Junkies

Odysseus

Gummy Panda wrote: »

That's actually a good point. Some of these addicts we call junkies probably would be toe rags regardless of heroin.

That is one of the issues of treatment, people can come with a long history of social problems and involvement in criminalogy and people think just giving them a cup of methadone will solve it, it won't.

Pushtrak

Chain_reaction wrote: »

Pretty sure you're very wrong about ease of reversal.

Come on. You could at least try to find something to back up your point. I didn't have a clue one way or the other. So, I looked it up.
http://stanfordhospital.org/clinicsmedServices/clinics/urology/male_infertility/vasectomy-reversal.html

How effective is vasectomy reversal?

The effectiveness of a vasectomy reversal is up to 90-95 percent. Vasovasotomy procedures (90-95 percent) generally have higher success rates than vasoepididymostomy procedures (65-70 percent). In either type of surgery, the vasectomy reversal is often more successful with microsurgery as this allows precise reapproximation of the cut ends of the genital tract. Microsurgery is a type of surgery that requires an operating microscope to perform the procedure. Fellowship trained in microsurgery, our experts are able to delivery state-of-the-art care with superior success rates.

http://www.tubal-reversal.net/blog/2011/tubal-ligation-reversal/tube-tied-reversal-what-does-it-mean.html

Tube Tied Reversal Success Rate

The chances of pregnancy after tube tied reversal depend on many factors. The chances of pregnancy depend on the age of the patient at the time of tubal reversal surgery, the methods used to perform the tubal closure, and the health and length of the fallopian tubes after the reversal procedure.

The tube tied reversal success rate is approximately 70% for most types of tubal ligation or, to put it another way, about 3 out of every 4 patients who has a reversal of tied tubes will become pregnant.

The doctors of Chapel Hill Tubal Reversal Center can provide you with extensive information about tube tied reversal success rate.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-17278225 - though with a quick google I'm more finding who chemical castration would be used on than much on the efficacy of reversing the procedure

Some MPs in Moldova's parliament questioned the efficacy of chemical castration, pointing out that it is reversible - and calling for alternative methods to be considered, according to Moldovan newspaper Timpul

Pretty sure when I don't know something it is prudent to look it up.

Jimoslimos wrote: »

'Heroin' is actually quite a clean safe drug. Diamorphine is commonly used in hospitals for pain relief. A bit moreish granted, but overall no less safe than say nicotine.

A lot of the 'horribleness' arises from complications due to its illegality. Impurities, unclean needles, etc. Methadone as a drug is probably more toxic.

Not arguing for full legalisation per se, addiction is also responsible for some of the negative side-effects - poor personal care (hygeine/dental), malnutrition. However administering 'clean' heroin to junkies in a controlled environment should be one consideration in controlling addiction.

You brought up heroin in the smoking thread, and I didn't really want to go in to it as it isn't a topic I am too familiar. Safe in this context still allows for people dying of overdose, doesn't it?

When it comes to the legalization of drugs, I'd like a sensible approach of decriminalising drugs that aren't so dangerous in a purified form and regulate them. When it comes to heroin, though in a purified form, I don't know what "safe" means. This, to me seems a central point in the discussion. (Not just in terms of the decriminalisation but in terms of treatment.)

Edit: To add a link. http://www.debate.org/debates/Heroin-should-be-legalized/1/ It is a debate with a pro and con side, that much I see already. Will not quote any of it here though.

Odysseus

Pushtrak wrote: »

When it comes to the legalization of drugs, I'd like a sensible approach of decriminalising drugs that aren't so dangerous in a purified form and regulate them. When it comes to heroin, though in a purified form, I don't know what "safe" means. This, to me seems a central point in the discussion. (Not just in terms of the decriminalisation but in terms of treatment.)

No the chap is right, in such programmes exact doses are given out so it is quite safe. A person either has to made a choice to take what would be an overdose for them, or fail safes have failed and someone with little experince of it, got their hands on it.

kunst nugget

af_thefragile wrote: »

Its because methadone doesn't give the user any "high" or "buzz" and is long acting, the heroin user cannot abuse methadone and so he can slowly be weaned off his addiction.

Yes, it can be abused.

http://www.drug-overdose.com/methadone.htm

An article showing that methadone is starting to overtake heroin in contributing to drug fatalities.

