South County GC Closed

Gambino

thegen wrote: »

But how do you know who refused to or tried negotiating because they disagreed with marketing strategies?

Did the board send out a list of names who did this? If you are in possession of such a list you might share it with us.

See #567

Gambino

I see someone has now started a text campaign - saying that Pat Kavanagh "seized the shareholders investment" so why would anyone support him?

Answers might include "in order to preserve their investment" and could also include the comment that the said investment was abandoned by the shareholders.

If the texter has an alternative plan to watching grass grow, he will presumably let us know in due course.

thegen

[QUOTE=Gambino;78672707]See #567[/QUOTE]

That does not answer my question.

You might share with us the cell phone number these texts are coming from. And shareholders investment is dead with the company going under.

Gambino

thegen wrote: »

That does not answer my question.

You might share with us the cell phone number these texts are coming from. And shareholders investment is dead with the company going under.

I don't have such a list although I do know bits of the story. I am suggesting that such a list be published so everyone knows where everyone is coming from. Do you agree?

I understand the moderators frown on phone numbers in these boards. It is an Irish number but I don't recognise it, nor do I especially care.

And I am well aware that the shareholder investment is gone.

Alrite Chief

Gambino wrote: »

I see someone has now started a text campaign - saying that Pat Kavanagh "seized the shareholders investment" so why would anyone support him?

Answers might include "in order to preserve their investment" and could also include the comment that the said investment was abandoned by the shareholders.

If the texter has an alternative plan to watching grass grow, he will presumably let us know in due course.

Come on Gambino you said yourself way back in this thread you were only interested in constructive and positive debate. You said you wanted other users to keep their rumours and negatives to themselves. Its obvious enough where you stand in this whole affair. Lets wait until Wednesdays meeting to see what the facts are. Committee will know what is true and what isn't true regarding all these rumours. Its in their interest to keep us informed and lets face it the committee are they only people we can truly rely on at the moment until the dust settles and intentions become clearer.

Gambino

Alrite Chief wrote: »

Come on Gambino you said yourself way back in this thread you were only interested in constructive and positive debate. You said you wanted other users to keep Its obvious enough where you stand in this whole affair. Lets wait until Wednesdays meeting to see what the facts are. Committee will know what is true and what isn't true regarding all these rumours. Its in their interest to keep us informed and lets face it the committee are they only people we can truly rely on at the moment until the dust settles and intentions become clearer.

No problem with that Alrite. I hope the texter is who running his "f*ck the Kavanaghs" campaign takes note.

Redzah

thegen wrote: »

That does not answer my question.

You might share with us the cell phone number these texts are coming from. And shareholders investment is dead with the company going under.

Yes exactly, from reading this thread and the media and SC website, it looks clear that SC were not meeting their lease liabilities/rental payments as they fall due under the terms of the agreement. Therefore if they default on the payments the lessor/landlord has every right to reclaim his land. If the shareholders invested funds in the company that defaulted on their payments then they have the following options;

1. Raise more capital to meet the rental/lease payments under the agreement with the landlord.

2. Renegotiate the terms of the lease/rental agreement

3. Do nothing and whinge about how the landlord took his land back which by the information presented so far in this thread that he was perfectly entitled to do.

If i was a landlord and agreed that i would only receive 80% of the income from my tenant and then they requested a further deduction to 50% of agreed amount then of course i would consider my options and reclaiming the land was one of these.

As far as the investment is concerned unless options 1 or 2 above are not explored then the investment is a dead duck.

Alrite Chief

Gambino its **** them all is where i stand at the moment. The board, the Kavanaghs and the scabs who refused to pay. I like most are one of the innocent parties in all of this and unfortunately we're are the people that get screwed most of all. Lets see what the committee have to say Wednesday. Im ready to jump ship or stay put depending on the developments over the next week or so.

Gambino

Im ready to jump ship or stay put depending on the developments over the next week or so.[/QUOTE]
Likewise but I have a preference to stay if it looks sustainable. I don't think any of the other options in the area are nearly as good courses but if it comes to that........

stinkypoo

Gambino talks about reality. Why did 65 memebrs not shareholders not renew in January. Is it possible they got their cheap golf for twelve months and when the price went up they moved onto the next club. What was their incentive to stay. The alarm bells should have been ringing at that stage. Thats the reality of the situation. Its seems the shareholders not renewing was the final straw. You could ask should more not have been done to gather support from the memebers and shareholders at the start of the year?

fennetec

stinkypoo wrote: »

Gambino talks about reality. Why did 65 memebrs not shareholders not renew in January. Is it possible they got their cheap golf for twelve months and when the price went up they moved onto the next club. What was their incentive to stay. The alarm bells should have been ringing at that stage. Thats the reality of the situation. Its seems the shareholders not renewing was the final straw. You could ask should more not have been done to gather support from the memebers and shareholders at the start of the year?

