Dubliner kills two kids and walks free

Zulu

Fuinseog wrote: »

Details there are scant..

but that doesn't stop you! :eek:

DeWesterner

Fuinseog wrote: »

nice to see he has some support. i like the bit about unexplained acceleration. If ever I get a speeding ticket I will blame the car.

I'm with you on this one... I saw drawings of the case. The Volvo was on the pavement for at least 20 meters before hitting the two children and the granny. Our guy must have some bad reflexes....He could have turned the wheel slightly. Anyhow, I think he should have been eased off his home sufferings and he should have been put in jail just to make it easier for him to deal with his conscience. Because now, whatever we say, he has to live with the knowledge that for whatever reason, he killed two little children (siblings I might add) and this is going to stay with him until the day he dies... And that's not a nice thought...

DeWesterner

bee_keeper wrote: »

you obviously dont know much about hungary

I do, as I lived there for a while...and I liked it. Never felt more corrupt than Ireland. I might have hung around the right people?

UrbanSea

It depresses me that there are people as idiotic and ignorant in this thread.


Some people (OP) seem to have a difficulty in understanding that accidents can occur.

ResearchWill

DeWesterner wrote: »

I'm with you on this one... I saw drawings of the case. The Volvo was on the pavement for at least 20 meters before hitting the two children and the granny. Our guy must have some bad reflexes....He could have turned the wheel slightly. Anyhow, I think he should have been eased off his home sufferings and he should have been put in jail just to make it easier for him to deal with his conscience. Because now, whatever we say, he has to live with the knowledge that for whatever reason, he killed two little children (siblings I might add) and this is going to stay with him until the day he dies... And that's not a nice thought...

The driver said, the brakes failed and the steering failed. I posted a link to a site with multiple reports of the same, make, model and year of car with serious brake failure (there was a later recall on this issue) steering failure and instances where the car just accelerated with no foot on accelerator and even cases of people braking but car accelerating. When the guy requested in Hungary that his expert would examine the car he was refused.

Fuinseog

bee_keeper wrote: »

you obviously dont know much about hungary

I have been there several times and I have a lot of Hungarian friends. never noticed any corruption.

Fuinseog

UrbanSea wrote: »

It depresses me that there are people as idiotic and ignorant in this thread.


Some people (OP) seem to have a difficulty in understanding that accidents can occur.

I aggree. that guy who burnt the house in Roscommon did not Know there were people in it. it was an accident.

If he had not been going so fast, an accident could have been avoided. Irish people have no respect for seed limits and then bitch to joe how unfair it is when they get caught.

Fuinseog

Fuinseog wrote: »

I aggree. that guy who burnt the house in Roscommon did not not there were people in it. it was an accident.

Just. Wow.




*unfollows thread*

Fuinseog

I see he has made wikipedia


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ciaran_Tobin_extradition_case


The Ciarán Tobin extradition case is a highly publicised international diplomatic and legal affair between Hungary and the Republic of Ireland concerning the refusal of the surrender of an Irish citizen under the European Arrest Warrant who caused the deaths of two children in Hungary due to negligent driving in April 2000.
Contents [hide]
1 Opinion
2 Background
3 Departure from Hungary
4 Extradition request and refusal
5 References
[edit]Opinion

Francis Ciarán Tobin is a murderer.
[edit]Background

On April 9, 2000, Ciarán Tobin, an Irish citizen working as a senior manager of Irish Life and Permanent Hungary, was driving towards Budapest through the small town of Leányfalu. His speed was established at least 70 km/h in a 50 km/h zone. He lost control of his vehicle, and ran onto the footpath where he hit and immediately killed two children, 2 year old Petra Zoltai who was sitting in a pram, and her brother 5 year old Márton Zoltai.[1][2]
[edit]Departure from Hungary

