Pre-built machine; am I stuck with it?

Alactric

Hey lads, new guy here. I was wondering if you could give me some advice on an ancient pre built dell machine I have.

I have the XPS 420. It's got 375 watt power supply, core 2 Q6600 2.4ghz processor and 2 gigs of RAM. It's also got a PCIs 2.0 x16 video card slot with a pre-historic 2600XT 1gb in it, and it's all running on 32bit Vista.

So I'm wondering realistically what my options are as of now. Obviously the most I can do is 4gb or ram (or 3. something, I know it can't use all of it) and the card slot and PSU gives me an even more limited selection. However I did find out that the 420 doesn't use a proprietary power supply so i guess that gives me a lot of room? But considering I've never messed around with a PC's guts this much the thought of screwing with the power supply bugs me. That said I'm happy with the CPU.

I'm having great difficulty finding a 375 watt gpu, I just keep getting the 4670 and 8800? If the upgrade is so incremental is it really worth the hassle of upgrading this piece of junk?

Eboggles

What exactly do you want do do with it? The 7750 would fit in that PSU I'd say if you wanted to lean towards gaming. Otherwise fill out these questions if you want to get a new build.

Tij da feen

You could put a 6870 in there. Shadowhearth ran a 6870 on pretty much the same machine AFAIK. You could then upgrade the RAM. I'm not sure it's really worth investing much into the system but the 6870 and the RAM increase would give a nice boost.

Alactric

I'm aware of the template, I chose not to use it as I don't think it accurately reflects what I'm trying to do. I don't want to rebuild whole portions of the machine. I want to know how easily can I update the the machine to semi-modern standards. If I could meet recommended specs on a newer game and reach 30-45fps by simply swapping out the GPU and RAM I'd be delighted. But as I posted, I have some serious bottlenecks. I'm simply asking what I can realistically do with such severe restrictions.

Alactric

Tij da feen wrote: »

You could put a 6870 in there. Shadowhearth ran a 6870 on pretty much the same machine AFAIK. You could then upgrade the RAM. I'm not sure it's really worth investing much into the system but the 6870 and the RAM increase would give a nice boost.

Is Shadowhearth still on Boards?

uncle_sam_ie

Alactric wrote: »

Is Shadowhearth still on Boards?

He's everywhere :D

Tij da feen

Found ShadowHearth's original post:

q6600 2.4ghz
3gb ram
8800GT
640gb
dells 375 PSU

He stuck a 6870 into that and was able to play BF3 on 1680x1050 on med-high settings I think. Upgrade with RAM from adverts on top of that you should be able to breath some life into the system.

Alactric

Tij da feen wrote: »

Found ShadowHearth's original post:

q6600 2.4ghz
3gb ram
8800GT
640gb
dells 375 PSU

He stuck a 6870 into that and was able to play BF3 on 1680x1050 on med-high settings I think. Upgrade with RAM from adverts on top of that you should be able to breath some life into the system.

Whoah, that sounds amazing. :cool:

ShadowHearth

uncle_sam_ie wrote: »

He's everywhere :D

on topic:

i have same spec dell too, its now hooked to my telly in bedroom. you know for all porn and stuff.

so its xps 420 3gb ram and it had 8800GT in it. i was looking in to what gpu i can fit in there on that 375w and the best solution after a bit of research - 6870. i got club 3D one.
375w is more then enough for that card. dells psu are quite damn good. in fact best things from dell are - Monitors and PSUs.

now i did that upgrade around august last year, so no 7 series out by then.
by the looks of it, now you could fit in 7850, which will be faster and use waaaaaaaaaaay less power too.

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/AMD/HD_7850_HD_7870/24.html

so just food for thought: 6870 eats about 169w max load, 7850 is at 101w. so you got a headroom for OCING too.
depending on your budget 6870 and 7850 will be best bet.

Alactric

So you've had no problem running anything in the last year? BF3, Arkham City, Deus Ex, Skyrim? What type of FPS do you get on high?

ShadowHearth

Alactric wrote: »

So you've had no problem running anything in the last year? BF3, Arkham City, Deus Ex, Skyrim? What type of FPS do you get on high?

now BF3 at 1650x1050 with everything high, motion blur off, SSAO AA lowered a bit, but not turned off. i had a constant 40++ fps. i did not tried much on 1080p though, because when i got my new Rig, i havent played much on the old PC.

MW3 maxed out at 1080p, havent seen any difference between my 2500k gtx 570/gtx680

WOW - maxed out with **** loads of fps.

witcher 2 - all maxed out, but no uber sampling. had huge fps at 1650x1050. uber sampling brings to its knees even my new machine.

cant remember other games.

Alactric

ShadowHearth wrote: »

now BF3 at 1650x1050 with everything high, motion blur off, SSAO AA lowered a bit, but not turned off. i had a constant 40++ fps. i did not tried much on 1080p though, because when i got my new Rig, i havent played much on the old PC.

