South County GC Closed

fennetec

scubapro wrote: »

Just in!

The Men's and Ladies Committees will convene a meeting for all members and shareholders next Wednesday.


Both Committees are meeting on Monday to discuss various issues and some options for a way forward. We will inform members of the time and location of the Wednesday in due course.


Just for clarification, we are aware that the landlords are sending out emails on their behalf, informing members of updates in relation to the golf course. We want to inform members that any emails from the landlords do no represent the Men's and Ladies committees. The Men's and Ladies committees will be looking at all options on the table including any proposal from the landlords. It is the committees view that the interests of the members and shareholders will be best served by acting as a group and that is why we will be convening a meeting on Wednesday. All other meetings arranged by landlords and/or other members while potentially welcome do not represent the official views of the Men's and Ladies committees.


We hope to see as many members as possible at the Wednesday meeting we are organising and at that stage we will hopefully be in a position to clarify options from various quarters including offers from other clubs and any proposals the current landlords would like us to consider.



Michael Moore, Captain Men's Club 2012
Sheelagh Stubbs, Lady Captain 2012
The Men's and Ladies Committees will convene a meeting for all members and shareholders next Wednesday.


Both Committees are meeting on Monday to discuss various issues and some options for a way forward. We will inform members of the time and location of the Wednesday in due course.


Just for clarification, we are aware that the landlords are sending out emails on their behalf, informing members of updates in relation to the golf course. We want to inform members that any emails from the landlords do no represent the Men's and Ladies committees. The Men's and Ladies committees will be looking at all options on the table including any proposal from the landlords. It is the committees view that the interests of the members and shareholders will be best served by acting as a group and that is why we will be convening a meeting on Wednesday. All other meetings arranged by landlords and/or other members while potentially welcome do not represent the official views of the Men's and Ladies committees.


We hope to see as many members as possible at the Wednesday meeting we are organising and at that stage we will hopefully be in a position to clarify options from various quarters including offers from other clubs and any proposals the current landlords would like us to consider.


Michael Moore, Captain Men's Club 2012
Sheelagh Stubbs, Lady Captain 2012

This is a welcome email I have just received right now. Accordingly I am withdrawing Avon Ri as a venue for the meeting that was to be held on Tuesday as this meeting being arranged by the Ladies and Mens captains will ensure that all members interests can be discussed and no matter what is decided we can decide together. This will be the first step in the members putting together a proposal for the landowner as opposed to the landowner putting together a proposal for the members. Avon Ri, Blessington, will not be available for any meeting on Tuesday.

shamco

Gambino wrote: »

Yes, I thought my last contribution would go down well. I'm not wishing bad luck on any clubs, but if they get some of the sh*t stirrers that ruined South County as new members, then I fear for them.

Good luck to you all - but don't use up all your bullets shooting us messengers. You will need some for your other foot.

Found yesterday that the landlord now owns parcels of land that belonged to shareholders. Apparently a previous board gave these away. What I would like to know is what we got in return and why werent the shareholders not consulted.

Alrite Chief

frost53 wrote: »

BTW some posts too personal..don't have to be Sherlock Holmes to figure out who some of the posters are.

Can you elaborate on this statement? You say this as if furious staff, paid up members and shareholders should feel guilty by posting their feelings here. I can't speak for everyone here but I intend to tell every single one of these **** what I think of them when I see them.

Some posters here seem to think there is a divide at SCGC which will hinder a recovery. Well let me tell you. We all have one thing in common. Our golf club has been swept from under our feet and there is people who are accountable and will be found out. Most have been. Once we cleanse the club and make sure they never step foot near the place again we will get the club back where it belongs.

May I just add that this mornings email from Michael and Sheelagh is the very first step in progress since the text last Wednesday morning. I welcome it and an looking forward to it. Will be far more constructive than Pat Kavanagh's proposed meeting.

thegen

frost53 wrote: »

:pac::pac:


Cut it out, Jimmy

Is it Jimmy or EH????

Gambino

fennetec wrote: »

scubapro wrote: »

Just in!

The Men's and Ladies Committees will convene a meeting for all members and shareholders next Wednesday.


Both Committees are meeting on Monday to discuss various issues and some options for a way forward. We will inform members of the time and location of the Wednesday in due course.


