My solution to drink driving laws and rural isolation.

SafeSurfer

I was driving home from the pub last night after having a couple of pints while waiting for a chinese. Before I get lectured about being irresponsible the pub is on the age of a small village with deserted country roads about 2 miles from my house.

The pub was deserted, especially for a Friday night. A couple of weeks ago an elderly bachelor was found dead in his house. He was last seen 4 days before by the postman. This was a man that went to the village for a couple of pints every night and drove home about 3 miles again along quiet back roads.

The man in question had stopped going to the village since the introduction of the stricter drink driving limits which effectively mean any more than a pint and you could be convicted for drink driving.

I am also aware of the hurt and damage caused by drunk drivers and the misery this has left in its wake.

However. My idea is to allow a higher drink driving limit for people driving tractors. Say to double the current limit so someone driving a tractor could have 2 to 3 pints and still drive home.

What do you think?

Owen_S

Mattie we know it's you, stop hiding under that alias.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

I think 2 miles is a nice walk home.

aaronjumper

Let people that drive vehicles that can crush other vehicles drink more?
Really?

hairyprincess

If you can afford to go out drinking then you can afford a taxi home.

Simple as.

Pedro K

SafeSurfer wrote: »

The man in question had stopped going to the village since the introduction of the stricter drink driving limits which effectively mean any more than a pint and you could be convicted for drink driving.


What do you think?

He could have gone to the pub and drank non alcoholic drinks, no?

littlehedgehog

Go to the pub and not drink.. or drink non-alcoholic beers..?

Canis Lupus

I'm just waiting for the googlecar to go into mass production. Drink driving problem solved.

El Weirdo

hairyprincess wrote: »

If you can afford to go out drinking then you can afford a taxi home.

Simple as.

Whilst I don't agree with the OP; that really isn't a viable option in rural areas.

Shryke

Somehow I don't think an old mans inability to get locked is the real issue here.

tvercetti

Make a rule that after a certain time, a one way system is employed, preferably all roads leading away from the pub, problem solved!

M cebee

that's a non runner

they can cycle although that's dangerous enough

a lot of people round my way just take a chance and drive home

someone will ring the local pub if the guards are pulling

aaronjumper

El Weirdo wrote: »

Whilst I don't agree with the OP, that really isn't a viable option in rural areas.

It is if you arrange one earlier in the day. Like my parents do to get home from the pub that's near where they live, which is the back of beyond.

lazygal

Is it really that hard to not drink alcohol? Does the need to imbibe alcohol trump the need for social interaction in the pub?

hairyprincess

El Weirdo wrote: »

Whilst I don't agree with the OP; that really isn't a viable option in rural areas.

Why?

partyatmygaff

SafeSurfer wrote: »

The pub was deserted, especially for a Friday night. A couple of weeks ago an elderly bachelor was found dead in his house. He was last seen 4 days before by the postman. This was a man that went to the village for a couple of pints every night and drove home about 3 miles again along quiet back roads.

The man in question had stopped going to the village since the introduction of the stricter drink driving limits which effectively mean any more than a pint and you could be convicted for drink driving.

As sad as that story is, it's hardly the government's fault that someone's only means of socialising is getting drunk.

However. My idea is to allow a higher drink driving limit for people driving tractors. Say to double the current limit so someone driving a tractor could have 2 to 3 pints and still drive home.

What do you think?

I think you should extend that brilliant idea. The heavier and bigger your vehicle, the higher the limit. Perfectly sensible, as i'm sure everyone else will agree.

Icepick

satellite Internet

MadYaker

hairyprincess wrote: »

Why?

Because there are no taxis...

ball

Why don't more people cycle home?
At least that way you're not putting anyone else at risk. You'll probably fall into a bush or something.
The worst case scenario is being knocked over by a car. But that's a lot better than crashing a car yourself, right?

Plus, you won't get your push-bike license taken from you!

jaffacakesyum

I don't know how anyone can justify drink driving. I don't give a sh1t if you're in a rural area. It's an incredibly stupid and selfish thing to do.

As for the OP's suggestion, wtf?

hairyprincess

MadYaker wrote: »

Because there are no taxis...

There are no taxis in rural Ireland? Really? Not one? :eek:

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

hairyprincess wrote: »

There are no taxis in rural Ireland? Really? Not one? :eek:

No, but he's two stools over.

SafeSurfer

Pedro K wrote: »

He could have gone to the pub and drank non alcoholic drinks, no?

Yes he could have gone to the pub and had a cup of tea and a game of cards. But you have to remember this was a man of a certain generation in rural Ireland. He would nt go to a pub for a mineral or cup of tea any more than he would go to his GP and say he was lonely or depressed.

It may not make sense but thats just the way it is.

lazygal

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Yes he could have gone to the pub and had a cup of tea and a game of cards. But you have to remember this was a man of a certain generation in rural Ireland. He would nt go to a pub for a mineral or cup of tea any more than he would go to his GP and say he was lonely or depressed.

It may not make sense but thats just the way it is.

