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Single men vs Single women
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Luckily myself (and many other Irish girls just like me) have found ourselves lovely foreign guys who, hats off to them, have been showing us exactly what we've been missing all these yearsThe introduction of euro and easteren euro chicks showing exactly how it should be done must be having a huge affect on this.
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by the sounds of things, with the majority of irish men emigrating, women here will be left with a bigger dilemna than ever, either emigrate themsleves, or marry into other nationalities. and tbh, i don't know many irish women who would date a foreigner in their home country.
I have seen irish women date foreigners - its everywhere,just walk down your local joint and see it for yourself.
I had a friend who used to live in my neighbourhood who lives with a guy from morrocco.
And they have manners
(they dont spend it all down the pub or in ladbrokes on some ****ing horse or a hare,or who knows now a celebrity,and probably wouldnt know what you meant if you asked them)unlike a lot of 'jokey' irish guys..and the put downs there are none,but maybe thats just what i have noticed so far,im not going to be stupid and tar them all with the same brush..But i think maybe the culture is different there is less swearing,and drinking,for a start but past that..you know,having said that i dont think all of them are angels im sure there are a few bastards 
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christmas2012 wrote: »I have seen irish women date foreigners - its everywhere,just walk down your local joint and see it for yourself.
I had a friend who used to live in my neighbourhood who lives with a guy from morrocco.
And they have manners (they dont spend it all down the pub or in ladbrokes on some ****ing horse or a hare,or who knows know a celebrity,and probably wouldnt know what you meant if you asked them)unlike a lot of 'jokey' irish guys..and the put downs there are none,but maybe thats just what i have noticed so far,im not going to be stupid and tar them all with the same brush..But i think maybe the culture is different there is less swearing,and drinking,for a start but past that..you know,having said that i dont think all of them are angels im sure there are a few bastards
ah sure i know what you mean, you can't beat an irish woman's nack for destroying a mans confidence :rolleyes:0 -
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A longtime single mate of mine once told me that being an average run of the mill type of guy in Ireland was like "living on the moon". He was stuck in a rut for years and everybody that knew him could tell it was really getting him down.
He eventually bit the bullet and moved to Slovakia to work for an American multinational for one third of the salary that he was on in Ireland. It was a big gamble but he now has the most ridiculously stunning fiancée that I've ever seen and a baby on the way and he couldn't be happier.
Sometimes the grass is much greener in pastures new 0 -
A longtime single mate of mine once told me that being an average run of the mill type of guy in Ireland was like "living on the moon". He was stuck in a rut for years and everybody that knew him could tell it was really getting him down.
He eventually bit the bullet and moved to Slovakia to work for an American multinational for one third of the salary that he was on in Ireland. It was a big gamble but he now has the most ridiculously stunning fiancée that I've ever seen and a baby on the way and he couldn't be happier.
Sometimes the grass is much greener in pastures new
Going by your anti-Irish woman post history, this anecdote likely isn't true...0 -
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Battered Mars Bar wrote: »Ya there's something seriously f**ked up with irish womens dating attitudes. There's serious personification of males sexual interest and drive as something sick, barbaric, perverted and dangerous.
What are you talking about?
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The fact is that my mate was single for years and he only became happy when he left Ireland. Coincidence? Maybe, but he was a Mayo man with red hair so most women here never gave him the time of day.
Heh, ok, now I know you're definitely making it up. Believe it or not, Phat Cat, there are Mayo men, some with red hair, in relationships in Ireland RIGHT NOW! Shocking, I know! 0 -
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Ok I don't agree with her put-downs but lol... says he joining in with the insults of Irish women on this thread. :pac:
ah sure i know what you mean, you can't beat an irish woman's nack for destroying a mans confidence :rolleyes:christmas2012 wrote: »I have seen irish women date foreigners - its everywhere,just walk down your local joint and see it for yourself.
I had a friend who used to live in my neighbourhood who lives with a guy from morrocco.
And they have manners (they dont spend it all down the pub or in ladbrokes on some ****ing horse or a hare,or who knows know a celebrity,and probably wouldnt know what you meant if you asked them)unlike a lot of 'jokey' irish guys..and the put downs there are none,but maybe thats just what i have noticed so far,im not going to be stupid and tar them all with the same brush..But i think maybe the culture is different there is less swearing,and drinking,for a start but past that..you know,having said that i dont think all of them are angels im sure there are a few bastards 0 -
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Like Mr. Mackay's arm-positioning in the still followed by the lamb's face in the next one. 0 -
But there's loads of women who want a man like the above. They don't all think the same way.
