Euro 2012 Group C (Irelands Group)

Jayob10

Italy more than fancy their chances of beating us looking at their finish to this game. Happy with a point.

Will I Amnt

Lads.Is it not head to head record if it finishes level on points??
Unless Italy score,only a win will do us against Spain as finishing on 4 points Croatia would be ahead of us.

~Rebel~

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

ARe the Dutch not gone?

Not mathetmatically. If Holland beat portugal, and Germany beat Denmark, 3 teams will be on the same points, and the head to heads would be even too (each would have beaten and lost to another), so that would come down to the goal difference.

Renn

Mars Bar wrote: »

not mathematically. Neither will Ireland I think...

If they lose they will.

Jimmy Iovine

Last chance here.

Pudsy33

cambo2008 wrote: »

Lads.Is it not head to head record if it finishes level on points??
Unless Italy score,only a win will do us against Spain as finishing on 4 points Croatia would be ahead of us.

But we would finish ahead of spain if they fail to beat croatia

BKC

cambo2008 wrote: »

Lads.Is it not head to head record if it finishes level on points??
Unless Italy score,only a win will do us against Spain as finishing on 4 points Croatia would be ahead of us.

So confusing. It's times like this when George Hamilton would come in handy!

Jayob10

cambo2008 wrote: »

Lads.Is it not head to head record if it finishes level on points??
Unless Italy score,only a win will do us against Spain as finishing on 4 points Croatia would be ahead of us.

We can draw with Spain

BUT

we'll be shouting for Croatia v Spain and hoping we beat Italy in that case

Or else a draw in the above game and we can edge Spain on goal difference if we beat Italy and draw with Spain

Mr.Crinklewood

Linesman on the far side has been terrible.

~Rebel~

cambo2008 wrote: »

Lads.Is it not head to head record if it finishes level on points??
Unless Italy score,only a win will do us against Spain as finishing on 4 points Croatia would be ahead of us.

Not quite. But with this result, we need it to be us AND croatia who go through. So we'd have to beat Italy, and Spain, or else beat italy and draw Spain, with Spain getting beaten in the last game.

We'd be needing a lot of unlikely factors to take place.

joe123

Think it goes on Goal difference. Otherwise Holland would already be out.

Where To

Where To wrote: »

Italy haven't beaten Croatia since 1942.

BKC wrote: »

Means nothing! Last meeting was six years ago...

kitakyushu wrote: »

Probably helps that Croatia didn't exist as an independent state 1943-1991.

Italy still haven't beaten Croatia since 1942.

Pudsy33

On the plus side, a win tonight and we just need a point against Italy

Renn

Where To wrote: »

Italy still haven't beaten Croatia since 1942.

So lame

Jayob10

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Not quite. But with this result, we need it to be us AND croatia who go through. So we'd have to beat Italy, and Spain, or else beat italy and draw Spain, with Spain getting beaten in the last game.

We'd be needing a lot of unlikely factors to take place.

Spain won't need to be beaten in the last game. A draw will do us if we beat Italy.

Thats provided we draw tonight.

SuperInfinity

There seems to be some confusion among the commentators and here about what Ireland are going to have to do now, maybe some denial. On RTE 2 they are saying Ireland will be looking to draw and win their final two games.

To clarify: If Ireland draw and win their final two games they will definitely be out, unless Croatia beat Spain and there is at least a two goal margin in Ireland's favour in one of the results.

As unfair as it may seem in a tournament where Holland still have good chances of getting through after losing their first two games... if Ireland and Croatia are level on points then Croatia will get through based on that they beat Ireland. Because it's a tiebreak between the teams on equal points. Italy cannot get four now, and besides that Ireland will have to beat them.

In the highly unlikely even that Ireland beat Spain and draw with Italy, then Spain can still get through ahead of Ireland by beating Croatia in the final game.

Jayob10 wrote: »

Spain won't need to be beaten in the last game. A draw will do us if we beat Italy.

Thats provided we draw tonight.

