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Advice for me for when I finish my degree
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07-06-2012 11:58pm#1Hi, I'm sorry if most of this has been covered on here. I'm looking to get into film production.
I'm going into my final year in a non-film related course that I do enjoy, but don't love. I wanted to do the BA in film production in IADT three years ago but talked myself out of it. And now I wouldn't be able to afford doing another BA.
I've done a mediay FETAC course and got some experience in film production through that and through a film soc, but not much.
I've read a good few books on film and took a documentary studies and film studies module through the course I'm in now.
Can anyone give me advice on these options I was thinking of:
1) Do a MA in film production
2) Do a one/two year course from a list here
http://filmireland.net/2011/01/11/get-into-film-listings-of-film-courses/
3) Do some filmbase courses, meet some people, hopefully get some work helping out on films0
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If you want to make films, make films. No-one needs to do a course, not anymore. Might be handy for meeting people but you won't get a big job in the Irish film Industry with an MA or Diploma.0
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While I'd agree with you that a course isn't necessary and that you can learn everything you need to know off your own bat, there are numerous advantages to doing it through a recognised education system.If you want to make films, make films. No-one needs to do a course, not anymore. Might be handy for meeting people but you won't get a big job in the Irish film Industry with an MA or Diploma.
The main thing amateurs (like myself) lack is the knowledge of the organisation structures processionals use so their work is compatible with every one else's work. Learning best practice, procedures and techniques in a class setting from someone that really knows what their talking about will knock months/years off your learning cycle. If you can learn through collage you probably should, lone film makers aren't the norm and are rarely successful.0 -
film makers in general are rarely successful :P0
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Depends on what success is. Lots of Irish film school directors have done well but it's usually short lived and they quietly move into television where they get well-paid work making dross. In this age there really is no excuse for needing to get a film qualification unless you want to teach. Lots of Irish film courses are just expensive scams taught by failed filmmakers. It's been going on for years and the lack of success of Irish film is because of this. If you want to learn the 'knowledge of the organisation structures professionals use' then join the union. But this is more for the international productions coming here.0
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Depends on what success is. Lots of Irish film school directors have done well but it's usually short lived and they quietly move into television where they get well-paid work making dross.
That's a massive generalisation. In reality if anyone wants to make a living in Film/TV these days unless they're very very successful they have to work in both Film & TV.Lots of Irish film courses are just expensive scams taught by failed filmmakers. It's been going on for years and the lack of success of Irish film is because of this.
How do you equate somebody running a subpar film course with the lack of success of Irish film?If you want to learn the 'knowledge of the organisation structures professionals use' then join the union. But this is more for the international productions coming here.
Why is it only for international productions coming? Why should the Irish industry not use proper professional organisation structures and techniques for its own productions? I'd put it to you that the 'oh that sort of professional practice is only for the big internationals' attitude would be much more harmful to the Irish film industry than someone running a course that you deem to be a scam.0 -
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Because they haven't made anything up to much and most Irish film lecturers are complete nobodies.How do you equate somebody running a subpar film course with the lack of success of Irish film?
No they don't. The best directors work in cinema. The rest are just hacks earning good money in television.That's a massive generalisation. In reality if anyone wants to make a living in Film/TV these days unless they're very very successful they have to work in both Film & TV.
Because we're too small a country to regularly make these large productions internally. Most Irish movies require smaller crews with people doing more than one role. There's nothing sadder then seeing Irish movies made on small budgets imitating the larger production models. A lot of these titles are dreadful and our film schools are to blame.Why is it only for international productions coming? Why should the Irish industry not use proper professional organisation structures and techniques for its own productions? I'd put it to you that the 'oh that sort of professional practice is only for the big internationals' attitude would be much more harmful to the Irish film industry than someone running a course that you deem to be a scam.0 -
Because they haven't made anything up to much and most Irish film lecturers are complete nobodies.
That's why the courses aren't good in your opinion. It's still not a reason why the Irish film industry as a whole. Did you mean the lecturer's lack of success?No they don't. The best directors work in cinema. The rest are just hacks earning good money in television.
