Let's protect the high priced perscription trade

Jay D

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0528/new-drug-laws-being-prepared.html
The laws will also make it illegal to import these drugs without a licence from the Irish Medicines Board.

Merchants Quay Ireland Director Tony Geoghegan said there is now a large black market in tranquillisers like valium or xanax.

He said many drug users become unknowingly addicted to the benzodiazepine, which are often more difficult to detox from than heroin.

He also added that it is now the norm for drug users to use prescription drugs such as valium on top of heroin.

Speaking on RTÉ's News at One, Mr Geoghegan said he agreed with Dublin Lord Mayor Andrew Montague that the illicit sale of prescription drugs on the streets of the capital now far outstrips the sale of heroin, cannabis and cocaine combined.

He said the new laws will address one avenue of concern, but he called for more coherence in the system of prescribing drugs, with better co-ordination between GPs and treatment clinics.

Merchants Quay Ireland is the country's biggest treatment service.

While I can definitely see the reasoning behind a load of drug takers being addicted to such drugs to take away from heroin and the like, I just feel this is a pile of crap otherwise.

Just for example, buy such pills in Spain over the counter. Result is you sleep when you cannot. You don't need to go waiting around some doctor's surrgery and then pay over the odds to obtain them. €7 or so will do it.

I don't know how effective it will be in deterring people or take away from that "huge black market" but I genuinely feel we are lagging behind once again with completely outdated approaches.

Logical Fallacy

Legalise it.

Oh, hang on.

Biggins

Just what the doctor ordered!

Logical Fallacy

Jay D wrote: »

Just for example, buy such pills in Spain over the counter. Result is you sleep when you cannot. You don't need to go waiting around some doctor's surrgery and then pay over the odds to obtain them. €7 or so will do it.

To be serious for a second,

Unless you are desperate to sleep it's not normally a good idea to associate Benzo's with "being a little helping hand". That's how more than a few people get addicted to things.

Stinicker

Jay D wrote: »

While I can definitely see the reasoning behind a load of drug takers being addicted to such drugs to take away from heroin and the like, I just feel this is a pile of crap otherwise.

Just for example, buy such pills in Spain over the counter. Result is you sleep when you cannot. You don't need to go waiting around some doctor's surrgery and then pay over the odds to obtain them. €7 or so will do it.

I don't know how effective it will be in deterring people or take away from that "huge black market" but I genuinely feel we are lagging behind once again with completely outdated approaches.

I completely agree, I was having alot of trouble sleeping last year and my GP refused point blank to prescribe me sleeping pills even though I was almost at the stage of sleeping all day and awake all night and I was getting borderline depressed and she still would not prescribe them for me. A friend of mine brought me back some pills from abroad and after taking about 5 (over 5 nights) I got my circadian rhythm back on track!

The entire medical and pharmaceutical profession here is a cartel using regulations like these to protect their monopoly.

beeroclock

Jay D wrote: »

While I can definitely see the reasoning behind a load of drug takers being addicted to such drugs to take away from heroin and the like, I just feel this is a pile of crap otherwise.

Just for example, buy such pills in Spain over the counter. Result is you sleep when you cannot. You don't need to go waiting around some doctor's surrgery and then pay over the odds to obtain them. €7 or so will do it.

I don't know how effective it will be in deterring people or take away from that "huge black market" but I genuinely feel we are lagging behind once again with completely outdated approaches.

Get a grip will ya

Are you somehow implying Irish pharmacists over charge? Come of the stage will ya, I mean its not like you can get alot of off the shelf tonics at huge discounts online or abroad

Between doctors, dentists, pharmacists etc we are well looked after and charged fairly (ya fooking right)

Logical Fallacy

Stinicker wrote: »

I completely agree, I was having alot of trouble sleeping last year and my GP refused point blank to prescribe me sleeping pills even though I was almost at the stage of sleeping all day and awake all night and I was getting borderline depressed and she still would not prescribe them for me. A friend of mine brought me back some pills from abroad and after taking about 5 (over 5 nights) I got my circadian rhythm back on track!

The entire medical and pharmaceutical profession here is a cartel using regulations like these to protect their monopoly.

But surely it would be in the interests of them to have not only prescribed you said drugs, but to give you more than you need?

The example given in your post makes no sense in light of the point you are trying to make.

Jay D

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

To be serious for a second,

Unless you are desperate to sleep it's not normally a good idea to associate Benzo's with "being a little helping hand". That's how more than a few people get addicted to things.

and what about valium? The scaremongering others added in just to cover such ones up (I feel anyway).

Ghandee

This should put it into perspective for a lot of Irish people reading this.


Anyone can walk into boots in the north, and walk out with a pack of ibuferon for sixteen pence, that's right, pence not pounds!

