Lennox due to be put to sleep **Mod Warning - Post 97**

fatmammycat

adrenalinjunkie wrote: »

fatmammycat - I've merged your thread with the existing one.

Oh, thank you.

heartofwhite

Official Statement From Lennox's Family:

http://www.examiner.com/article/family-of-lennox-releases-official-statement-on-doomed-dog-s-fate

We would like to take this opportunity to thank you all again for your messages of support. We are sorry to say at the present time Belfast city council seem to be intent on killing our boy. Despite previous assurances otherwise, we have been denied the opportunity to say goodbye. We have also been told that we cannot collect his body and bring Len home. We have been informed however that we will receive "some" ashes in the mail.

This is disgraceful behaviour. I mean, it is 2012 and who has the right to do this??? If a person is deemed a danger based on appearance, are they put down??? Why in this day and age are animals treated with such disrespect and outright ignorance. I am so so so mad right now.

The Sweeper

Belfast City Council spoke to the BBC earlier this evening and basically said that rehoming Lennox to the US wouldn't fix the problems, because he had been identified as aggressive and unpredictable by behavioural experts. Subsequently they won't release him. Victoria Stilwell has made a good effort but it'll come to nothing I'd say.

The first minister has attempted to intervene and so on but apparently also to no avail.

BCC have to keep Lennox alive past midnight, because the family has a right to lodge an appeal with the supreme court right up to midnight tonight (which they won't do, because they'd just lose and Lennox would spend longer in captivity). Once midnight passes the council have the legal right to euthanise the dog, which I can only imagine they'll do as soon as possible.

dodderangler

I'd love to take that dog he's gorgeous
It's terrible

Binka

The Sweeper wrote: »

BCC have to keep Lennox alive past midnight, because the family has a right to lodge an appeal with the supreme court right up to midnight tonight (which they won't do, because they'd just lose and Lennox would spend longer in captivity). Once midnight passes the council have the legal right to euthanise the dog, which I can only imagine they'll do as soon as possible.

My partner and I said a prayer for Lennox tonight that he will find some peace over the bridge.

stevoman

Imo the dog has been deemed illegal and that'd just that. If the owners wanted some pet for life they could have chosen any of the other 'legal' breeds.

I'm sure some people would love to see American pit bulls legalised in the UK but let's face it, they are the rolls Royce of fighting breeds, bred for this job for hundreds of years. You can't just breed that nature of a them in a few generations. I'm sure the family of 5 year old ellie lawerenson will testify to that, she was not killed by one but decapitated.

I spent days in hospital after being mawled by a dog as a child, so I'm not discriminating against one breed, they all bite, but had it been a pity bull I'm sure I wouldn't be typing this right now.

Melion

stevoman wrote: »

I'm sure the family of 5 year old ellie lawerenson will testify to that, she was not killed by one but decapitated.

I spent days in hospital after being mawled by a dog as a child, so I'm not discriminating against one breed, they all bite, but had it been a pity bull I'm sure I wouldn't be typing this right now.

Decapitated? Really? Why would you come in here and.blatantly talk shít? You know aswell as everyone else who will read that lie that you are talking absolute bóllox.

stevoman

Melion wrote: »

stevoman wrote: »

I'm sure the family of 5 year old ellie lawerenson will testify to that, she was not killed by one but decapitated.

I spent days in hospital after being mawled by a dog as a child, so I'm not discriminating against one breed, they all bite, but had it been a pity bull I'm sure I wouldn't be typing this right now.

Decapitated? Really? Why would you come in here and.blatantly talk shít? You know aswell as everyone else who will read that lie that you are talking absolute bóllox.

post reported. If you take the time to watch the BBC documentary like I did recently that aired a few years ago on dog fighting in northern Ireland, they play an audio testimony of the paramedics who arrived on the scene where he stated he found the body and pool of blood with the head against a chair. That the meaning I took from it.

Just a note on what you wrote there with all the swear words. If you can't hold a reasonable debate with Somewhon perhaps you might find some other forums on the Internet where you might meet other like minded folks who share the same low demeanour as yourself.

DamagedTrax

stevoman wrote: »

Just a note on what you wrote there with all the swear words. If you can't hold a reasonable debate with Somewhon perhaps you might find some other forums on the Internet where you might meet other like minded folks who share the same low demeanour as yourself.

'dangerous dogs' about calavan and the farmer boys? they never said she was decapitated. they said they found her in a pool of blood with her head resting against a chair :rolleyes:

also lennox is an amercian bulldog/lab X (with dna testing to prove it) and is getting called a pit bull 'type'. 100% not an american pit bull terrier.

Melion

stevoman wrote: »

post reported. If you take the time to watch the BBC documentary like I did recently that aired a few years ago on dog fighting in northern Ireland, they play an audio testimony of the paramedics who arrived on the scene where he stated he found the body and pool of blood with the head against a chair. That the meaning I took from it.

Just a note on what you wrote there with all the swear words. If you can't hold a reasonable debate with Somewhon perhaps you might find some other forums on the Internet where you might meet other like minded folks who share the same low demeanour as yourself.

