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cyclists on the dundalk to castle'bham road

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13

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    #62
    ShiverinEskimo
    Hosted Moderators Posts: 18,115 ✭✭✭✭ShiverinEskimo


    buffalo wrote: »
    20kmph? I should get down to this race, I could win that easily! ;) If it moved at that speed, surely you'd be able to overtake at some point? More than likely you're exaggerating, because most races travel at a speed of at least 35kmph, and usually more like 40kmph.

    Why didn't I overtake? :rolleyes: Read my posts and you'll know why. There were no gaps aside from ones occupied by a pace car. Had it been safe to overtake I would have done so. I can equate it to having 3 to 4 lorries running convoy in front of you. Would take some stretch of road and clear oncoming lane and no junctions to make it safe to overtake in that scenario.
    buffalo wrote: »
    And if you're exaggerating that point, I see no reason to believe you're not exaggerating the rest of your statements.

    I have marshalled at races in Meath, Wicklow and in Dublin. Usually once a race, I encounter somebody who considers their time far more important than everyone else's, and would endanger lives given half a chance. I have seen a clearly visible marshall clipped by a car, and the driver blamed the marshall for getting in the way. I have had bumpers against my knees on more than one occasion. All because the driver was being delayed by, at the most, two full minutes.

    Cool story bro - really - just not sure what it's got to do with me or this situation. I've never clipped anyone in my life. I'm not a dangerous driver. The reason I am so opposed is because I HAD to sit there and suffer it so as not to endanger myself, the cyclists or on-coming traffic.

    buffalo wrote: »
    If the club in question are not doing anything illegal, and are not endangering your life, I suggest you either learn to live with the delay, or avoid it. Or join! See the world from the saddle! :)

    So anything that's not illegal and/or endangering your life is off-limits for criticism. So basically fúck other road users - live with the regular disruption to your life or don't go home until the cyclists have decided they are finished with the public road.


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    #63
    buffalo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,077 ✭✭✭buffalo


    ShiverinEskimo wrote: »
    So anything that's not illegal and/or endangering your life is off-limits for criticism. So basically fúck other road users - live with the regular disruption to your life or don't go home until the cyclists have decided they are finished with the public road.

    It's not off-limits for criticism, but your reaction is rather extreme. Every day at rush hour, the cycle tracks sprinkled throughout the city are quite often filled with discourteous/incompetent motorists. I have learned to live with it, unless it's actively dangerous. I'm suggesting you do the same. The cyclists are also members of the public, they have a right to use the public road as well, even if it is inconvenient for you.
    ShiverinEskimo wrote: »
    I couldn't run him over so I had to sit there.
    This makes you sound like one of those drivers I have encountered, hence me relating the "cool story".

    I notice you didn't address the fact that you stated the races moved at 20kmph, which is completely at odds with any race I have witnessed or raced.


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    #64
    ShiverinEskimo
    Hosted Moderators Posts: 18,115 ✭✭✭✭ShiverinEskimo


    To my knowledge it was around 20kmph. I didn't log exact speeds for the entire 20 minutes I was stuck. I couldn't even tell you if it was a race - someone else suggested it was. I'm not au fait with the ins and outs of major cycling meet ups.

    You seem to be assuming I'm some kind of demon on the road and that I my reaction to this situation was somewhat extreme. Fact is an entire string of motorists was held up by a long, wide group of cyclists, and pace motorbikes/cars. They have a right to use the road, but they need to get it into their heads that they are SHARING it. A concept that seems lost on you considering your solution is to put up with it or avoid driving the only road to where I needed to go.

    If you think inconveniencing other road users (who also have a right to share that road) to that degree is a perfectly fine then maybe you should take a look at your own attitudes too as you seem to use horror story examples of asshole motorists who do endanger lives as reasoning to justify your holding up of all motorists. Because some idiots clipped a marshall suddenly that gives you the mentality that all motorists are to be ignored when using a major road? And that said motorists should just accept it?


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    #65
    buffalo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,077 ✭✭✭buffalo


    ShiverinEskimo wrote: »
    To my knowledge it was around 20kmph. I didn't log exact speeds for the entire 20 minutes I was stuck. I couldn't even tell you if it was a race - someone else suggested it was. I'm not au fait with the ins and outs of major cycling meet ups.

    You seem to be assuming I'm some kind of demon on the road and that I my reaction to this situation was somewhat extreme. Fact is an entire string of motorists was held up by a long, wide group of cyclists, and pace motorbikes/cars. They have a right to use the road, but they need to get it into their heads that they are SHARING it. A concept that seems lost on you considering your solution is to put up with it or avoid driving the only road to where I needed to go.