MW3 maxed out at 1080p, havent seen any difference between my 2500k gtx 570/gtx680

WOW - maxed out with **** loads of fps.

witcher 2 - all maxed out, but no uber sampling. had huge fps at 1650x1050. uber sampling brings to its knees even my new machine.

cant remember other games.

Witcher 2 maxed? Wow. Well this is something else, I didn't think I could do anything with this PC. Gotta do some shopping, btw when you say 6870 you mean Radeon and not Sapphire right?

Tij da feen

Alactric wrote: »

Witcher 2 maxed? Wow. Well this is something else, I didn't think I could do anything with this PC. Gotta do some shopping, btw when you say 6870 you mean Radeon and not Sapphire right?

Sapphire is just a vendor. Sapphire is quite a good brand, if you get a good price go with them.

ShadowHearth

Alactric wrote: »

Witcher 2 maxed? Wow. Well this is something else, I didn't think I could do anything with this PC. Gotta do some shopping, btw when you say 6870 you mean Radeon and not Sapphire right?

Yup. Witcher 2 was the reason I went for upgrade. My 8800gt was barely able to run witcher 2 on med settings. Playing game like witcher 2 on anything, but max is a sin and should be looked at like criminal offence.

Look at any 6870 with aftermarket cooling solution.those should be around 150eu. Btw 7850 would be even more performance m8.

SpannerMonkey

I have the exact same PC dell xps 420 I have upgraded mine to 4gb of RAM and stuck in a Sapphire HD6870 Vapor-X graphics card ( its a great card cool and quiet )and updated to windows 7 and it's well able for modern applications I'm able to run battlefield 3 on a mix of high and ultra setting without any problem total cost of upgrading would be quite low maybe 200-250 at the absolute max paying max retail prices , well worth doing if you don't have cash for a new PC , and u coul possible get graphics card second hand etc

ShadowHearth

SpannerMonkey wrote: »

I have the exact same PC dell xps 420 I have upgraded mine to 4gb of RAM and stuck in a Sapphire HD6870 Vapor-X graphics card ( its a great card cool and quiet )and updated to windows 7 and it's well able for modern applications I'm able to run battlefield 3 on a mix of high and ultra setting without any problem total cost of upgrading would be quite low maybe 200-250 at the absolute max paying max retail prices , well worth doing if you don't have cash for a new PC , and u coul possible get graphics card second hand etc

It's quite shocking how good these q6600 4gb ram and 6870 5 year pcs can be. 5 year old pc with updated gpu for 150 transfers old ceappy pc to a modern gaming machine

Alactric

ShadowHearth wrote: »

Yup. Witcher 2 was the reason I went for upgrade. My 8800gt was barely able to run witcher 2 on med settings. Playing game like witcher 2 on anything, but max is a sin and should be looked at like criminal offence.

Look at any 6870 with aftermarket cooling solution.those should be around 150eu. Btw 7850 would be even more performance m8.

Just one last clarification, the 7850 is a part of a whole new series no? I'd be good to for power consumption and space within the case if I went for it?

ShadowHearth

Alactric wrote: »

Just one last clarification, the 7850 is a part of a whole new series no? I'd be good to for power consumption and space within the case if I went for it?

did you even checked the link i gave you? :pac:

here look at this m8:
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/AMD/HD_7850_HD_7870/23.html

7850 performance is higher then 6870 and it draws way less power then 6870.

6870 is safe bet for around 150eu, 7850 is a good, but it will be around 240eu

Alactric

ShadowHearth wrote: »

did you even checked the link i gave you? :pac:

here look at this m8:
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/AMD/HD_7850_HD_7870/23.html

7850 performance is higher then 6870 and it draws way less power then 6870.

6870 is safe bet for around 150eu, 7850 is a good, but it will be around 240eu

I meant if a 6870 fits will a 7850?

Skerries

6870 here for €139.90
but if delivery is more than €20 then here will be cheaper as they do free delivery
7850 for around €236 from here, which should have free delivery

Skylinehead

Should do yeah.

Alactric

Would 7850 not be massive overkill though? Seeing as my Ram will maxed at 3gb unless you switch up to Win 7, and I only have Q6600? GPU performance can't be that divorced from everything else can it?

ShadowHearth

Alactric wrote: »

Would 7850 not be massive overkill though? Seeing as my Ram will maxed at 3gb unless you switch up to Win 7?

thats a good point. he wount be able to have 3gb ram. 4gb ram is max. so 2gb ram +2gb gpu.

well 6870 would be the best so. cheap and cheerful, save the rest of the money for next built then.