Once again the cartels get together, end result = Paddy gets fleeced.:mad:

Stinicker

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

But surely it would be in the interests of them to have not only prescribed you said drugs, but to give you more than you need?

The example given in your post makes no sense in light of the point you are trying to make.

My doctor "prescribed" me healthy eating and exercise to cure my symptoms. When there is nothing serious wrong with you all they are interested in getting you back as soon as possible so they can rip you off again.

Jay D

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

But surely it would be in the interests of them to have not only prescribed you said drugs, but to give you more than you need?

The example given in your post makes no sense in light of the point you are trying to make.

Your uncle manages at United Drug, your sister's a Doctor and your brother owns the chemist next door to her practice.

grindle

Jay D wrote: »

and what about valium? The scaremongering others added in just to cover such ones up (I feel anyway).

Valium is a benzodiazepine.

Biggins

Ghandee wrote: »

...Once again the cartels get together, end result = Paddy gets fleeced.:mad:

We are not 'Rip-Off Ireland' for nuffin' ya know!

Jesus Shaves

Jay D wrote: »

Just for example, buy such pills in Spain over the counter.

No you can't.

Jay D

Stinicker wrote: »

I completely agree, I was having alot of trouble sleeping last year and my GP refused point blank to prescribe me sleeping pills even though I was almost at the stage of sleeping all day and awake all night and I was getting borderline depressed and she still would not prescribe them for me. A friend of mine brought me back some pills from abroad and after taking about 5 (over 5 nights) I got my circadian rhythm back on track!

The entire medical and pharmaceutical profession here is a cartel using regulations like these to protect their monopoly.

The same man, I had problems and took these "Calms" which are probably the same as taking a sugarless sweet or something and done nothing at all to help. Similarly a gpill one night corrects the pattern again.

Stinicker

Ghandee wrote: »

This should put it into perspective for a lot of Irish people reading this.


Anyone can walk into boots in the north, and walk out with a pack of ibuferon for sixteen pence, that's right, pence not pounds!

Once again the cartels get together, end result = Paddy gets fleeced.:mad:

Walk into a chemist here and you'll have some nosey gowl trying to insinuate you are suicidal if you ask for anything stronger than smarties. I wonder how women buy contraceptives and the like with such nosey and judgemental people.

Chuck Stone

16 paracetamol in the UK 19p.

It costs about €2.30 to €3.00 for 24 generic paracetamol in the local pharmacies.

We're being screwed.

Biggins

Stinicker wrote: »

Walk into a chemist here and you'll have some nosey gowl trying to insinuate you are suicidal if you ask for anything stronger than smarties. I wonder how women buy contraceptives and the like with such nosey and judgemental people.

Some of them HAVE to ask those questions so that they are indemnified from any tried claims against them later.

humbert

Actually I think people becoming addicted to prescription drugs is a problem in Ireland.

I'm no fan of pharmacists being lax handing out prescription drugs and doctors prescribing drugs too freely but this seems like entirely sensible legislation.

Jay D

grindle wrote: »

Valium is a benzodiazepine.

ok my bad, I will say having taken them though, I don't see a huge issue.

grindle

Jay D wrote: »

ok my bad, I will say having taken them though, I don't see a huge issue.

There isn't, until you take it for weeks or months on end "just to relax", and then find you can never feel "relaxed" without them.

As cautionary as that sounds, I'm in full favour of cheap, accessible drugs, and I don't believe people should blame the drugs (or their dealers, Big Pharma or otherwise) for the user's choice.

steddyeddy

Jay D wrote: »

While I can definitely see the reasoning behind a load of drug takers being addicted to such drugs to take away from heroin and the like, I just feel this is a pile of crap otherwise.

Just for example, buy such pills in Spain over the counter. Result is you sleep when you cannot. You don't need to go waiting around some doctor's surrgery and then pay over the odds to obtain them. €7 or so will do it.

I don't know how effective it will be in deterring people or take away from that "huge black market" but I genuinely feel we are lagging behind once again with completely outdated approaches.

It isnt as much the dangers of taking drugs I would be worried about rather that the drugs were legit. If the chemical formula for a drug differs in just one place bad things can happen. Thalidomide being a good example.

Borderfox

Zomig is €10 per tablet here and €4 per tablet in Portugal. Very same tablets not generic. Same old same old rip off in this country.

Chain_reaction

Its grand, most of our Mothers probably have a stash anways.

InReality

Eh they are 2 seperate issues

1) Yes most drugs are a rip off & our EU overlords have demanded we reform here.
&
2) Sleeping tablets are very addictive.