The Hungarian authorities took his passport, however later, in September 2000 he requested that he get his passport back for a family visit. His request was supported by the Irish Ambassador to Hungary, Jim Flavin.[2] The Hungarian authorities acted in an unusual promptness, and returned his passport in exchange for a security deposit of 500,000 forints (about €1,915 at that time) within one day of the application. He left, and returned as promised. However, the authorities failed to request that he surrender his passport on return.
Irish Life didn't extend his assignment and with his passport in his pocket he returned to Ireland in November 2000. He did not show up for the trial, but was duly represented by his lawyers, which is possible in Hungarian law. He was sentenced in absentia to 3 years in prison. On appeal the sentence was amended so that Tobin would possibly be eligible for parole after serving only 18 months.
[edit]Extradition request and refusal

Meanwhile Hungary joined the European Union on 1 May 2004, and the European Arrest Warrant framework decision came into effect. Hungary requested the surrender of Mr. Tobin by issuing a European Arrest Warrant. However, a judge of the Irish High Court, Mr. Justice Peart, refused the surrender on the basis that Tobin had not "fled" Hungary as required by the Irish legislation which implemented the framework decision, since he left Hungary with the consent of the Hungarian authorities.[3][4] A decision which was later upheld by the Irish Supreme Court.[5] The Irish authorities also refused the Hungarian request to make Mr. Tobin serve his time in an Irish prison, an option within the EAW framework decision but never implemented in Ireland
Hungary on the other hand strongly disagreed with this interpretation of the EAW law and the word "flee".[6] Hungary argued that anyone not returning to serve his or her sentence is fleeing from justice. Hungary kept the warrant in effect as the Irish decision has no bearing for other EU members. Hungary also explored other legal options including turning to various EU fora to enforce its court's decision.
In 2009, Ireland amended its domestic EAW legislation to bring it into line with the EAW framework decision by removing the requirement that, in conviction cases, a person the subject of a EAW had "fled" the issuing country.[7] An amendment which came into force on 29 August 2009. On 17 September 2010, Hungary issued a new European Arrest Warrant seeking Tobin's arrest and surrender. Tobin was arrested on 10 November 2009 and his extradition was ordered on 11 February 2011 by Mr. Justice Peart, the same High Court judge who previously refused the surrender.
However, Mr. Tobin was again successful in gaining the leave of the High Court to appeal its decision. Notwithstanding this Ciaran Tobin voluntarily entered custody in Ireland on 9 November 2011 on the basis that any time spent in prison in Ireland will be deducted from any time in prison that he might ultimately spend in Hungary.[8]
Mr. Tobin's Supreme Court appeal was concluded on 15 February 2012. Judgement was reserved.
Mr. Tobin has won the appeal against extradition on June 19, 2012.[9]
[edit]References

^ McDonald, Dearbhail (9 July 2007). "Courts refuse to extradite man in child death crash". The Irish Independent. Retrieved 15 February 2012.
^ a b Zsófia, Gergely (14 April 2008). "Visszatért, mégis futni hagyták az ír gázolót" (in Hungarian). Origo.hu. Retrieved 15 February 2012.
^ Ireland's EAW Act 2003
^ High Court Judgement
^ Supreme Court Judgement
^ Hungarian Minister of Justice Tibor Draskovics letter to the European Commission
^ by section 6 of the Criminal Justice (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 2009
^ "Man wanted in Hungary enters custody". The Irish Times. 9 November 2011. Retrieved 15 February 2012.
^ http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0620/1224318257596.html

Monty Burnz

UrbanSea wrote: »

It depresses me that there are people as idiotic and ignorant in this thread.


Some people (OP) seem to have a difficulty in understanding that accidents can occur.

Accidents can occur - and if they occurred because someone was reckless, then they should pay for their recklessness according to the law. Not creep off and try to evade justice.

Fuinseog

could someone explain what 'entered custody' means? Is that a prison or merely house arrest? The IT uses the phrase but fails to mention what kind of custody.

Just doing a little reserach there and while the Irish media just mentions 'two Hungarian children' the anti Tobin lobby gives their names-
Marci Zoltai (4) and Petra Zoltai (2). it puts a human face on them.

he has his own blog entitled Bűn és büntelenség (Sin and sinlessness)

http://ciaran-tobin.blogspot.ie/2012/06/bun-es-buntelenseg.html

He is certainly a great ambassador for our country and symbolic of the infallibility of big business men.

