How many can speak Irish in AH

Owen_S

Isn't it against the rules to speak Irish on AH?

Owen_S

Owen_S wrote: »

Isn't it against the rules to speak Irish on AH?

Only if you're doing it to exclude some posters, but it is suggested that a translation is added.

PS, not posting as a mod.

SocSocPol

a cupla focal, getting better as the official Irish gets more and more anglicised.

Iwasfrozen

Eathrin wrote: »

I have fluent Gaeilge, but I'm in 6th year, sure I'll never speak it again. I think that's disgraceful. The few that leave school with fluent Irish will inevitably lose it because it's just not a part of our society at all, there's no scope to use it.

Then why'd you bother becoming fluent in it?

Owen_S wrote: »

Isn't it against the rules to speak Irish on AH?

It is if you don't provide a translation.

Misty May

Tá gaeilge agam. Nuair a bhi mé ag obair i London thart ar 1989 bhuail mé le bean a bhí thart ar 70 bliain d'aois agus í tar éis a gcuid saol a chaitheamh ansin. Thosaigh sí ag labhairt gaeilge liom toisc go raibh mo ainm i ngaeilge. Ní raibh sé dearmadtha aici agus bhainemar an-taithneamh as an cómhrá.

timewilltell

Ceapaim go bhfuil mo Gaeilge maith go leor.

IS brea liom an Ghaeilge agus táim an bróduil as mo chuid Gaeilge. Usaidim Gaeilge gach lá agus táim i gconaí ag iarraidh é a fheabsu.

mikemac1

Sonas, Spraoi agus Sugradh

Used to be given those in primary school

Medusa22

I can understand most of the posts that are in Irish and I can read a bit of it but I'm really bad at constructing sentences, mostly because of the grammar. I was quite good at Irish in school but I've forgotten most of it and it has only been a few years since I left school.

Iwasfrozen

It's a useless language to know since all the speakers already speak english, there's no incentive to learn it that isn't rooted in silly nationalistic inventions.

later12

Sea táimse líofa sa Ghaeilge toisc gur chaitheas roinnt mhaith ama ag foghlaim i nuair a bhíos i mo bhuachaill og. Níl an teanga ro-usáideach domsa anois agus go bhfuil mé fasta ach is breá liom í a labhairt liom féin (níl Gaeilge sa chlann againn) no filíocht a léamh trí mheán na Gaeilge. Ta se cosúil le Laidin sa doigh nach bhfuil usáid soléir ann don Ghaeilge sa la atá inniu, ach is teanga breá is lán le miotas í ag an am chéanna.

Oranage2

Yes I'm fluent because I spent some time learning it as a young boy. The language isnt to useful now as I'm older but I love speaking it to myself(no body in the family speaks it) or poetry to rad in irish. It's kinda like latin the way its not used but still a lot of power at the same time.

Eathrin

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Then why'd you bother becoming fluent in it?

I still love the language. It's absolutely beautiful. I want to be fluent, I just don't want to live in a country which provides no scope to use it's official language.

Iwasfrozen

Eathrin wrote: »

I still love the language. It's absolutely beautiful. I want to be fluent, I just don't want to live in a country which provides no scope to use it's official language.

I don't see what's particularly beautiful about it. Like all languages it's only a means of communication. We're talking about languages here not women. There's no purpose to irish beyond nationalistic trivialities and if you don't want to live in a country that doesn't provide scope for one of it's official languages then I assume you don't want to live in Ireland.

later12

later12 wrote: »

Sea táimse líofa sa Ghaeilge toisc gur chaitheas roinnt mhaith ama ag foghlaim i nuair a bhíos i mo bhuachaill og. Níl an teanga ro-usáideach domsa anois agus go bhfuil mé fasta ach is breá liom í a labhairt liom féin (níl Gaeilge sa chlann againn) no filíocht a léamh trí mheán na Gaeilge. Ta se cosúil le Laidin sa doigh nach bhfuil usáid soléir ann don Ghaeilge sa la atá inniu, ach is teanga breá is lán le miotas í ag an am chéanna.

Oranage2 wrote: »

Yes I'm fluent because I spent some time learning it as a young boy. The language isnt to useful now as I'm older but I love speaking it to myself(no body in the family speaks it) or poetry to rad in irish. It's kinda like latin the way its not used but still a lot of power at the same time.