No it won't. Croatia will get through because having the same amount of points as us they will have beaten us in our game.

grenache

sdeire wrote: »

But then we'll have 4 points, and so will Italy, with Spain having 5. Italy's GD is 3 better than ours, so that wouldn't work. We're not going to beat Italy by 4 goals.

We need this to be a draw, us to draw with Spain, and then we beat Italy and Croatia beat Spain. That's to go through with GD left aside. A big ask, but possible.

Alternatively, we beat Italy AND Spain. Again, a massive, massive ask.

italy's goal difference is 2 better. But you're right of course. I didn't take GD into account.

dfx-

A draw might actually do.. :eek:

Croatia - 7pts
Ireland - 4pts
Spain - 2pts
Italy - 2pts

Pudsy33

SuperInfinity wrote: »

There seems to be some confusion among the commentators about what Ireland are going to have to do now, maybe some denial. On RTE 2 they are saying Ireland will be looking to draw and win their final two games.

To clarify: If Ireland draw and win their final two games they will definitely be out, unless Croatia beat Spain and there is at least a two goal margin in Ireland's favour in one of the results.

As unfair as it may seem in a tournament where Holland still have good chances of getting through after losing their first two games... if Ireland and Croatia are level on points then Croatia will get through based on that they beat Ireland. Because it's a tiebreak between the teams on equal points. Italy cannot get four now, and besides that Ireland will have to beat them.

In the highly unlikely even that Ireland beat Spain and draw with Italy, then Spain can still get through ahead of Ireland by beating Croatia in the final game.

Thats incorrect. A spanish croatian draw would see us through.

Croatia 5
Ireland 4
Spain 3
Italy 2

Bodhisopha

Any idea on how to approach this game mentally from an Irish fans point of view?

frisbeeface

joe123 wrote: »

Think it goes on Goal difference. Otherwise Holland would already be out.

It's head to head. Holland are still in because if they beat Portugal and Germany beat Denmark then they'll be in a 3 way tie with Portugal and Denmark with each of them having 1 win and 1 loss from the head to head. So it goes to goal difference then.

JerryHandbag

Its this simple - Ireland draw tonight, beat Italy. Spain fail to beat Croatia.
Ireland and Croatia go through.

BKC

joe123 wrote: »

Think it goes on Goal difference. Otherwise Holland would already be out.

It's H2H, but will be goal difference in that group as if Denmark, Portugal, and Holland all have 3 points in the end they will all be level on H2H.

flyswatter

Rules on qualification from group on Page 9 here:


http://www.uefa.com/multimediafiles/download/competitions/euro/91/87/57/918757_download.pdf



If two or more teams are equal on points on completion of the group matches, the
following criteria are applied, in the order given; to determine the rankings:
a) higher number of points obtained in the matches among the teams in question;
b) superior goal difference in the matches among the teams in question (if more
than two teams finish equal on points);
c) higher number of goals scored in the matches among the teams in question (if
more than two teams finish equal on points);
d) superior goal difference in all the group matches;
e) higher number of goals scored in all the group matches;
f) position in the UEFA national team coefficient ranking system (see Annex I,
paragraph 1.2.2);
g) fair play conduct of the teams (final tournament);
h) drawing of lots.

Phoenix Park

SuperInfinity wrote: »

There seems to be some confusion among the commentators and here about what Ireland are going to have to do now, maybe some denial. On RTE 2 they are saying Ireland will be looking to draw and win their final two games.

To clarify: If Ireland draw and win their final two games they will definitely be out, unless Croatia beat Spain and there is at least a two goal margin in Ireland's favour in one of the results.

As unfair as it may seem in a tournament where Holland still have good chances of getting through after losing their first two games... if Ireland and Croatia are level on points then Croatia will get through based on that they beat Ireland. Because it's a tiebreak between the teams on equal points. Italy cannot get four now, and besides that Ireland will have to beat them.

In the highly unlikely even that Ireland beat Spain and draw with Italy, then Spain can still get through ahead of Ireland by beating Croatia in the final game.