That is the big question, or should I say the big problem. Say what we like about the Kavanaghs but they are putting the information out for us all to see. What in the name of God is the delay in calling a meeting of the members? Are the board hoping that enough of us will say we have had enough and we will just go elswhere? That is what I am about to do if someone can direct me to Kileen, I tried Beechpark yesterday but there was a gale force blowing. If anyone has any idea about other clubs can they message them to me. Thanks.

Gambino

stinkypoo wrote: »

Gambino talks about reality. Why did 65 memebrs not shareholders not renew in January. Is it possible they got their cheap golf for twelve months and when the price went up they moved onto the next club. What was their incentive to stay. The alarm bells should have been ringing at that stage. Thats the reality of the situation. Its seems the shareholders not renewing was the final straw. You could ask should more not have been done to gather support from the memebers and shareholders at the start of the year?

I talked to Michael Diskin about that a while back. He said that cost was the stated factor in people moving on in only a small number of cases. Most left because other clubs that suited them better (location, friends were members) had become available. Some found SC too tough, too windy etc. Michael was diligent in his job and I'm pretty confident he explored that thoroughly with those leaving.

Notwithstanding that, "churn" is a part of the golf scene since the end of big joining fees and some turnover is inevitable. We were doing OK in staying ahead of the game - more joining than leaving - until the "rebel" members and shareholders pulled the rug from under everyone.

Gambino

fennetec wrote: »

That is the big question, or should I say the big problem. Say what we like about the Kavanaghs but they are putting the information out for us all to see. What in the name of God is the delay in calling a meeting of the members? Are the board hoping that enough of us will say we have had enough and we will just go elswhere? That is what I am about to do if someone can direct me to Kileen, I tried Beechpark yesterday but there was a gale force blowing. If anyone has any idea about other clubs can they message them to me. Thanks.

That's funny, seeing as you cancelled a meeting scheduled for tomorrow.

I imagine there are some legal steps to be completed before we can have the full picture and therefore a proper discussion. I was told the board is meeting today to appoint a liquidator. If (as is also reported) Pat Kavanagh is meeting the Committees tomorrow, then Wednesday is as soon as we can meaningfully talk about it.

thegen

Gambino wrote: »

I talked to Michael Diskin about that a while back. He said that cost was the stated factor in people moving on in only a small number of cases. Most left because other clubs that suited them better (location, friends were members) had become available. Some found SC too tough, too windy etc. Michael was diligent in his job and I'm pretty confident he explored that thoroughly with those leaving.

Notwithstanding that, "churn" is a part of the golf scene since the end of big joining fees and some turnover is inevitable. We were doing OK in staying ahead of the game - more joining than leaving - until the "rebel" members and shareholders pulled the rug from under everyone.

Gambino, MD did not do his job. I know of four members who left for various reasons, starting a family, medical problems etc and not one of them received a phone call from MD. If you lose a client in business you pick up the phone. SC or MD did not. MD was focused on getting in new members, which he failed in while ignoring people who were members and letting them leave without an exit interview.

thegen

Gambino wrote: »

That's funny, seeing as you cancelled a meeting scheduled for tomorrow.

I imagine there are some legal steps to be completed before we can have the full picture and therefore a proper discussion. I was told the board is meeting today to appoint a liquidator. If (as is also reported) Pat Kavanagh is meeting the Committees tomorrow, then Wednesday is as soon as we can meaningfully talk about it.

The board cannot appoint a liquidator without an EGM and a vote by shareholders on said appointment.

Gambino

thegen wrote: »

Gambino, I know of four members who left for various reasons, starting a family, medical problems etc and not one of them received a phone call from MD. If you lose a client in business you pick up the phone. SC or MD did not. MD was focused on getting in new members, which he failed in while ignoring people who were members and letting them leave without an exit interview.

I'm not here to defend or explain MD's performance but in my experience he was diligent and on top of things. Maybe he was too busy trying to talk some reality and sense into the "rebels". The cases you mention don't sound as if they were negotiable and hardly count as people flitting from club to club, which was the insinuation concerning the marketing strategy.