Just for clarification, we are aware that the landlords are sending out emails on their behalf, informing members of updates in relation to the golf course. We want to inform members that any emails from the landlords do no represent the Men's and Ladies committees. The Men's and Ladies committees will be looking at all options on the table including any proposal from the landlords. It is the committees view that the interests of the members and shareholders will be best served by acting as a group and that is why we will be convening a meeting on Wednesday. All other meetings arranged by landlords and/or other members while potentially welcome do not represent the official views of the Men's and Ladies committees.


We hope to see as many members as possible at the Wednesday meeting we are organising and at that stage we will hopefully be in a position to clarify options from various quarters including offers from other clubs and any proposals the current landlords would like us to consider.



Michael Moore, Captain Men's Club 2012
Sheelagh Stubbs, Lady Captain 2012
The Men's and Ladies Committees will convene a meeting for all members and shareholders next Wednesday.


Both Committees are meeting on Monday to discuss various issues and some options for a way forward. We will inform members of the time and location of the Wednesday in due course.


Just for clarification, we are aware that the landlords are sending out emails on their behalf, informing members of updates in relation to the golf course. We want to inform members that any emails from the landlords do no represent the Men's and Ladies committees. The Men's and Ladies committees will be looking at all options on the table including any proposal from the landlords. It is the committees view that the interests of the members and shareholders will be best served by acting as a group and that is why we will be convening a meeting on Wednesday. All other meetings arranged by landlords and/or other members while potentially welcome do not represent the official views of the Men's and Ladies committees.


We hope to see as many members as possible at the Wednesday meeting we are organising and at that stage we will hopefully be in a position to clarify options from various quarters including offers from other clubs and any proposals the current landlords would like us to consider.


Michael Moore, Captain Men's Club 2012
Sheelagh Stubbs, Lady Captain 2012

This is a welcome email I have just received right now. Accordingly I am withdrawing Avon Ri as a venue for the meeting that was to be held on Tuesday as this meeting being arranged by the Ladies and Mens captains will ensure that all members interests can be discussed and no matter what is decided we can decide together. This will be the first step in the members putting together a proposal for the landowner as opposed to the landowner putting together a proposal for the members. Avon Ri, Blessington, will not be available for any meeting on Tuesday.

I think you should read the last paragraph of Michael's email again.

Alrite Chief

Gambino wrote: »

I think you should read the last paragraph of Michael's email again.

I think you should read who the email is from again.

Gambino

Alrite Chief wrote: »

Gambino wrote: »

I think you should read the last paragraph of Michael's email again.

I think you should read who the email is from again.

OK, Michael and Sheelagh.

Alrite Chief

Gambino wrote: »

Alrite Chief wrote: »

Gambino wrote: »

I think you should read the last paragraph of Michael's email again.

I think you should read who the email is from again.

OK, Michael and Sheelagh.

It's things like that which do you no favours in this thread. To dismiss the lady captain like that tells its own story. I have you down to 2 people now.

fennetec

Gambino wrote: »

I think you should read the last paragraph of Michael's email again.

What would you do? I'll guess. The likes of you would walk in and kiss his ass and have no bargaining tool, the only one being that if PK did not accept your offer you would move somewhere else - which it is becoming apparant by the post that this is what you should do.


Meeting for Tuesday is cancelled - the members shall decide and not some gombeen or landlord.

Gambino

Alrite Chief wrote: »

Gambino wrote: »

Alrite Chief wrote: »

Gambino wrote: »

I think you should read the last paragraph of Michael's email again.

I think you should read who the email is from again.

OK, Michael and Sheelagh.

It's things like that which do you no favours in this thread. To dismiss the lady captain like that tells its own story. I have you down to 2 people now.

It was an oversight. Allright Alrite?

Alrite Chief

I should hope so. The Ladies committee have been brilliant in all things great about SCGC over the years.

Gambino

Fennetec, I don't especially care who calls meetings but the members cannot evaluate the situation without knowing the landlords position. The meeting on Wednesday can achieve little unless we know the situation with the course.

fennetec

Gambino wrote: »

Fennetec, I don't especially care who calls meetings but the members cannot evaluate the situation without knowing the landlords position. The meeting on Wednesday can achieve little unless we know the situation with the course.

Its about two months ago now sincefirst saw the new "forrestry fencing" going up around some of the open boundaries between the different landowners along the par 5 and 6 & 7th holes being fenced off with barbed wire.. I'd say the situation with the course was known at that time and the evaluation process you are talking about will be exactly that, an evaluation process - to see how stupid we all are. As far as I am concerned there is some chance for SDGC if all the members stick together, one bargaining group, one new club. A proposal is put to the landowner and he acceps it or rejects it - that is my evaluation.

