Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 11/12

TheTownie

Blatter wrote: »

Darren Can ‏@Darren_Can
Earlier:Ferguson reported absent from tour due to "club business." Now: his media mouthpiece Bob Cass says Lucas Moura set for #MUFC medical



Here's the article:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2183770/Manchester-United-splash-50m-Lucas-Moura-Robin-Van-Persie-Glazers-send-signal.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

Crayons at the ready people...

Pro. F

Blatter wrote: »

Darren Can ‏@Darren_Can
Earlier:Ferguson reported absent from tour due to "club business." Now: his media mouthpiece Bob Cass says Lucas Moura set for #MUFC medical

I'll be very disappointed if this deal is for anything over £20m.

Unless Nani goes (which would be its own separate disappointment). If Nani were to leave then that would be a reasonable explanation as to why Fergie would spend big on a player like Moura.

Whatsisname

MagicMarker wrote: »

Nick Powell's goal last night, Bebe involved in the build up wearing No. 7. :eek:

Am I the only one who thinks he resembles De Gea in the thumbnail?

Your Airbag

Jame Gumb wrote: »

The point that you're trying to make doesn't make sense.

If a guy comes in on a free transfer and becomes a useful squad player, he's been successful.

If a guy comes in for the biggest fee ever and becomes a useful squad player, he has not really been successful.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree. I can't see the logic in your point either but hey, thats football. In terms of a free transfer, thats slightly going of point and its easy for anyone to be a success if you use that reasoning.

I'll take one last shot at trying to explain myself. If Berb came on a free and did what he did you would class him a success. He came for a big fee and has done the same. I judge a footballer on his ability, goals etc not the fee attached to him. How you can say he's a flop as a football player because of his fee but than say he's a success as a footballer because of his lack of fee? it doesnt make sense to me. You judge a footballer on his football.

Torres for example. 50m. Big fee. He can be considered a flop so far for a shocking lack of goals, again its what he does on the pitch that dictates this but lets just say he finished one goal behind of the top scorer last season who was RVP and Chelsea won what they did, FA cup and CL, plus the EPL.

He would be deemed a success and his fee never mentioned. Even though his fee is 47m above the 3m Arsenal paid for RVP, even with one goal less he would be called a success and no jokes heard about his fee. Thats becasue a player is rightly judjed by what they do on the pitch which usually brings success. There should be no fee to goal ratio expected of a player, its unrealistic.

PS My last reply to you was a bit strong. Your new here Jamie and I like your posting thus far mainly because you have manners and respect, there is a complete lack of it in here sometimes and my last post my have come across like this. Keep up the contibution, your a good addition to the forum.

It doesnt help I'm Berbs biggest fan either I guess. Right I'm off out. Keep it fictional ladies and gentleman.

DM_7

Re Berba

He was bought to bring new options to the side, score goals, lead the attack when Rooney was out, win trophies.

He met this targets on many occasions, sometimes he didn't - that is normal for a footballer (some of the problems meeting those expectations are arguably more to do with SAF than Berbatov).

Most importantly, for me, he made significant contributions towards United being successful.

I know he was not a 'great' success. But so what? It doesn't mean he was a flop. Flop means fail completely. He did not fail to make a contribution to success at United. He often played his part to a high level.

Donnielighto

What would people make of Moura in for ~25M and nani out for big bucks, 30/35M with the difference put toward sahin or some other young and proven CM/DCM?

I'd hate to see nani leave but it would soften the blow

Donnielighto

Re berba

The fee is about value for money.

The performance is whether or not the player was a success.


Both of these are important and subjective.

Liam O

Donnielighto wrote: »

What would people make of Moura in for ~25M and nani out for big bucks, 30/35M with the difference put toward sahin or some other young and proven CM/DCM?

I'd hate to see nani leave but it would soften the blow

As much as I love Nani (and I really do ) if you told me that for the price he was sold for United would get Lucas and Sahin I think I'd take it. It wont happen though and if United gave the money for Sahin then the team would be better off with Nani than Lucas.

3hn2givr7mx1sc

bullvine wrote: »

It makes total sense you said we wouldnt have won the league had Berbatov not scored a hat trick but whose to say if someone had played instead they wouldnt have done as well, 7-8 players were far more influential that season than berbatov. Theres a reason he didnt even make the bench for the Barca Game. You think he had a Van Nistelrooy 2003 season the ways yis are drooling over him.

