Dublin Marathon 2012 - 'Improvers' thread

Micilin Muc

Anybody else following P&D's 55-70 eighteen-week plan or going for sub 3:30?

Knightmove

Hiya Micilin , I dont have the time to do the 55-70 P&D schedule but I will do the P&D up to 55m and try and do a little additional mileage as well. My goal time is 3.15 as of now.

Micilin Muc

It's a great plan alright! What time are you improving from?!

Knightmove

First effort was 3.21 in the spring using the same programme

shivDCM

i did HH for last years DCM and ran a 3.42. i'm going to try P&D up to 55m this year and aiming for 3.30 also.

beeduybe

Micilin Muc wrote: »

Anybody else following P&D's 55-70 eighteen-week plan or going for sub 3:30?

Knightmove wrote: »

Hiya Micilin , I dont have the time to do the 55-70 P&D schedule but I will do the P&D up to 55m and try and do a little additional mileage as well. My goal time is 3.15 as of now.

shivDCM wrote: »

i did HH for last years DCM and ran a 3.42. i'm going to try P&D up to 55m this year and aiming for 3.30 also.

I'll be following P&D's < 55 mile 18 week plan with the intention of going sub 3:30 so it's good to see there are a few others using the same plan or have a similar target time.

Completed the first run of the schedule today - 8 miles with 4 @ LT Pace. Hadn't done many runs like that before so found it pretty tough near the end. The thoughts of doing 7 miles at LT pace look scary at the moment but they are a good bit away yet to start worrying too much.

Best of luck with the training.

RedRunner

Micilin Muc wrote: »

I would do the Half on the Saturday and take a rest on Sunday. As long as you don't go too hard I think you should be fine.

Cheers Micilin,

Sounds like a plan.

jim0

Younganne wrote: »

im with you on that, but at the begininning i use to think that people were looking as how slow i was going...now it doesn't matter and i don't think about anyone elses pace.

I get even more satisfaction when someone passes you in a race, and then i pass them back out in the last 100m:D:D

My motivation for this year's DCM is getting passed by Ray Darcy and his entourage in the last 100m of last year's event. Well done Ray, and you do great work, but I am still hurting!!

Red Belly

Well against my better judgment I went for it in last Sunday's half and got through it ok. With about 1 mile to go I had a slim chance of a PB (I'd really had to have put the hammer down for the whole last mile and I didn't feel there was much left in the tank).

In any event as soon as I tried to up the pace my left hamstring started to sieze up so discretion being the better part of valour and all that, I stopped to stretch it out, walked for a couple of hundred metres and jogged in for a 1:56:something.

Given that I lost 3 or 4 minutes in the last mile to stretching and walking, and also that right up to mile 13 I felt fine, I can take a lot of encouragement from a sub 2 hour half with an injury disrupted build-up, 4 months from Dublin.

This week is rest and recovery. The hamstring is sore, not torn or pulled sore, just fatigued sore and my left ITB is really sore. So it'll be plenty of foam-rolling and stretching for a few days. Hopefully I'll be on the bike by the end of the week and I've a physio appointment on Saturday. I plan to start into a 16-week training programme for Dublin on July 8th so next week I'd hope to be a doing a few easy runs. The paces of my long runs will be a good bit slower than the training paces I've been hitting in half marathon training so it's all about staying injury free now.

My next race is a half at the end of August for which I plan to not taper and aim for exactly 2 hours. If I can do that then I should be on target for a sub 4 in Dublin.

rb

Clearlier

Red Belly wrote: »

Well against my better judgment I went for it in last Sunday's half and got through it ok. With about 1 mile to go I had a slim chance of a PB (I'd really had to have put the hammer down for the whole last mile and I didn't feel there was much left in the tank).

In any event as soon as I tried to up the pace my left hamstring started to sieze up so discretion being the better part of valour and all that, I stopped to stretch it out, walked for a couple of hundred metres and jogged in for a 1:56:something.

Given that I lost 3 or 4 minutes in the last mile to stretching and walking, and also that right up to mile 13 I felt fine, I can take a lot of encouragement from a sub 2 hour half with an injury disrupted build-up, 4 months from Dublin.