Alactric

SpannerMonkey wrote: »

I have the exact same PC dell xps 420 I have upgraded mine to 4gb of RAM and stuck in a Sapphire HD6870 Vapor-X graphics card ( its a great card cool and quiet )and updated to windows 7 and it's well able for modern applications I'm able to run battlefield 3 on a mix of high and ultra setting without any problem total cost of upgrading would be quite low maybe 200-250 at the absolute max paying max retail prices , well worth doing if you don't have cash for a new PC , and u coul possible get graphics card second hand etc

I'm not sure if you're still reading this thread, but you said you upgraded you're ram to 4gb. I assume it was ddr 2 800mhz right? Unless there's newer model that uses ddr3 that I don't know about.

ShadowHearth

Alactric wrote: »

I'm not sure if you're still reading this thread, but you said you upgraded you're ram to 4gb. I assume it was ddr 2 800mhz right? Unless there's newer model that uses ddr3 that I don't know about.

dont worry about 667 or 800 ram. you wont feel a damn thing. xps 420 only ddr2 too.

SpannerMonkey

Alactric wrote: »

I'm not sure if you're still reading this thread, but you said you upgraded you're ram to 4gb. I assume it was ddr 2 800mhz right? Unless there's newer model that uses ddr3 that I don't know about.

as shadow hearth said no huge differance and the XPS 420 only supports DDR2 , this is the one i went for
http://www.crucial.com/eu/store/mpartspecs.aspx?mtbpoid=3C984BE5A5CA7304
it did make a huge differance for 50 quid in fairness
4gb is the most you can use so dont bother getting any more
but get matching pairs of ram , thats why i got a fresh 4GB instead of just topping up with an extra 2 GB
.
.
.

Alactric

SpannerMonkey wrote: »

as shadow hearth said no huge differance and the XPS 420 only supports DDR2 , this is the one i went for
http://www.crucial.com/eu/store/mpartspecs.aspx?mtbpoid=3C984BE5A5CA7304
it did make a huge differance for 50 quid in fairness
4gb is the most you can use so dont bother getting any more
but get matching pairs of ram , thats why i got a fresh 4GB instead of just topping up with an extra 2 GB
.
.
.

Yup, I'm ready to go now. Got the 4gb kit and the 6870 on order, all for a cool 170 quid. Thanks Spanner / Shadow and you other lads, you've made a PC gamer outta me again

I think this thread can be locked or something?

ShadowHearth

Nah. Thread can stay. Let us know how will you get on, when stuff arrives and you have a go at it. It is always nice to see how it all ends.

SpannerMonkey

Alactric wrote: »

SpannerMonkey wrote: »

as shadow hearth said no huge differance and the XPS 420 only supports DDR2 , this is the one i went for
http://www.crucial.com/eu/store/mpartspecs.aspx?mtbpoid=3C984BE5A5CA7304
it did make a huge differance for 50 quid in fairness
4gb is the most you can use so dont bother getting any more
but get matching pairs of ram , thats why i got a fresh 4GB instead of just topping up with an extra 2 GB
.
.
.

Yup, I'm ready to go now. Got the 4gb kit and the 6870 on order, all for a cool 170 quid. Thanks Spanner / Shadow and you other lads, you've made a PC gamer outta me again

I think this thread can be locked or something?

Nah leave it open and let us know how u get on , for the 6870 you may need to get an adaptor for the cable to power the GPU as the new card has 2 x 6 pinn power plugs and your old card only has 1 , my one came in the box with the card so u might be ok .

It is a bargain upgrade alright , will transform the pc :-) , if u can get one cheap consider an upgrade to windows 7 as well it runs much better ,

ShadowHearth

SpannerMonkey wrote: »

Nah leave it open and let us know how u get on , for the 6870 you may need to get an adaptor for the cable to power the GPU as the new card has 2 x 6 pinn power plugs and your old card only has 1 , my one came in the box with the card so u might be ok .

It is a bargain upgrade alright , will transform the pc :-) , if u can get one cheap consider an upgrade to windows 7 as well it runs much better ,

Feck! That's right! I remembered about this in bed last night, I wanted to say that!!!

OP, newer 6870 all need 2x6 pin connections. Xps 420 has only 1. You can make 1 more 6 pin from 2xsata or 2x molex. I am stupid fecker. So I went hard way: 2xadaptera from sata to molex and then adapter from 2x molex in to 6 pin.

2x molex in to 6 pin Ussually comes with gpu, but not all. You can get those adapters in local maplins for few quid.

Alactric

ShadowHearth wrote: »

Feck! That's right! I remembered about this in bed last night, I wanted to say that!!!

OP, newer 6870 all need 2x6 pin connections. Xps 420 has only 1. You can make 1 more 6 pin from 2xsata or 2x molex. I am stupid fecker. So I went hard way: 2xadaptera from sata to molex and then adapter from 2x molex in to 6 pin.

2x molex in to 6 pin Ussually comes with gpu, but not all. You can get those adapters in local maplins for few quid.

No worries mate, order won't ship till monday, I'll just stick in with the rest.

Is this the one your on about? http://www.amazon.co.uk/Molex-to-2-SATA-Internal-Power-Splitter-Cable/dp/B0002GRUV4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1336827756&sr=8-1