The Great Irish Famine

My name is URL · 13-05-2012 9:10pm #1

It wasn't really a famine.. was it? =/

IM0 · 13-05-2012 9:10pm

no they still had broadband

TeddyTedson · 13-05-2012 9:11pm

My name is URL wrote: »

It wasn't really a famine.. was it? =/

I don't get all the fuss about it either, I mean if they could afford to emigrate they could afford to eat in a modest restaurant.

Intensive Care Bear · 13-05-2012 9:11pm

My name is URL wrote: »

It wasn't really a famine.. was it? =/

Well it definitely wasn't a feast either.

Sky King · 13-05-2012 9:12pm

Don't see what was so great about it either. Like, lots of people died.

im invisible · 13-05-2012 9:12pm

My name is URL wrote: »

It wasn't really a famine.. was it? =/

no, but shur it was great tho, wasnt it

Intensive Care Bear · 13-05-2012 9:13pm

If it was just the potatoes that were affected, at the end of the day, you will pay the price if you're a fussy eater.

dlofnep · 13-05-2012 9:13pm

My name is URL wrote: »

It wasn't really a famine.. was it? =/

Well, while an important food source was hit hard - the biggest problem was managing it, and the export of alternative food sources to Britain. (Meat, fish, grains). Not to mention, Ireland was incredibly poor at the time and wholly unprepared for the disease that followed from malnurishment.

I wouldn't use 'famine' to describe it - Systematic pillaging of the poor is probably a better description. Our local Gaeltacht here in Waterford still carries indepth stories from the famine, which are frankly horrifying to hear and is remnant of something that you'd expect to happen in the stone age, and not mid 19th century Ireland.

Sky King · 13-05-2012 9:14pm

Well there was still lots of food available, but the local peons just couldn't afford it so they died instead.

Does that define a famine?

My name is URL · 13-05-2012 9:14pm

im invisible wrote: »

no, but shur it was great tho, wasnt it

Well it was definitely Irish, so we've nobody to blame but ourselves.

golden lane · 13-05-2012 9:15pm

it didn't put anybody off potatoes....

biko · 13-05-2012 9:15pm

Over a million dead aren't laughing.

im invisible · 13-05-2012 9:15pm

remember Sinead o'connor years ago saying 'there was no famine' and people saying she was mad. and she tore up the picture of the pope, and people said she was mad then too, and look at her now....

dlofnep · 13-05-2012 9:16pm

TeddyTedson wrote: »

I don't get all the fuss about it either, I mean if they could afford to emigrate they could afford to eat in a modest restaurant.

Eat once sure, and then what? The famine wasn't something that lasted a week. It went on for over 7 years and saw the deaths of a million people on the Island. If that happened today - it would echo around the world for decades.

I'm always amazed at how cynical people can be about mass death, of which no doubt - many of your relatives died horrific deaths in. Stop trying to be 'that guy' and show a bit of respect.

Sky King · 13-05-2012 9:16pm

im invisible wrote: »

remember Sinead o'connor years ago saying 'there was no famine' and people saying she was mad. and she tore up the picture of the pope, and people said she was mad, and look at her now....

Mad as a box of frogs.

golden lane · 13-05-2012 9:17pm

dlofnep wrote: »

Well, while an important food source was hit hard - the biggest problem was managing it, and the export of alternative food sources to Britain. (Meat, fish, grains). Not to mention, Ireland was incredibly poor at the time and wholly unprepared for the disease that followed from malnurishment.

I wouldn't use 'famine' to describe it - Systematic pillaging of the poor is probably a better description. Our local Gaeltacht here in Waterford still carries indepth stories from the famine, which are frankly horrifying to hear and is remnant of something that you'd expect to happen in the stone age, and not mid 19th century Ireland.

more people died in russia.....during the great famines of the thirties....

im invisible · 13-05-2012 9:20pm

golden lane wrote: »

more people died in russia.....during the great famines of the thirties....

you can't compare the two, shur they used all their spuds to make vodka

dlofnep · 13-05-2012 9:21pm

golden lane wrote: »

more people died in russia.....during the great famines of the thirties....