The drink driving laws might not make sense to him either but that's just the way it is.

MadYaker

hairyprincess wrote: »

There are no taxis in rural Ireland? Really? Not one? :eek:

Jesus wept. Im guessing you're from Dublin? In small rural villages taxis are virtually non existant. Think about it.

hairyprincess

MadYaker wrote: »

Because there are no taxis...

hairyprincess wrote: »

There are no taxis in rural Ireland? Really? Not one? :eek:

It's hard to argue with the statistics
Living most of my life in rural Ireland I've never had a problem getting a taxi. Especially if you are just going out for a few drinks, then there really is no excuse to not book your taxi to go home before you even go out.

http://www.nationaltransport.ie/taxi-and-bus-licensing/taxi/taxi-statistics/vehicle-licences-county-and-category-january-2012/

goose2005

A tractor is harder to manoeuvre and probably has worse brakes than a car, so is probably more likely to end up in a ditch. If he lives in the middle of nowhere, he has about a 1 in 100000 chance of a gard stopping him, couldn't he just risk it?

hairyprincess

MadYaker wrote: »

Jesus wept. Im guessing you're from Dublin? In small rural villages taxis are virtually non existant. Think about it.

If you look at my past posts you will figure out I'm from Donegal. I live in a tiny village and can name off six taxi services off the top of my head. So, sorry but I don't buy that excuse

Red21

Most of the folk who your, Drunk tractor driving scheme is aimed at don't have their tractors taxed or insured as they only use them on the farm.

Chun Li

ball wrote: »

Why don't more people cycle home?
At least that way you're not putting anyone else at risk. You'll probably fall into a bush or something.
The worst case scenario is being knocked over by a car. But that's a lot better than crashing a car yourself, right?

Plus, you won't get your push-bike license taken from you!

Nah that's not worst case scenario, you may still destroy somebody elses life. What if you were the one that killed a drunken cyclist, living the rest of your days with that would be a living nightmare.

El Weirdo

hairyprincess wrote: »

It's hard to argue with the statistics
Living most of my life in rural Ireland I've never had a problem getting a taxi. Especially if you are just going out for a few drinks, then there really is no excuse to not book your taxi to go home before you even go out.

http://www.nationaltransport.ie/taxi-and-bus-licensing/taxi/taxi-statistics/vehicle-licences-county-and-category-january-2012/

I would wager that the vast majority of those taxis are based in the larger towns in each county.

Mint Sauce

I fail to see why the drink drive rules should be any different for people living in country areas compared to those living in urban areas.

If I go drinking in the local town at home, I still have to travel the 4 or 5 miles to my local village along a national road, go through the village, and then travel the couple of miles down the rural country road. Does that mean I can park my car in the village and only get the taxi driver to drive me just as far as there to save me an extra few quid?

Along that same of stretch of rural road, a man had died driving his tractor home after he went down an embankment after a few drinks.

Personally I wont even drive after one pint, If I go out weather it be at home, or where I live during the working week I'm bringing money for the taxi with me or staying at a friends or family house.

ch750536

hairyprincess wrote: »

If you can afford to go out drinking then you can afford a taxi home.

Simple as.

What's a taxi?

lazygal

El Weirdo wrote: »

I would wager that the vast majority of those taxis are based in the larger towns in each county.

If people chose to live in more isolated areas, they can't expect the same services and facilities as more populated areas. This is the problem with once-off houses and farms in rural Ireland, people expect the services of a more urban area to be provided in places where its just not viable economically or socially to do so.

Both my parents come from extremely rural areas and made a conscious decision to raise their family in a large city because they didn't like how limited life can be in rural areas.

El Weirdo

lazygal wrote: »

If people chose to live in more isolated areas, they can't expect the same services and facilities as more populated areas.

I never said that they should.

I was just pointing out that getting a taxi home isn't always a viable option.

Logical Fallacy

hairyprincess wrote: »

If you look at my past posts you will figure out I'm from Donegal. I live in a tiny village and can name off six taxi services off the top of my head. So, sorry but I don't buy that excuse

Where I grew up you wouldn't, and still can't, find a taxi for about 20 miles.

Needless to say there is a pub though.

SafeSurfer

jaffacakesyum wrote: »

I don't know how anyone can justify drink driving. I don't give a sh1t if you're in a rural area. It's an incredibly stupid and selfish thing to do.

As for the OP's suggestion, wtf?

Drink driving is a reality every night of the week all over the country. Probably even more so given the closure of rural Garda stations.

As for walking home along unlit winding country roads even if you are wearing a high vis jacket I am convinced that driving after a couple of pints is statistically safer.

The idea of a higher drink driving limit for tractors, maybe below a certain engine size is because they can only travel at about 30 kmph.

Tractors are already classified differently than cars for example, 16 year olds can drive tractors. Why not acknowledge the fact that the chances of being involved in an accident in a vehicle with a much lower maximum speed is less than that for a standard car.

When was the last time somebody was killed driving a tractor after a couple of pints?

lazygal

El Weirdo wrote: »

I never said that they should.