Yup and I would still be single (and most likely a virgin) if they didn't.Well whatever the term is - when you said it is used as a buzzword to cover up for other attributes. News to me.
You said my description of confidence in the post you replied to was 'alien to you'. You were very specific about that and so I am asking you what description you are talking about, cause I know I didn't post one. Kinda ironic then that you called my post "presumptuous" when you were guilty of a little presuming yourself.
Eh, I was stripping a man of all he had and leaving him with just confidence. To suggest I use a man somewhere between the extremes, shows that you just didn't get the point, as had I used a man somewhere 'between the extremes' as you inferred I should, then he would obviously have many more attributes than the guy with nothing, wouldn't he and so the point would obviously then be nullified.Using unrealistic extremes doesn't make for effective debating. So for a woman not to be shallow/a gold-digger, she has to go out with a homeless guy - as if there's nothing in between him and a rich guy?The King of Moo wrote: »I'm happy to let you think that.
I'm happy for you to think that you let me think something.
We are discussing the traits that women find attractive in men (or at least that's the direction the thread had careered off in) and so it's natural that this is the prism in which my comments were and are based.You seem to be looking at confidence entirely through the prism of attracting the opposite sex: it's more basic than that.
That's a nice soundbyte, but means shag all really. Still, you should try and sell it, be great for an After Shave advert.Confidence means not having to feel you need to back up your confidence with "goods."
Of course and I have many friends who fit that very description. Men who undoubtedly have quite a few reasons to be lacking in confidence (unemployment, disabilities etc) and yet they are very confident in themselves but that is not something which you will find out from meeting them for five minutes or even one night in fact.True self-confidence is about being comfortable with who you are, regardless of what "goods" you may or may not have.
Woah there, I said no such thing.No, I don't entirely accept that. I don't think you can generalise that *all men* lacking confidence have less going for them.
What I did say was that from the point of a woman looking at guys, the men lacking in confidence would be and I quote:
Far different from saying that "all men lacking confidence have less going for them".Guys lacking confidence tend to be [..] less likely to have a lot going for them than the confident ones
I'm not suggesting it does, but it's the main one in the context of single people meeting and as men do the approaching, the decision whether or not to give the guy the time of day or not is made quite quickly. Far quicker than any of what you suggested could be correctly, let alone accurately, deemed or not and yes I know this is not the only avenue in which women are looking for evidence of confidence.Confidence doesn't always come from outer trappings of success, either in a material sense or in terms of having some attractive qualities.
I'm not suggesting it is but women that are attracted to confidence, won't have an opportunity to find the above out if the guy hasn't already shown enough signs of confidence previously in order for them to get far enough for a woman to find out the rest. Well not with any of the women in which I am referring anyway.Desperation isn't always a factor either: that only applies when someone is clearly trying to find a woman, but those aren't the only times women notice men and their confidence levels.
All these things you list are also things which men would also like to see in women , but you don't hear men going on about confidence being something which they find attractive in the opposite sex, to anywhere near to the same degree as you hear women doing so and why would that be? I mean, if it just means what you're suggesting that it does, then how come men are not listing it such a fashion also?I think the attraction to confidence is a pretty fundamental thing: it shows someone's at ease with themselves, which people find attractive. Maybe it's because that shows the person will not bring any serious drama to the table, but I think it's even more basic than that.
If your thinking is correct (regarding these women who put confidence at the top of their list) then a shy Male Model would get little or no dates and an Ugly Guy with bags of confidence (not arrogance) would beating the ladies off (not inferring they would have cocks here) regularly - but that is not the way it is. So either all these women who put confidence as a top quality for men that they are attracted to, time and time again are either lying or it's a case of what I am suggesting and there is in fact more to meet the eye and that: when women put confidence as No.1 attractive quality, it is in fact more to do with what confidence in men is indicative of, which women are truly attracted to.