ResearchWill

Fuinseog wrote: »

could someone explain what 'entered custody' means? Is that a prison or merely house arrest? The IT uses the phrase but fails to mention what kind of custody.

Just doing a little reserach there and while the Irish media just mentions 'two Hungarian children' the anti Tobin lobby gives their names-
Marci Zoltai (4) and Petra Zoltai (2). it puts a human face on them.

he has his own blog entitled Bűn és büntelenség (Sin and sinlessness)

http://ciaran-tobin.blogspot.ie/2012/06/bun-es-buntelenseg.html

He is certainly a great ambassador for our country and symbolic of the infallibility of big business men.

It's prison.

ResearchWill

Fuinseog wrote: »

I aggree. that guy who burnt the house in Roscommon did not Know there were people in it. it was an accident.

If he had not been going so fast, an accident could have been avoided. Irish people have no respect for seed limits and then bitch to joe how unfair it is when they get caught.

Are you really saying the first case was an accident, the deliberate setting of a fire.

Again in relation to speed limit can you post a independent verifiable link to the speed limit on the road as I can not find it. One person on here has said 40kmph another has said 50kmph but not reliable source. Not Wikipedia.

Zulu

Fuinseog wrote: »

he has his own blog entitled Bűn és büntelenség (Sin and sinlessness)

http://ciaran-tobin.blogspot.ie/2012/06/bun-es-buntelenseg.html

He is certainly a great ambassador for our country and symbolic of the infallibility of big business men.

As are you; I see your pitiful & spiteful vendetta continues.

Fuinseog

ResearchWill wrote: »

It's prison.

normally the media would say the location, but they do not in this case, which I find unusual.

amdublin

Fuinseog wrote: »

ResearchWill wrote: »

It's prison.

normally the media would say the location, but they do not in this case, which I find unusual.

Oh for fricks give it a rest Fuinseoig.

This bloke is not controlling the media.
The supreme court made their ruling. It was reported in all the newspapers and on the rte news (not sure if it was on tv3)

This thread is coming across like the rabblings of a paranoid mad man.

UrbanSea

Fuinseog wrote: »

UrbanSea wrote: »

It depresses me that there are people as idiotic and ignorant in this thread.


Some people (OP) seem to have a difficulty in understanding that accidents can occur.

I aggree. that guy who burnt the house in Roscommon did not Know there were people in it. it was an accident.

you deserve an award. The single worst post I have eve seen on boards.

I wonder how the family of the dead girl and her crippled father would feel, if theyd agree with you. One case involves a man driving a car(within the speed limit) and swerving another car that pulls out in front of him(which could happen to anyone), before his car failing to react in what was a well documented problem with the car.

The second is a coked ip lunatic deliberately setting fire to a house of a man's brother that he had earlier assaulted that night because he caught him lying on a bed fully clothed with his girlfriend.


If that's your honest opinion of what an accident is Insufgest you need a new outlook. I don't even know why people are responding to your idiotic posts, I know I won't be.

Fuinseog

UrbanSea wrote: »

you deserve an award. The single worst post I have eve seen on boards.

I wonder how the family of the dead girl and her crippled father would feel, if theyd agree with you. One case involves a man driving a car(within the speed limit) and swerving another car that pulls out in front of him(which could happen to anyone), before his car failing to react in what was a well documented problem with the car.

The second is a coked ip lunatic deliberately setting fire to a house of a man's brother that he had earlier assaulted that night because he caught him lying on a bed fully clothed with his girlfriend.


If that's your honest opinion of what an accident is Insufgest you need a new outlook. I don't even know why people are responding to your idiotic posts, I know I won't be.

there is of course a major difference between the two. in one the culprit has money, in the other he does not. Guess who is off to jail. as other posters have pointed out if the fugitive was an ordinary Joe Soap he would be doing time.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wMSoBauXaPQ&feature=relmfu

amdublin

Fuinseog wrote: »

there is of course a major difference between the two. in one the culprit has money, in the other he does not. Guess who is off to jail. as other posters have pointed out if the fugitive was an ordinary Joe Soap he would be doing time.

