Why do people refer to Christianity, Islam and Judaism as "Organised religion"?

KiethM89

Organised religion implies that it was just organised and set up by a group of people and artificially created, which annoys and upsets me. Christianity is the truth. Islam and Judaism are also religions which I truly and deeply respect, they have similar ideologies, which further reinforces my notion that religion is truth.

MegGustaa

KiethM89 wrote: »

Organised religion implies that it was just organised and set up by a group of people and artificially created, which annoys and upsets me. Christianity is the truth. Islam and Judaism are also religions which I truly and deeply respect, they have similar ideologies, which further reinforces my notion that religion is truth.

Organised is here meant in the sense of 'organisation'. As in the church is organised into clergy and a hierarchy. There's a strict set-up to it. There are also organised behaviours and rituals (like going to Mass) associated with it. People 'organise' into groups or communities, too, associated with a church or religious denomination or whatever. It makes no implications about the actual content of their beliefs.

Onesimus

It is always nice to be organized.

prinz

To differentiate established churches, with rules, regulations etc, it from more individualistic spiritualism/religious approaches.

Lantus

Christianity is an amalgamation of many much older religions that share too many similar themes to be just coincidence. Deitys that were born virgin births, crucified, rose after 3 days, ascended to a better place. etc.

The birth of christianty was in a time when the religous crisis of the time mirrored the financial one we are in today. The powers at be took existing ideas and time honoured themes and created 'christianity' probably in the belief that they were preserving society and doing the 'right' thing.

The fact that man has managed to create such a complicated hierachal system of churches and power around the religion is fascinating in itself. The fact that so many people defer to that power is equally interesting.

You could argue that almost all religion is organised in the sense that once you create organised scriptures, rules and people structures it becomes a corporate entity in its own right. Of couse followers of religion dont really have any right to question or challenge their religion. Its a matter of acceptance or refusal. Its unchanging manner is both its greatest strength and its greatest weakness. The further mankind advances away from the fixed point in time these religions were created the more able we will be to unshackle ourselves from the past and really start to develop as a species.

Gurgle

KiethM89 wrote: »

Organised religion implies that it was just organised and set up by a group of people

Implies is a bit soft.
When I use the term I'm saying it outright, implying nothing.

As in:
Organized: Rigid hierarchy, priests / equivalents nominated by more senior levels right up to the top. Specifics of faith and rules of behavior strictly dictated by the most senior person who could be bothered. No questioning anyone above you. Individual laymen ask questions and accept answers.

Not 'Organized': Local autonomous groups, without 'senior management' figures out there who can march in and lay down the law. Priests / equivalents selected by the group. Individual laymen referred to the relevant holy book and encouraged to search for their own answers with some advice and pointers.

I feel its perfectly appropriate to differentiate between these two basic types of religious affiliations.

tommy2bad

Lantus wrote: »

Christianity is an amalgamation of many much older religions that share too many similar themes to be just coincidence. Deitys that were born virgin births, crucified, rose after 3 days, ascended to a better place. etc.

The birth of christianty was in a time when the religous crisis of the time mirrored the financial one we are in today. The powers at be took existing ideas and time honoured themes and created 'christianity' probably in the belief that they were preserving society and doing the 'right' thing.

The fact that man has managed to create such a complicated hierachal system of churches and power around the religion is fascinating in itself. The fact that so many people defer to that power is equally interesting.

You could argue that almost all religion is organised in the sense that once you create organised scriptures, rules and people structures it becomes a corporate entity in its own right. Of couse followers of religion dont really have any right to question or challenge their religion. Its a matter of acceptance or refusal. Its unchanging manner is both its greatest strength and its greatest weakness. The further mankind advances away from the fixed point in time these religions were created the more able we will be to unshackle ourselves from the past and really start to develop as a species.

Oh where to begin?
Amalgamation of other religions? Er no, it may have absorbed some influences as it moved into different areas but to say that its an amalgamation is misleading. "Deitys that were born virgin births, crucified, rose after 3 days, ascended to a better place. etc." All these are unique to Christianity btw, unless you get your theology from Zeitgeist the movie.

Their was a religious crisis as world wide as our financial crisis 2000 years ago? Well their must have been for the powers that be to invent a catch all religion to sort it out.

The fact that man is naturally inclined to a male dominant hierarchy in every endeavor is fascinating, nothing unique about religion.

Develop as a species? what? like grow an other arm or better teeth, I always fancied a tail, one I could use like a monkey.:)
Unfortunately only devils get tails.:(

KamiKazi

it is organised, as a means to control people of low intelligence.

Run_to_da_hills

KamiKazi wrote: »

it is organised, as a means to control people of low intelligence.

"For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent" 1 Corinthians 1:19

Benny_Cake

KamiKazi wrote: »

it is organised, as a means to control people of low intelligence.