Complete rubbish. Loads of quality directors work in television too. Scorsese and Tarantino have both directed television for example.
If you want to work as a director in Ireland you will end up directing either ads or television to keep going. And your assertion that everyone who works in television is a hack is just blind ignorance really. David Caffrey director of Love/Hate is a mile from being a hack.
Name an Irish director that works solely in film. There's not too many out there I'd wager.Because we're too small a country to regularly make these large productions internally. Most Irish movies require smaller crews with people doing more than one role. There's nothing sadder then seeing Irish movies made on small budgets imitating the larger production models. A lot of these titles are dreadful and our film schools are to blame.
Just because someone doubles up on a role doesn't mean that they should be striving for professionalism. The 'ah sure I'll be the AD, the producer and I'll do the wardrobe' attitude is not a professional attitude and I would be wary of working with anyone who thinks that that's a good way to work.0 -
Yes, but they're mainly based in cinema. Most Irish directors work in television or shorts while a few have made one or two features. This is different to what the best directors do: making dozens of feature films.Complete rubbish. Loads of quality directors work in television too. Scorsese and Tarantino have both directed television for example.
I mean they're either academics with no practical experience or have tried to make films and failed. Why would someone interested in making films want to learn from these people?That's why the courses aren't good in your opinion. It's still not a reason why the Irish film industry as a whole. Did you mean the lecturer's lack of success?
That's my point! There are very few Irish directors working mainly in film SO WHAT'S THE SENSE IN GOING TO FILM SCHOOL? People who switch from ads/Fair City/shorts are not cut out to make good feature films anyway. The best directors work in feature films most of the time.If you want to work as a director in Ireland you will end up directing either ads or television to keep going. And your assertion that everyone who works in television is a hack is just blind ignorance really. David Caffrey director of Love/Hate is a mile from being a hack.
Name an Irish director that works solely in film. There's not too many out there I'd wager.
That's different to having a large crew with everyone doing different roles on a low-budget Irish movie. The best Irish films are made with smaller crews. The rest are just used to give lots of people jobs.Just because someone doubles up on a role doesn't mean that they should be striving for professionalism. The 'ah sure I'll be the AD, the producer and I'll do the wardrobe' attitude is not a professional attitude and I would be wary of working with anyone who thinks that that's a good way to work.0 -
Yes, but they're mainly based in cinema. Most Irish directors work in television or shorts while a few have made one or two features. This is different to what the best directors do: making dozens of feature films.
Because there's so little money in Ireland for features is the main reason that Irish directors don't get to make dozens of films in this country.I mean they're either academics with no practical experience or have tried to make films and failed. Why would someone interested in making films want to learn from these people?
I understand what you mean but I still don't think you can blame the lack of success of Irish film just on this one thing.That's my point! There are very few Irish directors working mainly in film SO WHAT'S THE SENSE IN GOING TO FILM SCHOOL?
To learn. You get to shoot, edit and work with equipment in film school that you might not have the chance to just doing it yourself. You get to learn the craft of editing, you get to study screenwriting. Film school isn't just for directors.People who switch from ads/Fair City/shorts are not cut out to make good feature films anyway.
Says you. Again I think you're generalising. I know lots of directors that direct ads and fine feature films (not so much Fair City!).The best directors work in feature films most of the time.[
If they can. But as I said there's so few feature film opportunities in Ireland it's tough to work mainly with features.
I agree with some of what you're saying but I don't buy the whole 'film schools are the reason Irish cinema isn't successful' line. There's lots of great directors out there who have been to film schools in Ireland.0 -
I've just finished the BA in Media Studies in NUI Maynooth, and to be honest what I've learned here is mostly because of what I have done outside of the course. You didn't miss much, a lot of it is concerned with film theory and audience theory, which is somewhat useful, but not as useful as actually making a film. What I would suggest is looking in to one-year practical courses in places like Ballyfermot. A showreel is what's most important and these practical courses can get you started on that.