I'm not quite sure why you reported my post as there was no personal abuse in it. Around here it's attack the post, not the poster and that's what I did.
You can take whatever you like from that audio clip but you are very wrong, how about reading the transcript of the grandmothers court statement instead?
People like you really annoy me as you most likely have never been around these "restricted breeds" and have absolutely no experience of them. Just out of interest, what breed of dog "mauled" you when you were young?

Is all that a reasonable enough debate for you?

fatmammycat

DamagedTrax wrote: »

'dangerous dogs' about calavan and the farmer boys? they never said she was decapitated. they said they found her in a pool of blood with her head resting against a chair :rolleyes:

also lennox is an amercian bulldog/lab X (with dna testing to prove it) and is getting called a pit bull 'type'. 100% not an american pit bull terrier.

I don't think DNA testing was done on Lennox and in the court records his owner accepts that he is in fact some kind of Pitbull. Regardless of his breed, the dog is entirely blameless in this entire debacle. Poor old thing. I hate BSL nonsense.

By the way I was mauled by a dog as a child, I almost lost an ear, it was the family collie. Which continued to live with us until it died of old age. * shakes head*

Dirk Gently

Anyone know why they wouldn't allow the family to see the dog before it is put down, and why they will only send ashes out to the family in the post? When was the last independant confirmed visit / check up? BCC seem to be going out of their way to be as unreasonable as possible.

fatmammycat

No idea Dirk, security maybe?
If nothing else, I really hope this case opens up the BSL debate and it is judged to be unjust and unfair. Being a knee-kerk kind of nation I wouldn't be at all surprised if they tried to introduce this kind of thing South of the border. As the owner of a RB dog I would fight this tooth and nail.

Dirk Gently

well it's confirmed that he's been put down.

http://www.belfastcity.gov.uk/news/news.asp?id=3109

stevoman

Melion wrote: »

stevoman wrote: »

I'm not quite sure why you reported my post as there was no personal abuse in it. Around here it's attack the post, not the poster and that's what I did.
You can take whatever you like from that audio clip but you are very wrong, how about reading the transcript of the grandmothers court statement instead?
People like you really annoy me as you most likely have never been around these "restricted breeds" and have absolutely no experience of them. Just out of interest, what breed of dog "mauled" you when you were young?

Is all that a reasonable enough debate for you?

I reported your post because of the use of foul language in it. People like you really annoying me as you cannot reply to a comment in an adult manner without resorting to those kind of words. They are unpleasant to read so please keep the language civil from now on please if you don't mind.

As I said that was the interpretation I took from that audio clip, if I was wrong in that interpretation, fair enough, it still doesn't exclude that poor children died an absolutely horrific death at the jaws of an American pit bull, I breed which I have already stated was bred and developed with the sole intention of dog fighting and further roots back until animal baiting.

Do I have any experience of restricted breeds? Yes I do, my parents have had a rottweiler for the last 11 years, half of its life I live at home with it so I would consider myself having experience with them.

What dog was a I mauled by asking a child? A golden retriever, I received 36 stitches in the head when I was four years old and spent quite a lot of time recovering from it. As I said any breed will bite, but had it have been an American pit bull I believe the outcome could have been far worse.

I wouldn't trust any dog around a child as a rule of thumb. I breed and more importantly train springer spaniels for the field and have been doing so for some time. I wouldn't trust any of the dogs around my two children regardless of how well I know there temperaments.

Regardless of any situation, American pit bulls have been deemed illegal in the UK and this dog has been deemed to to be an American pit bull terrier, hence it is illegal now to be in the possession of that animal and now it has to be put down. That's the law. If people wish to continue to flaunt that law in the UK then they must be prepared to face the consequences of knowing they are sentencing that animal to death if they are caught. End of.

andreac

stevoman wrote: »

Melion wrote: »

Regardless of any situation, American pit bulls have been deemed illegal in the UK and this dog has been deemed to to be an American pit bull terrier, hence it is illegal now to be in the possession of that animal and now it has to be put down. That's the law. If people wish to continue to flaunt that law in the UK then they must be prepared to face the consequences of knowing they are sentencing that animal to death if they are caught. End of.

Actually it wasnt deemed to be an American Pit Bull Terrier, it was deemed to be pit bull "type" dog because it "looked" kind of like a pitbull, not because it was an actual pitbull.

DamagedTrax

fatmammycat wrote: »

I don't think DNA testing was done on Lennox

it was. it just wasnt admissable in court as it is a law based on look rather than fact

and in the court records his owner accepts that he is in fact some kind of Pitbull

his owners agreed that he fit the pit bull 'type' not that he was any kind of pitbull. if the courts turned around tomorrow and decided that all poms were pit bull 'types' that still wouldnt make them a pitbull.

if i were to go on 'type' laws my bitch would be a pit bull 'type' yet she's a staffordshire

ISDW

DamagedTrax wrote: »

'dangerous dogs' about calavan and the farmer boys? they never said she was decapitated. they said they found her in a pool of blood with her head resting against a chair :rolleyes:

also lennox is an amercian bulldog/lab X (with dna testing to prove it) and is getting called a pit bull 'type'. 100% not an american pit bull terrier.