No it won't. Croatia will get through because having the same amount of points as us they will have beaten us in our game.

but we can draw tonight ( lol ) and get through by beating Italy ( lol ) if Spain and Croatia draw. Croatia and ourselves would go through (lol with loads of ooo's in it)

kitakyushu

dfx- wrote: »

Ireland have to win their final two games, they can't finish ahead of Croatia with a draw, Eamon...

No, we can still get thru with 4. But it would require Croatia to beat/draw with Spain and take the group.

~Rebel~

JerryHandbag wrote: »

Its this simple - Ireland draw tonight, beat Italy. Spain fail to beat Croatia.
Ireland and Croatia go through.

Also, hell to freeze over, and pigs to fly.

TheRedDevil10

SuperInfinity wrote: »

There seems to be some confusion among the commentators and here about what Ireland are going to have to do now, maybe some denial. On RTE 2 they are saying Ireland will be looking to draw and win their final two games.

To clarify: If Ireland draw and win their final two games they will definitely be out, unless Croatia beat Spain and there is at least a two goal margin in Ireland's favour in one of the results.

As unfair as it may seem in a tournament where Holland still have good chances of getting through after losing their first two games... if Ireland and Croatia are level on points then Croatia will get through based on that they beat Ireland. Because it's a tiebreak between the teams on equal points. Italy cannot get four now, and besides that Ireland will have to beat them.

In the highly unlikely even that Ireland beat Spain and draw with Italy, then Spain can still get through ahead of Ireland by beating Croatia in the final game.

Jayob10 wrote: »

Spain won't need to be beaten in the last game. A draw will do us if we beat Italy.

Thats provided we draw tonight.

No it won't. Croatia will get through because having the same amount of points as us they will have beaten us in our game.

a draw in the spain and croatia game will do us you clown

dfx-

Best thing to do is win both games:pac:

MagicMarker

Why is there no match thread?

~Rebel~

MagicMarker wrote: »

Why is there no match thread?

Imagine the emotions of reading through this thread in a few months/years! (especially if good things happen)

frisbeeface

If we draw tonight:
We need to beat Italy and hope Spain don't win

If we win tonight:
We need to draw or beat Italy and hope Spain don't win. Small chance we could still get through with a draw and a Spain win: ourselves, Spain and Croatia could end up tied on 4 points with goal difference deciding who gets eliminated.

JerryHandbag

Anyone else feel like punching Craig Doyle?

SuperInfinity

Phoenix Park wrote: »

but we can draw tonight ( lol ) and get through by beating Italy ( lol ) if Spain and Croatia draw. Croatia and ourselves would go through (lol with loads of ooo's in it)

And there's another possibility: we could beat both Spain and Italy and then we wouldn't have to depend on anyone's results.

onemorechance

Pudsy33 wrote: »

Thats incorrect. A spanish croatian draw would see us through.

Croatia 5
Ireland 4
Spain 3
Italy 2

1 Spain 7
2 Italy 5
3 Croatia 4
4 Republic of Ireland 0

aindriu80

does anyone have the table done after the 1-1 draw tonight. I think its was a better result for us that they drew. But at the end of the day we have to get 4 points and that's us to beat the Italians. Pretty tricky but to say the least, but at least it will keep the tournament open till the last game if we don't lose tonight.

I think Spain will beat Croatia in their last game. If we draw tonight we will have done really well this tournament no matter how we get on with the Italians.

Jimmy Iovine

JerryHandbag wrote: »

Anyone else feel like punching Craig Doyle?

Can't believe he keeps getting a show. All of them imaginatively called "Craig Doyle Live".

Samich

JerryHandbag wrote: »

Anyone else feel like punching Craig Doyle?

Watching on ITV? I'm sticking with the circus on RTE

Phoenix Park

MagicMarker wrote: »

Why is there no match thread?

usually reserved for big games only

kitakyushu

Jimmy Iovine wrote: »

Can't believe he keeps getting a show. All of them imaginatively called "Craig Doyle Live".

I'd never seen any of his shows before. I tuned in for the "interview" with Schillaci. What a fúcking joke that was.

aindriu80

Samich wrote: »

Watching on ITV? I'm sticking with the circus on RTE

I can get ITV HD on SKY for free but cant get RTE 2 HD which is a bit annoying. The picture is so much better but UK commentary is terrible.