I'd like to be fluent, but still have a long way to go, as for using it on a day to day basis, I see little hope of that as there are few fluent speakers around here.

The best I can do at the moment is "coupla focal" with the children.

EddyC15

Is féidir liom é a labhairt ach tá mo gramadach go huafásach!

dlofnep

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

I don't see what's particularly beautiful about it.

Well, the other post finds it beautiful. What's it to you? Are you offended at the idea that someone might actually like the language? Get over yourself and stop using every chance you have to tell us how much you don't like the language. It's played out.

Eathrin

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

I don't see what's particularly beautiful about it. Like all languages it's only a means of communication. We're talking about languages here not women. There's no purpose to irish beyond nationalistic trivialities and if you don't want to live in a country that doesn't provide scope for one of it's official languages then I assume you don't want to live in Ireland.

There's beauty in a lot of things you know, languages happens to be one of them, women happens to be another. In fact, an Irish speaking woman is particularly beautiful:)

No purpose? We may as well do away with the thousands of languages in existence worldwide and standardise communication in that case.

I want to live in Ireland, I love my country, but of course it could be far far better. My point is I want to live in an Ireland where we support our heritage and culture AND maintain an ambitious and modern approach to national and international affairs.

Pedant

Labhraímse an teanga sin úd. D'fhreastal mé ar scoileanna lán Gaeilge ar faigh ceithre bliain déag. Ach, ní dóigh liom go bhfuil aon maitheas ann sa lá atá inniu ann, níl aon úsáid ann. Bíodh sé i bhfad níos fear dá mba rúd é gur fhoghlaim mé teanga níos coitianta ón mór-roinn (cosúil le Fraincis nó Gearmáinis) go dtí an caighdeán gur fhoghlaim mé Gaeilge.

Ms.M

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

I don't see what's particularly beautiful about it. Like all languages it's only a means of communication. We're talking about languages here not women. There's no purpose to irish beyond nationalistic trivialities and if you don't want to live in a country that doesn't provide scope for one of it's official languages then I assume you don't want to live in Ireland.

Saying "I haven't a clue why people bother learning Irish" would be better than supposing it's all down to silly nationalistic notions. Having no interest or understanding of something hardly qualifies you to reduce it to "nationalistic trivialities". To some people languages are purely a means of day-to-day communication. But a lot of people, (and they needn't be Irish speakers or know anything about Irish) understand languages to be above and beyond that.
My interest in languages extends far beyond Irish and far beyond communication. You mightn't get that but to each their own. Linking a language to "nationalistic trivialities" is crazy. I don't care how many RA heads speak Irish, it's my language too.

Ms.M

Pedant wrote: »

Labhraímse an teanga sin úd. D'fhreastal mé ar scoileanna lán Gaeilge ar faigh ceithre bliain déag. Ach, ní dóigh liom go bhfuil aon maitheas ann sa lá atá inniu ann, níl aon úsáid ann. Bíodh sé i bhfad níos fear dá mba rúd é gur fhoghlaim mé teanga níos coitianta ón mór-roinn (cosúil le Fraincis nó Gearmáinis) go dtí an caighdeán gur fhoghlaim mé Gaeilge.

Tuigim do chás ach níl an locht ar an nGaeilge nár fhoghlaim tú níos mó teangacha ar scoil. Cabhraíonn an teanga liom agus mé ag iarraidh teanga ar bith a fhoghlaim caithfidh mé a rá.
Tá Fraincis agus Gearmáinis éasca go leor is dócha gan Gaeilge a bheith ar eolas agat ach lasmuigh den mhór-Roinn, tá teangacha le struchtúir atá an-difriúl le Béarla... Is í mo thaithí ag foghlaim Gaeilge a thug cabhair dom.
Déarfainn go mbeifeá ábalta teanga ar bith a fhoghlaim i bhfad níos sciobtha ná duine le Béarla amháin.
Tá an t-ádh ort gur fhreastail tú ar Ghaelscoil. D'fhreastail mé ar phobalscoil agus bhí triúr againn á déanamh mar ábhar Ardleibhéal.