This week is rest and recovery. The hamstring is sore, not torn or pulled sore, just fatigued sore and my left ITB is really sore. So it'll be plenty of foam-rolling and stretching for a few days. Hopefully I'll be on the bike by the end of the week and I've a physio appointment on Saturday. I plan to start into a 16-week training programme for Dublin on July 8th so next week I'd hope to be a doing a few easy runs. The paces of my long runs will be a good bit slower than the training paces I've been hitting in half marathon training so it's all about staying injury free now.

My next race is a half at the end of August for which I plan to not taper and aim for exactly 2 hours. If I can do that then I should be on target for a sub 4 in Dublin.

rb

Just a thought on the injury free front. Your left hamstring and your left ITB hurt after the race. It's probably not a coincidence that they're on the same side. It might be worth asking your physio to see if they can see an imbalance in your muscles and/or your running. A bit of prevention now is worth hours of rehab later!

Red Belly

Clearlier wrote: »

Just a thought on the injury free front. Your left hamstring and your left ITB hurt after the race. It's probably not a coincidence that they're on the same side. It might be worth asking your physio to see if they can see an imbalance in your muscles and/or your running. A bit of prevention now is worth hours of rehab later!

Actually it's not just the left hamstring and ITB! In the last two years I've had issues with my left hip, left calf, left shin, left foot....! I started running as a hobby at 40 and there are a lot of imbalances and sciatica type problems and I've been regularly attending physio to help address them but it appears to be about managing these issues rather than eliminating them. Often I'll have a niggle that only gets better with exercise and gets worse with rest! My dilemma is always which I should do coupled with a touch of OCD which means once I start following a training prog I really mentally struggle to just skip a sesssion if I don't feel right. A month ago I had a real personal breakthrough when I got a dose of shinsplints and took two weeks off running! Coming up to an event I will pretty much always convince myself I'm injured and won't be able to run it but I tend to do ok anyway.

One thing that I haven't tried yet is custom-made orthotics but I keep hearing mixed views on their effectiveness.

rb

shivDCM

beeduybe wrote: »

I'll be following P&D's < 55 mile 18 week plan with the intention of going sub 3:30 so it's good to see there are a few others using the same plan or have a similar target time.

Completed the first run of the schedule today - 8 miles with 4 @ LT Pace. Hadn't done many runs like that before so found it pretty tough near the end. The thoughts of doing 7 miles at LT pace look scary at the moment but they are a good bit away yet to start worrying too much.

Best of luck with the training.

Thanks.
I'm doing that run tonight.
I'll give it a go but not going to push too hard this early in the program.
Plenty of time for that.
Keep us posted how your getting on.

Micilin Muc

shivDCM wrote: »

Thanks.
I'm doing that run tonight.
I'll give it a go but not going to push too hard this early in the program.
Plenty of time for that.
Keep us posted how your getting on.

This is the only speedwork in Week 1. The slower-paced runs later in the week help you recover. On finishing the final LT mile, you might be glad you pushed yourself ... I dreaded it the first time round and it was grand.

Younganne

Marathon Training - The Plan (for now, anyway, some of you might have noticed i like to change my mind:rolleyes:)

Well I have decided to follow Ecoli's plan for the next few weeks and build back up my fitness slow & steady and then I will switch to the P&D up to 55 miles, 12 week plan or stay with Ecoli's plan, that decision is for a later date.

So this weeks plan looks like this

|Mon|Tue|Wed|Thur|Fri|Sat|Sun|
|Rest|6 mile easy|Session 1*|6m easy|15 min recovery|5 miles RACE|1 hr 45 easy

Session 1 - 1 mile easy, 20 min diagonals*, 1 mile easy

Looking forward to hearing how P&D works out for you guys that are starting it this week and it will help with my final decision if a few weeks time.:D

This will be my third marathon and i'm aiming for Sub 4 this year!!!

shivDCM

Micilin Muc wrote: »

This is the only speedwork in Week 1. The slower-paced runs later in the week help you recover. On finishing the final LT mile, you might be glad you pushed yourself ... I dreaded it the first time round and it was grand.

