Australia or New Zealand???

technodub

The pros and cons.... A friend of mine is asking me too come to new zealand with him at the end of the year in search of riches this country might never see again! (Especially after we sign our lives away to the germans on thursday!) So my question is what are peoples experiences of the 2 places?? Iv heard New Zealanders are like the irish personality wise but the weather seems to be better in oz! Im a qualified carpenter so anybody know of the work/ money situation in each country? Amy feedback would be much appreciated folks ...
Cheers

seachto7

weather is good in NZ too, much more bearable than Aus. Dollar is stronger in Aus I reckon,and work prospects probably better there too. I would choose NZ if it were me......... nth island........

Cookie_Monster

As they say over here, the problem with Aus is that it's full of Australians

supernova84

Canada

RATM

Having done a year in both I would say NZ. Don't get me wrong, Oz is a great place and has better weather but I personally found Kiwis better to get on with than Aussies. The Aussies are a good bunch but can be a bit arrogant at times, especially when it comes to sport and their achievements. I worked during the Olympics and was nauseating listening to (some) of them banging on about how great they are.

The Kiwis have a more laid back manner about them (this may not be to everyone's taste but it is to mine) and are more similar to the Irish outlook overall.

Wages and job opportunities are a good bit better in Oz but I wouldn't let that be the deciding factor- if you look hard for a job in NZ you will get one. The weather in NZ may not be as good but personally living through 35+ degree summers isn't my thing- give me the more balmy 25-28 degrees of NZ anyday. Even in winter most days get up to 15 degrees so it is much more bearable than here.

Finally I'd recommend working in a place like Queenstown or Wanaka over any of the cities. Both are cool places and it is hard not to have fun there once you secure a decent job.

The Aussie

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

As they say over here, the problem with Aus is that it's full of Australians Kiwis and Paddies

Noticed a mistake so i fixed it up for you there, hope you dont mind

Ive got a brother who has lived in New Zealand for years now, says he will only go back to Oz for holidays, ive been over to see him 4 times now, my longest stay was 3 months, i love the place.

RATM wrote: »

The Aussies are a good bunch but can be a bit arrogant at times, especially when it comes to sport and their achievements. I worked during the Olympics and was nauseating listening to (some) of them banging on about how great they are.

Not been to NZ since the World Cup im guessing :pac:

jank

Why dont you do both?

technodub

Cheers lads sorry been away for awhile thats why i have not replied! Ye a few people i have talked too have said they found kiwis alot better suited to Irish people then Aussies! Alot more laid back which is always a good thing and im assuming they will have plenty of work for carpenters in the likes of Christchurch after the quakes.. Another thing kinda putting me off oz is the amount of Irish people there! I wanna leave the country and meet new people not just end up hanging around Irish bars with Irish people Canada is another option but i have a friend who is also a carpenter and he wants to go to new zealand so it would be handy if we could get jobs in the same place and share tools / house and maybe a car! Realistically anywere is going to be better then Ireland at the moment! Thanks for the inputs!

pclancy

Come visit both and make your own mind up, you'll soon see the differences and what matters to you is what will make you choose. You won't as rich in NZ as you can in OZ but life is really fantastic here for many other reasons then money.

telly_lover

technodub wrote: »

Cheers lads sorry been away for awhile thats why i have not replied! Ye a few people i have talked too have said they found kiwis alot better suited to Irish people then Aussies! Alot more laid back which is always a good thing and im assuming they will have plenty of work for carpenters in the likes of Christchurch after the quakes.. Another thing kinda putting me off oz is the amount of Irish people there! I wanna leave the country and meet new people not just end up hanging around Irish bars with Irish people Canada is another option but i have a friend who is also a carpenter and he wants to go to new zealand so it would be handy if we could get jobs in the same place and share tools / house and maybe a car! Realistically anywere is going to be better then Ireland at the moment! Thanks for the inputs!