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/analysis/report-finds-methadone-contributes-to-more-deaths-than-heroin-1275181.html

OldNotWIse

pontia wrote: »

junkies are sub human vermin,they should be rounded up and used as pot hole fillers.they drain society.

That's not very nice :mad: I had two rats once and they were absolutely lovely. Please dont insult their memory

Pushtrak

kunst nugget wrote: »

An article showing that methadone is starting to overtake heroin in contributing to drug fatalities.

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/analysis/report-finds-methadone-contributes-to-more-deaths-than-heroin-1275181.html

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15378662

The principal mechanisms by which methadone causes death are discussed: respiratory depression, aspiration of vomit, pulmonary oedema, bronchopneumonia, cardiac problems and renal failure. Many such deaths are preventable, if drug interactions and polydrug use are avoided, its longer period of metabolism and individuals' tolerance levels are considered. It is hoped that this paper will (a) help guide health professionals in their management and treatment of patients participating in methadone treatment programmes, and (b) provide some basic information for those dealing with individuals who have consumed methadone.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22035341

It is critical for health care providers who treat patients on methadone to have adequate information on the interactions of methadone with other drugs of abuse and other medications. We set out to describe drug-drug interactions as well as physiological and pathophysiological factors that may impact the pharmacokinetics of methadone.

Interactions of methadone with other drugs can lead to increased or decreased methadone drug levels in patients and result in potential overdose or withdrawal, respectively. The former can contribute to methadone's fatality.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21871161 I'll copy the abstract in its entirety here. Important to present all info relating to methadone.

A 6-year-old male child was scheduled for a dental procedure requiring conscious sedation. Prior to the procedure, the child was administered a dental cocktail containing chloral hydrate, hydroxyzine, and methadone. After returning from the dentist, the child appeared groggy and was allowed to sleep. A few hours later, he was found unresponsive, and following resuscitation attempts at a local medical center, he was pronounced dead. Toxicological analyses of femoral blood indicated the presence of hydroxyzine at less than 0.54 μg/mL, trichloroethanol (TCE) at 8.3 μg/mL, and methadone at 0.51 μg/mL. No meperidine was detected. The cause of death was reported to be due to the toxic effects of methadone. The toxicological analysis was corroborated by the analysis of the contents of the dental cocktail, which revealed the presence of hydroxyzine, chloral hydrate, and methadone. Residue from a control sample obtained from the same pharmacy, but administered to a different subject, was found to contain hydroxyzine, chloral hydrate, and meperidine. This report represents the first known fatality due to accidental substitution of methadone in a dental cocktail.

There's a study relating to genetic predictability relating to methadone overdose to be found here.

Finally, an increase in unintentional medication overdose Oklahoma 94-06 here. This is about medication overdoses generally, and not specifically about methadone. That said, the conclusion:

Unintentional medication-related deaths are increasing in Oklahoma and often involve multiple substances. Substances most frequently contributing to deaths were prescription opioid analgesics. Prevention strategies should target people aged 35-54 years and emphasize the dangers of coingesting substances and misusing prescription pain medications.

promethius42

Well at least they haven't started eating us like the guy in America.

Foxhound38

Odysseus

Foxhound38 wrote: »

Try looking for methadonia on youtube, you might learn a bit

promethius42

promethius42 wrote: »

Well at least they haven't started eating us like the guy in America.

Who?

bogmanfan

There's a lot of talk about junkies' rights, as though these people are somehow innocent victims. At the end of the day, they started taking heroin. They should accept responsibility for their actions. We live in an age where nobody takes personal responsibility for anything. Everything's somebody else's fault. 'It's the dealers' or 'It's society' or 'It's lack of government funding'. BS. Unless you're forcibly injected with heroin a number of times against your will, then your addiction is your fault.

I would be 100% in favour of sterilisation. I work on Talbot St and see these Walking Dead types every day, pushing prams and screaming at their kids. I don't see how anyone could suggest that these children have a great start in life. How many of them will manage to break out of the family cycle of addiction and unemployment?

And what sort of message will clean, prescription drug clinics send out? You can get hooked on gear, and the government will look after you. Screw that. If a junkie ends up in court for an offence relating to their habit - theft, burglary etc - why can't a judge sentence them to enforced medically-supervised detox? Why should a junkie's right to shoot up outweigh the public's right not to be robbed or mugged by them?