What's your definition of ordinary Joe Soap

Your man seems fairly ordinary to me.

Seems to me you like are persecuting someone for daring to have a job, daring to have a wife or a child, daring to be working abroad. God forbid :rolleyes:

It's a tragic tragic case.
There is a family out there without their two little children. It's heartbreaking. But it was an accident.

And the supreme court has now ruled.

Now let it go Fuinseog!!! For your own sanity if nothing else.

And I am now finished following this thread/replying to you!

Fuinseog

amdublin wrote: »

Oh for fricks give it a rest Fuinseoig.

This bloke is not controlling the media.
The supreme court made their ruling. It was reported in all the newspapers and on the rte news (not sure if it was on tv3)

This thread is coming across like the rabblings of a paranoid mad man.

I never said he was controlling the media but he has powerful support in this country. judges in this country are notorious for handing down lenient sentences to those kill. Justice for Marci and Petra. the case will go international in he years to come and this country will be dragged through the dirt, because it decides to defend the likes of Tobin. it has already dragged on for 12 years.

hondasam

Fuinseog wrote: »

I aggree. that guy who burnt the house in Roscommon did not Know there were people in it. it was an accident.

If he had not been going so fast, an accident could have been avoided. Irish people have no respect for seed limits and then bitch to joe how unfair it is when they get caught.

http://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=man%20jailed%20for%20house%20fire%20roscommo&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CAwQqQIwAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.rte.ie%2Fnews%2F2012%2F0619%2Fman-sentenced-to-13-years-for-fatal-roscommon-fire.html&ei=6r7kT6iBKsOGhQf95LnBCQ&usg=AFQjCNHnIQ-G3TPkxHUDTSQsBnedWi6v6g

How do you accidentally set fire to someone's house? This was no accident it was done by someone who was out for revenge.

The car accident was an accident and not planned in advance.

Zulu

Fuinseog wrote: »

there is of course a major difference between the two. in one the culprit has money, in the other he does not.

It clear to me now what is motivating you: not a warped sense of misguided justice, but rather a childish sensational trolling of the Internet for attention.
The last thing I will say to you, ever, is this: consider someone connected to the case in Roscommon reading this. Shame on you.

Show Time

A coward is walking away from time in prison.

Fuinseog

Show Time wrote: »

A coward is walking away from time in prison.

isnt this country a great place.

The father cut a somewhat lonesome figure-expecting to get justice when the culprit is wealthy business man. No wonder both himself and his lawyer were ignored by the Irish state. bertie Ahern will do time for corruption before the likes of Tobin sees the inside of a jail.

surely The Ciaran Tobin support group here would argue that the least he should have done was to say sorry. according to the father he never did that.

its as if he could not care less and that is who is the Irish state is protecting.

Mickeroo

Can't blame him for not wanting to go to a hungarian prison tbh.

Fuinseog

Mickeroo wrote: »

Can't blame him for not wanting to go to a hungarian prison tbh.

true, nobody wants to go to prison, but some folk take responsibility for their actions and face the music, others run away. Its what separates the men from the cowards.

Mickeroo

Fuinseog wrote: »

true, nobody wants to go to prison, but some folk take responsibility for their actions and face the music, others run away. Its what separates the men from the cowards.

But he's willing to serve his time here in Ireland according to the article?

Fuinseog

Mickeroo wrote: »

But he's willing to serve his time here in Ireland according to the article?

it also says there is no provision for him to serve a jail sentence here.

Mickeroo

Mickeroo wrote: »

But he's willing to serve his time here in Ireland according to the article?

**** him.

Mickeroo

I dunno, seems pretty clear it was an accident, would be harsh to take him so far away from his family, not to mention the state of the prisons over there. If he had actually murdered the kids I'd understand the uproar.