i lived and worked in both countries at the end of the nineties

they both have their charms but australia was the clear winner for me , better wages , better weather , more extroverted people

new zealand is a beautifull country but other than that , i didnt find it all that appealing , im puzzled by this thing i often hear about kiwis being quite similar to us irish , i didnt see that at all , i would say we are more similar to australians but not particulary similar to either , new zealand has a tiny irish influence compared to australia and is much more pro british , it has a huge scottish influence however , kiwis are dour , they are also a pretty hard and brutal bunch in my experience , australians take no prisoners either but like americans , at least they tend to respect those who put in an effort , new zealand also doesnt have anything like the same community spirit which is so visible in ireland , for a rural country with a small population , this is a surprise , people are quite individualistic , oh and heaven help you if you feel the need to complain about anything in new zealand , kiwis absolutley cannot tollerate complaining and are incredibly thin skinned when it comes to criticism , im not talking about grumbling or moaning about trivial matters , i mean anything from your roof leaking to your workplace colleague being a nightmare , they simply dont want to hear negative feedback under any circumstances , i also found kiwis to be incredibly inward looking , they have little interest in anything thats not new zealand orientated


to conclude , new zealand is a wonderfull place for a holiday but to live in , give me ireland anyday , even in the present condition its in

CommanderC

Weather in Wellington sucks. Have been living in Ireland for a year now, but am from NZ and was based in Wellington for about 5 years. Winters there are so rainy. My first winter in Ireland, has been much shorter and much more tolerable.

telly_lover

CommanderC wrote: »

Weather in Wellington sucks. Have been living in Ireland for a year now, but am from NZ and was based in Wellington for about 5 years. Winters there are so rainy. My first winter in Ireland, has been much shorter and much more tolerable.

wellington was my favourite place in new zealand

CommanderC

telly_lover wrote: »

i lived and worked in both countries at the end of the nineties

they both have their charms but australia was the clear winner for me , better wages , better weather , more extroverted people

new zealand is a beautifull country but other than that , i didnt find it all that appealing , im puzzled by this thing i often hear about kiwis being quite similar to us irish , i didnt see that at all , i would say we are more similar to australians but not particulary similar to either , new zealand has a tiny irish influence compared to australia and is much more pro british , it has a huge scottish influence however , kiwis are dour , they are also a pretty hard and brutal bunch in my experience , australians take no prisoners either but like americans , at least they tend to respect those who put in an effort , new zealand also doesnt have anything like the same community spirit which is so visible in ireland , for a rural country with a small population , this is a surprise , people are quite individualistic , oh and heaven help you if you feel the need to complain about anything in new zealand , kiwis absolutley cannot tollerate complaining and are incredibly thin skinned when it comes to criticism , im not talking about grumbling or moaning about trivial matters , i mean anything from your roof leaking to your workplace colleague being a nightmare , they simply dont want to hear negative feedback under any circumstances , i also found kiwis to be incredibly inward looking , they have little interest in anything thats not new zealand orientated


to conclude , new zealand is a wonderfull place for a holiday but to live in , give me ireland anyday , even in the present condition its in

Wow- have never heard so many countries generalised in one go. For the record...I'm neither hard nor brutal

Rua1

CommanderC wrote: »

Weather in Wellington sucks. Have been living in Ireland for a year now, but am from NZ and was based in Wellington for about 5 years. Winters there are so rainy. My first winter in Ireland, has been much shorter and much more tolerable.

I'd say the same thing (from Wellington), but the weather in Wellington seems to put on a lovely show for my irish husband. Not long back from a visit there, and, according to my parents, the weather pretty much packed in the minute we left.

CiaranC

New Zealand by a mile for me. Better weather, better lifestyle, better people.

telly_lover

CiaranC wrote: »

New Zealand by a mile for me. Better weather, better lifestyle, better people.

found them to be an amoral bunch tbh , two faced aswell , superfically friendly but if you need help , they dont want to know

Crumble Froo

Really curious where telly lover lived in New Zealand.

I prefer NZ over Oz for a number of reasons. Should point out a bias now, in that I couldnt find work for the few months I did live in oz and never quite 'settled'.

(nevermind, I'll finish this later, about to get kicked outta library...)

NakedNNettles

If its an outdoors lifestyle thing you are after then I would say NZ. It does feel very isolated from the world though, people are laid back, Wellington is the best city. Apart from the locals, it always felt like everyone else was temporarily passing through.

If its work and money then Oz, the beach and party lifestyle is tops here. Apart from Perth, Oz feels a bit more connected with the world especially Sydney and Melbourne. Melbourne has a more European feel with the buildings and all, Sydney feels more American.

Personally I enjoyed both countries, however overall the best part of my journey, living and working, I would have to call it as the Oz east coast, there is just a great buzz, so many nationalities settle down to make new lives and the weather is great.