    If you think inconveniencing other road users (who also have a right to share that road) to that degree is a perfectly fine then maybe you should take a look at your own attitudes too as you seem to use horror story examples of asshole motorists who do endanger lives as reasoning to justify your holding up of all motorists. Because some idiots clipped a marshall suddenly that gives you the mentality that all motorists are to be ignored when using a major road? And that said motorists should just accept it?

    I'm signing off here, but I think it's perhaps you who needs to realise you are sharing the road. My solution to you is to share the same road, or use a different one.


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    #66
    feck sake lads
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,889 ✭✭✭feck sake lads


    ShiverinEskimo wrote: »
    To my knowledge it was around 20kmph. I didn't log exact speeds for the entire 20 minutes I was stuck. I couldn't even tell you if it was a race - someone else suggested it was. I'm not au fait with the ins and outs of major cycling meet ups.

    You seem to be assuming I'm some kind of demon on the road and that I my reaction to this situation was somewhat extreme. Fact is an entire string of motorists was held up by a long, wide group of cyclists, and pace motorbikes/cars. They have a right to use the road, but they need to get it into their heads that they are SHARING it. A concept that seems lost on you considering your solution is to put up with it or avoid driving the only road to where I needed to go.

    If you think inconveniencing other road users (who also have a right to share that road) to that degree is a perfectly fine then maybe you should take a look at your own attitudes too as you seem to use horror story examples of asshole motorists who do endanger lives as reasoning to justify your holding up of all motorists. Because some idiots clipped a marshall suddenly that gives you the mentality that all motorists are to be ignored when using a major road? And that said motorists should just accept it?
    share the road indeed, have you ever got stuck behind a funeral now that would wreck the normal impatient driver's head , you seem to be annoyed about the racing groups but what is your thoughts on the everyday cyclist that share our roads.remember this an impatient driver is a major menice on our roads basically a killer ,what do you think would happen if a car hits a cyclist .

    i'm not having a go at you honest but for the sake of a few minutes;)


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    #67
    Oceans12
    Closed Accounts Posts: 167 ✭✭Oceans12


    There are a few down this direction too that think they own the road, cycling along .... All over the road..


    They should cycle one abreast only as its much safer to do so.

    And also if you want to race the open public road is not the place for it


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    #68
    Chips Lovell
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,269 Mod ✭✭✭✭Chips Lovell


    The alternative is to apply to close the roads, but that probably is even more inconvenient to both motorists and race organisers.


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    #69
    ShiverinEskimo
    Hosted Moderators Posts: 18,115 ✭✭✭✭ShiverinEskimo


    feck sake lads wrote: »
    but what is your thoughts on the everyday cyclist that share our roads.remember this an impatient driver is a major menice on our roads basically a killer ,what do you think would happen if a car hits a cyclist .

    i'm not having a go at you honest but for the sake of a few minutes;)
    ShiverinEskimo wrote: »
    Single cyclists going to and from work etc. are fine by me and I have all the patience and courtesy in the world for them.

    The single cyclist isn't a problem as there will likely be ample space and time to overtake him safely.

    Can I clarify that I am not against cyclists. I'm againsts cyclists who take over an entire lane frequently and for long periods.


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    #70
    kormak
    Registered Users Posts: 887 ✭✭✭kormak


    Wishbone Ash wrote: »
    Sounds like you were driving too fast if you nearly killed him. It could have been a tractor or livestock. The cyclist may have been intending to make a right turn and therefore would be obliged to take up a position about one foot from the white line.

    No sorry, I was driving between 80-100 km/h, well within the speed limit.
    Animals/livestock are to be excused... THEY'RE ANIMALS!! they don't have the same brain power as cyclists (although some would wonder!)
    Tractors stopped/slowed down on a road is reasonable... cyclists, cycling that far near the line when the rest of the road is near perfect is not!! at any rate, I'd fancy the farmer's chances of surviving injury much more than the cyclist.
    What you did was illegal as a person in charge of roadworks is entitled to stop/direct traffic. Customs officials and persons in charge of animals are also allowed to stop/direct traffic.
    Firstly, I never said he was in charge of roadworks, he was simply a workman. Secondly, prove the above statment?!


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    #71
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »
    The alternative is to apply to close the roads, but that probably is even more inconvenient to both motorists and race organisers.

