Erecting a kit shed

lakill Farm

Im looking for guidance in erecting a kit shed. The cement base is in 50ft x 22 ft and the shed is 47ft x 20ft. 6/7" of cement in the base. The 8 areas where the up rights are to be positioned were counter sunk a further 18" and filled with cement (ie 24" squared of cement in these areas .

The frame is
4 x 10ft uprights (Back) with base plates
4 x 12 ft uprights(front) with base plates
4 x 20ft (something) cross sections to go from front to back
15 x 6x3 timbers. 3 bays x 5 timbers.

How do i put it together?

I have available 4 lads, 2 towers of scaffold (8ft each)
SDS drill and all bolts and screws. I have no loader and the mini digger isnt much use . Oh and a head of steam if and when needed:rolleyes:

sh1tstirrer

Is it an A framed shed? You need to square up holes for the poles first or else you will have a disaster on your hands.

lakill Farm

no its a lean to style.

axel7

The concrete 'pads' you've put in are a great job. Once you have your up-rights square it should in theory all fall into place. Put up a similar lean-to up a few months ago. Put all the up-rights up first (obviously, ) , square them up with tape and line. Then put the cross-sections up, don't tighten these fully until the timbers are in, they're not always exactly 15 9''. If you could get your hands on a tractor with a loader for a day or two it would be a great help. This, along with the scaffolding, makes it easier.

Bizzum

As stated already, the most important thing you will have to get right is that the uprights are put up square. If you put up the 4 corners they should be equidistant both ways and most importantly the diagonals have to be the same, (give or take an inch), from the corner uprights (or ideally a point back behind them) run a line to ensure the central uprights are in line. Plumb your uprights when you're fixing them. At ground level if this is the case all should fall into place higher up!

So in three words. Square, plumb and level.

lakill Farm

the concrete base is in fairly close to perfect.

So do i put up 1x 10ft back, 1 12ft front and a cross section and measure 15ft 9 on from that to put up the next 2 uprights completing a bay?

martin46585

Stand your back row of stanchion first, tie them together at mid height with the timber purlins, then stand your front corner stanchion #1, and complete the frame with the top rafter, then stand #2 stanchion and again complete the frame, now put on your timbers to complete the first bay, and so on with #3 and #4 completing your bays as you go,
Lay out a complete frame before you start to find the exact distance between the front and back stanchions,
Though I would say that a machine is called for to lift the rafters, as at approximate 150kg each, quite a handful at 12 ft high,
Hope this helps.....

JohnBoy

measure, check, measure, check, measure, check.

Keep doing it till you're done.

dont be in too much of a rush to tighten things till you've it nearly finished.

ratchet straps can be very handy helpers.

is the slope part of the frame steel or timber?

if it's steel then I'd be tempted to make up the frames on the flat and then stand them up. amish barn style

Muckit

The advice to ensure your pillars are situated square is good advice. Spend plenty of time to make sure that they are.

Pull diagonals (ie from front LHS girder to back RHS girder. And from front RHS girder to LHS girder) They should be the same. This is the simplist method to ensure you are bang on the money.

Use a long level to ensure they are plumb.

When it comes to fitting trusses and holes are a little off (I'm talking mm), use ratchet straps from girder to girder to persuade holes to aline.

Oh and keep the camera or phone in the pocket and take pics as you progress so we can all praise your good work!;)

Dupont

set corner one first but only put one bolt in,then go to end one, measure right distance and make sure its plumb when measuring and pull line on them to make sure there lineing in ok. fill in between making sure they are square to line and plumb beacause 3 mm off plumb at bottom will be alot worse at top. line the back row off front make sure same distance apart and right lenght and put these up. it would be handy to get loan of a wee loader or tractor with loader if not two men on stage of scaffold at each end should work.you will lift uprights by hand,just get a man to foot the bottom. keep timbers off till end because you will be able to move uprights about to bolt on trusses if there not ligning up. make sure and put on some timbers that night to keep it safe and if giving heavy wind put them all on. did you get plan to put up with right measurments? outside trusses will have lugs flush for gable. corner post will have lugs on flat and in web