Deus Ex Machina

Foxhound38 wrote: »

I wonder why people go on it in the first place - ignorance about the zombification that results in it is no longer an excuse really...

The reason I first tried it is the same reason why I became addicted to it: the incredible high it induces. It is unlikely that somebodywithout prior exposure and personal experience of other illicit drugs is going to find themselves in a situation where they're being offered heroin. That being so, the decision to try it isn't a huge leap, rather another step down a road they're already following.

I understood that there were risks involved in taking the drug, but the same thing applied to all the drugs I had taken before and yet they hadn't caused any egregious health problems. At the same time I was aware of heroin's status as the ultimate high. That rather shoddy balance sheet resulted in my first sampling and was the incipience of an addiction with which I still struggle. I can't speak for every addict, but I doubt my pattern was unique.

Snowie

People are inherently good. Over the years we've had rise of the wiggers, rise of the junkies rise of this and that....

We as nation have are difficulties e look at depression as a stigma in many eyes and we look at. People are just as much a herd like elephants were back animals longing to be belong.. This is a primary instinct.

It only take one person in a group to get into drugs and before you know there hole groups into drugs... at first its a couple of reefers and suddenly it gets much worse ...

I dont nesscerely like the junkies that rome middle abi street looking like they've not showered in 10 years... Its distasteful to say the least.... How ever I know some people who've kicked the habit and to see were they've been to where they are right now I'm happy for them, they see there error in there ways.
But most of the time addiction weather it cigarettes heroin special k or even coke is down to one thing.....

The longing to fit in with the crowd... As stupid as they may sound thats why...

Odysseus

Snowie wrote: »

People are inherently good. Over the years we've had rise of the wiggers, rise of the junkies rise of this and that....

We as nation have are difficulties e look at depression as a stigma in many eyes and we look at. People are just as much a herd like elephants were back animals longing to be belong.. This is a primary instinct.

It only take one person in a group to get into drugs and before you know there hole groups into drugs... at first its a couple of reefers and suddenly it gets much worse ...

I dont nesscerely like the junkies that rome middle abi street looking like they've not showered in 10 years... Its distasteful to say the least.... How ever I know some people who've kicked the habit and to see were they've been to where they are right now I'm happy for them, they see there error in there ways.
But most of the time addiction weather it cigarettes heroin special k or even coke is down to one thing.....

The longing to fit in with the crowd... As stupid as they may sound thats why...

It is a tad more complex than that, to be fair.

promethius42

Deleted User wrote: »

Who?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/us-news-blog/2012/may/30/face-eating-man-bath-salts-drug

Bet the guy who shot him thought it was the start of the zombie invasion. :pac:

The Waltzing Consumer

Snowie wrote: »

People are inherently good. Over the years we've had rise of the wiggers, rise of the junkies rise of this and that....

The rise of the what? :pac:

whistlingtitan

Watching some of posts on here and just brings me back to my first post

We as a nation are far far to pc …
With people not wanting to use the word junkie to giving them free drugs and condom letting them decide if they want treatment

It's reasons like these. Nothing gets done in this country
Find them remove them for at least a year enforced detox as for dealers death Penelty

DERPY HOOFS

I do not understand how in this day and age people are still starting taking heroin after the harm it has done to previous generations.My friend works on O Connell Street and she says junkies are always going into her shop and robbing the buns and cakes.She is too afraid to stop them in case they beat her up in the shop or walking home.

Foxhound38

DERPY HOOFS wrote: »

I do not understand how in this day and age people are still starting taking heroin after the harm it has done to previous generations.My friend works on O Connell Street and she says junkies are always going into her shop and robbing the buns and cakes.She is too afraid to stop them in case they beat her up in the shop or walking home.

It's this idea that society needs to appease them because of the stupid mistake they made getting addicted. Everything is provided for them, and yet we're still walking on eggshells around them. Seriously, I think society has the right to say that we will no longer tolerate their addiction and the affects it has on that society - if that means forcing them to a remote island for as long as it takes to get treatment, then so be it...

Odysseus

whistlingtitan wrote: »

Watching some of posts on here and just brings me back to my first post

We as a nation are far far to pc …
With people not wanting to use the word junkie to giving them free drugs and condom letting them decide if they want treatment

It's reasons like these. Nothing gets done in this country
Find them remove them for at least a year enforced detox as for dealers death Penelty

For me it reinforces that some people just can't listen to others, you asked a question, people who are involved in treatment give you some answers, but you still think your right. The above would just be wasting money as it would not work.