    Oh come on! These are weekly Club League races not Open competitions. Hardly cause for road closures, or for holding up traffic either.:mad:

    I cycle raced for years and cannot condone the behaviour of my old club in recent years. These are public roads and the cyclists need to take note of their responsibility not to cause traffic disruption.


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    #72
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,926 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    I think it all boils down to cyclists and motorists having more consideration for each other. I have learned a bit from this thread.


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    #73
    feck sake lads
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,889 ✭✭✭feck sake lads


    tayto lover wrote: »
    I think it all boils down to cyclists and motorists having more consideration for each other. I have learned a bit from this thread.

    AT LAST a convert:D:D:D


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    #74
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    buffalo wrote: »
    It's not off-limits for criticism, but your reaction is rather extreme. Every day at rush hour, the cycle tracks sprinkled throughout the city are quite often filled with discourteous/incompetent motorists. I have learned to live with it, unless it's actively dangerous. I'm suggesting you do the same. The cyclists are also members of the public, they have a right to use the public road as well, even if it is inconvenient for you.

    I notice you didn't address the fact that you stated the races moved at 20kmph, which is completely at odds with any race I have witnessed or raced.
    `
    Firstly, this thread is about Club cyclists around Dundalk. I don't know which "city" you refer to. Cycle tracks are not the issue at all. These are club events held on open roads by large numbers of cyclists.
    As for 20km/h. These are not Open races. They include many weaker club members and I have seen them often as slow as 20km/h - particularly in the hilly area of Ravendale that has been mentioned. DO you know the area at all? Do you know the events by Cu Chulainn CC that we are discussing?


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    #75
    Bunnyhopper
    Registered Users Posts: 1,414 ✭✭✭Bunnyhopper


    ShiverinEskimo wrote: »

    Is it obnoxious and inconsiderate every time cars have to wait at a level crossing? No. It's safe.

    As is a properly organized and marshalled cycle race.

    Every time cars have to queue behind a bus at a stop? No it's traffic.

    As is the cycling that had the cheek to get in your way.

    Every time cars are delayed by someone on horseback or by a learner driver? No. They don't actively block traffic and prevent overtaking.

    "Actively block" is a very slippery term there, slippery to the point of being meaningless. They can all "block" other traffic and prevent overtaking simply by being there. They're not blocking traffic: they are traffic. Your posts take issue with some kinds of traffic and not others. Safety concerns are relevant here, too, particularly with respect to the marshals "blocking" traffic.

    Is it obnoxious and inconsiderate every time a cyclist is delayed by a queue of cars. No. That's traffic.

    Just as it is when cyclists delay cars.

    Every time a pedestrian has to wait to cross the road because of traffic? No. It's safe and there are lights in place to ensure the junction is shared fairly by motorists and pedestrians alike.

    Again, your concern for safety is selective and stops short of those cyclists. The roads are shared, not just the junctions, and the rules of the road, as enforced by the Gardaí, are in place just like the lights.

    Is it obnoxious and inconsiderate when streets are closed for the Marathon or a Formula 1 display or Paddy's Day or Obama? No. They are once-offs, at weekends and accomodate quite a considerable number of spectators, have diversions in place and the public is notified well in advance.

    So a repeat event is a no-no, and you mustn't be inconvenienced on weekdays. Right. It must be so annoying for you to find that the universe hasn't organized itself around you :) What's your threshold for the number of spectators required before you'll let other people have a go on your road?

    Got any more?

    You seem to be labouring under the misapprehension that you had cobbled together posts that amounted, in the midst of all their tetchy entitlement, to a rebuttal.

    The main impression I get from your posts is that your real objection to this is that these people had the cheek to get in your way.


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    #76
    Mycroft H
    Registered Users Posts: 9,313 ✭✭✭Mycroft H


    Bunnyhopper wrote: »
    The main impression I get from your posts is that your real objection to this is that these people had the cheek to get in your way.


    "I'm in a car, how dare anyone get in my way"


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    #77
    ShiverinEskimo
    Hosted Moderators Posts: 18,115 ✭✭✭✭ShiverinEskimo


    Bunnyhopper wrote: »
    The main impression I get from your posts is that your real objection to this is that these people had the cheek to get in your way.

    Well you've got the wrong impression.
    BX 19 wrote: »
    "I'm in a car, how dare anyone get in my way"

    :confused: I honestly wonder what your reaction would be to a huge group of cyclists taking up a whole road would be. I bet you'd sit there smiling and delighted that they decided to disregard other road users completely and cheer them on yea?


