Eucharistic Congress

Onesimus

The problem with Bishops not following Church discipline is something that arises out of fear. In America they are more outspoken. Here we live in a small country that would be viewed as a tiny town in America. The culture is different. There is a ''fear'' of running people away of the Church and of them ( the Bishops ) rehashing an old ''Pound the pulpit'' type preaching if they turned the likes of Bertie Ahern away from communion.

This fear of what the people may think of them is nothing new. The apostles suffered from the same thing. They went in hiding after Jesus was Crucified.

They ran away in the garden of Gethsemene.

Yet these are all the things in scripture the Bishops must meditate on and certainly should not be viewed by them as an excuse to act the way they do, but as an opportunity to repent and change their ways and to be fearless in their deliverance of the faith to the faithful.

The hour of death will come upon us, it will come, and we shall not escape it. May the prince of this world and of the air (cf. John 14:30; Eph. 2:2) find our misdeeds few and petty when he comes, so that he will not have good grounds for convicting us. Otherwise we shall weep in vain. 'For that servant who knew his lord's will and did not do it as a servant, shall be beaten with many stripes' (cf. Luke 12:47).

St. Hesychius the Priest

neemish

Brer Fox wrote: »

I think if I did something similar, people would regard me as an egomaniac. I myself would regard me as an egomaniac if I set up a charity in my own name. As I said, it's bizarre and egotistical.

If I lived a heroic life, and die, then by all means name a charity after me, but not before that.

Maybe the Charity is named in that way so that people will recognise it and be able to contribute to the wonderful work that it does.

I am interested that in googling Peter McVerry you chose to focus on the name of the Charity rather than the work that it does. It is one of the few groups that focuses on homelessness in young people (as young as 12 - think of the kids that you know. How many of them would survive on the streets at the age of 12??) The group aims to intervene at an early stage and hopefully set people on a better path in life. Fr. Peter himself still lives in one of the towers in Ballymun and leads a very simple, quiet life dedicated to serving the Kingdom of God. Instead of criticising and talking from an ivory tower, why not volunteer with them or a similar group and learn what they do?

By the way, I have no affiliation to Fr. McVerry or his Charity

Benny_Cake

neemish wrote: »

Maybe the Charity is named in that way so that people will recognise it and be able to contribute to the wonderful work that it does.

I am interested that in googling Peter McVerry you chose to focus on the name of the Charity rather than the work that it does. It is one of the few groups that focuses on homelessness in young people (as young as 12 - think of the kids that you know. How many of them would survive on the streets at the age of 12??) The group aims to intervene at an early stage and hopefully set people on a better path in life. Fr. Peter himself still lives in one of the towers in Ballymun and leads a very simple, quiet life dedicated to serving the Kingdom of God. Instead of criticising and talking from an ivory tower, why not volunteer with them or a similar group and learn what they do?

By the way, I have no affiliation to Fr. McVerry or his Charity

Indeed, actually the Peter McVerry trust was originally named the Arrupe Society, after the Superior General of the Jesuits, but took it's present name a few years back. Peter McVerry is very well known in Ireland and his name would undoubtedly help in fundraising. I have no doubt that if a man of his talents suffered from egomania he would have found a more lucrative path in life, instead he has dedicated himself to serving the least of God's people.

HamletOrHecuba

neemish wrote: »

Fr. Peter himself still lives in one of the towers in Ballymun and leads a very simple, quiet life dedicated to serving the Kingdom of God. Instead of criticising and talking from an ivory tower, why not volunteer with them or a similar group and learn what they do?

By the way, I have no affiliation to Fr. McVerry or his Charity

You dont know what Brer does or does not do and it would be foolish to presume given the clear Gospel command to not make a point of advertising our good deeds.

However I object to you saying that Fr McVerry leads a life dedicated to serving the Kingdom of God- he is very open about seeing problems in this world in terms that are very this worldly, problems of a spiritual order he ignores, also he is what you could call "open minded", after all he doesnt believe in hell or even purgatory so what than is the point in calling people to ascetic struggle? The Kingdom of God is not about "humanitarianism", its about struggle against the world, the flesh and the devil.

Even with worldly problems have you ever heard him condemn usury or call for the death penalty for dealing hard drugs?

Benny_Cake

HamletOrHecuba wrote: »

You dont know what Brer does or does not do and it would be foolish to presume given the clear Gospel command to not make a point of advertising our good deeds.