I'm sure it'll be grand. Not overly worried. Slowly slowly catchy monkey at this stage for me. plenty of speed sessions between now and Oct. I'll let you know how I go later this evening! Great to be back training with a target.

Clearlier

Red Belly wrote: »

Actually it's not just the left hamstring and ITB! In the last two years I've had issues with my left hip, left calf, left shin, left foot....! I started running as a hobby at 40 and there are a lot of imbalances and sciatica type problems and I've been regularly attending physio to help address them but it appears to be about managing these issues rather than eliminating them. Often I'll have a niggle that only gets better with exercise and gets worse with rest! My dilemma is always which I should do coupled with a touch of OCD which means once I start following a training prog I really mentally struggle to just skip a sesssion if I don't feel right. A month ago I had a real personal breakthrough when I got a dose of shinsplints and took two weeks off running! Coming up to an event I will pretty much always convince myself I'm injured and won't be able to run it but I tend to do ok anyway.

One thing that I haven't tried yet is custom-made orthotics but I keep hearing mixed views on their effectiveness.

rb

I laughed at that. There's a certain value in just managing problems particularly if you're not looking to find where your limits are but instead to keep fit and enjoy your running. On the other hand it gets expensive going to the physio every week and there's a possibility that you're going to run into a serious injury anyway if the root of the problem is not addressed. If your current physio isn't able/willing to address the root cause or at least identify it then it might be worth getting an opinion from someone else.

IMO if you have a congenital problem then orthotics can be great. If your problem is something that's happening because of a weakness/imbalance then orthotics can help in the short term but in the longer term they will just shift the problem elsewhere. If you do go down this route make sure that you get them from an orthotist/podiatrist not an over the counter/off the shelf/physio prescribed/charlatan at a running expo/internet guru. The latter often charge the same as the former but almost always haven't a clue how to help you.

Younganne

Hurray, first one done & dusted.

Tuesday 26th June - Week 1, Day 1 -7.20m in 1:11:00 @ 9.52/160:D

shivDCM

1 down. 8m total, 4@7.30/8. Struggled bigtime for the first 'fast' mile but got into a rhytm after that. downhill from here. bring it on.

RedRunner

HH Inter1 - First run today 3m @8.30 pace..probably faster than I should be doing it since PMP is 9.09.

After illness last week ,just great to get out running agan. Bit of pain on right side of knee which is a slight worry. See how I go for rest of week.

liamog

First run nailed, but was planned for 6am, turned into 11pm. Really need to get a handle on morning runs.

Am being optimistic with paces at the moment, I've spent the Spring helping a new runner with her endurance training so no speed work at all, on the plus side I do have a good base of distance. And the slow running is where I suffered after the 20 Mile mark last year.

Here's my week 1, it's adapted from Hal's Int 1 plan

Mon|Tue|Wed|Thur|Fri|Sat|Sun|
40 Min Swim|3m Easy|5m Steady|3m Easy|Rest|5 miles RACE|8m Long

Skipped the swim this week and next due to lack of funds, who'd of thought €3 would break the budget for the month.

run44

RedRunner wrote: »

HH Inter1 - First run today 3m @8.30 pace..probably faster than I should be doing it since PMP is 9.09.

After illness last week ,just great to get out running agan. Bit of pain on right side of knee which is a slight worry. See how I go for rest of week.

Hey RedRunner,

I've decided to do HH Intermediate 1 too, as I don't think I'll have the time for P&D this year. Also going for sub 4hr race so will be interested to hear how your training goes. Good start - best of luck with it. Hope the knee won't be a problem...

liamog

run44 wrote: »

Hey RedRunner,

I've decided to do HH Intermediate 1 too, as I don't think I'll have the time for P&D this year. Also going for sub 4hr race so will be interested to hear how your training goes. Good start - best of luck with it. Hope the knee won't be a problem...

