Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 11/12 MOD POST #1130

machiavellianme

Dickerty wrote: »

Kess, you make a lot of sense, but we know Kenny had a semi for buying British, so that explains a part of it. And then we don't know if those other players would have signed for us. 12 months ago, we had NO European football to offer. We had sold Alonso, Masc and Torres in the previous 18 months. We were clearly coming out of a very difficult period.

If you were an up-and-coming player, would YOU have signed for us?

If it were me, then yes. With pride. Who wouldn't want to line up with a liverbird on their chest in the hope of creating history? Seriously, players should jump at the chance to get a team like Liverpool chase them. Even better if there's no big name drama queen whinging in your way to a first team slot. And if you do well but circumstances don't improve at least you know that leaving isn't a big problem and you'll be on your way to chelsea/Barca/real

DDC1990

Well at least we know now.

About time.

D'Agger

Kess73 wrote: »

Granted most people say that Henderson would excel in a cm role and that putting him on the right put the player at a disadvantage. But was Henderson even bought as a CM to start with? He had two full seasons before he joined Liverpool where he mostly played at RM for Sunderland so it is not as though the role was alien to him.

I know people will say that he plays in CM for the Englan u-21, but I would pay more heed as to where he played week in week out at club level over an under age international set up that he would play with a smaller number of times a year.

With this, as a young player coming into the Sunderland side - he wasn't going to get on as a CM, like Liverpool bringing through youth players like Gerrard and more recently Shelvey, Pacheco - when played it's mainly been out wide on the fringes rather than in a central role.

The counter argument can be made that, were he good enough, he'd get into CM at Sunderland, however we saw him play there - most notably against Chelsea at Stamford Bridge - I'm open to correction but from what I remember in that game Henderson was fairly central on the pitch and ran things.

I do think that he lacks in courage, but plenty of players could have that said about them and many of them have gone on to be good players. I think the biggest flaw in Henderson's game is that he comes across as a bit of a stupid footballer in that he is slow to spot an obvious pass, slow to spot a run, or slow to twig that if he moved quickly after giving a pass that he would be able to receive the ball back quickly in the better position.

Granted he is still youngish in footballing terms, but many of the players that people have mentioned on here in terms of who they would like to see at Liverpool are around the same age as Henderson and many are younger, and they all seem far more rounded players and far more developed. Henderson may come good, but if he plays the coming season the way he played a large chunk of last season, then I really don't see him amounting to much. Huge season for him as he needs to step up his game to a huge degree and also become consistent in terms of being able to stay at that level.

I completely disagree on this tbqh - from what I've seen on Henderson, he looks to be the most obvious of our midfielders - and with regard to his defined role - I'd take a stab at, what may not be his role at present, but what he does very well, is give and go - keeps the ball moving constantly.

I see Shelvey, Gerrard, Adam - all look for killer passes and spray the ball wide when they can - Henderson is better at laying it off, going for it again.

Now, while that might not split teams open - his fitness allows him to keep his opponents constantly moving. He doesn't do hollywood balls to often (perhaps he doesn't have it in his locker) but he's well able to keep the ball moving - and I think Kenny wanted him for that kind of pass and move style.

Just to bring age and money into it a little.

Henderson was 21 when we got him for £16m (plus almost four million in future add ons) and is now 22.

Just to throw out a few of my usual names and see how they and Henderson match up.

Moussa Sissoko. 22 years of age. Big, powerful, tough tackler, quick, good passer. Very good in defence and good going forward. Would rate him as being a good few levels better than Henderson and would be in the £10m to £12m.


Markus Henriksen. 19 years of age, turns 20 towards the end of this month. Tall, strong, good tackler, good passer, can defend and attack. Seems to be a natural leader even when playing with guys up to ten years his senior. Seems to already to be capable of stepping in against international level players and looking a match for them. Probably in the £10m range at present, maybe less.

Younes Belhanda. 22 years of age. Four months older than Henderson. Huge amount of attacking talent be it in CM, CAM, or out wide. Great passing range, and excellent playmaker and attacker. Probably in the £12m to £20m range.


All three are in the Henderson price bracket or less and all three are in the same age bracket but I would take any of them over Henderson because I would have more confidence on any of them being able to impose themselves onto a game, and would have confidence in their abilities because it is pretty obvious what each is good at because they back it up week in week out on the pitch. Now can anyone come on here and say exactly what Henderson is good at and what qualities does he impose onto a game week in week out? No I doubt anyone can. I reckon many can come on and say what it looks like Henderson might be able to do or what he might develop into, but trying to pin down things that he does bring week in week out is difficult.

I know you said that Henderson didn't set the price which is fair enough of you to look at both sides but you're leaving out who was at the helm of transfers at the time.

Comolli overpaid on pretty much every player he brought to LFC - and overpaid astronomically so while I may be called pedantic on for doing it - I refuse to argue on price with Henderson, I rather talk about ability.

