Italy v Ireland, Poznan, KO 7:45pm

Tigerandahalf

Id bring on shane long for Keane. Italy look vulnerable when we run at them. Pirlo at the base of their diamond is a weak defender. Only problem now is that Italy will sit back, be v hard to break down.

Francie Barrett

Mushy wrote: »

I've only seen Given's conceding of the corner....WTF!

A few seconds before that we had the ball and Ward lost possession that led to the shot at Given.

noodler

Samich wrote: »

Yeah after his howlers in the other games!

Westwood is a very good goalie!

Who can't get a game for Sunderland?

On what basis is Westwood a better goalkeepr than Given?

I don't understand you wishing our best keeper would retire so that somebody who can't get a game for Sunderland will replace him.

Given may well retire out of his own choice but I would certainly prefer it if he stuck around for another campaign.

Samich

Long for Keane please.

SirDelboy18

Marc Wilson is having a great time watching Ward make a complete tít of himself at this tournament is all I can say.

SantryRed

WallyGUFC wrote: »

Buffon having very little to do. We're so uncreative. When we try (Whelan's horrific pass) we see that this squad can't. But there are more talented players who Trap has consostently overlooked. Trap out.

Wish he'd just fcuking play 4-5-1 against the better sides. Give us a fcuking chance. Keane is doing nothing anyways and so is Doyle.

Barr

devotional1993 wrote: »

Stan's calling them by nicknames and first names-duffer this-aidan that.

The match is also on BBC HD for anyone who does not have saorview and wantS to watch it in HD.

kryogen

Francie Barrett wrote: »

Watch the goal, Stephen Ward gave the ball away under no pressure at all that led to the corner where Italy scored.

No he didn't Whelan did

Ah, you mean the second ball, me see

Samich

noodler wrote: »

Who can't get a game for Sunderland?

On what basis is Westwood a better goalkeepr than Given?

I don't understand you wishing our best keeper would retire so that somebody who can't get a game for Sunderland will replace him.

Given may well retire out of his own choice but I would certainly prefer it if he stuck around for another campaign.

St Ledger can't get a game for Leicester? :rolleyes: Your point being?

steelcityblues

Embarrassing how the travelling hoardes continually boo the Croatian, Spanish and now Italian players. 'Best fans', indeed.

gandalf

Agree with the general opinion Keane should be taken off for Long. I have a bad feeling that Trap will put on Cox for Doyle though

tayto lover

Francie Barrett wrote: »

A few seconds before that we had the ball and Ward lost possession that led to the shot at Given.

Which Given should have held easily.

eyescreamcone

keith16 wrote: »

Maybe Given wouldn't be making so many mistakes if he didn't have so much to do thanks to us been unable string two passes together....

Given looks unfit.
He looks like a guy who put on a few pounds while out injured.
Compared to other keepers he looks fat!!

His 3 performances in the Euros have been below his normal standard.
Are his best performances now a thing of the past???

ambid

Francie Barrett wrote: »

Watch the goal, Stephen Ward gave the ball away under no pressure at all that led to the corner where Italy scored.

Actually you're right.

In fairness though two Italians were closing him down and no Irish were showing for the ball. We're very bad a offering options to the man in possession. It's the same when Whelan gave the ball away at the start of that move - he had no viable short options and had to look for a long pass. He should have been offered him short pass options. It's too easy to criticise the guy in possession rather than the others who hide and who don't offer options to the guy in possession.

noodler

edgecutter wrote: »

Please remind yourself of Ireland vs Bulgaria and then think why we didnt qualify as winnerd for the world cup.

We scored early in both games and than receded into our shells as per usual until Bulgaria equalised.

Surely you understand I wasn't seriously advocating a return for a 35-year old Kilbane who was playing League one football for Huddersfield last season.

Jayob10

noodler wrote: »

Sadly I am starting to think bringing back Kilbane would improve our defence.

There was a massive clamour for Ward on this forum in September last year.

Ward has consistently been poor. Trap really fancies some very poor players.

O'Dea, Ward, Green, Whelan, Stephen Hunt

You cannot carry any passengers at this level

O'Shea has been abysmal for 5 years + at right back for instance, poor distribution is shown up time and time again, but he'd be decent at centre back with Dunne I think.

