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Comments

  • #52
    Lantus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,027 ✭✭✭Lantus


    NO.

    The minute we let private companies who may well be run by shareholders run our core services then the primary function of that organisation is to please its shareholders and generate dividends rather than care, heal or teach.

    A country can run its services properly if we: -

    A - Put the right people in control
    B - Put the right systems and polices in place.

    Today in my town we have the same councillers and same TD's running as were present when I arrived here 8 years ago. Systemic apathy pervades every corner of irish political life and that in turns ensures a badly run and broken system that no leader has any will or desire to change as the status quo they enjoy in their limited circle is fine.

    It would be nice to see some competition amongst the brighest and best this country has to offer in stepping up to change our country for the better.


  • #53
    ardmacha
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,476 ✭✭✭ardmacha


    Privatisation or not, defined benefit pensions should be banned, they're a stupid stupid idea in a public or private job.

    There is nothing intrinsically stupid about defined benefit pensions, except that people have been living longer.


  • #54
    hardCopy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,969 ✭✭✭hardCopy


    ardmacha wrote: »
    There is nothing intrinsically stupid about defined benefit pensions, except that people have been living longer.

    As they will continue to do, the schemes never work unless the company manages to grow exponentially and new recruits continuously top up the kitty. As soon as a company stagnates they're left with a pension deficit.


  • #55
    cgarrad
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,611 ✭✭✭cgarrad


    Lantus wrote: »
    NO.

    A country can run its services properly if we: -

    A - Put the right people in control
    B - Put the right systems and polices in place.

    Eh that's the initial problem???? It cant be done under state control. Has the last 15-20 governments not proved that already?


  • #56
    opti0nal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 892 ✭✭✭opti0nal


    ardmacha wrote: »
    There is nothing intrinsically stupid about defined benefit pensions, except that people have been living longer.
    Thanks to public sector health care?


  • #57
    sarumite
    Registered Users Posts: 2,909 ✭✭✭sarumite


    ardmacha wrote: »
    There is nothing intrinsically stupid about defined benefit pensions, except that people have been living longer.

    Most DB schemes are in deficit at the moment....many of them substantially. People have been living longer for a quite a while. Its not a new problem. While it may not be an intrinsically stupid idea, it is stupid to continue to offer them as long as they remain unsustainable.


  • #58
    creedp
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,815 ✭✭✭creedp


    sarumite wrote: »
    Most DB schemes are in deficit at the moment....many of them substantially. People have been living longer for a quite a while. Its not a new problem. While it may not be an intrinsically stupid idea, it is stupid to continue to offer them as long as they remain unsustainable.


    If they are unsustainable then either the contributions are too low or the contributions are not wisely invested. For people who know about these things would it be fair to say that a reason many Irish defined pension schemes are in deficit is that they were too heavily invested in Irish banks?


  • #59
    sarumite
    Registered Users Posts: 2,909 ✭✭✭sarumite


    creedp wrote: »
    If they are unsustainable then either the contributions are too low or the contributions are not wisely invested. For people who know about these things would it be fair to say that a reason many Irish defined pension schemes are in deficit is that they were too heavily invested in Irish banks?

    DB pensions face bigger challenges than DC pensions. All things being equal (i.e. DC pensions were no less likely to invest in Irish banks), then questions about the viability of DB pensions persists. From what I have read the problem is a little of both, contributions are too low and return on investment is too low. The pension payments are based on an absolute quantifiable yearly amount which isn't always directly related to the contribution of the pensioner.


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