Ms.M

Tee hee hee, I typed that into google translate for funsies:

I understand your situation but this is not fault of the language you learn more languages ​​in school. The language helps me and I want to learn any language I have to say. French and German is easy enough without the Irish probably know just outside the great continent, there are languages ​​with structures very differently to English ... In my experience of learning Irish who helped me. I would be able to learn any language much more quickly than someone with only English. Are you lucky that you attended school. I attended the Community and the three of us were being done as a matter of level.

Haha. Last sentence is particularly dodgy Only three people did honours level in my year at school and I envied the poster was all..... :P

Iwasfrozen

Eathrin wrote: »

There's beauty in a lot of things you know, languages happens to be one of them, women happens to be another. In fact, an Irish speaking woman is particularly beautiful

No purpose? We may as well do away with the thousands of languages in existence worldwide and standardise communication in that case.

I want to live in Ireland, I love my country, but of course it could be far far better. My point is I want to live in an Ireland where we support our heritage and culture AND maintain an ambitious and modern approach to national and international affairs.

It would be brilliant if we could standardise communication. Imagine all humans being able to effectively communicate without barriers. Unfortunately that won't happen.

What I was saying is that outside nationalism there is no purpose to the irish language. No real reason for it's existence. I'm not interested in helping to maintain a language that has for all intents and purposes been reduced to a sort of code for it's followers.

Mrs.M wrote:

Saying "I haven't a clue why people bother learning Irish" would be better than supposing it's all down to silly nationalistic notions. Having no interest or understanding of something hardly qualifies you to reduce it to "nationalistic trivialities". To some people languages are purely a means of day-to-day communication. But a lot of people, (and they needn't be Irish speakers or know anything about Irish) understand languages to be above and beyond that.
My interest in languages extends far beyond Irish and far beyond communication. You mightn't get that but to each their own. Linking a language to "nationalistic trivialities" is crazy. I don't care how many RA heads speak Irish, it's my language too.

There is no reason to learn irish over another language other then silly nationalistic notions, there is no other explaination for it. If you like languages there are many many more useful languages for you to learn. I can see no reason, other then nationalism, for why someone would want to learn irish. There are no practical benifites to that language over other ones. If you have practical reasons for learning Irish over another one please do share, I'd be interested in hearing it.

Naomi00

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

It would be brilliant if we could standardise communication. Imagine all humans being able to effectively communicate without barriers. Unfortunately that won't happen.

What I was saying is that outside nationalism there is no purpose to the irish language. No real reason for it's existence. I'm not interested in helping to maintain a language that has for all intents and purposes been reduced to a sort of code for it's followers.



There is no reason to learn irish over another language other then silly nationalistic notions, there is no other explaination for it. If you like languages there are many many more useful languages for you to learn. I can see no reason, other then nationalism, for why someone would want to learn irish. There are no practical benifites to that language over other ones. If you have practical reasons for learning Irish over another one please do share, I'd be interested in hearing it.

How many languages do you speak? I'm guessing one?

Enkidu

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

I don't see what's particularly beautiful about it. Like all languages it's only a means of communication. We're talking about languages here not women.

I agree Unit 201, the humans have strange customs, we must report back to primary command with this information.

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

There's no purpose to irish beyond nationalistic trivialities and if you don't want to live in a country that doesn't provide scope for one of it's official languages then I assume you don't want to live in Ireland.

Yeah, it's true, I remember a study in Nature showing that people who do things differently to Iwasfrozen are all weird and are always some kind of walking nationalist stereotype.

Paz-CCFC

dlofnep wrote: »

Ah raight Fadhb ar bith mar sin! Tá an ceart agat tho! An chéad uair a bhí mise i mBéal Feirste, ní raibh cliú ar bith cad a bhí ag tarlú!

Bhíos ag labhairt le duine ón Tuaisceart, agus dúirt sé nár thuig sé canún na Mumhan ag an tosach, ach an oiread - cheap sé gur droch-Ghaeilge focail mar "bhíos" agus "chuas"!

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

It would be brilliant if we could standardise communication. Imagine all humans being able to effectively communicate without barriers. Unfortunately that won't happen.

As Mandarin Chinese has by far the highest amount of native speakers, we'll use that as the standardised language, so. Spanish comes second, so it might be useful to use it as a back up language, so long as it doesn't interfere with Mandarin, of course.