However I object to you saying that Fr McVerry leads a life dedicated to serving the Kingdom of God- he is very open about seeing problems in this world in terms that are very this worldly, problems of a spiritual order he ignores, also he is what you could call "open minded", after all he doesnt believe in hell or even purgatory so what than is the point in calling people to ascetic struggle? The Kingdom of God is not about "humanitarianism", its about struggle against the world, the flesh and the devil.

It's unusual to see the phrase "open-minded" used as a term of abuse. Also, do you have any proof to support your claim that he doesn't believe in hell or purgatory (not that I think it's a deal-breaker)?

HamletOrHecuba wrote: »

Even with worldly problems have you ever heard him condemn usury or call for the death penalty for dealing hard drugs?

Usury appears to be something of a hobby-horse for you, but we'll leave it at that. The death penalty for dealing hard drugs - is it a requirement of a Christian minister to call support that? I think your own rather extreme political views are coming to the surface there. For what it's worth, this was what John Paul II had to say on the subject in 1995:

It is clear that, for these purposes to be achieved, the nature and extent of the punishment must be carefully evaluated and decided upon, and ought not go to the extreme of executing the offender except in cases of absolute necessity: in other words, when it would not be possible otherwise to defend society. Today however, as a result of steady improvements in the organization of the penal system, such cases are very rare, if not practically non-existent.

HamletOrHecuba

Benny_Cake wrote: »

It's unusual to see the phrase "open-minded" used as a term of abuse. Also, do you have any proof to support your claim that he doesn't believe in hell or purgatory (not that I think it's a deal-breaker)?

Ring him up, it is not something he hides.

HamletOrHecuba

Benny_Cake wrote: »

It's unusual to see the phrase "open-minded" used as a term of abuse. Also, do you have any proof to support your claim that he doesn't believe in hell or purgatory (not that I think it's a deal-breaker)

http://www.rte.ie/tv/wouldyoubelieve/petermcverry.html

Indeed he is extremely public about it!

Benny_Cake

HamletOrHecuba wrote: »

http://www.rte.ie/tv/wouldyoubelieve/petermcverry.html

Indeed he is extremely public about it!

Interesting, I'm sorry I missed that episode. In his daily work I would imagine he sees hell right here in Dublin. It must colour his views somewhat. In any case, that doesn't take from his good work and his sincere Christian faith.

Brer Fox

Benny_Cake wrote: »

Interesting, I'm sorry I missed that episode. In his daily work I would imagine he sees hell right here in Dublin. It must colour his views somewhat. In any case, that doesn't take from his good work and his sincere Christian faith.

There's no point being sincerely in error.

It's sad but there are several priests I know who do a lot of good works for the poor but are in open dissent against Church teaching. What is it about that combination? I wonder if it might be that doing good works salves their conscience against their dissent.

Padre Pio said about those who don't believe in hell - they'll believe in it when they get there.

"I don't believe in Hell - God is not a judge. .. God is the one who loves you with no conditions attached".

Fr Peter appears not to be familiar with the many Gospel incidents where Jesus warned about hell. If God has no conditions, then why in the Parable of the Sheep and the Goats does the Lord say that those who neglect their brothers will go to hell?

HamletOrHecuba

Benny_Cake wrote: »

Interesting, I'm sorry I missed that episode. In his daily work I would imagine he sees hell right here in Dublin. It must colour his views somewhat. In any case, that doesn't take from his good work and his sincere Christian faith.

"The biggest obstacle to justice is spirituality"

Fr Peter McVerry.

"And the Lord answering, said to her: Martha, Martha, thou art careful, and art troubled about many things:But one thing is necessary. Mary hath chosen the best part, which shall not be taken away from her."

Luke 10:41-42.

As for God not being a Judge how anyone could read the New Testament and not see that Christ makes the strong point of stressing that God is a Judge is beyond me; so obviously Fr Peter rejects the New Testament, so be it, he probably is sincere in his faith, but his faith is NOT Christian.

HamletOrHecuba

Benny_Cake wrote: »

Interesting, I'm sorry I missed that episode. In his daily work I would imagine he sees hell right here in Dublin. It must colour his views somewhat. In any case, that doesn't take from his good work and his sincere Christian faith.