Gambino

fennetec wrote: »

Gambino wrote: »

Fennetec, I don't especially care who calls meetings but the members cannot evaluate the situation without knowing the landlords position. The meeting on Wednesday can achieve little unless we know the situation with the course.

Its about two months ago now sincefirst saw the new "forrestry fencing" going up around some of the open boundaries between the different landowners along the par 5 and 6 & 7th holes being fenced off with barbed wire.. I'd say the situation with the course was known at that time and the evaluation process you are talking about will be exactly that, an evaluation process - to see how stupid we all are. As far as I am concerned there is some chance for SDGC if all the members stick together, one bargaining group, one new club. A proposal is put to the landowner and he acceps it or rejects it - that is my evaluation.

Such a confrontational attitude is not going to get us very far. The landlord didn't close the club and so far he is the one trying to keep the course viable. From what I have heard he is anxious to explore the options that will suit as many people as possible.
Rather than messing him around by offering and then withdrawing venues, or presenting him with "take it or leave it" demands, we need to engage in reasonable discussion. He has many more options than we do.

GreeBo

Guys some of you are leaving yourselves open to being done for defamation/libel. You are not anonymous on here, your details can and will be passed onto the relevant authorities. Dont post anything that you wouldnt say openly in public.
Mods are not here to keep you legal.

GreeBo

Several infractions handed out. The next piece of personal abuse gets a 2 week ban.
Also, this board does not exist so that people can accuse other members of things or try to "out" their public persona.
The next accusation, attempt at naming another boards member or making a derogatory remark against anyone related to SCGC gets a 1 month ban.

tonyka

GreeBo wrote: »

Several infractions handed out. The next piece of personal abuse gets a 2 week ban.
Also, this board does not exist so that people can accuse other members of things or try to "out" their public persona.
The next accusation, attempt at naming another boards member or making a derogatory remark against anyone related to SCGC gets a 1 month ban.

thought you would never act to keep this civil ..... thanks:)

Dtoffee

Reading this thread is a classic example of how so many golf clubs are in trouble these days ........ too many opinions and not enough listening or leadership.

Its astounding that its taken a week for the committees to issue a statement and call a meeting. I have been in a club that was in this position many years ago and the lack of contact from the Committees gave every rumour and innuendo creedence. No amount of bull**** about finding out details etc can negate the fact that the Committee should be issuing daily updates from day one (online or by email or just a notice outside the front gate) even if it was just let members know they are working on the situation.

I think some scgc posters on here are genuine about trying to make the best of a bad lot .... but there's far too many fractions coming out for anything other than one step forward, three steps back.

Personally, I'd find out what Gambino's doing ....... and run the other way :eek:

Gambino

Dtoffee wrote: »

Reading this thread is a classic example of how so many golf clubs are in trouble these days ........ too many opinions and not enough listening or leadership.

Its astounding that its taken a week for the committees to issue a statement and call a meeting. I have been in a club that was in this position many years ago and the lack of contact from the Committees gave every rumour and innuendo creedence. No amount of bull**** about finding out details etc can negate the fact that the Committee should be issuing daily updates from day one (online or by email or just a notice outside the front gate) even if it was just let members know they are working on the situation.

I think some scgc posters on here are genuine about trying to make the best of a bad lot .... but there's far too many fractions coming out for anything other than oe step forward, three steps back.

Personally, I'd find out what Gambino's doing ....... and run the other way :eek:

I'll take that as a compliment.
And by the way, its factions not fractions, although we probably have fractions of factions at each others throats.

fennetec

Dtoffee wrote: »

Reading this thread is a classic example of how so many golf clubs are in trouble these days ........ too many opinions and not enough listening or leadership.

Its astounding that its taken a week for the committees to issue a statement and call a meeting. I have been in a club that was in this position many years ago and the lack of contact from the Committees gave every rumour and innuendo creedence. No amount of bull**** about finding out details etc can negate the fact that the Committee should be issuing daily updates from day one (online or by email or just a notice outside the front gate) even if it was just let members know they are working on the situation.

I think some scgc posters on here are genuine about trying to make the best of a bad lot .... but there's far too many fractions coming out for anything other than one step forward, three steps back.