Even St.Ledger, rarely lets us down but you cannot play above yourself every game, eventually you will get a glimpse of why he cannot get a game for Leicester. Its as simple as that

v3ttel

What the hell were the Irish fans singing? One to the tune of I just can't get enough, and another to the tune of that fairly generic "he scores when he wants"?

klose

Stupid pass from whealan and poor keeping from given kill off a good enough half for us. Westwood should clearly be in goal.

FrankGrimes

I feel for Shay, he's clearly been either struggling to recover from the injury or is still feeling the effects of it and maybe wrongly convinced himself that he is fit. Either way, he is clearly not up to scratch in terms of form or confidence and the pity is that some people will remember him for his mistakes in this tournament rather than his truly outstanding service over the past decade. He can bounce back from this but on the other hand, Westwood probably deserves a chance.

But the main thing to say is that our play in the lead-up and for the goal was a microcosm of all that is wrong with Ireland at the moment and highlights the flaws in the manager's tactics, both by design and in their execution.

We have 2 defensive midfielders that are instructed to only do a portion of what a midfielder is normally expected to do - they are both clearly instructed to act more as a deterrent and to jockey and hold 10 yards in front of the centre-halves to put the opposition off going down the middle. They are not asked to press the player on the ball, they are not asked to get a tackle in at all costs, and we know they are not asked to pass the ball forwards.

Having one midfielder that is asked to do so little is something you can get away with if you have another midfielder that is asked to press the ball and get his foot on it and maybe even keep possession. I've rarely seen 2 midfielders asked to hold in this manner but then they'd be part of a 3-man midfield. Having a 2-man midfield both of whom are not asked to go to the ball results in giving quality players space, just as was done for the shot that led to the corner - it was gobsmacking just how both Andrews and Whelan put so little pressure on the ball carrier.

Shay's fumble reflects his poor form and confidence, Andrews let a man get a free header unforgiveably, Shay could've done better when it reached him and Duff for some bizarre reason was standing perpendicular to the line rather than parallel to it which is what you do by default when manning the back post so you can clear with your feet before the ball crosses the line. All highlights the flaws of the tactics but also the poor coaching of the team - setup for corners should be a lot better than that.

Green Diesel

Rooney10 wrote: »

another to the tune of that fairly generic "he scores when he wants"?

f**k off roy keane, we'll sing when we want.

cgpg5

Rooney10 wrote: »

What the hell were the Irish fans singing? One to the tune of I just can't get enough, and another to the tune of that fairly generic "he scores when he wants"?

It's the actual "I just can't get enough" tune I think with "when I see you baby" replaced by "when I see the Ireland". It's a Celtic song

kryogen

gandalf wrote: »

Agree with the general opinion Keane should be taken off for Long. I have a bad feeling that Trap will put on Cox for Doyle though

A good bet at 1/3

Mushy

Francie Barrett wrote: »

A few seconds before that we had the ball and Ward lost possession that led to the shot at Given.

Saw that too. Series of shambolic attempted passes, can't have complaints. 45 mins to look the future Trap, please use it.

kryogen

lol

Renn

maybe wrongly convinced himself that he is fit

There's another one to add to the list noodler

Kerrydude1981

Rooney10 wrote: »

What the hell were the Irish fans singing? One to the tune of I just can't get enough, and another to the tune of that fairly generic "he scores when he wants"?

Second one was aimed at Roy Keane

Roy Keanes a w*nker we'l sing what we want

noodler

Samich wrote: »

St Ledger can't get a game for Leicester? :rolleyes: Your point being?

We have no better alternatives for St Ledger?

We have gotten to the play-offs twice with St Ledger?

My point is we have better alternative to Westwood right now - who is proven at international level.

How can you not see this?

Deliberately would be my guess!

devotional1993

If only Doyle had taken a bloody shot in the first minute...

Francie Barrett

Marc Wilson left back is the obvious choice! Even though he's a Stoke player, their fans will tell you he is a good passer and actuallt confident on the ball.

SirDelboy18

To think, people were forking out 3K to watch this rubbish.


A la Capello in the last WC - he should have gone straight after and Trap should go now also.

Deedsie

steelcityblues wrote: »

Embarrassing how the travelling hoardes continually boo the Croatian, Spanish and now Italian players. 'Best fans', indeed.

Wah Wah Wah....

kryogen

Oh Bill, dont ever change

Barr

Hopefully Italy will not shout up shop for the second half.

SirDelboy18

noodler wrote: »

We have no better alternatives for St Ledger?

We have gotten to the play-offs twice with St Ledger?

My point is we have better alternative to Westwood right now - who is proven at international level.