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

There is no reason to learn irish over another language other then silly nationalistic notions, there is no other explaination for it. If you like languages there are many many more useful languages for you to learn. I can see no reason, other then nationalism, for why someone would want to learn irish. There are no practical benifites to that language over other ones. If you have practical reasons for learning Irish over another one please do share, I'd be interested in hearing it.

I'm learning Scots Gaelic at the moment. I plan on learning Manx and Welsh some time in the future, if I can, as well as regaining my French and maybe learning Breton. 4 out of 5 of those languages would be as "useless" as Irish and I have no link with the countries to which their native. So, where could your ridiculous notion of only learning minority languages for nationalistic reasons fit in here?

Iwasfrozen

Paz-CCFC wrote: »

I'm learning Scots Gaelic at the moment. I plan on learning Manx and Welsh some time in the future, if I can, as well as regaining my French and maybe learning Breton. 4 out of 5 of those languages would be as "useless" as Irish and I have no link with the countries to which their native. So, where could your ridiculous notion of only learning minority languages for nationalistic reasons fit in here?

I said there where no practical reasons for learning it other then nationalism, which there isn't. I assume you're learning these languages for academic reasons?

later12

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

I said there where no practical reasons for learning it other then nationalism, which there isn't.

Wtf?

There's the poetry... literature... mythology... and the fact that it's quite a poetic language in its structure. are you for real?

Paz-CCFC

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

I said there where no practical reasons for learning it other then nationalism, which there isn't. I assume you're learning these languages for academic reasons?

Not at all. I'm learning/will be learning them in my spare time, because I'm fond of them.

Iwasfrozen

later12 wrote: »

Wtf?

There's the poetry... literature... mythology... and the fact that it's quite a poetic language in its structure. are you for real?

... I mention practical reasons and you mention poetry. Are you for real?

Paz-CCFC wrote:

Not at all. I'm learning/will be learning them in my spare time, because I'm fond of them.

You learn five languages in your spare time because you're fond of them? Fair play everyone should have a hobby. Still isn't a practical reason though.

Iwasfrozen

Paz-CCFC wrote: »

As Mandarin Chinese has by far the highest amount of native speakers, we'll use that as the standardised language, so. Spanish comes second, so it might be useful to use it as a back up language, so long as it doesn't interfere with Mandarin, of course.

Unfortunately a standardised language would never work. Look at esperento.

Paz-CCFC

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

You learn five languages in your spare time because you're fond of them? Fair play everyone should have a hobby. Still isn't a practical reason though.

But it's also not based on your nonsense of nationalism, which wouldn't be practical, if you consider poetry not to be practical.

Iwasfrozen

Paz-CCFC wrote: »

But it's also not based on your nonsense of nationalism, which wouldn't be practical, if you consider poetry not to be practical.

There are no practical reasons for learning irish, other then nationalism. Which I rightfully called silly nationalism. You know thinking about your standardised language idea we all could just learn newspeak. Doubleplusgood think yes?

Gumbi

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Paz-CCFC wrote: »

But it's also not based on your nonsense of nationalism, which wouldn't be practical, if you consider poetry not to be practical.

There are no practical reasons for learning irish, other then nationalism. Which I rightfully called silly nationalism. You know thinking about your standardised language idea we all could just learn newspeak. Doubleplusgood think yes?

Have you not been reading this thread? There ARE practical reasons.

As for your assertion of it ony being worth learning for nationalistic reasons, what about this makes it worthless?

dlofnep

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

There are no practical reasons for learning irish, other then nationalism.

I learned Irish because I wanted to be able to communicate in Irish. I have met more friends through the language, and have gone on countless trips away to the Gaeltacht and have had the time of my life. I've a couch in almost every county in Ireland anytime I want through the language.

Not everyone sees the world as a robot like you do. There's no practical reason to eat nice food over food that is more nutritionally optimal, but we do it - because we enjoy it. In the same respect - people learn some languages because the journey of learning the language is a challenge, it is fun - and the end of it - they get to be part of a community of people. The majority of the world's population is bilingual, and the majority of these people speak minority languages - many of which have less speakers than the Irish language does.