For a person of higher intelligence that's a very brief post, would you like to back up such a huge generalisation?

qrrgprgua

KiethM89 wrote: »

Organised religion implies that it was just organised and set up by a group of people and artificially created, which annoys and upsets me. Christianity is the truth. Islam and Judaism are also religions which I truly and deeply respect, they have similar ideologies, which further reinforces my notion that religion is truth.

Community.. Such is the nature of man. Family--> Community. Man to some extent has always been organised. Christ organised his disciples. He chose them. They passed they faith to others. As so we have apostolic succession in many Churches. An apostolic Church.

There is nothing wrong with Organised Religion. Is a modern day term. And its applied to many groups and sects.

shizz

tommy2bad wrote: »

Oh where to begin?
Amalgamation of other religions? Er no, it may have absorbed some influences as it moved into different areas but to say that its an amalgamation is misleading. "Deitys that were born virgin births, crucified, rose after 3 days, ascended to a better place. etc." All these are unique to Christianity btw, unless you get your theology from Zeitgeist the movie.

Their was a religious crisis as world wide as our financial crisis 2000 years ago? Well their must have been for the powers that be to invent a catch all religion to sort it out.

The fact that man is naturally inclined to a male dominant hierarchy in every endeavor is fascinating, nothing unique about religion.

Develop as a species? what? like grow an other arm or better teeth, I always fancied a tail, one I could use like a monkey.:)
Unfortunately only devils get tails.:(

They most certainly are not.

tommy2bad

shizz wrote: »

They most certainly are not.

Shizz, if you can give some examples that would help your case, I'v googled and apart from the usual conspiracy theorists, no respected historian or scholar makes these claims.

PDN

tommy2bad wrote: »

Shizz, if you can give some examples that would help your case, I'v googled and apart from the usual conspiracy theorists, no respected historian or scholar makes these claims.

If Shizz can, then he/she can do it in the Atheist Debate thread rather than trolling this one.

Bannasidhe

tommy2bad wrote: »

Shizz, if you can give some examples that would help your case, I'v googled and apart from the usual conspiracy theorists, no respected historian or scholar makes these claims.

You need to be a bit more precise in your search terms.

Just off the top of my I am a historian with bits of velum saying I am and published peer reviewed articles and fancy awards which call me a respected scholar head I suggest you look at Sol Invictus - feast day Dec 25th, use of a 'radiate crown' or halo to indicate divine association. From a 1967 article in the New Catholic Encyclopaedia

Besides, the Sol Invictus had been adopted by the Christians in a Christian sense, as demonstrated in the Christ as Apollo-Helios in a mausoleum (c. 250) discovered beneath St. Peter's in the Vatican...from the beginning of the 3rd century "Sun of Justice" appears as a title of Christ"

Resurrection Deities:
A dying god also known as a dying-and-rising or resurrection deity, is a god who dies and is resurrected or reborn, in either a literal or symbolic sense. Male examples include the ancient Near Eastern and Greek deities Baal,Melqart, Adonis, Eshmun, Attis, Tammuz, Asclepius, Orpheus, as well as Ra, Osiris, Jesus, Zalmoxis, Dionysus and Odin.

For virgin births have a look here :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_virgin_births

That enough to keep you going?

tommy2bad

Bannasidhe, I could and would love to debate the difference between religions but as PDN pointed out it's a big tangent.
If your up for it I'll start a thread!
None of your examples hold up to close examination and anyway we xians have the old foreshadowing thing as a fall-back

Bannasidhe

tommy2bad wrote: »

Bannasidhe, I could and would love to debate the difference between religions but as PDN pointed out it's a big tangent.
If your up for it I'll start a thread!
None of your examples hold up to close examination and anyway we xians have the old foreshadowing thing as a fall-back

tommy I did reply but my post was deleted.

TheIrishGrover

Organised religion/organised crime: Same old same old: organised groups exploiting others

tommy2bad

TheIrishGrover wrote: »

Organised religion/organised crime: Same old same old: organised groups exploiting others

Whether I agree or disagree, this exemplifies the problem the OP was addressing.
"Organised" you say that like it's a bad thing!
The alternative is chaos and as fond as I am of chaos magic, it's not all that chaotic, it has teachers, leaders, disciples etc. Organization is how we do things, Anyone for a game of cards? football? ludo? all organized but we don't call them organized games either to distinguish them from some disorganized games or as a disparaging term.
I guess it's become shorthand for 'stuff we dislike' about faith and I have sympathy for that but were stuck with it unless we all go our own path and I can't see any fun in that or it lasting past two people finding themselves in the same moonlight glade and organizing a getogether next full moon.

Quatermain

tommy2bad wrote: »

If your up for it I'll start a thread!
None of your examples hold up to close examination and anyway we xians have the old foreshadowing thing as a fall-back

I'd be interested in discussing that. I'd say those examples stand up to very close scrutiny indeed. Much like how the Easter Bunny was in fact a Norse goddess once upon a time.

PDN

Way off topic.