How can you not see this?

Deliberately would be my guess!

Ciaran Clark is better than St Ledger.

kitakyushu

noodler wrote: »

Who can't get a game for Sunderland?

On what basis is Westwood a better goalkeepr than Given?

I don't understand you wishing our best keeper would retire so that somebody who can't get a game for Sunderland will replace him.

Given may well retire out of his own choice but I would certainly prefer it if he stuck around for another campaign.

You do talk some rubbish. Given wouldn't get his game at Sunderland either if the alternative was Mignolet. Westwood has performed well in the opportunities he has been given for Ireland to date. I'm as big a fan of Given as the next man but he is clearly letting the side down in this tournament and has even done so in some of the qualifier too.

noodler

SirDelboy18 wrote: »

Ciaran Clark is better than St Ledger.

St Ledger is proven when playing for Ireland.

Him not getting regularly club football doesn't seem to be problem.

Soups123

The stupidity of the football fan never amazes me, coming into this tournament given was one of the few we'd all agree was a definate starter, now some want him retired, not dropped, not challenged more but retired and we havent a keeper who is getting a regular game ready to replace? Even if we go with Westwood and he gets injured what we do then......... Fickle fickle fickle

adox

Barr wrote: »

The match is also on BBC HD for anyone who does not have saorview and wantS to watch it in HD.

Also on Sky in HD on Rte 2(if you have a Sky sub).

Mushy

noodler wrote: »

We have no better alternatives for St Ledger?

We have gotten to the play-offs twice with St Ledger?

My point is we have better alternative to Westwood right now - who is proven at international level.

How can you not see this?

Deliberately would be my guess!

Westwood is better than an injured Given at this stage. The least the guy deserves is his chance now that Given is injured and they can't qualify.

No changes, positive!

Lapin

No changes made.

Ah Trap FFS :mad:

joseph brand

Fishooks12 wrote: »

This thread is a mess of hyperbole and bad cliches. Bar the mistake that led to the goal we've been decent. We had a very good spell where we were the better side for 20minutes

Decent? Can't hang on to the ball. We look like clowns out there. Have we even troubled their keeper?

Trap made no changes to his losing formula.

noodler

Soups123 wrote: »

The stupidity of the football fan never amazes me, coming into this tournament given was one of the few we'd all agree was a definate starter, now some want him retired, not dropped, not challenged more but retired and we havent a keeper who is getting a regular game ready to replace? Even if we go with Westwood and he gets injured what we do then......... Fickle fickle fickle

The place has multiplied in size over the last month or so with a fair few people who probably don't watch Ireland play very often.

To be expected.

Samich

noodler wrote: »

We have no better alternatives for St Ledger?

We have gotten to the play-offs twice with St Ledger?

My point is we have better alternative to Westwood right now - who is proven at international level.

How can you not see this?

Deliberately would be my guess!

Clark, O Shea moving to the centre and Stephen Kelly right back is better even.

kryogen

Our top passer has been St. Ledger

Samich

Soups123 wrote: »

The stupidity of the football fan never amazes me, coming into this tournament given was one of the few we'd all agree was a definate starter, now some want him retired, not dropped, not challenged more but retired and we havent a keeper who is getting a regular game ready to replace? Even if we go with Westwood and he gets injured what we do then......... Fickle fickle fickle

Colin Doyle mate, how about thinking before you post.

SirDelboy18

noodler wrote: »

St Ledger is proven when playing for Ireland.

Him not getting regularly club football doesn't seem to be problem.

And Clark couldn't be proven for Ireland because Trap won't give him even a hint of friendly time.

Which is Trap's fault!

tayto lover

kryogen wrote: »

Our top passer has been St. Ledger

He's also made more saves than Shay.

noodler

Mushy wrote: »

Westwood is better than an injured Given at this stage. The least the guy deserves is his chance now that Given is injured and they can't qualify.

No changes, positive!

You don't know Given is injured.


Even still, if Given is carrying a strain now, for argument's sake, how does that support the case of somebody who wants him to retire when a Sunderland's sub goalkeeper is the only option?

Admitting of course, Westwood has looked perfectly decent the two games I can remember seeing him play for Ireland.

Mars Bar

It's a shame Cunningham broke his leg when he did. He might have been our first choice LB at this tournament otherwise.

_Kaiser_

Lapin wrote: »

No changes made.

Ah Trap FFS :mad:

I know I did this the other night, but it's still true..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7hEqCdAwjs