Russia has a much larger population. The population of Ireland halved from the famine.

Pushtrak · 13-05-2012 9:22pm

Is this thread going to be great in the same sense as the famine?

gurramok · 13-05-2012 9:22pm

golden lane wrote: »

more people died in russia.....during the great famines of the thirties....

As a proportion of the population, I do not think so.

my name is URL wrote:

Well it was definitely Irish, so we've nobody to blame but ourselves.

No, we didn't control our own government back then. The foreign rulers did.

Mr Benevolent · 13-05-2012 9:22pm

I like potatoes.

Duckworth_Luas · 13-05-2012 9:24pm

The population of Co Roscommon decreased by over 93,000 people during the famine years.

To put that in perspective that county has a population today of 63,000.

woodoo · 13-05-2012 9:24pm

dlofnep wrote: »

Eat once sure, and then what? The famine wasn't something that lasted a week. It went on for over 7 years and saw the deaths of a million people on the Island. If that happened today - it would echo around the world for decades.

I'm always amazed at how cynical people can be about mass death, of which no doubt - many of your relatives died horrific deaths in. Stop trying to be 'that guy' and show a bit of respect.

I don't get how Irish people could take the piss out of our greatest tragedy. People who were related to us prob suffered greatly during the famine.

The same people would be up in arms if anyone makes a joke about the Jewish Holocaust. Our own tragedy doesn't seem to register with them.

Fenian Army · 13-05-2012 9:26pm

No, because so much food was taken out of the country under armed guard. There was no shortage of food. The circumstances around the "famine" were created by great injustice, the penal laws, being cast off the best land and forced to live off a miserly patch of dirt, evictions, the list of things is a long one. But one thing is certain, the "famine" was a direct cumulative result of brutal and barbaric British colonialism and the racist attitudes that went along with it.

The ports could have been closed like they were in the 1700s to food exports which would have greatly helped the Irish people. They weren't.

The fenians rebelled under William Smith O Brien demanding that the export of grain cease.

The revisionist nonsense is promulgated by gob****es who think it is "mature" to change history to put the British in a better light, its better to tell people that thick paddy relied on spuds so loads died - thats not the case. This bullsh!t "newfound maturity" is exactly that - bullsh!t from people who can't accept criticisms of Britain's, quite frankly, brutal and barbaric practices over the centuries because thats "anti British and immature". These people shy away from the historic facts seeking "balanced" history - that is a version which is from a British perspective and casts them in a better light than quite frankly they deserve.

These people need to cop on that criticizing the brutality that the Irish suffered at the hands of Britain is not immature, nor does it mean that you hate todays British people or are somehow "racist" towards them.

golden lane · 13-05-2012 9:27pm

dlofnep wrote: »

Russia has a much larger population. The population of Ireland halved from the famine.

i believed i million died....another million emigrated....

very few , compared to ireland..died in scotland, but one million emigrated..

with regards to russid.....some estimations are twenty six million....from the ukraine mostly......in some ares...90% died...

Wild Bill · 13-05-2012 9:27pm

The famine was genocide.

im invisible · 13-05-2012 9:28pm

Pushtrak wrote: »

Is this thread going to be great in the same sense as the famine?

Crowd:
Two! Four! Six! Eight!
Homer's crime was very great!
[pause]
"Great" meaning "large" or "immense",
We use it in the pejorative sense!

Sauve · 13-05-2012 9:29pm

woodoo wrote: »

I don't get how Irish people could take the piss out of our greatest tragedy. People who were related to us prob suffered greatly during the famine.

The same people would be up in arms if anyone makes a joke about the Jewish Holocaust. Our own tragedy doesn't seem to register with them.

I'm not in any way belittling the famine, but the Irish have this great way of getting over tragedies with humour.
'We' know that it's done, it can't be changed, so we may as well have a pint and a laugh rather than cry about it.
I mean that in general, about everything in the country, not just the famine.

Inventive User Name · 13-05-2012 9:32pm

TeddyTedson wrote: »

I don't get all the fuss about it either, I mean if they could afford to emigrate they could afford to eat in a modest restaurant.