That said - if you were to ask me what we should have paid for him - £10m is what he was worth - £12m is what we should have paid considering the hype around him, being capped for England yada yada yada.

I hope that all the guys and gals that say they see a potential top class player in Henderson get proven right though and that he goes on to become a lynchpin in the centre for Liverpool, but with all the names I mentioned in this post I can see lots of very obvious qualities that the named players show week in week out, but with Henderson I see a long list of maybes that he might bring to his game on a regular basis.

This is why I'm very much looking forward to Rodgers coming into the managerial role - I believe a man of his background working with youth players, fascination with tactics and movement etc. working with a player like Henderson, who can no doubt improve and a player who works very hard to improve, will improve Hendersons development.

We'll have to wait and see obviously, but I'm not too concerned about transfers at the moment - I think the squad we had last season hugely underachieved given some of the talent we had, I also think that a change in style will see us improve massively and as always the youth coming through and the potential for them to be given a shot under Rodgers excites me.

It's not just Henderson I'm looking forward to seeing next season - but the squad as a whole - but for both, interesting times lie ahead I hope.

budgemook

Devilman40k wrote: »

From his agents twitter account

His father / agents account?

Firstly, I thought he had the same agent as Glen Johnson.

Secondly, that account looks fake as feck.

Still think he'll go to Spurs but that account ain't real.

Kess73

Dickerty wrote: »

Kess, you make a lot of sense, but we know Kenny had a semi for buying British, so that explains a part of it. And then we don't know if those other players would have signed for us. 12 months ago, we had NO European football to offer. We had sold Alonso, Masc and Torres in the previous 18 months. We were clearly coming out of a very difficult period.

If you were an up-and-coming player, would YOU have signed for us?

Look at my list and see where a number of them were 12 months ago in terms of the size of the club they were playing for, and how much European football they had to look forward to last season.

Sissoko had no European football, Belhanda had none, Medel had none. Henriksen's games in Europe are always going to be limited in number as Rosenborg won't go far, and he is already off to a very good start in terms of form this season (season starts in March in Norway).


I think that Liverpool FC are still a very attractive option to many up and coming young players. Hell if you were a young player in the Toulouse/Montpelier/Rosenborg team in the summer of 2011, then Liverpool would be a huge team compared to who you are with. Would argue that the same point still stands.

Devilman40k

budgemook wrote: »

His father / agents account?

Firstly, I thought he had the same agent as Glen Johnson.

Secondly, that account looks fake as feck.

Still think he'll go to Spurs but that account ain't real.

Just seen source (Phil McNulty from BBC) say same thing

super_furry

If Juventus' bid for Van Persie is anything to go by, they'll offer €5million and a handful of reserve players.

Kess73

super_furry wrote: »

If Juventus' bid for Van Persie is anything to go by, they'll offer €5million and a handful of reserve players.

They can feck off if they think they can renege on the training bibs and footballs that were part of the earlier bid.

machiavellianme

Apart from buying gaston, we should never deal with Italian clubs again

Dickerty

machiavellianme wrote: »

Apart from buying gaston, we should never deal with Italian clubs again

Yeh, they are all the same, crooks!

Also, all Asians are smart, and all Blondes are dumb...

machiavellianme

Well then, when's the last time we got a good deal either buying or selling with an Italian club

Devilman40k

machiavellianme wrote: »

Well then, when's the last time we got a good deal either buying or selling with an Italian club

Ian Rush... and Ian Rush

Dickerty

machiavellianme wrote: »

Well then, when's the last time we got a good deal either buying or selling with an Italian club

There are so many!

Aquilani from Roma
Aquilani to Juve
Aquilani to Milan
Dossena
Poulson

Ok, gimme a sec...

Ooh, selling Sissoko and signing D-D-D-Doni!!!

missingtime

Riise to Roma?

Knex*

missingtime wrote: »

Riise to Roma?

I know he had gone a bit stale when we sold him, but, seeing Donkey Doss play left back for us had me nostalgic for Riise tbh.

Dickerty

I forgot about Risse. We got £4M I think - not bad, but not great for his quality in a niche position...

noodler

Never going to happen but would anyone take Berba for 10m if Utd were willing and he was willing?

missingtime

Knex. wrote: »

I know he had gone a bit stale when we sold him, but, seeing Donkey Doss play left back for us had me nostalgic for Riise tbh.

Someone was saying the Riise got too comfortable in his role as there was little to no competition for his position and as such his performances dropped.

Food for thought really.

Devilman40k

noodler wrote: »

Never going to happen but would anyone take Berba for 10m if Utd were willing and he was willing?

Yes for 10m we'd be mad not to try!

Dickerty

noodler wrote: »

Never going to happen but would anyone take Berba for 10m if Utd were willing and he was willing?

I don't think so, but he could work as the middleman of a front 3. But GOD he's lazy...