Other than that, you have to do unpaid internships. I've done one in radio, one in tv and I'm about to start one in print. I'm doing editing freelance on the side to make some money, but it sucks for ages. Best of luck with it!
One more thing: Buy the Adobe creative suite! It's €350 for students and includes Photoshop, Premiere Pro, After Effects, Flash, Illustrator and a few other great programs. You'll pay thousands for this bundle once you're not a student!0 -
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I've just finished the BA in Media Studies in NUI Maynooth, and to be honest what I've learned here is mostly because of what I have done outside of the course.
That's not a film course though. Somewhere like IADT is a practical course where people make quite a few films during it.0 -
This illustrates the problem with filmmaking in Ireland. There are dozens of successful international movies made over the last decade on very low budgets. But thanks to the films schools here no-one can do anything unless they get lots of money first!Because there's so little money in Ireland for features is the main reason that Irish directors don't get to make dozens of films in this country.
I'm not but it's one of the reasons.I understand what you mean but I still don't think you can blame the lack of success of Irish film just on this one thing.
They don't use FILM anymore in the film schools or very little. They use digital video. You don't need to go to college to get to use this stuff.To learn. You get to shoot, edit and work with equipment in film school that you might not have the chance to just doing it yourself. You get to learn the craft of editing, you get to study screenwriting. Film school isn't just for directors.
?Says you. Again I think you're generalising. I know lots of directors that direct ads and fine feature films (not so much Fair City!).
Maybe making the big budget stuff there are few chances but with today's digital cameras anyone can make a low-budget feature and you certainly don't need to waste money going to film school to do this.If they can. But as I said there's so few feature film opportunities in Ireland it's tough to work mainly with features.
It's one of the reasons. Anyway, why aren't these 'great directors' making 'great films'?I agree with some of what you're saying but I don't buy the whole 'film schools are the reason Irish cinema isn't successful' line. There's lots of great directors out there who have been to film schools in Ireland.0 -
But thanks to the films schools here no-one can do anything unless they get lots of money first!
I don't see how the film schools can be blamed for film being something that costs money. It's a business and people work at it. It's all very well making low budget films but if you want to be a professional sooner or later you have to make a living wage from it. And when you're making a big film it costs money.They don't use FILM anymore in the film schools or very little. They use digital video. You don't need to go to college to get to use this stuff.
Everyone focuses on the cameras and the rise of digital video in these dicussions. But it's not just the cameras, it's lights, the gear, the editing equipment and the chance to work with similarly talented and like-minded people that I see as a benefit of film school.
I would say if you compare a graduate short from the national film school you will see the standard is much higher than most low budget shorts that are being made. For instance something like Small Change which was a graduate film from there last year and went to Sundance. Or 'Undressing My Mother' - a student film that was wildly successful - it won best European short some years back.?
Lenny Abrahamson is a prime example. Works in television, features and ads. His stuff in all three is of a very high quality.Maybe making the big budget stuff there are few chances but with today's digital cameras anyone can make a low-budget feature and you certainly don't need to waste money going to film school to do this.
Yeah but as I pointed out you can't make much of a living from working solely on low budget features.
Out of interest I'd like to hear some of the low budget Irish features which you think are good.It's one of the reasons. Anyway, why aren't these 'great directors' making 'great films'?
Some are.
Conor McMahon has a new feature Stitches due out this year which has already secured North American distribution at Cannes and is getting great reviews. He works in television too.
Gary Shore has been snatched up by Hollywood and is attached to three feature projects at the moment. He also makes ads.
Kirsten Sheridan's Disco Pigs is excellent. Her new film Dollhouse has been well received at Berlin and SXSW.
Ciarán Foy just won the audience award at SXSW for his film Citadel.
Ken Wardrop's His & Hers is a fantastic film. He also directs ads.
All of these directors "wasted their money" at film school.
I'm not saying you have to go to film school to make films. I just think you can't dismiss all film schools out of hand as being totally a waste of money.0 -
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I'm just finishing my masters in film production, and while I have several issues with 'film education' as a concept, the benefits ultimately outweigh the negatives.
