Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Graduate Developer Salaries 2012 Edition
Options
Comments
-
-
-
-
-
-
Advertisement
-
-
Actually you can, everyone has a price. I can and have put up with a lot of bull****/poisonous environment because my daily rate made it worth it.
You say "generally", but there are of course exceptions. Where I work everyone is a developer, even the bosses. No managerial bull**** in sight. We are all architects I suppose
Job titles means **** all anyway! I was senior architect in last few jobs, now my job title is just developer again but I get paid more. But yes my situation is probably exceptional.
I ****ing hated my last job where I was actually forbidden to write code and had to manage a team in india -.-0 -
-
-
-
Advertisement
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
Never be the first one to mention salary, it gives them the advantage.
I was told the opposite — always be first to mention salary
The explanation I got was this: if you're applying for a position & think you're worth €30k, for instance. If you ask for the salary first (but keeping it fairly high-level — "I'm aware that all offers would be dependent on the candidate and their experience, but what salary range are you considering for the position?"):- If they say a higher number (€40–60k), you go away happy;
- if they say a lower number (€15–20k) you consider taking it if it's a good position, or negotiating when the time is right, or realising that you're applying well below your level & walking away
Either way you've a good result. On the other hand, if you let them bring it up first — "What's your salary expectations?" and you say €30k:- If they were offering higher, they tell you it sounds reasonable & go away laughing, (or else start to reconsider how appropriate you are for the position if you go too low)
- If they were offering lower, they may be put off by your higher figure & go with someone else — if they think you'll only be happy with the role until something else comes along, or that you seem arrogant that you've an inflated sense of your own worth.
Really interested why you think it gives them an advantage if you're first to mention it?0 -
I was told the opposite — always be first to mention salary
The explanation I got was this: if you're applying for a position & think you're worth €30k, for instance. If you ask for the salary first (but keeping it fairly high-level — "I'm aware that all offers would be dependent on the candidate and their experience, but what salary range are you considering for the position?"):- If they say a higher number (€40–60k), you go away happy;
- if they say a lower number (€15–20k) you consider taking it if it's a good position, or negotiating when the time is right, or realising that you're applying well below your level & walking away
Either way you've a good result. On the other hand, if you let them bring it up first — "What's your salary expectations?" and you say €30k:- If they were offering higher, they tell you it sounds reasonable & go away laughing, (or else start to reconsider how appropriate you are for the position if you go too low)
- If they were offering lower, they may be put off by your higher figure & go with someone else — if they think you'll only be happy with the role until something else comes along, or that you seem arrogant that you've an inflated sense of your own worth.
Really interested why you think it gives them an advantage if you're first to mention it?
Think of a interview like a game of poker, both sides operating on incomplete information. By asking about salary you are showing your hand, i.e that you are excited/interest in the position. Don't forget an interview is a two way street, they have to impress you as well. If they bring it up first, you know they are considering making an offer and you now have the upper hand in the negotiations.
The caveat I'd put on this, is that I wouldn't apply for a job without at least an advertised salary band.... its a mugs game.0 -
-
-
Advertisement
-
Think of a interview like a game of poker, both sides operating on incomplete information. By asking about salary you are showing your hand, i.e that you are excited/interest in the position. Don't forget an interview is a two way street, they have to impress you as well. If they bring it up first, you know they are considering making an offer and you now have the upper hand in the negotiations.
The caveat I'd put on this, is that I wouldn't apply for a job without at least an advertised salary band.... its a mugs game.
But they can already see your hand - you've given them your CV
Yeah, if it was an advertised band I'd probably hold off asking further alright. Otherwise, I'd ask about salary as a matter of course, unless I was going through an agent, where I'd leave it to them to sort it out.0 -
-
Your CV doesn't have any salary related information
Of course, but in terms of operating on incomplete information, their information about you is still a lot more complete than yours is about their budgets — if you've 6 years of experience & are applying for a junior role they know you're hard up.