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    #78
    event
    Registered Users Posts: 16,050 ✭✭✭✭event


    Bunnyhopper wrote: »

    How many accidents were there on those roundabouts, given how dangerous the marshals were being, and what did the Gardaí have to say about this danger?

    I'm sorry, i have to mention this.

    what are you saying, that because there were no accidents it was grand?
    I've seen this myself as well. on the Ardee N2/M1 roundabout, 3 marshalls stopping traffic on and off the M1. one of them stepped out from behind a sign post in front of the car in front of me, was very poor marshalling.


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    #79
    Mycroft H
    Registered Users Posts: 9,313 ✭✭✭Mycroft H


    event wrote: »
    I'm sorry, i have to mention this.

    what are you saying, that because there were no accidents it was grand?
    I've seen this myself as well. on the Ardee N2/M1 roundabout, 3 marshalls stopping traffic on and off the M1. one of them stepped out from behind a sign post in front of the car in front of me, was very poor marshalling.


    Have you mentioned this to the club in question. That sounds like bad form to be honest.


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    #80
    event
    Registered Users Posts: 16,050 ✭✭✭✭event


    I've no idea what club it was tbf


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    #81
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    event wrote: »
    I've no idea what club it was tbf


    Contacts are here:

    http://www.dundalkcycling.com/


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    #82
    whelan1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,786 ✭✭✭✭whelan1


    pure lunacy out cycling on that road tonight, really heavy showers and trying to concentrate on cyclists movements :confused::confused::confused:


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    #83
    feck sake lads
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,889 ✭✭✭feck sake lads


    yeah i think there ladys racing tonight.
    so a lot of cycling traffic about ,one can only be careful not to damage the precious car :rolleyes:


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    #84
    Mycroft H
    Registered Users Posts: 9,313 ✭✭✭Mycroft H


    whelan1 wrote: »
    pure lunacy out cycling on that road tonight, really heavy showers and trying to concentrate on cyclists movements :confused::confused::confused:


    Slow down if your finding it hard.


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    #85
    whelan1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,786 ✭✭✭✭whelan1


    BX 19 wrote: »
    Slow down if your finding it hard.
    how slow do you want me to go, in lashing rain, at 10-20mph wipers on full


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    #86
    Mycroft H
    Registered Users Posts: 9,313 ✭✭✭Mycroft H


    whelan1 wrote: »
    how slow do you want me to go, in lashing rain, at 10-20mph wipers on full


    If you have to yes.


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    #87
    feck sake lads
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,889 ✭✭✭feck sake lads


    mind you the club should pick less busy roads to race on, god knows theres plenty of them in that part of the country.
    racing on a main road is always going to be controversial .
    i said before i'm a cyclist near enough all my life and to be honest i avoid main roads like the plague.:eek:
    what car drivers don't realise cyclists take there life in there hands every time they go cycling all because the motorist is always in a hurry .
    but yeah the clubs should take racing off the main roads .


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    #88
    Beasty
    Administrators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 76,290 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Beasty


    whelan1 wrote: »
    pure lunacy out cycling on that road tonight, really heavy showers and trying to concentrate on cyclists movements :confused::confused::confused:
    50kph crosswinds are exactly the reason you have to give cyclists room. I've cycled in winds approaching 100kph - not an issue if you know what you are doing and drivers give you the minimum recommended 1.5m clearance

    It was a Time Trial - riders on their own against the clock, so there would never have been more than 2 cyclists at any place (and that would only have been when one was overtaking another)


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    #89
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,926 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Surely cycle racing should be postponed in dark, wet and windy conditions. It is just not safe and putting lives at risk.


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    #90
    feck sake lads
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,889 ✭✭✭feck sake lads


    tayto lover wrote: »
    Surely cycle racing should be postponed in dark, wet and windy conditions. It is just not safe and putting lives at risk.

    EH no is the answer to that one sorry.
    they wont cancel the Tour De France because it's raining.
    yeah i know this is not the Tour but our great heroes Sean kelly and Steven Roche started racing on irish roads in all kinds of weather.:cool:


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    #91
    indiewindy
    Registered Users Posts: 1,425 ✭✭✭indiewindy


    feck sake lads wrote: »
    EH no is the answer to that one sorry.
    they wont cancel the Tour De France because it's raining.
    yeah i know this is not the Tour but our great heroes Sean kelly and Steven Roche started racing on irish roads in all kinds of weather.:cool:

    They were pro's and roads were closed for them, these are just cycling for leisure. From reading the thread, we are lucky there have been no accidents yet


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