Personally, I'd find out what Gambino's doing ....... and run the other way :eek:

I couldn't agree more, it took too long and to compound the awful way in which the news broke the course was closed and members locked out of the clubhouse. Apart from the 6am text, as far as I was concerned anyway, the members had lost all contact with each other, we had been divided. The Raymie Burns issue is deplorable. I met Pat Kavanagh, he is a nice man but I strongly resented the fact that he was calling all the shots and the members were going to take it in the neck whatever was coming down the line. It is quite possible that the Captains had no access to the database but whatever happens at least we are meeting now. At least people won't be working so hard after Wednesday moving machinery around at three o'clock in the morning all on their own, we can all help when we reach a decision. A lot of hard work has gone into SDGC and only recently about two miles of boundary was fenced off I presume at night time with barbed wire without any golfer seeing one of the workmen so between machinery movers and fencers we have no problem labour wise anyway.

vikingdub

Gambino wrote: »

Fennetec, I don't especially care who calls meetings but the members cannot evaluate the situation without knowing the landlords position. The meeting on Wednesday can achieve little unless we know the situation with the course.

The meeting on Wednesday will enable the members to decide a strategy and arrange to seek legal advice on a number of questionable aspects of closure of the club and the repossession of the land by the Kavanaghs.

We know what the Kavanaghs' position is what is needed is to agree a clear and well formulated strategy for the members.

Gambino

vikingdub wrote: »

Gambino wrote: »

Fennetec, I don't especially care who calls meetings but the members cannot evaluate the situation without knowing the landlords position. The meeting on Wednesday can achieve little unless we know the situation with the course.

The meeting on Wednesday will enable the members to decide a strategy and arrange to seek legal advice on a number of questionable aspects of closure of the club and the repossession of the land by the Kavanaghs.

We know what the Kavanaghs' position is what is needed is to agree a clear and well formulated strategy for the members.

It still wouldn't have hurt to hear what the landlord is proposing but maybe it is better to have those discussions conducted by (I hope a sensible and reasonable) team from the club, rather than him be confronted by a baying mob, which would have been a risk on Tuesday.
Whether people like it or not, the Kavanaghs are part of the solution more than the problem. Anger isn't an argument -or a strategy.

Golfingfanatic

fennetec wrote: »

A lot of hard work has gone into SDGC and only recently about two miles of boundary was fenced off I presume at night time with barbed wire without any golfer seeing one of the workmen so between machinery movers and fencers we have no problem labour wise anyway.

There is enough wild innuendo and accusation on here with out adding to it. The fence was installed over a period of a week in full daylight and when I asked the greenkeeper what was going on he said that it was to prevent the adjoining farmer's cows from getting onto the course again and causing damage as they had last year. The trees on the land just outside the fence belong to Coillte.

What I'd like to hear is confirmation from the Board that all directors paid their subs this year and also that the loans from them to the club have not been repaid to them. I'd also like an explanation as to why they removed the equipment, thus ensuring that there would be great difficulty in maintaining the course. Surely if the Board had their shareholders interests at heart they would have not done this.

tonyka

Golfingfanatic wrote: »

There is enough wild innuendo and accusation on here with out adding to it. The fence was installed over a period of a week in full daylight and when I asked the greenkeeper what was going on he said that it was to prevent the adjoining farmer's cows from getting onto the course again and causing damage as they had last year. The trees on the land just outside the fence belong to Coillte.

What I'd like to hear is confirmation from the Board that all directors paid their subs this year and also that the loans from them to the club have not been repaid to them. I'd also like an explanation as to why they removed the equipment, thus ensuring that there would be great difficulty in maintaining the course. Surely if the Board had their shareholders interests at heart they would have not done this.

well said

Almaviva

Golfingfanatic wrote: »

What I'd like to hear is confirmation from the Board that all directors paid their subs this year and also that the loans from them to the club have not been repaid to them.

+1

Gambino

Almaviva wrote: »

Golfingfanatic wrote: »

What I'd like to hear is confirmation from the Board that all directors paid their subs this year and also that the loans from them to the club have not been repaid to them.

+1

Me too, but why confine it to the Board? Lets get the full story on the entire membership for the last few years. That way we will know where everyone is coming from - and whose opinion to take seriously.

alitoast

Did any members play up there this weekend?

Gambino

alitoast wrote: »

Did any members play up there this weekend?

Yes

Golf156

Very interesting reading on http://cashiq.net/. It's free to read up to 3 company accounts.
almost 1 million SC wages bill for 2010 and 2011, seems a bit high.

uberwolf

Golf156 wrote: »

Very interesting reading on http://cashiq.net/. It's free to read up to 3 company accounts.
almost 1 million SC wages bill for 2010 and 2011, seems a bit high.

25 staff @ 40k each. Not impossible to imagine a course, bar, restaurant, etc employing that many people/