Having professional ethics is not being PC there is a significant difference.

TwoShedsJackson

Gob$hites and all they may be, but lumping wiggers in with junkies is hardly fair.

Snowie

The Waltzing Consumer wrote: »

The rise of the what? :pac:

the rise of the wiggers there like white people who want to be blick :pac:

OldNotWIse

bogmanfan wrote: »

There's a lot of talk about junkies' rights, as though these people are somehow innocent victims. At the end of the day, they started taking heroin. They should accept responsibility for their actions. We live in an age where nobody takes personal responsibility for anything. Everything's somebody else's fault. 'It's the dealers' or 'It's society' or 'It's lack of government funding'. BS. Unless you're forcibly injected with heroin a number of times against your will, then your addiction is your fault.

I would be 100% in favour of sterilisation. I work on Talbot St and see these Walking Dead types every day, pushing prams and screaming at their kids. I don't see how anyone could suggest that these children have a great start in life. How many of them will manage to break out of the family cycle of addiction and unemployment?

And what sort of message will clean, prescription drug clinics send out? You can get hooked on gear, and the government will look after you. Screw that. If a junkie ends up in court for an offence relating to their habit - theft, burglary etc - why can't a judge sentence them to enforced medically-supervised detox? Why should a junkie's right to shoot up outweigh the public's right not to be robbed or mugged by them?

Exactly. Junkies rights are more important than the right of the everyday Joe Soap to commute without being robbed/hassled for change/cigarettes/being stuck in street brawls etc

It's ironic really that those who are against junkie sterilisation will, at the same time, admit that these people are where they are because of their childhoods - they admit that children of these junkies will be at an automatic high risk of becomming users...yet they think they should be allowed to procreate freely.

I'm sick of listening to people banging on about social exclusion and peer pressure and disadvantages and "sure God love him he didn't even have a field to kick a ball in" tripe- my own father and his siblings grew up in a one roomed flat in the mount pleasant tenements. None of them spend their days falling around abbey street pushing buggies and swapping methadone for pills.

whistlingtitan

Odysseus wrote: »

whistlingtitan wrote: »

Watching some of posts on here and just brings me back to my first post

We as a nation are far far to pc …
With people not wanting to use the word junkie to giving them free drugs and condom letting them decide if they want treatment

It's reasons like these. Nothing gets done in this country
Find them remove them for at least a year enforced detox as for dealers death Penelty

For me it reinforces that some people just can't listen to others, you asked a question, people who are involved in treatment give you some answers, but you still think your right. The above would just be wasting money as it would not work.

Having professional ethics is not being PC there is a significant difference.

Oh I beg to differ I read and understand what there saying BUT I also understand that they have a very one sided few and thoughts on it they are at the very heart of the problem
You say my way won't work and waste money !!!!!! Hello is it working now!!!!!!! So as it is it's a waste of money time people's skills but you have already decided its the only way
Meanwhile the public feel afraid of them and we continue to throw good money after bad
Having personal ethics is a nice way of saying I won't deal with the real problem

whistlingtitan

bogmanfan wrote: »

There's a lot of talk about junkies' rights, as though these people are somehow innocent victims. At the end of the day, they started taking heroin. They should accept responsibility for their actions. We live in an age where nobody takes personal responsibility for anything. Everything's somebody else's fault. 'It's the dealers' or 'It's society' or 'It's lack of government funding'. BS. Unless you're forcibly injected with heroin a number of times against your will, then your addiction is your fault.

I would be 100% in favour of sterilisation. I work on Talbot St and see these Walking Dead types every day, pushing prams and screaming at their kids. I don't see how anyone could suggest that these children have a great start in life. How many of them will manage to break out of the family cycle of addiction and unemployment?

And what sort of message will clean, prescription drug clinics send out? You can get hooked on gear, and the government will look after you. Screw that. If a junkie ends up in court for an offence relating to their habit - theft, burglary etc - why can't a judge sentence them to enforced medically-supervised detox? Why should a junkie's right to shoot up outweigh the public's right not to be robbed or mugged by them?