Confidence is something that people don't choose to have, it's something they have either earned, or just acquired over time for one reason or another. You can't just decide to be confident and so, when women seek it out, they know (even if only subconsciously) that any guy who is confident, is very likely to have very good reason to be and it is these reasons that they are attracted to.
Let's be honest, confidence is about success of one degree or another. You get a knock back, some criticism and your confidence can wain. You get a compliment, more security in your life, things work out, achieve some goals and your confidence soars. So when I say it is more what confidence in men is indicative of them having (or not having, as the case may be) which these self confessed women are reallyy attracted to, rather than just mere confidence in and of itself, it is for those reasons.
tl;dr
When the seagulls follow the trawler .. 0 -
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Mr.Biscuits wrote: »But there's loads of women who want a man like the above. They don't all think the same way.
Yup and I would still be single (and most likely a virgin) if they didn't.Well whatever the term is - when you said it is used as a buzzword to cover up for other attributes. News to me.
You said my description of confidence in the post you replied to was 'alien to you'. You were very specific about that and so I am asking you what description you are talking about, cause I know I didn't post one. Kinda ironic then that you called my post "presumptuous" when you were guilty of a little presuming yourself.
Eh, I was stripping a man of all he had and leaving him with just confidence. To suggest I use a man somewhere between the extremes, shows that you just didn't get the point, as had I used a man somewhere 'between the extremes' as you inferred I should, then he would obviously have many more attributes than the guy with nothing, wouldn't he and so the point would obviously then be nullified.Using unrealistic extremes doesn't make for effective debating. So for a woman not to be shallow/a gold-digger, she has to go out with a homeless guy - as if there's nothing in between him and a rich guy?The King of Moo wrote: »I'm happy to let you think that.
I'm happy for you to think that you let me think something.
We are discussing the traits that women find attractive in men (or at least that's the direction the thread had careered off in) and so it's natural that this is the prism in which my comments were and are based.You seem to be looking at confidence entirely through the prism of attracting the opposite sex: it's more basic than that.
That's a nice soundbyte, but means shag all really. Still, you should try and sell it, be great for an After Shave advert.Confidence means not having to feel you need to back up your confidence with "goods."
Of course and I have many friends who fit that very description. Men who undoubtedly have quite a few reasons to be lacking in confidence (unemployment, disabilities etc) and yet they are very confident in themselves but that is not something which you will find out from meeting them for five minutes or even one night in fact.True self-confidence is about being comfortable with who you are, regardless of what "goods" you may or may not have.
Woah there, I said no such thing.No, I don't entirely accept that. I don't think you can generalise that *all men* lacking confidence have less going for them.
What I did say was that from the point of a woman looking at guys, the men lacking in confidence would be and I quote:
Far different from saying that "all men lacking confidence have less going for them".Guys lacking confidence tend to be [..] less likely to have a lot going for them than the confident ones
I'm not suggesting it does, but it's the main one in the context of single people meeting and as men do the approaching, the decision whether or not to give the guy the time of day or not is made quite quickly. Far quicker than any of what you suggested could be correctly, let alone accurately, deemed or not and yes I know this is not the only avenue in which women are looking for evidence of confidence.Confidence doesn't always come from outer trappings of success, either in a material sense or in terms of having some attractive qualities.
I'm not suggesting it is but women that are attracted to confidence, won't have an opportunity to find the above out if the guy hasn't already shown enough signs of confidence previously in order for them to get far enough for a woman to find out the rest. Well not with any of the women in which I am referring anyway.Desperation isn't always a factor either: that only applies when someone is clearly trying to find a woman, but those aren't the only times women notice men and their confidence levels.
All these things you list are also things which men would also like to see in women , but you don't hear men going on about confidence being something which they find attractive in the opposite sex, to anywhere near to the same degree as you hear women doing so and why would that be? I mean, if it just means what you're suggesting that it does, then how come men are not listing it such a fashion also?I think the attraction to confidence is a pretty fundamental thing: it shows someone's at ease with themselves, which people find attractive. Maybe it's because that shows the person will not bring any serious drama to the table, but I think it's even more basic than that.
If your thinking is correct (regarding these women who put confidence at the top of their list) then a shy Male Model would get little or no dates and an Ugly Guy with bags of confidence (not arrogance) would beating the ladies off (not inferring they would have cocks here) regularly - but that is not the way it is. So either all these women who put confidence as a top quality for men that they are attracted to, time and time again are either lying or it's a case of what I am suggesting and there is in fact more to meet the eye and that: when women put confidence as No.1 attractive quality, it is in fact more to do with what confidence in men is indicative of, which women are truly attracted to.
