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Anyone ever nasty to you for being Irish
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Eve_Dublin wrote: »No one is a liar and I never accused anyone of that.
I'm bowing out now if you don't mind. Won't be replying to your posts. Your too confrontational. I'm up for a debate and as I said, even to have my mind changed but your twisting my words and the sarcastic tone in your posts does you no favours.
Don't come back!
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Happy Monday wrote: »Don't come back!
Ah! Haven't heard from you in a while since you made a fool of yourself earlier in the thread....:rolleyes:0 -
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Happy Monday wrote: »Don't come back!
what's with all the fighting n feuding? is it not possible to have a civilised debate?0 -
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Your advancement in education and your career will often be impeded because you are Irish in england or the north. .
really try telling that to this man
they are over 3 million irish living in the UK...now if they're being descriminated against like you're suggesting why don't they come back?..no one is making them stay over there0 -
Oh brilliant, so 75% of the country uprooted itself and left for england did it? Or are those the descendants of Irish immigrants who are still called "Irish". Your post defeats itself.really try telling that to this man
they are over 3 million irish living in the UK...now if they're being descriminated against like you're suggesting why don't they come back?..no one is making them stay over there
You'd want to wake up and cop yourself on.Anti-Irish racism is as old as the 12th century: it is not the result of IRA terrorism, says a study published yesterday. Even Irish jokes go back at least to the 16th century and chroniclers as long ago as 1187 were attacking the Irish for their filth and ignorance.
Dr Mary Hickman, director of the Irish Studies Centre at the University of North London, says in her book, Religion, Class and Identity, that since the Anglo-Norman invasion in the 12th century the English have tried to justify their attacks on Ireland by racism. She said yesterday: "Many people assume that current English hostility or discrimination towards the Irish is the result of events in Northern Ireland so they see it as regrettable but understandable."
Dr Hickman, who is conducting a nationwide study of discrimination against the Irish for the Equal Opportunities Commission, argues that Ireland is important to the security of England and successive generations have tried to justify invasion and colonisation by stereotyping the Irish as wild and uncivilised.
The Pope sanctioned the Anglo-Norman invasion on the grounds that Ireland was alleged to be only nominally Christian. Dr Hickman says: "The evidence for dominating Ireland has involved lengthy discussions on the Irish national character directly linked to notions about the Celts as a "race" or the Irish as a nation.
The emphasis prior to the 16th century was on the paganism, superstition and barbarism of the Irish. Before then, Dr Hickman says, the caricature concentrated on their wildness and savagery.
From the reign of Elizabeth 1, the English began systematically to colonise Ireland and the stereotype became more detailed: in particular the notion of the Irish as "stupid" became common. "Most of this was designed to show how English rule could be used to benefit the Irish," says Dr Hickman.
An anonymous contemporary of Shakespeare included a very ignorant and wild Irishman in the play Sir John Oldcastle, based partly, scholars think on MacMorris in Henry V.
During the 16th and 17th centuries, the stereotype changed: the half- human savage became a figure of contempt. In the 19th century more details of the stereotype, such as idleness and drinking, were filled in.
English attitudes to the Irish are closely connected to anti-Catholicism. Dr Hickman's book points out that a separate system of Roman Catholic schools grew up because of the hostility of English working class parents to having their children educated alongside Irish children. It was not the case that the Catholics insisted on their own schools.
A spokesman for the Commission of Racial Equality said they had commissioned their study because there was mounting concern about discrimination against those of Irish origin in the workplace and at schools.
t Religion, Class and Identity; Mary J Hickman; Avebury; pounds 37.50.
Words from the history of a nation's prejudice
12th century: "A most filthy race ... sunk in vice, a race more ignorant than all other nations of the first principles of the faith ... They pay neither tithes nor first fruits; they do not contract marriage, nor shun incestuous connections" - Giraldus Cambrensis.
18th century: The Irish are "buried in the most profound barbarism and ignorance" - David Hume.
1836: Irish immigration into Britain "is an example of a less civilised population spreading itself as a substratum beneath a more civilised community" - parliamentary inquiry into the Irish in Britain.
1930s: "They (the Irish) have settled into the closest poor quarter and turned the settlement into a slum" - J. B. Priestley.0 -
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I think as post-colonising nations go, the UK is pretty sound. British mainstream culture has changed a lot in the last few decades. No point pretending it hasn't. My oh was beat up for having an Irish accent once but I've never had a problem with a British person. Anecdotal but true! Met two young fellas who laughed when I told them I was doing Irish once. They genuinely thought I was making up a language.
Very innocent though. I find they often know very little about Irish history or think the IRA were the only terrorists in NI, that kind of thing. Nothing offensive or racist.
Have met anti-Irish people from elsewhere though. One from New Zealand (very unusual I know). He'd been living with a Protestant from NI and been indoctrinated into the teachings of Ian Paisley. Felt compelled to inform us of this after five mins of us walking into a hostel. We were teenagers, he was well into his thirties. Obnoxious eejit. I put him in his place though. Calmly and comprehensively. He wasn't expecting that. :cool: D*&$head.0 -
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Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,171 Mod ✭✭✭✭
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+1. Their attitudes to class and race among themselves is very different to even a generation ago.I think as post-colonising nations go, the UK is pretty sound. British mainstream culture has changed a lot in the last few decades. No point pretending it hasn't.
Yea back in the 90's I was in a pub in Southampton that had banknotes from around the world behind the bar. If you had one they didn't you got a beer in exchange. I noticed there were no Irish punts, so I offered one and quite a few of them(mostly younger ones funny enough) were surprised we had our own money and were handing the note around and wanted to see other notes and coins. The discussion went on for a bit and some thought we were part of the commonwealth and were independent the way the Isle of man is. Because we've been exposed to their culture and they get very little of ours(and much of it until recently enough was in the context of NI) we tend to know a lot more about them than the other way around. I've been in conversations with British people and knew more about some of their history than they did, which can freak them out a bit too.I find they often know very little about Irish history or think the IRA were the only terrorists in NI, that kind of thing. Nothing offensive or racist. Rejoice in the awareness of feeling stupid, for that’s how you end up learning new things. If you’re not aware you’re stupid, you probably are.
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