Best way to get involved with a startup?

Dave!

Hi folks,

I'm just looking for any thoughts here.

I'm 24, working as a web developer at the moment, and am fairly keen to get involved with starting my own company, or else help start a company with someone else, based around a web application of some sort.

I don't know a whole lot of developers, at least not ones that I think would be interested in doing the same, or that I'd be interested in starting one with.

Has anyone any suggestions for how best to network with other Irish developers, or is there a particularly good resource or site which would help bring people together like that?

There is probably a good few non-technical people who are looking to start companies, but I suppose currently I'm interested in working with other developers, or else good designers. I'm still building my skillset, and think I'd learn more working collaboratively with other coders.

Any thoughts?

Cheers

MyPeopleDrankTheSoup

There's a few things around Dublin you can get involved. I say Dublin as that's where everything is.

Most of the good stuff is government funded, like the NDRC Launchpad, http://www.ndrc.ie/launchpad/. They seem to have a lot of money and fund a lot of ideas every year.

I havn't actually attended anything yet myself and am in the same boat as you but I'm thinking of going to Swequity (http://www.inventorium.org/about/swequity/) on June 20th. I've no idea myself but just going as a developer and seeing what's there. You should check it out.

The Corinthian

I'd look at someone with different skills to you and probably not a Web developer, TBH.

Going into business is not simply about the service or product you supply. You have to bring in the business to begin with, then there are other roles to any contract that are not directly development related (analysis, project management, etc) and then there's the whole admin side of things.

You'll have far more success if you bring someone who can sell than another person who can develop like you.

RedXIV

I agree with the above, go for other skills unless you are unsure of your own ability. I was part of a startup with 4 developers only. It was a complete failure as we had no business sense and the most absurd project management style.

There are a good few entrepreneurial groups around and as said, they do tend to congregate around Dublin. Look up the enterprise forum on boards either?

MagicRon

Similar story to Dave. If there are any business heads out there with good ideas, I'd be interested in chatting with them!

Or if you have any ideas yourself Dave

Dave!

Cheers lads

You a techie yourself Ron? Much experience?

I've a handful of things floating about, most are small and not likely to make any money though!

conor.hogan.2

http://www.businessinsider.com/ideas-are-a-dime-a-dozen-execution-is-all-that-matters-2010-10

Apple, MS, Google, Oracle etc

None were particularly first out with their idea/product they make their money from.

Aswerty

I'm kind of in the same boat myself although I'm just looking to ship something and not necessarily be part of a start up. There so much out there that I'm stalling through indecision. I suppose my problem is I haven't done much coding outside of college and work and find it difficult to motivate myself beyond improving my understanding of my current core language or doing things like project Euler problems.

The Corinthian

Seeing as I been an entrepreneur for most of my adult life, perhaps I can impart a few observations I've learned over the last 20-odd years. It's a bit rambling, so apologies in advance.

First and foremost, Conor is quite right in that ideas are two-a-penny. They're like opinions or assholes, everyone has one. The danger is when one becomes blinded by passion for an idea; convinced that it is the 'Next Big Thing' and overvalue it beyond what is rational. Common examples of how such overvaluations play out are that the entrepreneur is so convinced in their idea that they do not properly research it before committing to it and they consider it so valuable that they guard it jealously.

The first will often result in a business being set up based on a business model that turns out to be flawed; expected demand wasn't there after all, or some critical legal or technical flaw ends up being discovered too late. Researching your business idea is the single most important thing you can do, and by research I mean scientifically rather than some ad hoc approach - this isn't some BS research or business plan for some potential investor, this is for you - thus you must be your own Devil's Advocate. Ruthlessly.

The second example will result in unrealistic expectations of partnership; the entrepreneur will seek partners that he or she desperately needs, offering only a tiny percentage even though they themselves bring nothing other than the idea and their conviction in it. As a result, they will rarely get anyone good, as anyone good has better options.

Then there is the reality of entrepreneurship. It is not easy. You are very unlikely to become a millionaire ever, let alone quickly. Your business is not simply about the widgets you supply or the service you offer, but about selling and managing it too. This means that if your business lacks some of these skills (such as an IT company with only developers running it), you'll end up failing sooner or later. It's a job with, ironically in this day and age, often greater job security than most 'permanent' jobs.