You may be right about the liquidator issue; perhaps they are just preparing the way today. The point is that we can have all the members meetings we want and as soon as we like but without the necessary information, they will just turn into shouting matches.

GreeBo

thegen wrote: »

Gambino, </modedit> I know of four members who left for various reasons, starting a family, medical problems etc and not one of them received a phone call from MD. If you lose a client in business you pick up the phone. SC or MD did not. MD was focused on getting in new members, which he failed in while ignoring people who were members and letting them leave without an exit interview.

Congratulations!
You have just received an all expenses paid 1 month holiday from the Golf Forum.

ForeRight

GreeBo wrote: »

thegen wrote: »

Gambino, </modedit> I know of four members who left for various reasons, starting a family, medical problems etc and not one of them received a phone call from MD. If you lose a client in business you pick up the phone. SC or MD did not. MD was focused on getting in new members, which he failed in while ignoring people who were members and letting them leave without an exit interview.

Congratulations!
You have just received an all expenses paid 1 month holiday from the Golf Forum.

Hahahaha banpie in the face

fennetec

Gambino wrote: »

That's funny, seeing as you cancelled a meeting scheduled for tomorrow.

I imagine there are some legal steps to be completed before we can have the full picture and therefore a proper discussion. I was told the board is meeting today to appoint a liquidator. If (as is also reported) Pat Kavanagh is meeting the Committees tomorrow, then Wednesday is as soon as we can meaningfully talk about it.

I can understand that there are legal steps to be taken and I am fully aware of the liquidation process. (I already have reservations about who is selecting the liquidator and who he will be hostile toward but I can not give the reason for my concern here) You are 100% right, there will be plenty of legal steps to be taken but my point is a meeting of all the members should have been called exactly one week ago to discuss the illegal steps that have already been taken and how people were notified of their termination of employment before any liquidator was appointed. It is an absolute disgrace that it is a week since the locks were changed and there has been no venue, date and time for a meeting circulated to members.

PhilipMarlowe

Gambino wrote: »

I'm not here to defend or explain MD's performance but in my experience he was diligent and on top of things. Maybe he was too busy trying to talk some reality and sense into the "rebels". The cases you mention don't sound as if they were negotiable and hardly count as people flitting from club to club, which was the insinuation concerning the marketing strategy.

You may be right about the liquidator issue; perhaps they are just preparing the way today. The point is that we can have all the members meetings we want and as soon as we like but without the necessary information, they will just turn into shouting matches.

"I'm not here to defend or explain..." followed by patronising explanations and defence. Ah bless.

GreeBo

ForeRight wrote: »

Hahahaha banpie in the face

Congratulations!
You have just received an all expenses paid 1 week holiday from the Golf Forum.
:cool:

fennetec

thegen wrote: »

Gambino, MD did not do his job. I know of four members who left for various reasons, starting a family, medical problems etc and not one of them received a phone call from MD. If you lose a client in business you pick up the phone. SC or MD did not. MD was focused on getting in new members, which he failed in while ignoring people who were members and letting them leave without an exit interview.

In fairness we can't blame him for taking money off us on one hand and not getting it on the other. I know that I had a few discussions with him about getting in new members and he was dead interested and followed through to secure them. This is why I am so, so dissapointed, I thought I was in the best little club in the world and that we were on the up. Let's not forget for one minute that there are two other clubs in Wicklow on the way out as well and a high profile club a few miles from SCGC lost in excess of 60 members this year as well and I am not talking about the Blessington area.

downthemiddle

fennetec wrote: »

thegen wrote: »

Gambino, MD did not do his job. I know of four members who left for various reasons, starting a family, medical problems etc and not one of them received a phone call from MD. If you lose a client in business you pick up the phone. SC or MD did not. MD was focused on getting in new members, which he failed in while ignoring people who were members and letting them leave without an exit interview.

In fairness we can't blame him for taking money off us on one hand and not getting it on the other. I know that I had a few discussions with him about getting in new members and he was dead interested and followed through to secure them. This is why I am so, so dissapointed, I thought I was in the best little club in the world and that we were on the up. Let's not forget for one minute that there are two other clubs in Wicklow on the way out as well and a high profile club a few miles from SCGC lost in excess of 60 members this year as well and I am not talking about the Blessington area.

Where are you talking about as a matter of interest?