On the negative side, there's only so much classes about three act structures will teach you, and will only provide you with a limited knowledge of what great cinema is: most of that you have to decipher for yourself.
On the plus side, the practical training I've gotten has been excellent, getting to use everything from RED to EX1. The amount of genuinely valuable contacts I've met has been fantastic, and will certainly be beneficial as soon as I graduate. The insights to the (often horrific) world of the Irish industry have been equally valuable, and the lessons on how to work and utilise the system may be cynical but ultimately the only way one is going to get anywhere in an industry that is very often worryingly closed. Also have gotten to work on several shorts and a whole feature, which were amazing and extremely positive experiences.
Make sure you do a practical course: film studies aren't going to get you anywhere fast. And one day courses aren't particularly helpful either. At the end of a day you can't train someone to be talented, or have good ideas, but coming out with a strong qualification is in no way any harm to anyone's career development.0 -
That's the point. We SHOULD be these making low-budget feature films most of the time. We should be producing directors who make one feature after another using low budgets. But thanks to the film schools this hasn't happened much. That's why Irish cinema is so bad and that's why Irish directors have performed so badly.I don't see how the film schools can be blamed for film being something that costs money. It's a business and people work at it. It's all very well making low budget films but if you want to be a professional sooner or later you have to make a living wage from it. And when you're making a big film it costs money.
The whole point of digital video filmmaking is that you DON'T need many lights or 'gear' or large crews.Everyone focuses on the cameras and the rise of digital video in these dicussions. But it's not just the cameras, it's lights, the gear, the editing equipment and the chance to work with similarly talented and like-minded people that I see as a benefit of film school.
What's short films got to do with this thread? The OP is asking about making feature films i.e. film production.I would say if you compare a graduate short from the national film school you will see the standard is much higher than most low budget shorts that are being made. For instance something like Small Change which was a graduate film from there last year and went to Sundance. Or 'Undressing My Mother' - a student film that was wildly successful - it won best European short some years back.
I wouldn't rate any of them to be honest. Not at the international level. They would need to produce more quality work to be considered 'great directors'.Lenny Abrahamson is a prime example. Works in television, features and ads. His stuff in all three is of a very high quality.
Yeah but as I pointed out you can't make much of a living from working solely on low budget features.
Out of interest I'd like to hear some of the low budget Irish features which you think are good.
Some are.
Conor McMahon has a new feature Stitches due out this year which has already secured North American distribution at Cannes and is getting great reviews. He works in television too.
Gary Shore has been snatched up by Hollywood and is attached to three feature projects at the moment. He also makes ads.
Kirsten Sheridan's Disco Pigs is excellent. Her new film Dollhouse has been well received at Berlin and SXSW.
Ciarán Foy just won the audience award at SXSW for his film Citadel.
Ken Wardrop's His & Hers is a fantastic film. He also directs ads.
All of these directors "wasted their money" at film school.
I'm not saying you have to go to film school to make films. I just think you can't dismiss all film schools out of hand as being totally a waste of money.
The only director to emerge from an Irish film school and do really well is John Moore but he has zero impact on Irish cinema.0 -
That's the point. We SHOULD be these making low-budget feature films most of the time. We should be producing directors who make one feature after another using low budgets. But thanks to the film schools this hasn't happened much. That's why Irish cinema is so bad and that's why Irish directors have performed so badly.
I'm all for making features using low budgets - especially these days. But how low are you talking? People need to live so people have to get paid otherwise filmmaking is just an expensive hobby that they do in their part time.
But even low budget features have to raise the cash somewhere and that takes time.
I don't think you can blame film schools for more low budget features not being made. What makes you think that's the problem?
If it's so easy to get quality low budget features made then why aren't more people doing it outside then?The whole point of digital video filmmaking is that you DON'T need many lights or 'gear' or large crews.
If you want to make something well you still need some amount of lights, gear and crew no matter what you're shooting on. Granted you can get away with less but if you rock up with just a camera man, director, sound man and actors then you'd want to be pretty feckin' good. Otherwise we'll just turn out Charlie Casanova style sh*te.What's short films got to do with this thread? The OP is asking about making feature films i.e. film production.