The real suffering that goes on in Dublin is not produced by material lack but by spiritual problems that can lead to material lack if say a parent drinks the money that should have gone for children's food. Most of us (myself included very much) need the fear of God, which is the beginning of wisdom, though indeed perfect love casts out fear.

Doc Farrell

HamletOrHecuba wrote: »

so obviously Fr Peter rejects the New Testament, so be it, he probably is sincere in his faith, but his faith is NOT Christian.

the mods have to make a decision how much more of this kind of trolling they will accept. There has to be a certain standard of posting allowed, otherwise it would be better to merge this forum with the conspiracy or soccer forum.

I open this forum because it is Irish and open to all but when I read people calling Fr Peter egotistical or unChristian then I have to accept that the mods have been burnt out by extremist trolling. Ban me for a week if you like for backseat modding but what on earth is the point of this forum if insults about truly great Irish Christians who dedicate their life to the poor are allowed?

Tighten up the charter and start banning trolls, otherwise you are simply wasting your lives.

For anyone sane reading this, Fr Peters new book will give even the most ignorant reader a clear understanding of his Christian beliefs.

HamletOrHecuba

Doc Farrell wrote: »

the mods have to make a decision how much more of this kind of trolling they will accept. There has to be a certain standard of posting allowed, otherwise it would be better to merge this forum with the conspiracy or soccer forum.
.

Look Peter McVerry is very clear that he DOESNT believe God is a Judge of anyone and that he DOESNT believe in Hell.

The New Testament clearly teaches both.

Therefore he rejects the New Testament.

Its that SIMPLE.

Why is stating the obvious trolling?

Why are you so impassioned to censor views that you dont agree with?

Brer Fox

Doc Farrell wrote: »

I open this forum because it is Irish and open to all but when I read people calling Fr Peter egotistical or unChristian then I have to accept that the mods have been burnt out by extremist trolling. Ban me for a week if you like for backseat modding but what on earth is the point of this forum if insults about truly great Irish Christians who dedicate their life to the poor are allowed?

Do you own boards.ie?

Onesimus

Brer Fox wrote: »

Do you own boards.ie?

I think it's a mistype. What he is saying is that ''I come to this forum'' and so on

neemish

HamletOrHecuba wrote: »

Even with worldly problems have you ever heard him condemn usury or call for the death penalty for dealing hard drugs?

Funny that you are pro-life in one forum and yet seem to condone taking a life when it suits!

In your faith, have you ever heard of the corporal works of mercy? It's all very fine taking Mary's part, but surely we have to care for our neighbours as well.

And since you like to quote the New Testament, have you heard the Parable of the Good Samaritan?

donegal_road

I heard yesterday that the cost of the Eucharistic Congress is expected to be €11.8 million. How can the church defend this while so many victims of abuse have been left un-compensated by the same institution?
Could this money have been better put towards helping many of the people who sleep on our streets (many of whom are victims of abuse, ironically)

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0530/eucharistic-congress-dublin.html

georgieporgy

donegal_road wrote: »

I heard yesterday that the cost of the Eucharistic Congress is expected to be €11.8 million. How can the church defend this while so many victims of abuse have been left un-compensated by the same institution?
Could this money have been better put towards helping many of the people who sleep on our streets (many of whom are victims of abuse, ironically)

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0530/eucharistic-congress-dublin.html

Money is earmarked for different things. I would prefer my money going to fund a worthwhile international conference on the Eucharist rather than into a bottomless pit . The sex abusers were not related to me and I am not responsible for paying for their victims rehab. Nevertheless, that said, I have also contributed support to victims in response to the Holy Father's entreaties.

I've also asked my wife, an atheist, if she would sell her jewellery so we can give the proceeds to the poor. So far she has refused.......

Corkfeen

Doc Farrell wrote: »

the mods have to make a decision how much more of this kind of trolling they will accept. There has to be a certain standard of posting allowed, otherwise it would be better to merge this forum with the conspiracy or soccer forum.

I open this forum because it is Irish and open to all but when I read people calling Fr Peter egotistical or unChristian then I have to accept that the mods have been burnt out by extremist trolling. Ban me for a week if you like for backseat modding but what on earth is the point of this forum if insults about truly great Irish Christians who dedicate their life to the poor are allowed?

Tighten up the charter and start banning trolls, otherwise you are simply wasting your lives.

For anyone sane reading this, Fr Peters new book will give even the most ignorant reader a clear understanding of his Christian beliefs.