~Rebel~

aindriu80 wrote: »

does anyone have the table done after the 1-1 draw tonight. I think its was a better result for us that they drew. But at the end of the day we have to get 4 points and that's us to beat the Italians. Pretty tricky but to say the least at least it will keep the tournament open till the last game if we don't lose tonight.

I think Spain will beat Croatia in their last game. If we draw tonight we would have done really well.

Unless we win tonight, the above bolded statements cant coexist unfortunately. A win for Spain after a draw tonight puts them on 5, and we'd be guaranteed out, only equal points to Croatia, but losing on head to head.

Samich

There's only about a 20% chance less of us winning against Italy as winning against Spain. We wouldn't beat Italy imo.

aindriu80

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Unless we win tonight, the above bolded statements cant coexist unfortunately. A win for Spain after a draw tonight puts them on 5, and we'd be guaranteed out, only equal points to Croatia, but losing on head to head.

Well I was talking about the Croatia Italy 1-1 draw tonight. I think it was a better result for us tonight.

I can see Spain drawing with us tonight but not us drawing with Spain. they can afford to beat Croatia in their final game.

I think it may come down to our goal difference if we end up on 4 points. But i'm not at all sure ?

fullstop

aindriu80 wrote: »

Well I was talking about the Croatia Italy 1-1 draw tonight. I think it was a better result for us tonight.

I can see Spain drawing with us tonight but not us drawing with Spain. they can afford to beat Croatia in their final game.

I think it may come down to our goal difference if we end up on 4 points. But i'm not at all sure ?

It doesn't come down to goal difference unless the head to head is level. Just to clarify :pac:

TheRedDevil10

aindriu80 wrote: »

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Unless we win tonight, the above bolded statements cant coexist unfortunately. A win for Spain after a draw tonight puts them on 5, and we'd be guaranteed out, only equal points to Croatia, but losing on head to head.

Well I was talking about the Croatia Italy 1-1 draw tonight. I think it was a better result for us tonight.

I can see Spain drawing with us tonight but not us drawing with Spain. they can afford to beat Croatia in their final game.

I think it may come down to our goal difference if we end up on 4 points. But i'm not at all sure ?

you don't have a clue mate. clearly an italian win was the best result tonight

SuperInfinity

aindriu80 wrote: »

does anyone have the table done after the 1-1 draw tonight. I think its was a better result for us that they drew. But at the end of the day we have to get 4 points and that's us to beat the Italians. Pretty tricky but to say the least, but at least it will keep the tournament open till the last game if we don't lose tonight.

No, it would be clearly better if Italy had won. Then if we drew Spain and beat Italy then it would depend on the Spain Croatia result. If:

1) Spain beat Croatia we would go head to head with Italy in points and be through with Spain.
2) Spain lost to Croatia then the same, except we'd be through with Croatia and Spain would be out.
3) Spain drew Croatia we would go head to head with both Italy and Croatia and Spain would be knocked out. Our 2 goal loss to Croatia might come back to haunt us then.

Since Spain are highly likely to beat Croatia it would have been by far the best result. As it is our chances are very low. Someone should have told me to cheer for Italy.

~Rebel~

aindriu80 wrote: »

Well I was talking about the Croatia Italy 1-1 draw tonight. I think it was a better result for us tonight.

I can see Spain drawing with us tonight but not us drawing with Spain. they can afford to beat Croatia in their final game.

I think it may come down to our goal difference if we end up on 4 points. But i'm not at all sure ?

confused.

A draw in the croatia italy match means we need Spain to not beat Croatia.

Had Italy won, then we'd have been relying on Spain beating Croatia.

I would have preferred the latter, as I think Spain will beat Croatia.

copacetic

aindriu80 wrote: »

I can get ITV HD on SKY for free but cant get RTE 2 HD which is a bit annoying. The picture is so much better but UK commentary is terrible.

It's on channel 294 for free if you have a skyhd box and no hd pack.

dfx-

Mendieta's penalty bounce must be avenged..