Well the thread has diverted into a discussion also on the benefits of film schools. I was using the point that people coming out of film school are working at a higher level quicker than some people who don't.
Also the OP didn't mention features. Film production covers shorts and features. You might not think shorts are a good place to learn the craft but most people do.I wouldn't rate any of them to be honest.
Well chances are you haven't seen all their work, have you?. Maybe watch them before you dismiss them as not being up to your standards.Not at the international level. They would need to produce more quality work to be considered 'great directors'.
The only director to emerge from an Irish film school and do really well is John Moore but he has zero impact on Irish cinema.
Are you talking solely about commercial success here? John Moore is not that great a director at all I wouldn't say. None of his work is quality - it's popcorn stuff that does well but it's instantly forgettable.
Just as a matter of interest who would you rate as a great Irish director?0 -
Well that's what TV is for. If you want a steady job work in television but don't applaud the film schools for producing graduates who end up directing Raw.Yes using low budgets. But how low are you talking? People need to live so people have to get paid otherwise filmmaking is just an expensive hobby that they do in their part time.
Spend that film school fee on making your first feature!I'm all for making low budget features but even low budget features have to raise the cash somewhere and that takes time.
This again is the problem with our films schools. People judging films on a technical basis. Plenty of Irish films out there that are very well made but still sh*te.If you want to make something well you still need some amount of lights, gear and crew no matter what you're shooting on. Otherwise we'll just turn out Charlie Casanova style sh*te.
So what? Lots of world-class directors start off making rubbish features and get better. In fact their early stuff is usually more interesting no matter how poorly made it is. Directors who have all the training and can work at higher levels are more suited to TV anyway.Well the thread has diverted into a discussion also on the benefits of film schools. I was using the point that people coming out of film school are working at a higher level quicker than some people who don't.
I have seen their work and again they are overrated.Well chances are you haven't seen their work. Maybe watch them before you dismiss them as not being up to your standards.
Commercially he's returned more profit with his films than any of the above titles you list. We don't have any 'great' Irish film directors. Never will if everyone heads off to film school as the best international filmmakers start out making their own stuff on the cheap and develop their own style.Are you talking solely about commercial success here? John Moore is not that great a director at all I wouldn't say. None of his work is quality - it's popcorn stuff that does well but it's instantly forgettable.
Just as a matter of interest who would you rate as a great Irish director?0 -
Out of interest FishBowl, what low budget Irish features do you consider good?0
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I thought this was brilliant but not sure if €800K is considered low budget? Directed by a playwright not a film school graduate.
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The whole point of digital video filmmaking is that you DON'T need many lights or 'gear' or large crews.
Just to say this is absolute nonsense. While digital filmmaking has made certain things easier and cheaper, it has in no way negated the need for lights, gears or crews. Yes, a new type of low-fi cinematography has emerged (and you certainly don't want every film to look like that), but for the vast majority of looks traditional film techniques are as vital as ever.
And yes, Snap is probably the most interesting Irish film of recent times (albeit not without its flaws) but DoP Kate McCullough - who is responsible for many of Snap's aesthetic triumphs - studied film and cinematography in IADT and later Poland. So it certainly didn't hurt her.0 -
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This again is the problem with our films schools. People judging films on a technical basis. Plenty of Irish films out there that are very well made but still sh*te.
Films should be judged on a technical basis. Not solely on it but how well a film looks and sounds is part of what it should be judged on.So what? Lots of world-class directors start off making rubbish features and get better. In fact their early stuff is usually more interesting no matter how poorly made it is.
You're going to have to provide examples here. I'm curious to know who you're talking about.Directors who have all the training and can work at higher levels are more suited to TV anyway.
And you're basing that on what exactly?I have seen their work and again they are overrated.
Have you? I'd be interested to knowing where you saw Citadel since it hasn't been released in Ireland yet. The same for McMahon's new feature. It hasn't even been screened for the cast and crew yet.Commercially he's returned more profit with his films than any of the above titles you list.
