast.

    Darren smith once said coaching is 2 % science
    and he has now 6 olympians in London
    now those 2 or 10 or whatever % are extremely important
    but they are not the core.


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