I actually agree with you. If he's not a troll that would mean he is a rather hateful individual that has little time for humanity. He has also adopted some rather absurd conspiracy theories... He prefers to condemn literally everything about humans, i'm sure he's secretly a lovely fellow. :pac: (That was a lie...)

HamletOrHecuba

neemish wrote: »

Funny that you are pro-life in one forum and yet seem to condone taking a life when it suits!

In your faith, have you ever heard of the corporal works of mercy? It's all very fine taking Mary's part, but surely we have to care for our neighbours as well.

And since you like to quote the New Testament, have you heard the Parable of the Good Samaritan?

So in order to be against in particular late term abortions one has to be a complete pacifist otherwise one is a hypocrite?

Yes I have heard of corporal works of mercy but they are not the be all and end all of Christianity otherwise that would put the British Labour Party far ahead of the vast majority of the saints. Who said we dont have to care for our neighbour? But once we put the corporal care of our neighbour above everything prayer than we are no longer in Christian territory.

Yes I have heard of the parable.

The man who fell and was wounded by thieves represents fallen man who left the Jerusalem of Paradise to journey towards the Jericho of hell, the thieves of course represent the demons.

The Priest and Levite passed by man in his condition because they had no means to help him, but Christ- the Good Samaritan- poured oil and wine representing the Sacraments into his wounds and brought him to the Inn which represents the Church, depositing two coins- the Old and New Testament.

The parable is about Spiritual works of mercy which according to Fr Peter get in the way of "Justice".

gimmebroadband

Corkfeen wrote: »

I actually agree with you. If he's not a troll that would mean he is a rather hateful dumbass that has little time for humanity. He has also adopted some rather absurd conspiracy theories... He prefers to condemn literally everything about humans, i'm sure he's secretly a lovely fellow. :pac: (That was a lie...)

Isn't personal attacks against the forum charter?

Corkfeen

gimmebroadband wrote: »

Isn't personal attacks against the forum charter?

Yep, i'll happily take a temporary ban on this one tbh.. I was rather annoyed at the time admittedly.. But to be fair hamlet, can bring out the worst in people. I shall remove the particular word though but i'll be honest, the poster has been posting venom for months. Apologies to the mods... I shall take leave myself.

Onesimus

Corkfeen wrote: »

Yep, i'll happily take a temporary ban on this one tbh.. I was rather annoyed at the time admittedly.. But to be fair hamlet, can bring out the worst in people. I shall remove the particular word though but i'll be honest, the poster has been posting venom for months.

Agreed. A clever Christian Holy troller if I am to be blunt and honest. Hamlet is a previous poster I know that has now changed names. if you google fisheaters forum you'll find that a lot of trads on that forum ( it is a forum specifically for the likes of sspx followers ) who spout nothing but venom and hatred all over the place and are very brutal towards people of any religion or creed.

I keep tellin folks that the sspx are not what they claim to be and that is ''people who are for the Pope''

Corkfeen

Onesimus wrote: »

Agreed. A clever Christian Holy troller if I am to be blunt and honest. Hamlet is a previous poster I know that has now changed names. if you google fisheaters forum you'll find that a lot of trads on that forum ( it is a forum specifically for the likes of sspx followers ) who spout nothing but venom and hatred all over the place and are very brutal towards people of any religion or creed.
'

An atheist and Christian agree.. Woooo! :pac:

HamletOrHecuba

Onesimus wrote: »

Agreed. A clever Christian Holy troller if I am to be blunt and honest. Hamlet is a previous poster I know that has now changed names. if you google fisheaters forum you'll find that a lot of trads on that forum ( it is a forum specifically for the likes of sspx followers ) who spout nothing but venom and hatred all over the place and are very brutal towards people of any religion or creed.

I keep tellin folks that the sspx are not what they claim to be and that is ''people who are for the Pope''

Point of information; fisheaters is for "liberal" SSPX and "Indult" Mass goers. It isnt a bit like you describe.

If you go to Cathinfo you will see a lot of giving out about fisheaters being far to worldly and soft.

HamletOrHecuba

Corkfeen wrote: »

An atheist and Christian agree.. Woooo! :pac:

"Woe to you when men shall bless you: for according to these things did their fathers to the false prophets."

Luke 6:26.

"If the world hate you, know ye, that it hath hated me before you.
If you had been of the world, the world would love its own: but because you are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you."

John 15:18-19.

Plowman

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