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New Local Area Plan - Proposal for Charlesland to become part of Kilcoole?

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    #32
    mirekb
    Registered Users Posts: 193 ✭✭mirekb


    Would it mean that the running track etc would be in Kilcoole too? Can't see the people of Greystones wanting to lose that amenity:D

    I said it before but Kilcoole cannot support Charlesland as far as the increase in school places go and this is a major consideration in any of these decisions.

    Do our town council have charge of Kilcoole too?


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    #33
    Annasopra
    Registered Users Posts: 41,065 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    mirekb wrote: »

    Do our town council have charge of Kilcoole too?
    No - in fact because it's an old town commission they are barely even in charge if Greystones.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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    #34
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    I could be wrong here but IMO.....
    Charlesland area was never "in Kilcoole," it was a farm just outside Greystones town, in the townland of Ballynerrin.
    The 4 big towns in Wicklow have their own town councils; Greystones, Bray, Arklow and Wicklow Town.
    Every other town and village is administered by Wicklow County Council, including Kilcoole. Now with Charlesland due to be handed over to a council, it makes sense to include it with Greystones, as it is obviously joined onto the town.
    But maybe the gombeen men didn't get round to the paperwork, and left Charlesland under WCC.
    But for the purposes of strategic plans for roads etc. it still makes sense to include all together in an "area plan", Greystones/Charlesland and Kilcoole, which is what they propose to do.


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    #35
    Annasopra
    Registered Users Posts: 41,065 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    recedite wrote: »
    I could be wrong here but IMO.....
    Charlesland area was never "in Kilcoole," it was a farm just outside Greystones town, in the townland of Ballynerrin.
    The 4 big towns in Wicklow have their own town councils; Greystones, Bray, Arklow and Wicklow Town.
    Every other town and village is administered by Wicklow County Council, including Kilcoole. Now with Charlesland due to be handed over to a council, it makes sense to include it with Greystones, as it is obviously joined onto the town.
    But maybe the gombeen men didn't get round to the paperwork, and left Charlesland under WCC.
    But for the purposes of strategic plans for roads etc. it still makes sense to include all together in an "area plan", Greystones/Charlesland and Kilcoole, which is what they propose to do.

    No

    This isn't really about what council charlesland comes under at all. When you say Charlesland is due to be handed over to a council, it's not really. The Charlesland road is due to be taken in charge by Wicklow County Council.

    This is about the local area development plans of Kilcoole and Greystones being merged into one plan.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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    #36
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    Two issues, the administrative area and the development plan; separate yet connected.


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    #37
    Annasopra
    Registered Users Posts: 41,065 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    recedite wrote: »
    Two issues, the administrative area and the development plan; separate yet connected.

    They're separate issues really - Greystones Town Council doesn't have the same status as a council as that of Bray/Wicklow/Arklow Town councils so Charlesland can vote in Greystones Town Council elections but the road will eventually be taken in charge by Wicklow County Council. That's not part of the development plans.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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    #38
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    mango salsa wrote: »
    so Charlesland can vote in Greystones Town Council elections but the road will eventually be taken in charge by Wicklow County Council. That's not part of the development plans.
    Does that not strike you as a bit barmy?
    I'm not disagreeing with you on any point of fact. I'm just saying that they were lazy in not bothering to bring Charlesland into the town's administrative area, and as a result they have this messy situation.


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    #39
    Annasopra
    Registered Users Posts: 41,065 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    recedite wrote: »
    Does that not strike you as a bit barmy?
    I'm not disagreeing with you on any point of fact. I'm just saying that they were lazy in not bothering to bring Charlesland into the town's administrative area, and as a result they have this messy situation.

    It IS in the Towns administrative area - The status of Greystones Town Council is lesser than that of Bray/Arklow/Wicklow town councils so most services in Greystones are provided through Wicklow County Council.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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    #40
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    mango salsa wrote: »
    It IS in the Towns administrative area - The status of Greystones Town Council is lesser than that of Bray.....
    Well it appears that Charlesland is outside the town council area currently, but as I said I'm no expert on the internal bureaucracy of the matter.

    But the reason its important is that sometime in the future all local councils will probably be given much more power to deliver services as well as revenue raising powers, as they do in other countries, eg the London boroughs. Most politicians and economists accept that. The property tax is supposed to be the first step.

    If you look at a map of Greystones 20 years ago, it was indeed a puny town, about 1/3 the size of Bray. Look at a current map now that Greystones/Delgany, Charlesland and Eden Gate have formed a single built-up conurbation. It's approx the same size as Bray. In a few years it will be bigger. There will be considerable power vested in the town councillors then, and maybe there will be a mayor too.


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    #41
    Annasopra
    Registered Users Posts: 41,065 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    recedite wrote: »
    Well it appears that Charlesland is outside the town council area currently, but as I said I'm no expert on the internal bureaucracy of the matter.

    I'm almost certain Greystones Town Council does include Charlesland.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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    #42
    pixbyjohn
    Registered Users Posts: 6,250 ✭✭✭pixbyjohn


    recedite wrote: »
    There will be considerable power vested in the town councillors then, and maybe there will be a mayor too.

    The Town council has a Mayor presently, Tom Fortune from Kilcoole and he is not the first Mayor we have had .


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    #43
    Annasopra
    Registered Users Posts: 41,065 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    pixbyjohn wrote: »
    The Town council has a Mayor presently, Tom Fortune from Kilcoole and he is not the first Mayor we have had .

    Only for another two weeks - I think Cllr Kathleen Kelleher will be the next nominee.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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    #44
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    Sorry I forgot about him. I meant an elected mayor, with powers.
    Something similar to the sort that has been proposed for Dublin.


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    #45
    The Real B-man
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 3,734 Mod ✭✭✭✭The Real B-man


    Does it really matter you still have all the amenities around you i would consider as far a Bray my local area as i have grown up in the Kilcoole, Greystones & Bray area.


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