If you ever want to get away from Oz for a few weeks break, NZ is just a 2 hour flight away and Indo is to the north, flights are cheap.

Many kiwis leave NZ when they are younger for the UK or Oz to make money and then return later in life so that should tell you something if you are inclined towards career and money.

Given a work visa for Oz I would go back, NZ not so much but I would go back to travel.

pclancy

Its hard generalise about the weather too. Both countries have extremes of rain/temperature depending on their geography. Wellington for example gets less annual rainfall then Galway but more then Dublin. Wellington gets way more annual sunshine then Dublin but has higher average wind speed. Nelson blows everywhere else out of the water with 2500+ hours of sunshine. Dunedin and Queenstown are snowy right now but you could probably wear shorts in Northland.

I always found Ireland consistantly grey sky'ed for weeks on end, in Welly generally any bad weather is gone after 48 hours and the suns back out.

Crumble Froo

And what still cracks me up here is that if it lasts more than 48hours, people start getting really bummed out on the absolutely awful weather, when really it's just a bit of cloud n rain, I'd love to see them deal with the constant greys at home.

So continuing from my post above, and with the weather theme, saying Australia has better weather than NZ is pretty subjective... Personally I'm of the opinion that my Irish skin is very quite simply NOT meant to be exposed to that much sun and I am just not built to deal with heat. I found the heat in Aussie - Sydney more than Melbourne - to be just suffocating. Life with a car with no air conditioning is disgustingly sticky and shiny, people hang out in malls or go for drives PURELY cos it's just a place to go with air conditioning. Also, the bugs got me. Fair enough I'm an arachnophobe (I will cry if startled by one, regardless of who's around), but more than that, I never got bothered by midgies that much at home, but the ants in Australia went to town on me, as did everything else grapesize or less that licked to feast on human. Also, cockroaches can fly. You may have known this already, but I did not. That was traumatising.

In New Zealand though, spiders can jump. Really ****ing fast too. The only biters are white tails, but like most of the nasties, they stick to the north island by and large. I had major problems around the West Coast of the South Island, the combination of heat and damp with sandflies and god knows what else was horrific. Even with repellent I had to completely give up on camping over New Year's.

In general, I have found kiwis to be humble, practical, blunt, resourceful, easy-going people and I'll echo the working bees for anyone moving house, and the pot luck and koha aspects of the culture.

The best way I can describe Australians, is that I'll never forget the moment when I realised that Kath & Kim were based very very much on very very real people. It stopped being funny then, and I moved back to NZ not too long after, but there's a certain haughtiness or something that I've never quite understood.

What I really love about NZ is the community feel. Particularly being so far from friend and family networks (and I didnt know any Irish people when I moved here), there is a great community feel, and there's a lot of emphasis put on community facilities, activities and events.

Probably worth mentioning too, that I'm not really a city person. Even going up to Auckland around Christmas time, I distinctly remember swearing never to live in a city bigger than Christchurch again. If anything, I think I'll be setting up home in Dunedin at some point in my future. (smaller than Chch, for those not familiar).

I suppose it's worth mentioning risks too. New Zealand is essentially made of melting glaciers, faultlines and volcanoes. Think a tornado or something hit an Auckland mall earlier this year too. Not immune to bushfires either.

Aussie's got bushfires and floods, I know that much. If you'd told me before I moved to NZ that moving there carried the risk of being in a major natural disaster, I think I would have approached it more warily (or would I?).

Each city has such a distinctive personality though, and I'd imagine the same is true for Australia, I reckon the best way to figure it out is go spend time there, follow what ya love and you'll find your place.

telly_lover

Crumble Froo wrote: »

And what still cracks me up here is that if it lasts more than 48hours, people start getting really bummed out on the absolutely awful weather, when really it's just a bit of cloud n rain, I'd love to see them deal with the constant greys at home.

So continuing from my post above, and with the weather theme, saying Australia has better weather than NZ is pretty subjective... Personally I'm of the opinion that my Irish skin is very quite simply NOT meant to be exposed to that much sun and I am just not built to deal with heat. I found the heat in Aussie - Sydney more than Melbourne - to be just suffocating. Life with a car with no air conditioning is disgustingly sticky and shiny, people hang out in malls or go for drives PURELY cos it's just a place to go with air conditioning. Also, the bugs got me. Fair enough I'm an arachnophobe (I will cry if startled by one, regardless of who's around), but more than that, I never got bothered by midgies that much at home, but the ants in Australia went to town on me, as did everything else grapesize or less that licked to feast on human. Also, cockroaches can fly. You may have known this already, but I did not. That was traumatising.