I suppose this lad will be let take the piss out of the famine, but if I make some Holocaust or 9/11 jokes, I'll probably get banned. :rolleyes:

TeddyTedson · 13-05-2012 9:32pm

dlofnep wrote: »

Eat once sure, and then what? The famine wasn't something that lasted a week. It went on for over 7 years and saw the deaths of a million people on the Island. If that happened today - it would echo around the world for decades.

I'm always amazed at how cynical people can be about mass death, of which no doubt - many of your relatives died horrific deaths in. Stop trying to be 'that guy' and show a bit of respect.

Just a bit of humor from Alan Partridge.

But don't be so high and mighty about it yourself, it's not as if any of us know any of the people who died. Yes it was tragic, but of course we can joke about it. Stop being so controlling.

Enkidu · 13-05-2012 9:33pm

golden lane wrote: »

more people died in russia.....during the great famines of the thirties....

And? Are you saying the famine was great craic because more people died in something else?

admiralofthefleet · 13-05-2012 9:33pm

should be called the Irish holocaust, the brits should be treated the same way nazi germany was

Temptamperu · 13-05-2012 9:35pm

Also the holocaust? did it really cost that much?

woodoo · 13-05-2012 9:36pm

Sauve wrote: »

I'm not in any way belittling the famine, but the Irish have this great way of getting over tragedies with humour.
'We' know that it's done, it can't be changed, so we may as well have a pint and a laugh rather than cry about it.
I mean that in general, about everything in the country, not just the famine.

I'll leave it to people from outside Ireland to make the jokes about it. I can't really imagine too many jokes in Israel about the holocaust. Or in England about their WW2 dead.

I think people here are so engulfed in British media they end up taking the piss out of our famine as if it wasn't their country it happened to. I don't think they are using humour as a way to deal with it. They just don't give a s**t. Which is quite sad.

dsmythy · 13-05-2012 9:37pm

biko wrote: »

Over a million dead aren't laughing.

Before the famine 8 million people are estimated to have lived in Ireland.

Today, 8 million of them are dead.

golden lane · 13-05-2012 9:41pm

Enkidu wrote: »

And? Are you saying the famine was great craic because more people died in something else?

you have just read what i said......for people to die, for any other reason than natural causes...that is horrific........no matter what nationality they are.....

that is my stance.....what is yours.....innuendo.

Sauve · 13-05-2012 9:41pm

woodoo wrote: »

I think people here are so engulfed in British media they end up taking the piss out of our famine as if it wasn't their country it happened to. I don't think they are using humour as a way to deal with it. They just don't give a s**t. Which is quite sad.

Very good point, I hadn't thought about it like that. Trying too hard to fit in with our cool cousins maybe? We're great at the aul self-deprecation in the name of seeming cool.

Wild Bill · 13-05-2012 9:45pm

Holocaust denial is a crime in Germany.

Perhaps we should follow their example? Reading this thread I'm leaning that way.

Shryke · 13-05-2012 9:47pm

It was a systematic colonial genocide and one that is still taboo.
I was reading an article in the Guardian talking about the unspoken and oft times scoffed at idea in England that they ever were as awful as other empires. It seems to be a common idea for many in England that their colonies spread education, dragging up their lessers and the like. The article went on to talk about a certain country, I can't remember which so won't guess, that was very far afield. The colonial abuse the author talks about took place in the 1860s there which is close to the time of the "famine". I read the article waiting, knowing full well Ireland wouldn't be mentioned.
Even for the person writing such an article they didn't want to go there. If a person did begin to think of it they'd have to take a step back and look at the rest of Irish history going centuries back and address that.
It's something so big and abhorrent that it can't be addressed but somehow it should for all the lives lost. Acknowledgement, vindication. It's not right that it's glossed over. The people that suffered were our ancestors, or mine anyway, they were the ones that stayed through the hardship and survived. I don't think it's right to make a joke out of it at all. Only an eejit would.