Anatom

I am dreadfully sorry to hear the news guys. I always love playing (and eating in!) South County and I seriously hope it all gets sorted out. I actually considered it for membership many years ago, but didn't have the shillings at the time. I do know a couple of members there and they are still shellshocked and genuinely worried about their club and its future.

However, parking that for a moment, I'm sorry to say that this thread has become an example of all that is wrong with online discussion threads/boards/forums. It is acting as a huge example to some of my friends, acquaintances and colleagues as to why they would never get it together to join the 21st century and do more stuff online. Without wishing to sound pompous, but if this is the future of "Social Media" than some of you here need to go back to school.

Slagging people off, insinuations and blatant speculation disguised (barely) as insider knowledge have resulted in I don't know how many pages of drivel and even deeper despair for those genuinely concerned at the loss of their money, their membership and their club.

I would like to make a suggestion to the moderators here. Given that we've had several days of "open and honest discussion" on this thread, can we restrict any further commentary on this forum to actual facts / updates (for example, from Wednesday's members' meeting) that may benefit or inform members / interested parties, and let the speculators and naysayers go somewhere else?

Finally, Greebo - a small point (and please take this in the manner in which its intended), but you banned the funniest post on this forum just there! "Banpie" indeed!

GreeBo

Anatom wrote: »

I am dreadfully sorry to hear the news guys. I always love playing (and eating in!) South County and I seriously hope it all gets sorted out. I actually considered it for membership many years ago, but didn't have the shillings at the time. I do know a couple of members there and they are still shellshocked and genuinely worried about their club and its future.

However, parking that for a moment, I'm sorry to say that this thread has become an example of all that is wrong with online discussion threads/boards/forums. It is acting as a huge example to some of my friends, acquaintances and colleagues as to why they would never get it together to join the 21st century and do more stuff online. Without wishing to sound pompous, but if this is the future of "Social Media" than some of you here need to go back to school.

Slagging people off, insinuations and blatant speculation disguised (barely) as insider knowledge have resulted in I don't know how many pages of drivel and even deeper despair for those genuinely concerned at the loss of their money, their membership and their club.

I would like to make a suggestion to the moderators here. Given that we've had several days of "open and honest discussion" on this thread, can we restrict any further commentary on this forum to actual facts / updates (for example, from Wednesday's members' meeting) that may benefit or inform members / interested parties, and let the speculators and naysayers go somewhere else?

Finally, Greebo - a small point (and please take this in the manner in which its intended), but you banned the funniest post on this forum just there! "Banpie" indeed!

Please dont backseat mod, it will get you banned.

Oh and if you want comedy --> Humour Forum

Anatom

GreeBo wrote: »

Please dont backseat mod, it will get you banned.

I don't even know what that means Greebo.

I thought I was just making a reasonable suggestion. If that steps beyond what's permissable, then I'm sorry. I'd better go back and read the instructions again...

fennetec

Both clubs are in East Wicklow and because I don't want to be the next one to get an all expenses holiday for a week from the mod thats all I am saying.

Redzah

fennetec wrote: »

Both clubs are in East Wicklow and because I don't want to be the next one to get an all expenses holiday for a week from the mod thats all I am saying.

Ah come on, surely that won't merit a ban, if you have info you could potentially save some of us cash.

Had a look at the ol humour forum there Greebo, its awful stuff, they even have a joke called the golfer which is utter tripe, although some at the South County meeting on Weds could do with utilising their clubs in this manner as they don't have any other use at present http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056619094

fennetec

Just heard that the Board of Directors went in this morning at 4am and took the 16th green and were last seen heading down Blessington Lake with it to lodge it in A.I.B. to meet redundancy payments. I hope this post is true because if not it is a huge example to some of my friends, acquaintances and colleagues as to why they would never get it together to join the 21st century and do more stuff online. Without wishing to sound pompous, but if this is the only way I can dillute the loss I am feeling for SCGC right now it leaves a lot to be desired about discussion forums and speculation disguised as insider information.

thinned it

fennetec wrote: »

Just heard that the Board of Directors went in this morning at 4am and took the 16th green and were last seen heading down Blessington Lake with it to lodge it in A.I.B. to meet redundancy payments. I hope this post is true because if not it is a huge example to some of my friends, acquaintances and colleagues as to why they would never get it together to join the 21st century and do more stuff online. Without wishing to sound pompous, but if this is the only way I can dillute the loss I am feeling for SCGC right now it leaves a lot to be desired about discussion forums and speculation disguised as insider information.

Ha