DNA testing in dogs is so flawed that its useless. I didn't think that he had ever been DNA tested, and his owner did admit that he was 'of type'.

Finally the poor dog is at peace.

I don't know the reasons the family weren't allowed to visit him etc, but I can only assume it was for security. With all of the hatred and personal attacks on BCC staff, I'm not sure that I don't blame them for taking this stance - death threats etc.

Unfortunately though 'type' is the law, thats why its so hard to fight against.

DamagedTrax

stevoman wrote: »

As I said that was the interpretation I took from that audio clip, if I was wrong in that interpretation, fair enough, it still doesn't exclude that poor children died an absolutely horrific death at the jaws of an American pit bull, I breed which I have already stated was bred and developed with the sole intention of dog fighting and further roots back until animal baiting.

and if you knew anything of the breed you'd know that the reason they are so human safe is because of their fighting blood.

its the X-bred dogs and the ones that are bred with no consideration to temperment that are causing the problems. coupled with an owner that doesnt understand the breed (or even worse fully understands them and uses them for the wrong reasons) you get a recipe for disaster.

its not well bred pitbull terriers that are the problem.

Jimmy Bottlehead

I honestly do think that BCC should be absolutely ashamed of themselves. It's absolutely abysmal that this happened.

toadfly

To be fair to the BCC, its not as black and white as the family are making out. At the end of the day the family are to blame. The council are following the (flawed) law and they have had no choice in that.

The family were offered rescue space in the republic in May 2010, they refused and didnt take the advice of this rescue that Lennox didnt have a hope of getting out alive if they continued and his only chance was over the border but they didnt listen. He was deemed dangerous, this isnt just about his looks.

RIP Lennox, you didnt deserve all this.

DamagedTrax

for the people that dont understand the different terminologies in this case.

american pitbull terrier - seperate breed

pit bull dog family - american pit bull, amstaff, staffordshire bull terrier (and some would say older hinks bull terrier)

pit bull 'type' - any dog that falls within the measurements and looks characteristic of an american pit bull terrier. (ie boxer/lab x can easily be considered a pitbull 'type' and often do in the UK. how does that make sense?)

andreac

andreac wrote: »

stevoman wrote: »

Actually it wasnt deemed to be an American Pit Bull Terrier, it was deemed to be pit bull "type" dog because it "looked" kind of like a pitbull, not because it was an actual pitbull.

Which is not really great for a country with so many discrimination problems. Again nothing learned from this situation. Its just been one big cluster puck.

stevoman

andreac wrote: »

Actually it wasnt deemed to be an American Pit Bull Terrier, it was deemed to be pit bull "type" dog because it "looked" kind of like a pitbull, not because it was an actual pitbull.

Either way he looks the part Imo so I think they got that decision to class him as that type correct.

toadfly

DamagedTrax wrote: »

pit bull 'type' - any dog that falls within the measurements and looks characteristic of an american pit bull terrier. (ie boxer/lab x can easily be considered a pitbull 'type' and often do in the UK. how does that make sense?)

It doesnt make even the tiniest bit of sense thats why the law is so messed up. Some states in the US have overturned BSL, dont know if it will ever change in the UK. I just hope to god it never comes in here.

DamagedTrax

TillyGirl wrote: »

He was deemed dangerous, this isnt just about his looks.

he was also deemed not dangerous by others. and no its more than just about his looks. its about ego and politics on all sides as far as i can see.

i cant comprehend the families decision not to let EGAR take him just as much as i cant comprehend the court's decision that he was a 'type' or their decision not to allow him to be rehomed

toadfly

DamagedTrax wrote: »

i cant comprehend the families decision not to let EGAR take him just as much as i cant comprehend the court's decision that he was a 'type' or their decision not to allow him to be rehomed

Neither can I and thats one of the big problems with this case. If they had his best interests at heart they would have let him go. Look at Bruce now, I've met him and hes so happy at EGAR.

Have you read EGARs statement on this?

DamagedTrax

TillyGirl wrote: »

Have you read EGARs statement on this?

i did. to be honest ive read so many accounts that ive stopped believing all sides now.

lennox is dead and a lot of people involved failed him.

fatmammycat

TillyGirl wrote: »

Neither can I and thats one of the big problems with this case. If they had his best interests at heart they would have let him go. Look at Bruce now, I've met him and hes so happy at EGAR.

Have you read EGARs statement on this?

I have, and I think it speaks volumes. Also - http://www.llaav.com/index.php/the-truth-2 has opened my eyes a little further regarding this dog's plight.

DamagedTrax

stevoman wrote: »

Either way he looks the part Imo so I think they got that decision to class him as that type correct.

just like all black people eat chicken and are crack heads.
all french are ignorant
all irish are drunks
all english are yobs





thats a picture of him as a puppy. pointless of you to use it as how can a puppy be 'type'? type laws are based on adult dogs as the breed standard is also. you cant apply a type law to an puppy.