I've seen young would-be WebDev firms/consultants argue that €150 p.d. is an excellent rate; after all this translates to €39k p.a. Except that it's not; to begin with there are not 52 working weeks in the year - two are public holidays and then you have to consider 20 days personal holidays too - so there's really 46 working weeks. And then, you need to consider unbillable work such as admin (those VAT returns don't submit themselves), sales and so on; if only 30% of your time is unbillable, you're doing well, but your above income has already dropped to €24k p.a. - and that's before we consider your overheads (rent, equipment, travel, accountants, insurance, etc).

Also, there is a very good chance that your 'idea' will not be what makes you a profit in the long term. Many companies literally stumbled upon success. The Altair 8800 was almost a side project for MITS when it took off, for example. The same can be said for companies like Zamano who are major premium-rate SMS providers; they were originally WAP consultancies that had PSMS on the side and quickly found that the former wasn't paying the bills and the latter was.

MITS didn't adapt accordingly and died when the Altair was superseded. Zamano did and is still around (although it's arguably not adapting to new realities now, but that's another discussion).

In reality many 'ideas' are sexy but not profitable, while those business models that do turn out to work are often unsexy or even go against the entrepreneur's vanity. Classically, most restaurants that fail are because they concentrate on the owner wants, not on what the customer is looking for - you might want to serve good food, but if your market prefers fish and chips, then serve fish and chips. Had you ever wondered why Italians in Ireland more often set up chippers than Italian restaurants, back in the 50's and 60's, after all?

Learn how to use a spreadsheet. You'll need it not simply for doing accounts (though most accounts are done in more specialized applications), but more importantly to project future cash flow. Why this is important is that other than avoiding the common pitfall of running out of money due to poor cash flow management (very common), it will also allow you to continually assess and sanity check where your business is and where it's going - if anywhere.

Partners, if you have some, are important. There are two considerations there; professional and personal. The first is that they compliment you - you want someone who brings something to the business that you don't and that you need. The latter is that they have the right character to collaborate constructively with you, that they don't have serious personal problems (no fun having an alcoholic as a business partner, I can tell you) and that they have a good work ethic. Of the last, you generally want to avoid 'artistic' personality types; they're unreliable and bore with the business grind easily after they've failed to become millionaires in the first year or two.

Also bare in mind, you may not need partners. It depends entirely on your business model and what skills and experience you have. Don't take one on simply because you're lonely - if you want a friend, buy a dog.

A final observation is that the worst thing that can happen to a business is not going bust, but not going bust. That is, SME's can sometimes limp along for years, making little or no money, with sometimes directors literally working without a salary to keep things going. That's where one of the aforementioned sanity checks should cause you to voluntarily close shop and move on.

In summation I'd say the following:

• Idea's are two-a-penny, no matter how special you think yours is.
• Research your business before committing to it. Write a business plan - a real one, not one to keep investors happy.
• Learn how to use a spreadsheet and use it on a regular basis to sanity check your business.
• Business is about profit, not pride; if your idea turns out to be a dog and something else in it is making money, drop your idea and develop the latter. If you're better off in a McJob in the long term than self-employed, close up shop. Be ruthless with yourself.
• Partners are not friends; choose carefully or not at all.

Clanket

Great post The Corinthian. I'm an accountant and everything you've said above is applicable to every type of business. I've seen most types of failure and a good portion of them are for the reasons you've stated.

I've decided to go back and learn how to programme (always had an interest in computers). Only completed 1st year of a degree course but am absolutely loving it. If anyone is looking for financial advice for an IT startup I'd be happy to help, or maybe even get involved in.

The Corinthian

Clanket wrote: »

Great post The Corinthian. I'm an accountant and everything you've said above is applicable to every type of business. I've seen most types of failure and a good portion of them are for the reasons you've stated.

Thanks, although TBH is was as much a rant as a post and could probably add a dozen or more examples of things that you should not do in business.

I suppose if you were to distil what I was saying down to one basic principle it is this: While entrepreneurship can be truly rewarding and fun, it's not a game. Just because you're chasing a dream, does not mean it is also very real in often the most mundane sense.

If anyone is looking for financial advice for an IT startup I'd be happy to help, or maybe even get involved in.

You may regret that

Clanket

The Corinthian wrote: »

You may regret that

Ha hopefully not. I really would like to get involved in a viable IT startup, initially in a financial way. My thinking is that I could then get experience in the programming/technical side.

So if anyone does come up with something, give me a shout.

Dboy85

The Corinthian wrote: »

You may regret that

Clanket wrote: »

Ha hopefully not. I really would like to get involved in a viable IT startup, initially in a financial way. My thinking is that I could then get experience in the programming/technical side.

So if anyone does come up with something, give me a shout.

PM Sent