Yep yep yep

df1985

that red luas line is the worst thing to happen to the city centre in years. junkies are bad enough but now we have mobile junkies with an easy place to hassle people.

Prefect_1998

Being in your own city, worried about being hassassed and mugged is one thing but having to witness the pure vile actions of these ' poor unfortunates' can be a eye opener / vomit inducer.

Picture the scene:
sitting in Burger King 6pm, waiting for someone to arrive, two junk bags (1 male, 1 female) sit down at a table in the middle of the eating area.

The female proceedes to struggle to remove her Drug paraphernalia from inside herself and hand it to her friend.

He then goes to the toilets to shoot up or whatever.

Really nice tuesday evening in the capitol city.

D

OldNotWIse

danielle_door wrote: »

Being in your own city, worried about being hassassed and mugged is one thing but having to witness the pure vile actions of these ' poor unfortunates' can be a eye opener / vomit inducer.

Picture the scene:
sitting in Burger King 6pm, waiting for someone to arrive, two junk bags (1 male, 1 female) sit down at a table in the middle of the eating area.

The female proceedes to struggle to remove her Drug paraphernalia from inside herself and hand it to her friend.

He then goes to the toilets to shoot up or whatever.

Really nice tuesday evening in the capitol city.

D

Which reminds me, it seems like they are much more...physically affectionate with each other in public than other couples... Like, waaaaaaaay too affectionate. Cue "junkies have a right to pda's too" onslaught - but like, I dont really want to see anyone eating the face off their other half, or have to listen to the slopping and shlurping of said exchanges at 8am on the luas while trying to keep my breakfast down...

Prefect_1998

i think their self awareness DNA has been eroded by the heroin itself. They do not seem to give a SH1T what they do in public or who they do it to.


Dublin as a whole is a disgrace in the way the situation is dealt with. Would you go anywhere as a tourist if you saw junkie 'women' rooting around in their box for a needle and some gear. Na would not be on the 1000 places to see before you die.

I am not sure there is a solution.

We have an issue in Ireland but especially dublin with a total lack of respect for people around you at a basic Level. The luas from tallaght to city centre is a cess pit of scum. Dublin scum seem to start being scum at a very early age. From 7 ish on they lose the fear of grownups, this leads to a lack of any sort of social standing.

This will only get worse as time goes on because they can get away with more and more, all the while having both hands down their adidas:mad:

I don’t post often but this really pushes buttons.

D

wilkie2006

OldNotWIse wrote: »

Which reminds me, it seems like they are much more...physically affectionate with each other in public than other couples... Like, waaaaaaaay too affectionate. Cue "junkies have a right to pda's too" onslaught - but like, I dont really want to see anyone eating the face off their other half, or have to listen to the slopping and shlurping of said exchanges at 8am on the luas while trying to keep my breakfast down...

To borrow from Andrew Maxwell:

A relationship that survives both people $hitting the bed? Now that is L-O-V-E.

Odysseus

whistlingtitan wrote: »

Oh I beg to differ I read and understand what there saying BUT I also understand that they have a very one sided few and thoughts on it they are at the very heart of the problem
You say my way won't work and waste money !!!!!! Hello is it working now!!!!!!! So as it is it's a waste of money time people's skills but you have already decided its the only way
Meanwhile the public feel afraid of them and we continue to throw good money after bad
Having personal ethics is a nice way of saying I won't deal with the real problem

Firstly personal ethics are not what I metioned I stated professional an even bigger difference. I have pointed out areas about treatment here that where incorrect, so I know the failures of treatment, and I have a good idea how the cutbacks about to be introduced will make things worse.

Where you around to remember what things were like post 1989 pre-methadone days? I can tell you now thing would be really messy if treatment clinics closed tomorrow.

But of course I have only being working and teaching in the area 14 years what would I know.

Logical Fallacy

bogmanfan wrote: »

There's a lot of talk about junkies' rights, as though these people are somehow innocent victims. At the end of the day, they started taking heroin. They should accept responsibility for their actions. We live in an age where nobody takes personal responsibility for anything. Everything's somebody else's fault. 'It's the dealers' or 'It's society' or 'It's lack of government funding'. BS. Unless you're forcibly injected with heroin a number of times against your will, then your addiction is your fault.

I would be 100% in favour of sterilisation. I work on Talbot St and see these Walking Dead types every day, pushing prams and screaming at their kids. I don't see how anyone could suggest that these children have a great start in life. How many of them will manage to break out of the family cycle of addiction and unemployment?