Woah there, where did I say United wouldn't have won the league if he didn't score that hat-trick? If ifs and buts were candy and nuts we'd be having a fecking feasht, but the facts are Berbatov played in those games and scored those goals. You're the one coming out with the "if" scenarios, not me. I'm speaking about what actually happened, not what might have happened if this fella or that fella played.

Jame Gumb

Cheers dude.

I actually like Berbatov and the match vs Barca was crying out for him in my view. Chico just kept running offside and giving the ball away. To have any chance, we needed someone with the technical ability to hold the ball up and work in tight spaces to distribute it to others. In Fergie we trust obviously but he got it wrong that night.

Donnielighto

Liam O wrote: »

As much as I love Nani (and I really do ) if you told me that for the price he was sold for United would get Lucas and Sahin I think I'd take it. It wont happen though and if United gave the money for Sahin then the team would be better off with Nani than Lucas.

Oh im not saying nani would pay for them both just cover one and pay for a chunk of the other. I'd rather have sahin(or other) and nani than Lucas, sahin(or other) and 10M

shrewdness

Alot of talk from different sources on Twitter that a deal for Lucas is far along, to the point of a medical tomorrow! Seems to be all coming from the following article in tomorrow's Daily Mail, so naturally I'm not believing anything! Would be nice if there was a bit of truth in it and it might explain why Fergie's stayed back from the next preseason game, we live in hope!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2183770/Manchester-United-splash-50m-Lucas-Moura-Robin-Van-Persie-Glazers-send-signal.html

Lord TSC

Liam O wrote: »

As much as I love Nani (and I really do ) if you told me that for the price he was sold for United would get Lucas and Sahin I think I'd take it.

Same here really. I think it would strengthen the overall squad by signing the two players and losing Nani. I'd hate for him to go and not be replaced, but if we got those two in and lost Nani, I'd live

Copper_pipe

He smiles again!

IvySlayer

What a pathetic cake.

VW 1

Sahin and Lucas for Nani would be acceptable, however likelihood is it would be nani plus at least 20m for Sahin and Lucas, if Sahin even wanted to come to us..

I'd gladly swap Nani if it meant getting both of these however.

Donnielighto

VW 1 wrote: »

Sahin and Lucas for Nani would be acceptable, however likelihood is it would be nani plus at least 20m for Sahin and Lucas, if Sahin even wanted to come to us..

I'd gladly swap Nani if it meant getting both of these however.

Gladly? I do it, reluctantly but I'd do it, feel awful guilty about it though

dahat

VW 1 wrote: »

Sahin and Lucas for Nani would be acceptable, however likelihood is it would be nani plus at least 20m for Sahin and Lucas, if Sahin even wanted to come to us..

I'd gladly swap Nani if it meant getting both of these however.

Why are people discussing Sahin,sure there is little or no links with us!!!!
We may as well be talking about Roy of the rovers!
If Lucas comes in Nani goes out,may not br this season but definately next seasons end imo.

bullvine

I agree the Moura deal makes no sense unless Nani is gone, haven't seen much of Sahin but hes got a fairly massive rep from what I gather. It will never happen if its a loan though.

Hes gone to Arsenal I'd say, Wenger likes his loan deals.

Donnielighto

dahat wrote: »

Why are people discussing Sahin,sure there is little or no links with us!!!!
We may as well be talking about Roy of the rovers!
If Lucas comes in Nani goes out,may not br this season but definately next seasons end imo.

I was using him as an example, really just an analog for a top tier youngish cm that can handle himself defensively and is technically proficient. Wordy due to thesis writing lately, forgive me. Also wired on amazing ground coffee.

SirDelboy18

Beyond strange that we would potentially sell Nani and keep Ashley Young on the books. There is a massive gulf in class between the two.

G.K.

Different roles in the squad I guess?