So you're judging films purely on commercial success then? In that case why are you so intent on making low budget features? Low budget features rarely make big returns at the box office.We don't have any 'great' Irish film directors. Never will if everyone heads off to film school as the best international filmmakers start out making their own stuff on the cheap and develop their own style.
Yeah like that Martin Scorsese guy. Or that guy Wes Anderson.
Sure loads of great directors (Fincher, Spielberg) didn't study film - although Spielberg wanted to. But there's lots who did.
I think you're being quite-blinkered in your anti-film school bias to be honest.
As with Galvasean I'd love to hear what low budget features you do think are good.
It's very easy to sit and rant about why Irish cinema is not successful but blaming it all on film schools is just inaccurate.
People who did go to film school aren't stopping anyone else from going out and making their own low budget features. And people are doing it, so why is it still film schools fault that none of these films have become successes?0 -
I thought this was brilliant but not sure if €800K is considered low budget?
You suggest earlier that people put the money they would have spent on film school towards their first low budget feature. You'd want a lot of students pooling their fees before they could stretch to 800k.
Snap was an interesting if flawed film though. - a cut above most Irish films. And as Jonny pointed out the DP was a film school graduate.0 -
I said it wasn't really low-budget. But it was made for far less money than many other Irish films which were awful.You suggest earlier that people put the money they would have spent on film school towards their first low budget feature. You'd want a lot of students pooling their fees before they could stretch to 800k.
So what? No Irish film school graduate could have directed that movie.Snap was an interesting if flawed film though. - a cut above most Irish films. And as Jonny pointed out the DP was a film school graduate.0 -
Not it's not. What lights did the Dogma 95 films use? None is the answer. Far more impressive that most Irish titles.johnny_ultimate wrote: »Just to say this is absolute nonsense. While digital filmmaking has made certain things easier and cheaper, it has in no way negated the need for lights, gears or crews. Yes, a new type of low-fi cinematography has emerged (and you certainly don't want every film to look like that), but for the vast majority of looks traditional film techniques are as vital as ever.
What this obsession with 'flaws'? Typical film-school way of thinking. We need more films like this with flaws.johnny_ultimate wrote: »And yes, Snap is probably the most interesting Irish film of recent times (albeit not without its flaws) but DoP Kate McCullough - who is responsible for many of Snap's aesthetic triumphs - studied film and cinematography in IADT and later Poland. So it certainly didn't hurt her.0 -
So what? No Irish film school graduate could have directed that movie.
In your opinion.
You seem quite blinkered and unable to appreciate or accept that there are many fine directors that have come out of film schools. There are also many terrible directors too. In the same way that there are great directors who didn't study film and terrible directors that didn't study film.
Your insistence at laying the blame for it all at the feet of Irish film schools is pretty blinkered. It's pretty boring to be honest.0 -
Rubbish. More film-school logic, lots of great films with bad sound e.g. Kes.Films should be judged on a technical basis. Not solely on it but how well a film looks and sounds is part of what it should be judged on.
See this is where we differ. I doubt another stupid Irish horror movie is going to make others take note of our cinema?Have you? I'd be interested to knowing where you saw Citadel since it hasn't been released in Ireland yet. The same for McMahon's new feature. It hasn't even been screened for the cast and crew yet.
There are loads of international examples. In fact the trend in Ireland is to move to lower budgets because of this.So you're judging films purely on commercial success then? In that case why are you so intent on making low budget features? Low budget features rarely make big returns at the box office.
Film schools were useful in the past: watching obscure movies, getting to use film, learning editing etc. But these can all be done on your own now. Better to buy a good DVD collection with the money as everything is now available.Yeah like that Martin Scorsese guy. Or that guy Wes Anderson.
Sure loads of great directors (Fincher, Spielberg) didn't study film - although Spielberg wanted to. But there's lots who did.
I think you're being quite-blinkered in your anti-film school bias to be honest.
As with Galvasean I'd love to hear what low budget features you do think are good.
I blame most of the crap Irish films that look great and are technically above average on the film schools.It's very easy to sit and rant about why Irish cinema is not successful but blaming it all on film schools is just inaccurate.