And what sort of message will clean, prescription drug clinics send out? You can get hooked on gear, and the government will look after you. Screw that. If a junkie ends up in court for an offence relating to their habit - theft, burglary etc - why can't a judge sentence them to enforced medically-supervised detox? Why should a junkie's right to shoot up outweigh the public's right not to be robbed or mugged by them?

OldNotWIse wrote: »

Exactly. Junkies rights are more important than the right of the everyday Joe Soap to commute without being robbed/hassled for change/cigarettes/being stuck in street brawls etc

It's ironic really that those who are against junkie sterilisation will, at the same time, admit that these people are where they are because of their childhoods - they admit that children of these junkies will be at an automatic high risk of becomming users...yet they think they should be allowed to procreate freely.

I'm sick of listening to people banging on about social exclusion and peer pressure and disadvantages and "sure God love him he didn't even have a field to kick a ball in" tripe- my own father and his siblings grew up in a one roomed flat in the mount pleasant tenements. None of them spend their days falling around abbey street pushing buggies and swapping methadone for pills.

To be honest I don't give a **** about junkies rights, I am merely interested in what has been shown to have a positive impact for the rest of people in society.

I think both sides are a bit pie in the sky about it tbh. Detox and Methodone don't work, sterilisation is such a pointless thing that will never happen there is no point in even talking about it.

Heroin clinics have been shown to dramtically reduce drug related crimes while also being far cheaper than detox/methadone.

Realistically its the best option if you want positive results.

Gummy Panda

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

Heroin clinics have been shown to dramtically reduce drug related crimes while also being far cheaper than detox/methadone.
.

Was it Norway that was giving out heroin but they had to use it in their special clinics?

I think it was something along the lines of that they would provide all stuff needed to inject heroin but wouldn't actually administer the injection. I have a fuzzy memory of the documentary I seen it in but I think they said it reduced the overdose rate and littering of used syringes.

christmas2012

They have a few plans to open up those special clinics in ireland..

http://www.irishexaminer.com/news/plans-for-consumption-room-to-let-drug-users-inject-under-supervision-180841.html

bullvine

I'm from a big council area in south dublin, I am well familiar with this species.

I was in town friday before last to watch Prometheus with my wife, havent been in town in awhile, I went from Stephens Green over to O'Connell street, it was at 4 O'clock in the daytime. I couldn't believe the amount of scumbags and junkies everywhere. I must have seen about 30 at least, the amount that came up looking for money or whatever, its was an eye opener. Its 10 times worse than it was about 2 years ago. Tourists everywhere getting hassled by them, something needs to be done about it, round them up I say!

The thing I found most bizarre was they dont even have clean clothes any more, in the old days, they'd have their Air Max and Fleck Tracksuits but these new breed are manky dirty, covered in whatever they've been lying in from some lane off Talbot Street.

I was telling the Taxi driver on the way home how shocked I was and he was saying there latest trick with the American Tourists is too wait till they go to the Luas and have big notes on them and cant get a ticket. The Junkie comes over and tells them they'll get them change, innocent/trusting American handds over money.. Junkie never to be seen again.

Odysseus

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

To be honest I don't give a **** about junkies rights, I am merely interested in what has been shown to have a positive impact for the rest of people in society.

I think both sides are a bit pie in the sky about it tbh. Detox and Methodone don't work, sterilisation is such a pointless thing that will never happen there is no point in even talking about it.

Heroin clinics have been shown to dramtically reduce drug related crimes while also being far cheaper than detox/methadone.

Realistically its the best option if you want positive results.

But they do for some people, I have patients on methadone that work in jobs where no one has a clue about their addiction. Each year patients get clean and remain so, in the same way heroin may work for others. Addiction is a subjective illness, no one treatment fits every addict.

But we need more services, people waiting up to 9 months to get into a detox unit, sure if they can stay away from heroin that long, they can detox in the community.

Odysseus

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

To be honest I don't give a **** about junkies rights, I am merely interested in what has been shown to have a positive impact for the rest of people in society.

I think both sides are a bit pie in the sky about it tbh. Detox and Methodone don't work, sterilisation is such a pointless thing that will never happen there is no point in even talking about it.