Deank

shrewdness wrote: »

Alot of talk from different sources on Twitter that a deal for Lucas is far along, to the point of a medical tomorrow! Seems to be all coming from the following article in tomorrow's Daily Mail, so naturally I'm not believing anything! Would be nice if there was a bit of truth in it and it might explain why Fergie's stayed back from the next preseason game, we live in hope!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2183770/Manchester-United-splash-50m-Lucas-Moura-Robin-Van-Persie-Glazers-send-signal.html

Bullsh!t articale, they've quoted Inter Milan as one of the preferred suitors of RVP, eh wrong, they want Lucas not RVP, that'll be Juventus.... Tabloid journalism wrecks my head....:mad:

Owen_S

The Daily Fail was the only major British paper which suggested that the fake boards.ie generated transfer rumour was likely to go ahead...

FutureGuy

Keno 92 wrote: »

European tour squad announced.

Tour squad: De Gea, Lindegaard; Evra, Ferdinand, Jones, M Keane, Vidic; Anderson, Carrick, Nani, Powell, Lingard, Scholes, Valencia, Young; Berbatov, Hernandez, Kagawa, Macheda, Rooney, Welbeck

Sun 5 - Valerenga (Oslo)
Wed 8 - Barcelona (Gothenburg)
Sat 11 - Hannover 96 (Hanover)

They spelled Bebe incorrectly.

J. Marston

Selling Nani would be madness.

Madness!

Winston Payne

SirDelboy18 wrote: »

Beyond strange that we would potentially sell Nani and keep Ashley Young on the books. There is a massive gulf in class between the two.

Between all the contract machinations that might be the way it falls. Hope not though. Surely Nani will sign, he's already amended his terms a few times. By January our worries will be over. Maybe.

RVD420

I'm terrified. If these reports are true and Moura and RVP come in, it has to signal the selling of Nani and Rooney. I fear this transfer window may mark the end of days for United.

RVD420

RVD420 wrote: »

I'm terrified. If these reports are true and Moura and RVP come in, it has to signal the selling of Nani and Rooney. I fear this transfer window may mark the end of days for United.

I doubt Fergie would replace 2 players with inferiority.

I thought the LFC thread was nuts...

Kylo Ren

RVD420 wrote: »

I'm terrified. If these reports are true and Moura and RVP come in, it has to signal the selling of Nani and Rooney. I fear this transfer window may mark the end of days for United.

lols

MikeyCdublin

Seen Robbie Brady tonight in the wright venue asked him was he staying or going on loan he said he will know next week

Professional Griefer

Would love to hear tomorrow Moura is with us. Hopefully its true and not all bollox.

Fergie missing is probably nothing though.

Lord TSC

What time is the game on today? Can't wait to see the full first team back in action

Al Capwned

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

What time is the game on today? Can't wait to see the full first team back in action

3 o clock, and I wont get to see it as I'm playing in League Cup game today for my club.

Will I Amnt

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

What time is the game on today? Can't wait to see the full first team back in action

15:00pm according to livescore.

TheFullDuck

Some claim by Ken Lawrence in the sunday world today. Article is basically about how Vidic's return is essential to United's season, which I agree with.
However, he then says in the closing paragraph that DDG's gaffes ultimately cost United the title. BS surely? He saved them more points in the 2nd half of the season than he cost them overall.


I'm a bit of a DDG fanboy so I hate to see unwarranted bashing of the man!

sob1467

Interesting if true

Manchester United 'look to hijack Nuri Sahin's Arsenal transfer'
Manchester United are hoping to derail Arsenal's bid to sign Nuri Sahin on loan, by making an offer to buy him, according to reports in Spain.
Like his Gunners counterpart Arsene Wenger, United boss Sir Alex Ferguson is in the market for another creative midfielder and is keeping a close eye on Sahin's situation at Real Madrid.

Nuri Sahin looks certain to leave Real Madrid for the Premier League (Picture: Getty)
The Turkey international has struggled to make an impact in La Liga since his move from Borussia Dortmund last summer and Real Madrid boss Jose Mourinho is happy for him to leave on a temporary basis.
Arsenal are said to be close to agreeing terms to take the 23-year-old on a season-long loan, but the Red Devils are preparing an alternative proposal, reports Marca.
United want to sign Sahin on a permanent basis and are apparently ready to lodge a formal bid.
The player is said to be excited by the interest from Old Trafford, but may find it difficult to persuade Real Madrid to agree to a sale.
Both Mourinho and club president Florentino Perez have high hopes for Sahin and believe he could return to the Santiago Bernabeu next summer ready to secure a place in the first team.
One factor that could change Madrid's stance is their attempt to sign Luka Modric.
If they can finally agree a fee with Spurs for the Croatian, it would push Sahin further down the pecking order and make a permanent departure more likely.