So that's 3 of us on the Intermediate Plan, should be good. I've muddled it up a little for the race series and the DLR Bay 10k which are the only races planned for the summer.

seanie_m

Hi RedRunner, liamog and run44

You can make that 4......

I think I'm also going to be using the HH Inter 1 training program, this is my first marathon though so I think that may potentially be subject to change at some point! I would see myself as being well-able to follow it though, I did the Connemara half this year in 93 minutes only going for about 5 runs in the 2 months leading up to it.

The aim is to reach or break 3:30, although that again may possibly have to be revised!

Let us know how you're getting on, the best of luck!

Seanie

RedRunner

seanie_m wrote: »

Hi RedRunner, liamog and run44

You can make that 4......

I think I'm also going to be using the HH Inter 1 training program, this is my first marathon though so I think that may potentially be subject to change at some point! I would see myself as being well-able to follow it though, I did the Connemara half this year in 93 minutes only going for about 5 runs in the 2 months leading up to it.

The aim is to reach or break 3:30, although that again may possibly have to be revised!

Let us know how you're getting on, the best of luck!

Seanie

Here's to the HHInter1 group so. Best of luck all and hopefully we can motivate each other as we go along. First time trying to follow any plan. Ive got plenty of races lined up but should be able to integrate into plan easily enough. 5m @9.10 avg thisevening around StAnnes Park Raheny,felt good after. Still a niggle around the knee but nothing serious. Must invest in an ITB roller!

That's a great time Seanie for the half with so little training, you must be a natural! Doing the Clontarf half at end of next week and hoping for sub 2hrs to see where I am for target of sub4 marathon. 2.10 is current PB

liamog

RedRunner wrote: »

Here's to the HHInter1 group so. Best of luck all and hopefully we can motivate each other as we go along. First time trying to follow any plan. Ive got plenty of races lined up but should be able to integrate into plan easily enough. 5m @9.10 avg thisevening around StAnnes Park Raheny,felt good after. Still a niggle around the knee but nothing serious. Must invest in an ITB roller!

That's a great time Seanie for the half with so little training, you must be a natural! Doing the Clontarf half at end of next week and hoping for sub 2hrs to see where I am for target of sub4 marathon. 2.10 is current PB

Last year's half was for me was 1:53 which translated into a 4:24 for the marathon, but that was due to the training plan collapsing last September. This year I really want to prove myself.

Got tonight's run started at 11:56pm, something about late runs is good for me, maybe I should find a Marathon to do with Jet lag, would be right on my schedule :-D

Mike D

I'm also doing the HH Inter1 so kicked off this week. Going for Sub 4. gonna be interesting when the midweek runs get up to 8m as my runs are in the morning...means getting up very early but hey, if it was easy everyone would be doing it. Looking forward to hearing progress from the HHI-1s!

sideline warrior

Also doing HHinter1. 1.40 half in April so will push for sub 3.30. Question. Play Astro turf on Wednesday's and reluctant to give it up but I can be a bit niggly after it. Did my 5 miler before footie last night and felt fine. Do any of ye also play footie and when would ye give it a break before the marathon?

RedRunner

sideline warrior wrote: »

Also doing HHinter1. 1.40 half in April so will push for sub 3.30. Question. Play Astro turf on Wednesday's and reluctant to give it up but I can be a bit niggly after it. Did my 5 miler before footie last night and felt fine. Do any of ye also play footie and when would ye give it a break before the marathon?

Its a good question. Having played competitive football(GAA) up until last year, I know how hard it is to give up but i'm turning 41 next week. Was picking up a lot of injuries near the end so knew I had to call it a day as it would affect the running. So I guess your age and ability to recover quickly from any footballing injury should help your decision. If it were me i'd certainly ditch the football in second half of training plan just in case you pick up an injury that takes a couple of weeks or more to recover from.

RedRunner

Race Number for Series: 9678

Race Number for DCM : 6734

I'll be the big tall ugly one !

Younganne

Wednesday 27th June -
Warm up = 1m @ 10.31/156
Diagonals
Cool down = 1.24m @10.23/167
Total 4.61m

Thursday 28th June -
6.30m @9.44/157