Heroin clinics have been shown to dramtically reduce drug related crimes while also being far cheaper than detox/methadone.

Realistically its the best option if you want positive results.

Have a look on youtube for a documentary called methadonia if you are interested I use it with students to give them a sense of the issues with methadone.
But we need more services, people waiting up to 9 months to get into a detox unit, sure if they can stay away from heroin that long, they can detox in the community.

bullvine

Odysseus wrote: »

Have a look on youtube for a documentary called methadonia if you are interested I use it with students to give them a sense of the issues with methadone.
But we need more services, people waiting up to 9 months to get into a detox unit, sure if they can stay away from heroin that long, they can detox in the community.

Your not gonna like this but in my opinion the Junkies I know like being Junkies! Lots of them come off it but end up going back to it. Constant relapse, they love the stuff!

laoch na mona

i see every time i go to Dublin we really need to solve the heroin proplem

Bell Butter

laoch na mona wrote: »

i see every time i go to Dublin we really need to solve the heroin proplem

I haven't been in the city for a few years now, what a kip. Google a search on "avoiding dublin" you'll get a lot of american sites telling the tourists to stay away from Dublin and go to the West instead.

laoch na mona

bullvine wrote: »

I'm from a big council area in south dublin, I am well familiar with this species.

there people that made stupid choices but still people

Paulie Gualtieri

junkies , a great bunch of dirty rotten low life scum who would be better off taking a long walk off a short peer.

Gummy Panda

Bell Butter wrote: »

laoch na mona wrote: »

i see every time i go to Dublin we really need to solve the heroin proplem

I haven't been in the city for a few years now, what a kip. Google a search on "avoiding dublin" you'll get a lot of american sites telling the tourists to stay away from Dublin and go to the West instead.

I know. Sure they'd see the lads having the craic, nailing seals heads to boards.

Dionysius2

What I find baffling about all the junkie mayhem on Dublin's O'Connell St and City Centre generally is that those who think that " something should be done about it " never seem to be able to look beyond seeing law enforcement as the answer. How is it possible to believe that any amount of law enforcement will alter the drug fuelled lifestyles of the human dross so devoted to such a destructive way of living ?

* Does anyone know where on the planet tough legal sanctions actually led to drug free zones ?

Odysseus

bullvine wrote: »

Your not gonna like this but in my opinion the Junkies I know like being Junkies! Lots of them come off it but end up going back to it. Constant relapse, they love the stuff!

Why would I not like that, there is some about our psychological relation to pleasure/enjoyment that is connected to addiction and human suffering in general. Sure if it wasn't enjoyable at some level people would not take it.


However, I can have a person in my office tell me how much they want to be clean and within an hour they are off their cake; and they are not lying to me when they tell me that. That is the paradox of addiction.

Ray Palmer

The problem stems from the change to begging laws. You couldn't beg on the streets and now you can. The cops used to be able to arrest them or at least threaten to.
Now they can't really do anything about them. It requires a change to the constitution.

Next referendum we have we should ask that to be added. We should all send the legal people involved in overturning the law a big thank you for defending the constitution and making things better!

SHOVELLER

1. Remove clinics from the city centre. I consider myself pretty well travelled but have never seen such a junkie infestation in any other capital city.

2. Revoke all social welfare rights from junkies. It is reprehensible that the taxpayer are literally paying junkies to consume drugs. This would also include revoking their "free" travel passes.

3. Compulsory sterilisation.

Unfortunately only the first option has been even discussed politically. The others are political suicide so will never happen.

If I was wealthy I would pay junkies to be sterilised like that american company mentioned.

RaRaRasputin

Well, at least we know that the Zombie Walk Dublin will never lack attendants.

I call them what they are, junkies, junkies, junkies, and all those who lament that the term is "dehumanising" should just get off their high horse and do something about that oh so grave problem rather than chastising other peoples' opinions.

plein de force

i wonder who had the bright idea to locate the methadone clinics right slap bang in the middle of the city centre? should have located them in the middle of nowhere and they all seem to have their travel passes so it's not like the poor things will be inconvenienced as they have fcuk all else to do but mug and hassle decent people and fight with each other

RaRaRasputin

Odysseus wrote: »

I metioned this before and so have others ethics that is why. We use to supply the depo injection but due to cut backs we can no longer offer it. See the difference choice, informed consent.

I hope that your "lectures" are more coherent