This is something you'll never understand, because your ego is in the way. Your anti-Irish sentiment is pathetic, and childish. You just come across as "that guy" who wants to stand out from the crowd. No more, no less. People like Irish - get over it.

dlofnep

Moreover - we had a French girl at our Irish conversational group this week. I'm trying to figure out how nationalism inspired her...

mcmoustache

I'm from Carraroe in Galway so I'm fluent.

I live in Dublin now though but I still speak Irish regularly by making it a big part of my social life. I have friends from home here, I do amateur acting with an Irish language acting group, I play football with Na Gaeil Óga (Dublin's only 100% Irish-speaking football club) and I regularly drink in Club Chonradh na Gaeilge which is an Irish-speaking pub/club.


It's the language that I was raised with and it's a huge part of my identity. I see myself as distinct from people outside the Gaeltacht but language and culture tends to do that.

mcmoustache

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

What I was saying is that outside nationalism there is no purpose to the irish language. No real reason for it's existence.

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

It's a useless language to know since all the speakers already speak english, there's no incentive to learn it that isn't rooted in silly nationalistic inventions.

There's more to languages than just translations of English. Aside form the fluffy stuff like poetry and other guff, they're full of historical, sociological, psychological and interpretive information. While there may be nationalistic reasons behind some people's motivations to learn the language, it's not the only reason for its existence. I think you should look around you a little, travel a bit and get yourself a clue. You're lacking one at the moment.

Iwasfrozen

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

What I was saying is that outside nationalism there is no purpose to the irish language. No real reason for it's existence. I'm not interested in helping to maintain a language that has for all intents and purposes been reduced to a sort of code for it's followers.

I'd substitute "nationalism" with "sentimentality". But that doesn't necessarily mean that there's no reason for its existence.

I kind of agree about the Irish language being a code for its followers. But then all languages are codes, in their own way.

I've a moderately good grasp of Irish. In my day, I was fluent, but I got out of practice, mainly because the people I knew in my 20s who spoke Irish weren't as much fun as the people who didn't. It probably didn't help that the language came with a lot of political and cultural baggage in those days. I'm not all that sure things have changed much.

If I were to embark on learning languages now, I have to admit that Irish would be a long long way down the list.

But nonetheless I think it would be a pity if the Irish language disappeared. When a language goes silent then we lose a part of the human story, and that's always to be regretted. One fortunate side effect of our colonial history was that we ended up with English as a native language. But it's no bad thing to have a second language at our disposal, I s'pose.

dlofnep

mcmoustache wrote: »

I'm from Carraroe in Galway so I'm fluent.

I live in Dublin now though but I still speak Irish regularly by making it a big part of my social life. I have friends from home here, I do amateur acting with an Irish language acting group, I play football with Na Gaeil Óga (Dublin's only 100% Irish-speaking football club) and I regularly drink in Club Chonradh na Gaeilge which is an Irish-speaking pub/club.


It's the language that I was raised with and it's a huge part of my identity. I see myself as distinct from people outside the Gaeltacht but language and culture tends to do that.

Is domhain beag é!

Say hello to Tiarnán and Brendán for me. Club Chonradh is a great spot.

mcmoustache

dlofnep wrote: »

Is domhain beag é!

Gan dabht. Go h-áirid i saol na Gaeilge.

dlofnep wrote: »

Say hello to Tiarnán and Brendán for me. Club Chonradh is a great spot.

I'll see them on Wednesday for rehearsal with Na Taoisigh. If not, we'll be hurling and footballing on Thursday. I'll tell them anti-penfold or frith-phenfold said hello. I'm sure it'll make perfect sense. Fyi, Brendán has posted here before as brendanose.

dlofnep

Just tell Tiarnán Seán from Waterford said hello. He'll know He was once the cornerstone of our ciorcal comhrá til he went back to the big schmoke!

mcmoustache

dlofnep wrote: »

Just tell Tiarnán Seán from Waterford said hello. He'll know He was once the cornerstone of our ciorcal comhrá til he went back to the big schmoke!

Will do.
Take care.

Enkidu

mcmoustache wrote: »

It's the language that I was raised with and it's a huge part of my identity. I see myself as distinct from people outside the Gaeltacht but language and culture tends to do that.