Someone mentioned Sinead O Conner. That reminds me of the book her brother wrote. It's called Star of the Sea and it's actually very good. It's set during the famine and reading it fleshed out in my mind what the realities of the time really must have been. It put some bones on the hardship and the horror of it. Well worth a read too.

Sauve · 13-05-2012 9:49pm

TeddyTedson wrote: »

But don't be so high and mighty about it yourself, it's not as if any of us know any of the people who died. Yes it was tragic, but of course we can joke about it. Stop being so controlling.

Just have a small ounce of respect for your ancestors (presuming you're Irish here) that died in this genocide. That's all.

Richard Hillman · 13-05-2012 9:50pm

We didnt they just eat cake instead of chips?

Pushtrak · 13-05-2012 9:50pm

Wild Bill wrote: »

Holocaust denial is a crime in Germany.

Perhaps we should follow their example? Reading this thread I'm leaning that way.

I doubt Famine denial is all that common. But regardless of this,the idea of denying something being a crime is preposterous. And at what point is it a crime? For not knowing everything about the history? For not knowing certain aspects? And what ought the punishment for such an "offence" be?

Where To · 13-05-2012 9:52pm

I blame the Catholic Church and the Irish obsession with land.

The famine would have happened even if the British or the potato had never been introduced to Ireland, too many people living on sh1t land, that's what caused the famine.

Sauve · 13-05-2012 9:52pm

Pushtrak wrote: »

I doubt Famine denial is all that common. But regardless of this,the idea of denying something being a crime is preposterous. And at what point is it a crime? For not knowing everything about the history? For not knowing certain aspects? And what ought the punishment for such an "offence" be?

It's not about not knowing that it happened, it's about denying that it happened when you know full well that it did.

Pushtrak · 13-05-2012 9:53pm

The point stands, though. So someone is a moron. Not a criminal offence.

woodoo · 13-05-2012 9:54pm

Where To wrote: »

I blame the Catholic Church and the Irish obsession with land.

The famine would have happened even if the British or the potato had never been introduced to Ireland, too many people living on sh1t land, that's what caused the famine.

That is nonsense there was plenty of food generated during the famine. The only problem is it was exported.

Sauve · 13-05-2012 9:54pm

Pushtrak wrote: »

The point stands, though. So someone is a moron. Not a criminal offence.

Maybe, but the Germans feel so strongly about the wrong that was done that they've made it a crime to deny it. I think that's fair enough.

As an aside, I think being a moron should be a crime unto itself, but that's a debate for another day!

Capt'n Midnight · 13-05-2012 9:55pm

Niamh Conolly: The church in Ireland secretly had lots of potatoes during the famine, and they hid the potatoes in pillows and sold them abroad in potato fairs. And the Pope closed down a lot of the factories that were makin' the potatoes and turned them into prisons for children.

Father Ted: God almighty, she says that as if there's something sinister about it all! I mean, what is the problem with her?!

charlemont · 13-05-2012 9:58pm

Where To wrote: »

I blame the Catholic Church and the Irish obsession with land.

The famine would have happened even if the British or the potato had never been introduced to Ireland, too many people living on sh1t land, that's what caused the famine.

I most certainly hope you are not a History teacher. :mad:

Funny how thick some people actually are, Sure the brain drain has been flowing since the famine so its not surprising then.

Where To · 13-05-2012 9:59pm

woodoo wrote: »

That is nonsense there was plenty of food generated during the famine. The only problem is it was exported.

How much extra food was exported in famine years that wasn't exported in other years?

How many people died of famine in areas with rich arable land?

Famine was inevitable.

Shryke · 13-05-2012 10:00pm

Where To wrote: »

I blame the Catholic Church and the Irish obsession with land.

The famine would have happened even if the British or the potato had never been introduced to Ireland, too many people living on sh1t land, that's what caused the famine.

Ireland has excellent land mostly. It's why the British kept us down, for our produce. The population of Ireland was high because of the potato. It grew easily, even in Irelands worst parts. Everything about your post is wrong and I can't be bothered continuing to waste time explaining to you why.

The Great Irish Famine

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