Devilman40k

Dickerty wrote: »

I don't think so, but he could work as the middleman of a front 3. But GOD he's lazy...

He is indeed...but for 20 odd goals a season I could over look that!

whatawaster

noodler wrote: »

Never going to happen but would anyone take Berba for 10m if Utd were willing and he was willing?

Not in a million years.

Dickerty

Devilman40k wrote: »

He is indeed...but for 20 odd goals a season I could over look that!

I don't know if we could rely on him for that many. He would have been given a LOT of chances at United, they create so many, and at Spurs he linked so well with Robbie. But it's certainly possible...

whatawaster

31 year old striker.

Big wages

Questionable attitude and commitment.

No thank you.

Dickerty

I certainly wouldn't pay that fee for him, nor will anyone (maybe a Russian team?).
And besides, we need to play Carroll. He needs to be part of the new system, learn how to keep the two centre-halves busy so that out other attackers can flourish...

spockety

missingtime wrote: »

Someone was saying the Riise got too comfortable in his role as there was little to no competition for his position and as such his performances dropped.

Food for thought really.

I think it was actually Riise himself who said it..

mike65

My favourite tenuous transfer non story of the day

What do you think we'd get? 5 million?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

mike65 wrote: »

My favourite tenuous transfer non story of the day

What do you think we'd get? 5 million?

Some training bibs and footballs were mentioned a while back.

missingtime

spockety wrote: »

I think it was actually Riise himself who said it..

Yup, I remember now, something I think he said he regretted a lot.

missingtime

mike65 wrote: »

My favourite tenuous transfer non story of the day

What do you think we'd get? 5 million?

Swap for the duck?

Dickerty

Nice story! Ibra is an "artist" now?

A ***** artist maybe!

Kess73

missingtime wrote: »

Swap for the duck?

Hehe


Straight swap for either El Shaarawy or Boateng.



I would be generous with regards to the Duck. I would give them Carroll and Aquilani for him.

daithijjj

Not read thread today so not sure if posted.

Pepe Reina ‏@pepe_official25
I look forward to returning to Liverpool soon to start the pre-season training. I can feel this season to be special.

noodler

daithijjj wrote: »

Not read thread today so not sure if posted.

Pepe Reina ‏@pepe_official25
I look forward to returning to Liverpool soon to start the pre-season training. I can feel this season to be special.

Reassuring!

Turtyturd

noodler wrote: »

Reassuring!

Just like the time Torres said similar?

Dodgy manager...Spanish payer committing himself to the club....this could be our year.

amiable

daithijjj wrote: »

Not read thread today so not sure if posted.

Pepe Reina ‏@pepe_official25
I look forward to returning to Liverpool soon to start the pre-season training. I can feel this season to be special.

I think this is a fake account

Kerrigooney

Turtyturd wrote: »

Just like the time Torres said similar?

Dodgy manager...Spanish payer committing himself to the club....this could be our year.

Calling the manager "dodgy" before we`ve even kicked a ball is a bit unfair,isn`t it?

djPSB

Looks like Sig going to Spurs.

jenno86

djPSB wrote: »

Looks like Sig going to Spurs.

Whys that?

opr

jenno86 wrote: »

Whys that?

On SSN atm that he'll be announced tomorrow.

Opr

djPSB

jenno86 wrote: »

djPSB wrote: »

Looks like Sig going to Spurs.

Whys that?

Sky Sports reported he has completed a medical with them.

djPSB

Disappointed that we have missed out on him but it's good to see the club have learnt from the 'buy at any cost' protocol which was present when we bought Carroll and Downing.

jenno86

Balls

Lex Luthor

missingtime wrote: »

Someone was saying the Riise got too comfortable in his role as there was little to no competition for his position and as such his performances dropped.

Food for thought really.

He said it himself in an interview

Turtyturd

Kerrigooney wrote: »

Calling the manager "dodgy" before we`ve even kicked a ball is a bit unfair,isn`t it?

Yeah apologies.....mediocre is a better fit.

daithijjj

amiable wrote: »

I think this is a fake account

Jaysus, i will have to tell Brad Jones, he is following him. :pac:

happyoutscan

jenno86 wrote: »

Balls

Double that, but if he doesn't want to come then let him off.

machiavellianme

djPSB wrote: »

Looks like Sig going to Spurs.

If that's the case then I hope he's a flop or a perpetual benchwarmer. Normally I wouldn't wish ill on a player like that but this fiasco has been a drawn out joke. At least we needn't feel bad about Swansea now

.

delw

Well if Sig is gone to Spurs so be it,an end to the saga,onwards&upwards

Turtyturd

machiavellianme wrote: »

If that's the case then I hope he's a flop or a perpetual benchwarmer. Normally I wouldn't wish ill on a player like that but this fiasco has been a drawn out joke. At least we needn't feel bad about Swansea now

.

Plus we have moral high ground, no other teams fans can accuse us of hi-jacking the move.

Moral victories FTW.