In New Zealand though, spiders can jump. Really ****ing fast too. The only biters are white tails, but like most of the nasties, they stick to the north island by and large. I had major problems around the West Coast of the South Island, the combination of heat and damp with sandflies and god knows what else was horrific. Even with repellent I had to completely give up on camping over New Year's.

In general, I have found kiwis to be humble, practical, blunt, resourceful, easy-going people and I'll echo the working bees for anyone moving house, and the pot luck and koha aspects of the culture.

The best way I can describe Australians, is that I'll never forget the moment when I realised that Kath & Kim were based very very much on very very real people. It stopped being funny then, and I moved back to NZ not too long after, but there's a certain haughtiness or something that I've never quite understood.

What I really love about NZ is the community feel. Particularly being so far from friend and family networks (and I didnt know any Irish people when I moved here), there is a great community feel, and there's a lot of emphasis put on community facilities, activities and events.

Probably worth mentioning too, that I'm not really a city person. Even going up to Auckland around Christmas time, I distinctly remember swearing never to live in a city bigger than Christchurch again. If anything, I think I'll be setting up home in Dunedin at some point in my future. (smaller than Chch, for those not familiar).

I suppose it's worth mentioning risks too. New Zealand is essentially made of melting glaciers, faultlines and volcanoes. Think a tornado or something hit an Auckland mall earlier this year too. Not immune to bushfires either.

Aussie's got bushfires and floods, I know that much. If you'd told me before I moved to NZ that moving there carried the risk of being in a major natural disaster, I think I would have approached it more warily (or would I?).

Each city has such a distinctive personality though, and I'd imagine the same is true for Australia, I reckon the best way to figure it out is go spend time there, follow what ya love and you'll find your place.

the community feel in rural new zealand simply does not compare to that of ireland , i once heard new zealand described as the holland of the south pacific , i think thats a pretty accurate description

hard headed practical blunt people
tollerant but not especially warm or friendly
ireligous
financially thrifty
liberal attitudes to sex , complete with legalised prostitution

i recognise none of the above traits as being particulary irish , the alledged similaritys between kiwis and paddys truly baffles me , i often wonder does it stem from the fact that both countries have a high proportion of farmers and have a green landscape , perhaps the common perception spread from there

Crumble Froo

I can't say I've had much experience with rural Ireland, to be honest, outside of holiday visits back to the old family home in Donegal as a kid, I grew up just outside the Dublin border. In New Zealand, almost all my living experience is in Christchurch and Dunedin, and I've done a fairly extensive amount of hitch hiking, which would be my only real contact with most of the rural communities here.

Since the quakes too, it has to be said, there's been a massive resurgence in community here. People are organising themselves, helping themselves and each other and making themselves heard in a very different way to before the quakes, and I have to say, it's been really inspiring to see.

I think that Ireland and New Zealand are both relatively small island countries situated beside a much larger, powerful country - there's a certain sort of attitude associated with that, I think. There's a relatively similar sense of humour (but it did take a while to adjust my humour to be a little more kosher in NZ, stuff I'd've never thought about in Ireland).

CiaranC

telly_lover wrote: »

the community feel in rural new zealand simply does not compare to that of ireland

Im not sure what you were expecting, to have the same 'community feel' as a migrant as you do in rural Ireland where you and your family lived for generations? Ask someone from Dublin who moves to rural Ireland about the community feel they experience as an outsider initially.

hard headed practical blunt people
tollerant but not especially warm or friendly
ireligous
financially thrifty
liberal attitudes to sex , complete with legalised prostitution

As someone from working class Dublin it sounds like I have more in common with Kiwis than I do with rural Irish people tbh.

That said, I dont think Kiwis and Irish are that similar, Kiwis have a strong calvinist streak that reminds me very much of a certain type of Scot. They can be quite dry and reserved. Thats OK though, its a breath of fresh air really and one of the reasons I like them.

telly_lover

CiaranC wrote: »

Im not sure what you were expecting, to have the same 'community feel' as a migrant as you do in rural Ireland where you and your family lived for generations? Ask someone from Dublin who moves to rural Ireland about the community feel they experience as an outsider initially.


As someone from working class Dublin it sounds like I have more in common with Kiwis than I do with rural Irish people tbh.