Confidence is something that people don't choose to have, it's something they have either earned, or just acquired over time for one reason or another. You can't just decide to be confident and so, when women seek it out, they know (even if only subconsciously) that any guy who is confident, is very likely to have very good reason to be and it is these reasons that they are attracted to.
Let's be honest, confidence is about success of one degree or another. You get a knock back, some criticism and your confidence can wain. You get a compliment, more security in your life, things work out, achieve some goals and your confidence soars. So when I say it is more what confidence in men is indicative of them having (or not having, as the case may be) which these self confessed women are reallyy attracted to, rather than just mere confidence in and of itself, it is for those reasons.
tl;dr
When the seagulls follow the trawler ..
You are describing circumstantial confidence which is different to core confidence. You can be confident without relying on validation from external sources.
You can choose to be confident, approach loads of women and you become indifferent to rejection or how well it goes, then you become more relaxed approaching women over time. That's what confidence is, feeling relaxed, a lack of anxiety, not being stifled, being out of your head focused on your own amusement, not whether you are making a good impression, all it takes to become like that is effort in the beginning to approach despite your fear.
You can be poor and pull hot women when you are confident, charming with good social skills. A confident homeless bum on the street is on the other end of the spectrum, they haven't met the simple criteria of being a normal well adjusted human being.
So confidence is a huge factor but there are other factors, you don't need to be rich to get hot women, in not saying it doesn't help but you simply don't need it.0 -
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Mr.Biscuits wrote: »Yup and I would still be single (and most likely a virgin) if they didn't.
You said my description of confidence in the post you replied to was 'alien to you'. You were very specific about that and so I am asking you what description you are talking about, cause I know I didn't post one. Kinda ironic then that you called my post "presumptuous" when you were guilty of a little presuming yourself.
Eh, I was stripping a man of all he had and leaving him with just confidence. To suggest I use a man somewhere between the extremes, shows that you just didn't get the point, as had I used a man somewhere 'between the extremes' as you inferred I should, then he would obviously have many more attributes than the guy with nothing, wouldn't he and so the point would obviously then be nullified.
I'm happy for you to think that you let me think something.
We are discussing the traits that women find attractive in men (or at least that's the direction the thread had careered off in) and so it's natural that this is the prism in which my comments were and are based.
That's a nice soundbyte, but means shag all really. Still, you should try and sell it, be great for an After Shave advert.
Of course and I have many friends who fit that very description. Men who undoubtedly have quite a few reasons to be lacking in confidence (unemployment, disabilities etc) and yet they are very confident in themselves but that is not something which you will find out from meeting them for five minutes or even one night in fact.
Woah there, I said no such thing.
What I did say was that from the point of a woman looking at guys, the men lacking in confidence would be and I quote:
Far different from saying that "all men lacking confidence have less going for them".
I'm not suggesting it does, but it's the main one in the context of single people meeting and as men do the approaching, the decision whether or not to give the guy the time of day or not is made quite quickly. Far quicker than any of what you suggested could be correctly, let alone accurately, deemed or not and yes I know this is not the only avenue in which women are looking for evidence of confidence.
I'm not suggesting it is but women that are attracted to confidence, won't have an opportunity to find the above out if the guy hasn't already shown enough signs of confidence previously in order for them to get far enough for a woman to find out the rest. Well not with any of the women in which I am referring anyway.
All these things you list are also things which men would also like to see in women , but you don't hear men going on about confidence being something which they find attractive in the opposite sex, to anywhere near to the same degree as you hear women doing so and why would that be? I mean, if it just means what you're suggesting that it does, then how come men are not listing it such a fashion also?
If your thinking is correct (regarding these women who put confidence at the top of their list) then a shy Male Model would get little or no dates and an Ugly Guy with bags of confidence (not arrogance) would beating the ladies off (not inferring they would have cocks here) regularly - but that is not the way it is. So either all these women who put confidence as a top quality for men that they are attracted to, time and time again are either lying or it's a case of what I am suggesting and there is in fact more to meet the eye and that: when women put confidence as No.1 attractive quality, it is in fact more to do with what confidence in men is indicative of, which women are truly attracted to.