People who did go to film school aren't stopping anyone else from going out and making their own low budget features. And people are doing it, so why is it still film schools fault that none of these films have become successes?
Anyway, if the OP really wants to go to film school wouldn't it be better if he went to a good one abroad?0 -
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Not it's not. What lights did the Dogma 95 films use? None is the answer. Far more impressive that most Irish titles.
Yes, but the Dogma 95 movement produced maybe two or three great films, and a lot of crap. They're probably responsible for 0.001% of the great films ever made, if even. Even its founders have gone on to abandon its principles after one or two experiments. Do you think Melancholia didn't use lights? Antichrist? Hmm. I certainly don't think Mr Von Trier would instantly say all digital film-making doesn't need light.
Some films look good with no lights, the much vaster majority don't. Your favoured older films, going by your posts in this forum, certainly feature a plethora of lighting setups.
Anyway, let's see the examples of your non-lit work, ey?Fishbowel wrote:What this obsession with 'flaws'? Typical film-school way of thinking. We need more films like this with flaws.
Oh you.0 -
Rubbish. More film-school logic, lots of great films with bad sound e.g. Kes.
Lots of sh*t films with bad sound too.
That doesn't mean that people shouldn't strive to record sound properly. Or make sure the shots are framed properly and the focus is correct.
The sort of 'ah sure that'll do' attitude is just the talk of people who don't have the skills to do better.See this is where we differ. I doubt another stupid Irish horror movie is going to make others take note of our cinema?
Despite your insistence I doubt you've seen either of those films have you but yet you've already dismissed it as 'stupid'. I'm not even sure which on you're talking about. Have you seen Citadel or Stitches?Anyway, if the OP really wants to go to film school wouldn't it be better if he went to a good one abroad?
Sure if they can afford it. So your hatred of film schools is only restricted to Irish ones is it?I blame most of the crap Irish films that look great and are technically above average on the film schools.
So why not team up DoPs from film schools with your magical non-film school directors then and get good films that are technically excellent.
The funny thing is that I agree with you that there's a slew of Irish films that are technically great but are boring as f*ck. I just don't think that blindly saying "nobody from a film school could ever have directed that" is the way to look at it.0 -
Sure there are, most are now working in TV or making shorts and winning useless awards. But the OP wants to get into FILM PRODUCTION. So unless he plans on emigrating there is little chance on getting regular work in this area here. He could of course make his own stuff but thanks to your advice he needs to spend a few years in film school first.In your opinion.
You seem quite blinkered and unable to appreciate or accept that there are many fine directors that have come out of film schools. There are also many terrible directors too. In the same way that there are great directors who didn't study film and terrible directors that didn't study film.
Your insistence at laying the blame for it all at the feet of Irish film schools is pretty blinkered. It's pretty boring to be honest.0 -
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Sure, but you don't need to go to film school to learn this.Lots of sh*t films with bad sound too.
That doesn't mean that people shouldn't strive to record sound properly. Or make sure the shots are framed properly and the focus is correct.
The sort of 'ah sure that'll do' attitude is just the talk of people who don't have the skills to do better.
From viewing previous Irish horror movies I have no expectations that these ones will be any better.Despite your insistence I doubt you've seen either of those films have you but yet you've already dismissed it as 'stupid'. I'm not even sure which on you're talking about. Have you seen Citadel or Stitches?
Yes, I can't blame foreign film schools for our dire Irish films?So your hatred of film schools is only restricted to Irish ones is it?
That's a good idea but I get the impression with Irish film schools the best people drop out? The team players stay and graduate. The kind of people who would talk a non-film school director away from trying different things? Film schools teach you to how to make films the same way as everyone else makes. That's why most Irish movies are so bad but look great?So why not team up DoPs from film schools with your magical non-film school directors then and get good films that are technically excellent.
The funny thing is that I agree with you that there's a slew of Irish films that are technically great but are boring as f*ck. I just don't think that blindly saying "nobody from a film school could ever have directed that" is the way to look at it.0
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