That's very interesting mcmoustache. My grandmother was from the Gaeltacht and my grandfather was not, however she often said that there was no real difference between the Gaeltacht and most of the rest of rural Ireland, i.e. she didn't really see herself as distinct. So I was just wondering what you consider to be distinct? (Apologies if this is an annoying question.)

mcmoustache

Enkidu wrote: »

That's very interesting mcmoustache. My grandmother was from the Gaeltacht and my grandfather was not, however she often said that there was no real difference between the Gaeltacht and most of the rest of rural Ireland, i.e. she didn't really see herself as distinct. So I was just wondering what you consider to be distinct? (Apologies if this is an annoying question.)

Not annoying at all. It really just boils down to the fact that I'm from a region with a particular language and culture. Most of the rest of the country uses a different language. While that would make it seem like the only real difference is language, language counts for a lot. Language is how we make sense of the world and put in into context.

On a more personal level, it's probably a bit of a tribal thing. I communicate differently with people from home than I do with people from the rest of the country. The people that I see as "my" people speak a certain language and partake in different cultural rituals and this, to me, creates an "us and them" situation. In some ways, it's not too different from the other things that people use to distinguish themselves from others such as profession, political philosophy, religion or even football club affiliation.

Also, on a personal level, when I'm communicating with people in different languages, it's a bit like using distinct partitions in my head. The pool where I pull my thoughts and ideas from is different for each language. When I speak in Irish to someone from home, there's a sense of familiarity and kinship that I think comes from Irish having been the dominant language of my childhood.

I'm probably not getting this idea across very well but I think the distinction that I feel is a bit like the way Scottish people feel different from the English. They're not that different but there's enough clear differences for members in each group to know that they are not the other. This gets back to the tribal thing as well so maybe that's the simple answer.

Leftist

I can speak six languages and none of them are irish yet I was taught irish from age 4 to 18.

Couldn't have been less arsed even as a chisler.

Sometimes even kids can see a waste of time infront of them.

Ficheall

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

What I was saying is that outside nationalism there is no purpose to the irish language. No real reason for it's existence. I'm not interested in helping to maintain a language ...

Have you a purpose?

Mr Benevolent

Ficheall wrote: »

Have you a purpose?

Does anybody? The planet will still sail on untroubled if none of us existed.

Iwasfrozen

dlofnep wrote: »

I learned Irish because I wanted to be able to communicate in Irish. I have met more friends through the language, and have gone on countless trips away to the Gaeltacht and have had the time of my life. I've a couch in almost every county in Ireland anytime I want through the language.

Not everyone sees the world as a robot like you do. There's no practical reason to eat nice food over food that is more nutritionally optimal, but we do it - because we enjoy it. In the same respect - people learn some languages because the journey of learning the language is a challenge, it is fun - and the end of it - they get to be part of a community of people. The majority of the world's population is bilingual, and the majority of these people speak minority languages - many of which have less speakers than the Irish language does.

This is something you'll never understand, because your ego is in the way. Your anti-Irish sentiment is pathetic, and childish. You just come across as "that guy" who wants to stand out from the crowd. No more, no less. People like Irish - get over it.

Thank you for that interesting psychoanalysis of my ego there Dlofnep, lordie knows how I've managed to struggle on all these years as a robot! Any way getting back to the point I understand some people like the irish language but that doesn't make it useful. The purpose of a language is it's use as a means of communication. Since there are no irish speakers who do not speak english left in existence that must mean irish is a redundant language. You might like learning it, either as a hobby, or a code to speak about people without them knowing while simultaneously enjoying a greater sense of "irishness" then them, or even as a way of feeling intellectually or academically sepierior to the bulk of irish people who only speak one language.

Ficheall

Confab wrote: »

Does anybody? The planet will still sail on untroubled if none of us existed.

That is exactly my point.

Iwasfrozen

Deleted User wrote: »

But nonetheless I think it would be a pity if the Irish language disappeared. When a language goes silent then we lose a part of the human story, and that's always to be regretted. One fortunate side effect of our colonial history was that we ended up with English as a native language. But it's no bad thing to have a second language at our disposal, I s'pose.

I agree that a language dying off is a shame. But that's what it is, a shame. The world goes on without irish.