http://www.metro.co.uk/sport/907451-manchester-united-look-to-hijack-nuri-sahins-arsenal-transfer#ixzz22ez8uzuC

kryogen

sob1467 wrote: »

Interesting if true



http://www.metro.co.uk/sport/907451-manchester-united-look-to-hijack-nuri-sahins-arsenal-transfer#ixzz22ez8uzuC

A load would be blown if we could get Sahin! Even being seriously interested would be a positive sign at this stage!

Jame Gumb

TheFullDuck wrote: »

However, he then says in the closing paragraph that DDG's gaffes ultimately cost United the title. BS surely? He saved them more points in the 2nd half of the season than he cost them overall

Morning Guys.

Did he though? Has anyone ever done a definitive analysis of this?

You've admitted that your a fan, so it's only natural for your view to be slanted a certain way. That's not a criticism - It's just being realistic.

I'm in the middle when it comes to De Gea - I'd say that last season's "debits and credits" probably balance out. However, coming after guys like Schmiechel and Van Der Saar who generally saved us more points than they cost us, a "break even scenario" really isn't good enough IMO.

The save towards the end of the Chelsea game at Stanford Bridge springs to mind as his best last season but we have to remember that we only got a point from that game. On the flipside, the "haters" don't have to look too far for "gaffes" that cost us three points.

The key point from my perspective is that the guy's extremely young for a goalkeeper AND on an upward curve performance wise. I expect him to be much better next season and to improve every season for the forseeable future. That should leave us in a very good place goalkeeper wise. The other great thing is that we have Lindergaard who is a super alternative.

It's all about the midfield Sir Alex! Get that chequebook out...Modric, Sahin, Fellaini...we'd be happy with one!

J

Al Capwned

Right, ignoring my sig for a minute, I'll try not be biased in this.

Regarding the goalkeeping situation, I cannot understand the argument by some to have Anders Lindegaard as the #1 keeper for us next term. David de Gea is, by far, the vastly superior goalkeeper. Some of his shot-stopping in particular, has been breathtaking. Literally.

That is not to say, however, that Lindegaard is not a top quality keeper - he is, but he is a level below DDG.

Granted, his dealing with crosses needs to (and has) improved, but what really stands out for me is his ability with the ball at his feet - he is as good a passer of the ball as many midfielders, and that attribute is massively important.
What's the point in throwing the ball back to your keepers feet if he can't keep the ball by passing it to one of his team mates. Just lumping it 60 yards turns it into a coin toss as to who gets possession. And with the always growing need not to give the ball away, especially against the better sides and in Europe, this is a huge bonus to have a keeper that proficient with the ball at his feet.

Lindegaard is a damn good understudy, and shouldn't be treated as anything more. de Gea should be our number 1 for many years to come.

kryogen

Who is saying Lindegaard should be the numner one?

Al Capwned

Ah not necessarily on here, Kryogen, but a few of my mates seem to think he should be.
________

I must try remember - Internet Forum =/= Lads at counter

I guess here is just a good place to vent, because if I try that argument later, Heineken will shout me down.

TheFullDuck

Jame Gumb wrote: »

TheFullDuck wrote: »

However, he then says in the closing paragraph that DDG's gaffes ultimately cost United the title. BS surely? He saved them more points in the 2nd half of the season than he cost them overall

Morning Guys.

Did he though? Has anyone ever done a definitive analysis of this?

You've admitted that your a fan, so it's only natural for your view to be slanted a certain way. That's not a criticism - It's just being realistic.

I'm in the middle when it comes to De Gea - I'd say that last season's "debits and credits" probably balance out. However, coming after guys like Schmiechel and Van Der Saar who generally saved us more points than they cost us, a "break even scenario" really isn't good enough IMO.

The save towards the end of the Chelsea game at Stanford Bridge springs to mind as his best last season but we have to remember that we only got a point from that game. On the flipside, the "haters" don't have to look too far for "gaffes" that cost us three points.