I wouldn't see raising the question of salary a marker that you're more interested than they are though, or vice versa — I get it as a standard interview question normally, unless I've brought it up first myself.0 -
Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,092 Mod ✭✭✭✭
Join Date:Posts: 59268
As this is my first job as a graduate I didn't haggle whatsoever. I accepted the number they offered and the benefits instantly. I really wanted a job so I suppose I could have made a mistake there. I was concerned haggling would make them look on other candidates in a better light, but as they skipped the second round of interviews because I couldn't make it and just gave me the job instead I might have been in a better position than I thought. I knew what I was going to be offered because the position salary was written down in front of him
As a graduate, I kinda think it was better to make sure my foot was in the door and haggle over wages in future interviews/reviews when you are in a better position and actually have some experience. I don't think the couple of thousand mattered much compared to what I am getting in experience and enjoying my job, but of course maybe I was foolish and should have tried? I will be in future interviews anyway.0 -
Tar.Aldarion wrote: »As this is my first job as a graduate I didn't haggle whatsoever. I accepted the number they offered and the benefits instantly. I really wanted a job so I suppose I could have made a mistake there. I was concerned haggling would make them look on other candidates in a better light, but as they skipped the second round of interviews because I couldn't make it and just gave me the job instead I might have been in a better position than I thought. I knew what I was going to be offered because the position salary was written down in front of him
As a graduate, I kinda think it was better to make sure my foot was in the door and haggle over wages in future interviews/reviews when you are in a better position and actually have some experience. I don't think the couple of thousand mattered much compared to what I am getting in experience and enjoying my job, but of course maybe I was foolish and should have tried? I will be in future interviews anyway.
No you did the right thing, the task when looking for the first job is just to get hired. Its when you get old and bitter like me that you argue over money 0 -
Haggling might make you look bad - you dont want an argument; just asking for a higher salary might make you look better though; maybe not, hard to say.Tar.Aldarion wrote: »As this is my first job as a graduate I didn't haggle whatsoever. I accepted the number they offered and the benefits instantly. I really wanted a job so I suppose I could have made a mistake there. I was concerned haggling would make them look on other candidates in a better light,
Could be a ploy! Probably not.Tar.Aldarion wrote: »but as they skipped the second round of interviews because I couldn't make it and just gave me the job instead I might have been in a better position than I thought. I knew what I was going to be offered because the position salary was written down in front of himTar.Aldarion wrote: »As a graduate, I kinda think it was better to make sure my foot was in the door and haggle over wages in future interviews/reviews when you are in a better position and actually have some experience. I don't think the couple of thousand mattered much compared to what I am getting in experience and enjoying my job, but of course maybe I was foolish and should have tried? I will be in future interviews anyway.
The first years salary delta, vs. your career earnings, is negligible.
Getting a position you can learn in, and build good experience in, is the crucial thing.
Only thing to bear in mind though, is whether the next raise you get will be based on your current salary; or if you change job, whether your expectations will be conditioned on your current salary; or if people ask 'what did you get paid in your last job'? There can be knock on effects.
Probably not an issue to worry about in your first job, but worth thinking about in future.
If you are getting on well, and doing good work, its worth asking in 6 months time - as you are no longer a fresh grad - to be bumped up to a better salary. Getting a bump at 6 months after starting is quite a common thing, as you've now shown competency, and that you aren't a bad hire.0 -
Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,092 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Join Date:Posts: 59268
Ah all right, got confused as it was the graduate thread, didn't know if it was supposed to apply to me etcNo you did the right thing, the task when looking for the first job is just to get hired. Its when you get old and bitter like me that you argue over money
Yeah i'm happy enough not having asked anyway, it's a negligible thing. I don't really know how raises work as they do a yearly review that happens at the start of the year. So i won't be doing one again til next year?! I've only been working 3 months and I had mine already. Was told that I wouldn't be having my 6 months probation review because this review was it. and that because I had already done well and he was very happy it was all sorted now, was quite impressed with my work, I've worked very hard on a project on my own, in a language nobody here knows. I also do a team project that they do know a lot on. I got a few percent increase to wage in this review. So I imagine that wouldn't be reviewed for a year again, but I don't know. All that matters at the moment is that it is good experience, and the people are nice and they are helpful. I enjoy it.Haggling might make you look bad - you dont want an argument; just asking for a higher salary might make you look better though; maybe not, hard to say.
Could be a ploy! Probably not.
The first years salary delta, vs. your career earnings, is negligible.
Getting a position you can learn in, and build good experience in, is the crucial thing.
Only thing to bear in mind though, is whether the next raise you get will be based on your current salary; or if you change job, whether your expectations will be conditioned on your current salary; or if people ask 'what did you get paid in your last job'? There can be knock on effects.
Probably not an issue to worry about in your first job, but worth thinking about in future.
If you are getting on well, and doing good work, its worth asking in 6 months time - as you are no longer a fresh grad - to be bumped up to a better salary. Getting a bump at 6 months after starting is quite a common thing, as you've now shown competency, and that you aren't a bad hire.
For the next job I would hope that my expectations wouldn't be conditioned and I would seek to see what the actual going rate would be. I imagine people lie about their past wage anyway. As for current job, I don't know, but increases could be based on current salary as I got a % increase this time, that might continue.0 -
-
-
Advertisement
-
Advertisement