Confidence is something that people don't choose to have, it's something they have either earned, or just acquired over time for one reason or another. You can't just decide to be confident and so, when women seek it out, they know (even if only subconsciously) that any guy who is confident, is very likely to have very good reason to be and it is these reasons that they are attracted to.
Let's be honest, confidence is about success of one degree or another. You get a knock back, some criticism and your confidence can wain. You get a compliment, more security in your life, things work out, achieve some goals and your confidence soars. So when I say it is more what confidence in men is indicative of them having (or not having, as the case may be) which these self confessed women are reallyy attracted to, rather than just mere confidence in and of itself, it is for those reasons.
tl;dr
When the seagulls follow the trawler ..
I don't have the time at the moment to respond to each individual point here, but I think saying that no-one is suggesting that confidence is the sole factor in determining attraction would sum up a lot of what I might say.
As for the bolded part: I disagree with a lot of that.
First of all, you've deliberately chosen extreme examples, like the homeless man earlier.
Second, I've never said that confidence overrides all possible flaws. If someone's very ugly then their confidence will help them, but they'll still find it difficult to form relationships due to their extreme ugliness. I've said a few times that confidence isn't the only important factor.
The same goes for the male model: if he's diffident then that'll be a hindrance, but his dazzling looks will still help him meet people.
But it's more constructive to posit more plausible examples: a good-looking man, but not a model, with low self-esteem, who finds it difficult to meet women and start relationships, and an ugly man, but not a repulsive one, with self-confidence who has little trouble with the ladies.
Surely you must agree that such people exist.
If you go to PI or read letters from men to Agony Aunts/Uncles you'll find plenty of cases of shy good-looking men who find it hard to talk to women.
There is still something of an emphasis on the man initiating contact with a woman in our society (though it's not as great as it has been in the past) and if a man can't approach a woman, his looks won't help him if she's not going to initiate contact.
Even if she does, if he has nothing interesting to say or is nervous, that might be off-putting, and it still might be up to him to take the plunge like kissing her or asking her back to his place.
On the other side of the coin, look at someone like Henry Kissinger. He's never been conventionally handsome and has one of the most boring voices imaginable, but plenty of beautiful women couldn't resist him because of his charm and charisma.
Look at Jack Black: not much of a looker on paper but he's got a lot of fans because of his confidence and because he's "funny."
Mick Jagger, Keith Richard, Bill Clinton... I think there are more famous attractive yet apparently ugly famous men than there are attractive and handsome ones!
And those are just the famous ones: I've seen plenty of first-hand examples of guys charming girls despite not being studs, and good-looking guys who get lots of glances but never take their chances due to shyness.
Basically: unless you're handsome yet completely lacking in self-confidence or quite confident yet spectacularly ugly, you'll be able to attract women.
Finally: confidence is something you can choose to have. Of course events in our life can raise or lower or confidence, and traumatic events can be hard to recover from, but that doesn't mean we're definitely stuck at the levels of confidence these events cause.
Many people pick themselves up after suffering a blow in life.
Many materially successful people lack self-confidence: why else would so many rich men, for example, be so concerned with having trophy wives and expensive cars? Because they're worried about what other people think about them.
Confidence is about how you feel about yourself, and you're the only one who really has control over that.
It's not an essential part of your personality that you can't do anything about.
Some people do find it more difficult to improve their confidence than others, but I don't believe it's ever impossible.
I used to be quite shy, but I decided to work on that, as I felt I had good reason to be more confident in myself, and it would make my life better, which it has.
I think some men like to say confidence can't be improved upon as saying so allows them to excuse themselves from the occasionally difficult task of improving their confidence levels.0 -
I'm a single bloke early 40's. Ten years ago I was a bit panicked by the idea of 'being alone forever' but not now. I've kinda eased into solitude and am happy in my own company. Occassionally the snake does stir but maybe only once a fortnight. I'm really glad that I'm not a slave to my own sex drive anymore. I've been pretty much asexual for a long time now and to be honest it's a big relief. I haven't completely given up on the idea of meeting someone special but as one of my favourite singers says 'I'd rather be alone than try to be somebody that I'm not'.
Is that you Father? 0 -
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