The key point from my perspective is that the guy's extremely young for a goalkeeper AND on an upward curve performance wise. I expect him to be much better next season and to improve every season for the forseeable future. That should leave us in a very good place goalkeeper wise. The other great thing is that we have Lindergaard who is a super alternative.

It's all about the midfield Sir Alex! Get that chequebook out...Modric, Sahin, Fellaini...we'd be happy with one!

J

A quick google of points won vs lost came up with nothing but off the top of my head the reaction saves vs Stoke, the saves at Norwich where Giggs went on to score a late winner and that save vs Chelsea were all points winning saves. To be fair I'll admit he cost us points vs Blackburn. The City demolishing wasn't his fault, defence were non-existant that day and although he did cost us a goal vs West Brom we still went on and won so it wasn't a costly mistake.

Like you said I'm a fan so maybe I'm forgetting some other gaffes :pac: but I'd never deliberately ignore them. He has the potential to be the best keeper in the world one day and he has shown plenty of that potential. Hopefully he will be United's no.1 for many years!

Regarding Lindegaard I agree with alproctor, a solid keeper that would do a good job for many teams in the league, but should be nothing more than our second choice. after signing a new contract recently he must be content to be no.2. Although, it was interesting to hear Eric Steele come out and say he has the chance to take the starting spot.

double GG

Delighted to see Modric is edging closer and closer to Real, and not see us wasting 40 million on him. Now to see Dembele signing a new contract at Fulham so we don't buy an average midfielder.

Jame Gumb

I hope we don't sign Moura or Van Persie.

It'd be like putting in a games room when you've no kitchen.

Sahin, Fergie...get involved.

sob1467

TheFullDuck wrote: »

A quick google of points won vs lost came up with nothing but off the top of my head the reaction saves vs Stoke, the saves at Norwich where Giggs went on to score a late winner and that save vs Chelsea were all points winning saves. To be fair I'll admit he cost us points vs Blackburn. The City demolishing wasn't his fault, defence were non-existant that day and although he did cost us a goal vs West Brom we still went on and won so it wasn't a costly mistake.

Like you said I'm a fan so maybe I'm forgetting some other gaffes :pac: but I'd never deliberately ignore them. He has the potential to be the best keeper in the world one day and he has shown plenty of that potential. Hopefully he will be United's no.1 for many years!

Regarding Lindegaard I agree with alproctor, a solid keeper that would do a good job for many teams in the league, but should be nothing more than our second choice. after signing a new contract recently he must be content to be no.2. Although, it was interesting to hear Eric Steele come out and say he has the chance to take the starting spot.

A great keeper yes but also to add to that list the two mistakes against basel that cost us a place in the knockout stages of the Champions League but must agree he redeemed himself in the second half of the season and deserves to be number one.

Also Alex Ferguson is a manager who usually does not rotate his goalkeepers whilst his number one is in good form. Maybe at the start of last year he was testing the two goalkeepers to see who was the better.

Jame Gumb

I think that DDG's first season was "okay"...not the disaster that some former contributors would claim but not the resounding success that some DDG fans would claim either.

However, the key thing is that he's young and his performances are on an upward curve.

We're well served at goalkeeper (and centre half, winger and up front). We need midfielders and fullbacks urgently. We've one left back and one right back (with some wingers and centre halves that can fill in during emergencies) and the midfield issue remains.

Giggsy11

It will be interesting to see who will play as LB today. We had only one LB in the squad and Evra has left the squad.

I have seen Keane playing as CM, RB and DM but not as LB.

Chancer3001

ddg cost ye 1/3 points vs blackburn when he was too wimpy to compete in the air against grant hanley, and also let yakubu score from an angle he shudda covered.

(although, you could of course blame rooney for that game too. that was the one he got dropped from the squad for)

Liam O

There was a period last season, probably around Christmas, might have been the Blackburn game where De Gea was floundering at pretty much every cross and I lost a lot of hope in him. It was more feeling sorry for him rather than angry at him. He did well in the 2nd half of the season and restored a lot of my faith in him but the jury is well and truly still out on him imo and Lindegaard has impressed a lot in pre season and when he played last season. Tbh, I'd be more than happy for either to be first choice.