martin46585

Too much information
Every body will have a different take on how to do this, but one thing I would like to say, don't for any reason leave a stanchion standing with one anchor bolt in the ground, whilst these fixings are great at what they do, they are only as good as the concrete below.
There would be no reason for tempory fixing any of the stanchions,
When squaring your front row of stanchions, pull a line parallel to the back row and strike your gable wall line perpendicular to these two, and measure a out a multiple of three, and on the back wall a multiple of four, and check that te hypothesis is a multiple of 5' ......

Farmer Pudsey

On a 47'X20' shed the diagonal should be 51' spot on.

So you can line up your two back pillars 47' apart. Then measure 51' diagonal from the outside of pillar "A" (or 50' 7" from the inside of that pillar) and 20' from the outside of pillar "B".

Where the two of these meet is the outside of pillar "C".

Now measure 47' and 20' from the outside of "C" and "A" respectively to find the outside of Pillar "D".

Confirm by measuring from outside of pillar "B" to "D" which is 51' or from inside edges of these pillar's which is equal to 49' 11".

I am presuming the girders are 8X4 if not get back and I will recalculate the inside measurements.

lakill Farm

All great info lads.

I have been taking photos all alone and ill put up photos when its finished and im happy to show it off.

Im keeping a total price also so should be able to tell ye exact cost to nearest €10

locky76

lakill Farm wrote: »

All great info lads.

I have been taking photos all alone and ill put up photos when its finished and im happy to show it off.

Im keeping a total price also so should be able to tell ye exact cost to nearest €10

Hire out a small cherry picker as well, the type you tow behing the car.
You can sit this on the concrete plinth and roll it forward and backwards, no messing with ladders etc. It'll be worth 3 men, you can bring the timbers up on the basket ans slew from one beam to another no bother!

Bizzum

Above all else be safe in your work. We dont want to be reading about you or one of your lads in the paper.

kboc

martin46585 wrote: »

Too much information
Every body will have a different take on how to do this, but one thing I would like to say, don't for any reason leave a stanchion standing with one anchor bolt in the ground, whilst these fixings are great at what they do, they are only as good as the concrete below.
There would be no reason for tempory fixing any of the stanchions,
When squaring your front row of stanchions, pull a line parallel to the back row and strike your gable wall line perpendicular to these two, and measure a out a multiple of three, and on the back wall a multiple of four, and check that te hypothesis is a multiple of 5' ......

hypotenuse

johngalway

No advice for you LF, but good luck with the project and like others I'm looking forward to the photos

martin46585

kboc wrote: »

hypotenuse

Many thanks for spell check fella, why not point out the te when your at it::rolleyes:
As it's the ipad that does the spellin, itsometimes concerns others more than i

kboc

martin46585 wrote: »

Many thanks for spell check fella, why not point out the te when your at it::rolleyes:
As it's the ipad that does the spellin, itsometimes concerns others more than i

i certainly didn't mean to be rude, but it was not a spell check, as a hypothesis and a hypotenuse are 2 widely different concepts.

A hypothesis is a statement which you try to prove (statistically) right or wrong http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypothesis

A hypotenuse is the "long side" in a right angle triangle. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypotenuse

martin46585

kboc wrote: »

i certainly didn't mean to be rude, but it was not a spell check, as a hypothesis and a hypotenuse are 2 widely different concepts.

A hypothesis is a statement which you try to prove (statistically) right or wrong http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypothesis

A hypotenuse is the "long side" in a right angle triangle. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypotenuse

Not for a second did I think rude, Though I would say that yourself and the other 680 ish viewer knew at a glance what the appropriate word was,

But thanks all the same......

Dupont

Bizzum wrote: »

Above all else be safe in your work. We dont want to be reading about you or one of your lads in the paper.