That said, I dont think Kiwis and Irish are that similar, Kiwis have a strong calvinist streak that reminds me very much of a certain type of Scot. They can be quite dry and reserved. Thats OK though, its a breath of fresh air really and one of the reasons I like them.

You nailed it when you say kiwis have a strong Calvinist streak , you know where else has a strong Calvinist streak , holland and of course Scotland , I found Nz to be a very Protestant place , nothing wrong with that but it would fly in the face of it being very similar to Ireland like many people claim

earnyourturns

Totally agree with the above posts: have been in Dunedin just over two years now, and in no way find the Kiwis to be particularly warm or friendly...

telly_lover

earnyourturns wrote: »

Totally agree with the above posts: have been in Dunedin just over two years now, and in no way find the Kiwis to be particularly warm or friendly...

dunedin is particulary scottish and the type of scots who make up a sizeable percentage of the kiwi population are a dour bunch , their not that keen on paddys either , their is a tall poppy syndrome which is very evident in new zealand , scots are also a begrudging people who dont like to see others doing well , thats one of the reasons i perfered australia than new zealand , australians are more like americans in that they compete very hard but respect those who try hard and do well , kiwis only like when thier own ( locality , family ) do well , i also dont agree that australians are arrogant , they are brash but thats not the same as arrogant , australians are much more generous of spirit than kiwis

earnyourturns

Yeah, I really don't agree with the "oh Kiwis are so like the Irish" thing. Especially on the South Island, the key values seem to be stoicism, taciturnity and self-reliance. No one could exactly describe South Islanders as witty raconteurs, whereas Irish people are notoriously garrulous. Also, wow, how stingy are New Zealanders whereas the Irish attitude to money is very much "we're here for a good time, not a long time. Another round, anyone?'

(I know this is total generalisation of course, exceptions to every rule, I'm just venting my frustrations in the depths of a Dunedin winter)

Crumble Froo

Wow! My experiences of Dunedin are such that it's my favourite place in the country and I can't wait till I finish the next 5 years of school so I can move down there!

That said, I suppose the vast majority of people I interact with, is through the music scene, and there's a really sweet, tight scene there. I suppose any generalisations I make about Dunedin will be specifically in reference to the the music scene, which I suppose isn't exactly representative of mainstream society in Dunners.

earnyourturns

Wow, goes to show how differently people can think about the same places! For me, living in Dunedin is like living in a provincial Scottish town in the 1950s. I, conversely, can't wait to finish uni here so I can leave!

telly_lover

earnyourturns wrote: »

Yeah, I really don't agree with the "oh Kiwis are so like the Irish" thing. Especially on the South Island, the key values seem to be stoicism, taciturnity and self-reliance. No one could exactly describe South Islanders as witty raconteurs, whereas Irish people are notoriously garrulous. Also, wow, how stingy are New Zealanders whereas the Irish attitude to money is very much "we're here for a good time, not a long time. Another round, anyone?'

(I know this is total generalisation of course, exceptions to every rule, I'm just venting my frustrations in the depths of a Dunedin winter)

absolutley , no one could ever accuse kiwis of talking the hind legs off a donkey - having the gift of the gab , talking ****e is a key irish trait , since when does calvinism lend itself to lighthearted gregariousness , even on the rugby field , have you ever seen an all black smile after scoring , its not as if they dont have the practice

kiwis are known for being tightfisted with money and are scornfull of lavish displays of wealth , they simply dont do bling , they dont do late night drinking either , 6 pm is the busy period in the pubs in farming country ffs

irish similar to kiwis :rolleyes: , were more like italians or even nigerians if you ask me

telly_lover

Crumble Froo wrote: »

Wow! My experiences of Dunedin are such that it's my favourite place in the country and I can't wait till I finish the next 5 years of school so I can move down there!

That said, I suppose the vast majority of people I interact with, is through the music scene, and there's a really sweet, tight scene there. I suppose any generalisations I make about Dunedin will be specifically in reference to the the music scene, which I suppose isn't exactly representative of mainstream society in Dunners.

are you into guns n roses and the black album by metalica , when i was in new zealand in 1998 , the teenagers were all into hard rock from the eighties while thier counterparts back in ireland and europe were into dance and hip hop , i love hard rock but the point was , new zealand tends to catch up on trends years after everyone else , its a bit like eastern europe in this regard