Chucky the tree

Stinicker wrote: »

I completely agree, I was having alot of trouble sleeping last year and my GP refused point blank to prescribe me sleeping pills even though I was almost at the stage of sleeping all day and awake all night and I was getting borderline depressed and she still would not prescribe them for me. A friend of mine brought me back some pills from abroad and after taking about 5 (over 5 nights) I got my circadian rhythm back on track!

The entire medical and pharmaceutical profession here is a cartel using regulations like these to protect their monopoly.

Why would the doctor prescribe you sleeping pills when you had no problem sleeping?

zagmund

I've heard that the rationale for keeping prices high are because "we depend on the multinational pharma companies in Cork and we don't want to upset them by selling their product at a low price" or "Won't someone please think of the employees"

However, I find this particular line of reasoning stinks. It's basically saying that the people of Ireland should each pay a subsidy of €x00 (or €x,000) per year to keep big pharma happy. This does not sit well with me.

Any time I'm in the UK I automatically drop into Boots and pick up a load of the 16p packets of whatever I see there just because I can't stand having to drop into a pharmacy or a convenience store at home and spending €4 or €5 on an identical product.

z

Nermal

humbert wrote: »

Actually I think people becoming addicted to prescription drugs is a problem in Ireland.

It's not my problem, so why am I overpaying?

Personally I don't really care what the outcome of a policy is, I care about the principle. The principle being that I, as an adult, should be allowed to buy any substance I like, from anywhere I like, and ingest however much of it I like.

mattjack

Stinicker wrote: »

I completely agree, I was having alot of trouble sleeping last year and my GP refused point blank to prescribe me sleeping pills even though I was almost at the stage of sleeping all day and awake all night and I was getting borderline depressed and she still would not prescribe them for me. A friend of mine brought me back some pills from abroad and after taking about 5 (over 5 nights) I got my circadian rhythm back on track!

The entire medical and pharmaceutical profession here is a cartel using regulations like these to protect their monopoly.

How much does your friend charge for these pills ?

I might be able to throw some business his way.

Mr Benevolent

Chuck Stone wrote: »

16 paracetamol in the UK 19p.

It costs about €2.30 to €3.00 for 24 generic paracetamol in the local pharmacies.

We're being screwed.

Yeah, but that's non-prescription medicine. The OP was complaining about the prescription stuff.

Logical Fallacy

Jay D wrote: »

Your uncle manages at United Drug, your sister's a Doctor and your brother owns the chemist next door to her practice.

So anyone who doesn't instantly drink the Cool-Aid has an agenda? Fair enough.

Jay D wrote: »

ok my bad, I will say having taken them though, I don't see a huge issue.

Well I have done all kinds of drugs, I wouldn't instantly assume the general populace should have easier access to them based on the fact that I did fine on them though. There is more to consider here than personal experience.

Borderfox wrote: »

Zomig is €10 per tablet here and €4 per tablet in Portugal. Very same tablets not generic. Same old same old rip off in this country.

Indeed. The difference in average wage is pretty dramatic though.

Nermal wrote: »

It's not my problem, so why am I overpaying?

Personally I don't really care what the outcome of a policy is, I care about the principle. The principle being that I, as an adult, should be allowed to buy any substance I like, from anywhere I like, and ingest however much of it I like.

Once you have comprehensive health insurance I completely agree.

Graces7

care with benzos including valium. Please, care... Takes but around 7 days to get hooked and yes, getting off them is hell. As a former long term involuntary tranx addict...

But yes, simple OTC painkillers are a terrible price here. I once tried to get simple aspirin and was told I must get a prescription.. why I asked? "You might be taking aspirin when you should be taking something else... " So I told the person I would send to the North. She was not pleased!

When I lived near the border it was fine; now i have friends in the US who send me aspirin, brufen etc in large bottles; chronic pain relief is easier and cheaper there.

mattjack

Graces7 wrote: »

care with benzos including valium. Please, care... Takes but around 7 days to get hooked and yes, getting off them is hell. As a former long term involuntary tranx addict...

But yes, simple OTC painkillers are a terrible price here. I once tried to get simple aspirin and was told I must get a prescription.. why I asked? "You might be taking aspirin when you should be taking something else... " So I told the person I would send to the North. She was not pleased!

When I lived near the border it was fine; now i have friends in the US who send me aspirin, brufen etc in large bottles; chronic pain relief is easier and cheaper there.

Chronic, as in long term pain ?

flutterflye

I was on melatonin before I was pregnant, now I'm on something I can't pronounce or spell beginning with 'A'! - It's an old anti dep that is nolonger really used as such, it's main use now is for insomniacs.

While the oul benzos are great for getting you asleep quicker, there are so many problems associated with them - don't know why melatonin isn't more widely prescribed - it's over the counter or in health shops in many other countries.