+1 be safe, take your time and do it right. we were putting on timbers on a shed last year and i was drilling the last one standing on top of wall drilling over my head and the other side kicked off the lug and came down and hit me across the head but luckily i fell into the bucket of the loader.

are you putting dpc on your timbers???

Bizzum

kboc wrote: »

hypotenuse

Pythagoras was some man to erect sheds:D

Odelay

locky76 wrote: »

Hire out a small cherry picker as well, the type you tow behing the car.
You can sit this on the concrete plinth and roll it forward and backwards, no messing with ladders etc. It'll be worth 3 men, you can bring the timbers up on the basket ans slew from one beam to another no bother!

Just don't try to lift any steel onto it when raised or use it when handling steel into position! The tow behind type are made for a man or two and a bucket of paint, many have had a supprise on these when simply lifting something themselves while in the basket. Alarm bells work when lifting from ground up but adjusting in the air...... gravity works faster than the up and down buttons.
Best of luck, let us know how the prices work.

lakill Farm

i had a cherrypicker powerwashing the house and hayshed 2 years ago and never again. it reached 40ft (Genie I think) but was a pain moving it.
I called the hire company and they dropped me a teleporter with a cage. OH drove it, ( fair spet from a corolla to a jcb teleporter) but she was good on it. Im all safety.

dpc on timber? i painted with a mix of 50/50 chero & burnt oil.

Viewtodiefor

lakill Farm wrote: »

i had a cherrypicker powerwashing the house and hayshed 2 years ago and never again. it reached 40ft (Genie I think) but was a pain moving it.
I called the hire company and they dropped me a teleporter with a cage. OH drove it, ( fair spet from a corolla to a jcb teleporter) but she was good on it. Im all safety.

dpc on timber? i painted with a mix of 50/50 chero & burnt oil.

You need a strip of the 4 inch block dpc nailed with flat head nails on the side of the timbers that meet your sheeting, otherwise obertime the sheeting will rust where it meets the timbers, some say it's not needed but in my view and many others it is, doesn't cost much only bit of time.

lakill Farm

Viewtodiefor wrote: »

You need a strip of the 4 inch block dpc nailed with flat head nails on the side of the timbers that meet your sheeting, otherwise obertime the sheeting will rust where it meets the timbers, some say it's not needed but in my view and many others it is, doesn't cost much only bit of time.

Ok. never hear of that. im using clading as roof not corrigation. Ill get a roll of 4" dpc . I might get to staple it on. My luck i would hit the felting nails with the hex screws.

DO you recommend same on side sheeting?

15 roof timbers x 15.9ft = 238.5ft or 72 Meters

JohnBoy

I had a proper big manitou cherry picker two years ago washing and painting the house.

came on an artic truck sized yoke.

it was well wobbly, would hate to do much off one of the small ones, I think I'd rather a ladder. (and I dont like ladders)

locky76

lakill Farm wrote: »

i had a cherrypicker powerwashing the house and hayshed 2 years ago and never again. it reached 40ft (Genie I think) but was a pain moving it.
I called the hire company and they dropped me a teleporter with a cage. OH drove it, ( fair spet from a corolla to a jcb teleporter) but she was good on it. Im all safety.

dpc on timber? i painted with a mix of 50/50 chero & burnt oil.

Ironic that you're all safety and using burnt oil;)

locky76

JohnBoy wrote: »

I had a proper big manitou cherry picker two years ago washing and painting the house.

came on an artic truck sized yoke.

it was well wobbly, would hate to do much off one of the small ones, I think I'd rather a ladder. (and I dont like ladders)

You'll have the plinth for the kit shed in- no better base for it, hook the picker on the car for shifting it forwards and backwards, I put up a 4 bay double sided shed wirth it, i'd a truck and hi-ab in for lifting the steel roof trusses.
The cherry picker was well able for it, i've used them loads of time as an electrician also.

lakill Farm

locky76 wrote: »

Ironic that you're all safety and using burnt oil;)

I used gloves and glasses when treating the timber and they will be in the roof. If a suck calf can lick then at 12 ft ill have lads wanting to buy them