I was just pointing out that getting a taxi home isn't always a viable option.

So they need to accept when going out, their choices are more limited, i.e. have an alcoholic drink and not drive home, with a massive wait for a taxi or a lift from a non drinking driver, or not drink and drive home. One's location doesn't merit different treatment under the drink driving laws.

SafeSurfer

lazygal wrote: »

If people chose to live in more isolated areas, they can't expect the same services and facilities as more populated areas. This is the problem with once-off houses and farms in rural Ireland, people expect the services of a more urban area to be provided in places where its just not viable economically or socially to do so.

Both my parents come from extremely rural areas and made a conscious decision to raise their family in a large city because they didn't like how limited life can be in rural areas.

Yet they make the exact same individual contribution, by way of taxes to the provision of those services which they do not enjoy.

Mint Sauce

lazygal wrote: »

When was the last time somebody was killed driving a tractor after a couple of pints?

You obvously didn't read my post only 5 before you made this one

Along that same of stretch of rural road, a man had died driving his tractor home after he went down an embankment after a few drinks.

Duckworth_Luas

I grew up working in a rural pub, and I mean rural. At the end of the night the owner would drive home any elderly bachelors etc that had no transport. He felt it was the least he could do for his loyal customers.

A few years back he sold the pub. The new owner decided that people should make their own way home. The customers who were so loyal to the previous owner deserted the new. The pub is now closed.

My point is that rural pub owners should invest in minibuses and ferry their customers home after closing. It's win win!

El Weirdo

lazygal wrote: »

So they need to accept when going out, their choices are more limited, i.e. have an alcoholic drink and not drive home, with a massive wait for a taxi or a lift from a non drinking driver, or not drink and drive home. One's location doesn't merit different treatment under the drink driving laws.

Again, please point out where I have said any different in this thread.

You seem to be reading something that I'm not typing.

SafeSurfer

Red21 wrote: »

Most of the folk who your, Drunk tractor driving scheme is aimed at don't have their tractors taxed or insured as they only use them on the farm.

I would agree that there are a large number of untaxed tractors in the country but I would say the vast majority are insured because most are driven on the road as well as on farm.

Shryke

(Edit: Quoting random people..)

SafeSurfer wrote: »

When was the last time somebody was killed driving a tractor after a couple of pints?

A tractor is a dangerous piece of heavy machinery. You're hoping that there's no one else around this person and that there isn't any other traffic. You're hoping they don't have too much as well. A tractor would destroy a small car or easily go through a wall in a rural area. I wouldn't like to see a tractor go into a house along the way.
Modern tractors can go a lot faster than 30mph. Try 50. You want someone with drink on them in a God damn tractor at 50 driving toward you? I hope this isn't what's being put forward.
A tractor is no where near as safe to drive as a piddling little car.

ResearchWill

ball wrote: »

Why don't more people cycle home?
At least that way you're not putting anyone else at risk. You'll probably fall into a bush or something.
The worst case scenario is being knocked over by a car. But that's a lot better than crashing a car yourself, right?

Plus, you won't get your push-bike license taken from you!

This was covered by section 51 of the Road Traffic Act 1961 now covered here http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2010/en/act/pub/0025/sec0006.html#sec6

.same.

lazygal wrote: »

Both my parents come from extremely rural areas and made a conscious decision to raise their family in a large city because they didn't like how limited life can be in rural areas.

Had they known how you'd turn out, they probably woulda stayed in the bog.

Where To

The problem isn't lack of taxis, rural Ireland is excellently serviced by taxis and hackneys.

The problem is people begrudge paying someone to take them home after spending an extortionate amount drinking themselves to oblivion.

kirving

A bit ridiculous that drink cycling is illegal, not much of a chance of injuring anyone but yourself.

Kolido

There really is no justification for drink driving. I don't know what the current punishment is for getting caught is but it should be immediate disqualification for a number of years imo. Everyone in the country is under the same law so it shouldn't be any different whether it's rural or not, they are still public roads afaik.
If you want a different limit for driving tractors, does that mean you can drive through a city also with more drink taken?

ResearchWill

Kolido wrote: »

There really is no justification for drink driving. I don't know what the current punishment is for getting caught is but it should be immediate disqualification for a number of years imo. Everyone in the country is under the same law so it shouldn't be any different whether it's rural or not, they are still public roads afaik.
If you want a different limit for driving tractors, does that mean you can drive through a city also with more drink taken?

The current punishment for drink driving on a first offence is a mandatory disquilification for between 6 months and 3 years depending on the reading, if it is simple drink or drug driving ar refusal to give sample it's 4 years.

For the new lower levels you can take a fixed penalty notice of a shorter ban that being 6 months and points and fine.

While jail time is possible it would not normally be given unless its a third offence or more.

girl in the striped socks

.same. wrote: »

lazygal wrote: »

Both my parents come from extremely rural areas and made a conscious decision to raise their family in a large city because they didn't like how limited life can be in rural areas.

Had they known how you'd turn out, they probably woulda stayed in the bog.

Wtf???