Getting into Photography

magicbastarder

Daveysil15 wrote: »

Having a diploma is photography is not the same as having a diploma in media, or engineering etc. The difference been you don't need a diploma to be a professional photographer.

and you *need* a diploma to work in media?
you don't *need* a degree in maths to prove fermat's last theorem. but it would sure help.

jonniebgood1

melekalikimaka wrote: »

of course it can be an expense they cant afford, that applies to many fields of study.... but i fail to understand whom it would be 'useless' for?

I presume it would be 'useless' for someone who was already familiar with the aspects of photography that make up such a course.

sineadw

jonniebgood1 wrote: »

melekalikimaka wrote: »

of course it can be an expense they cant afford, that applies to many fields of study.... but i fail to understand whom it would be 'useless' for?

I presume it would be 'useless' for someone who was already familiar with the aspects of photography that make up such a course.

I'd disagree again here. A degree (diploma, masters..) is so much more than the stated learning objectives. I knew a lot about photography starting mine, and what i learned most wasn't in any book or on any website. It's confidence, a new way of seeing, a new vocabulary, a new network.. lots of other things..

artyeva

sineadw wrote: »

I'd disagree again here. A degree (diploma, masters..) is so much more than the stated learning objectives. I knew a lot about photography starting mine, and what i learned most wasn't in any book or on any website. It's confidence, a new way of seeing, a new vocabulary, a new network.. lots of other things..

despite sinead's best efforts i think it's hard to acurately or adequately convey the importance of creativity in a field like photography, that straddles both sides of a medium - creative and technical - some get it, others might not ever.

from personal experience you cannot learn creativity [as much as you can learn it] alone, you learn through exposure and complete immersion in your medium for the duration of your course surrounded by others who are also completely immersed. being allowed the freedom and time to persue whatever aspect of the medium interests you, learning the context of what you're doing, exploring the history of the medium, having the support structures and experience of tutors and teachers around you. that's far more important in a field like photography [or any other creative field for that matter] than learning how to use a press a shutter.

but yeah, humberklog is on the right advice track for the op i suppose.

take as many photos as you can. take the photos that interest you, take photos that challenge you. does you school have a darkroom you could access? build up mini portfolios of images that have common themes, see how many different ways you portray something [or some one, or some place]. i've seen this book on amazon, and while i've never read it, i love the sound of it and would have loved it when i was still in school putting together my portfolio!! get the advice of your art teacher, see if they can set you some challenges and give you some critique as to what you can improve on. stuff like that will get you in the right frame of mind if, in a few years time, you want to put together a portfolio for college.

Gregor Samsa

jonniebgood1 wrote: »

I presume it would be 'useless' for someone who was already familiar with the aspects of photography that make up such a course.

I have a BA in Fine Art Painting from NCAD. About as "useless" a Degree as you could have from a career point of view. You don't need a degree to become an artist, and I never even became an artist

But it was the best learning experience of my life, and if I had to do it all over again, I would without any hesitation.

Doing a diploma/degree like this is not about the technical aspects. In Fine Art, we were never once told how to hold a paintbrush, how to mix a colour, how to paint in any particular style. But what we were given was 4 years of creativity, analysis, projects that pushed you out of your comfort zone, constant driving, and an environment where you could be completely immersed in your work. You could do anything you wanted, but you had to justify it. You had to be versed in the visual language you were trying to express yourself in. If you ended up with two boxes on top of each other, then fine, but you better be able to talk intelligently about why there were two boxes on top of each other. You also had access to technical stuff that you wouldn't have had access to in the real world (darkrooms, etching and screenprinting setups, kilns, metal casting, etc).

I'd say a (good) photography degree is somewhat similar. Very little of it is going to be about aperture, shutter speed and ISO. But you are going to be pushed on composition, asked to justify everything, eating, sleeping and breathing photography. And a few years of that can really help you develop your creative side that is very difficult (maybe not impossible) to do if you're working full time - even at photography.

It's an expensive experience (fees, lost earnings, etc), and not necessarily one that would be of interest to everyone, but certainly not useless.

artyeva

phutyle wrote: »

I have a BA in Fine Art Painting from NCAD. About as "useless" a Degree as you could have from a career point of view.

i'll see your painting BA and raise you a BA in sculpture

Gregor Samsa

artyeva wrote: »

i'll see your painting BA and raise you a BA in sculpture

A printmaker will come along soon and trump us both

magicbastarder

artyeva wrote: »

i'll see your painting BA and raise you a BA in sculpture

NCAD? i think i may know one of your lecturers. he may have retired a few years ago, though.

EyeBlinks

artyeva wrote: »

i'll see your painting BA and raise you a BA in sculpture

You're a sculptress ! Care to design a piece for me ?

Daveysil15

melekalikimaka wrote: »

of course it can be an expense they cant afford, that applies to many fields of study.... but i fail to understand whom it would be 'useless' for?

Well its useless for the talented photographers out there who are already successful. As artyeva pointed out, you can't learn creativity. Photography is not like maths or engineering. You're either creative or you're not.

artyeva

Daveysil15 wrote: »

Well its useless for the talented photographers out there who are already successful. As artyeva pointed out, you can't learn creativity. Photography is not like maths or engineering. You're either creative or you're not.

um, that's not quite what i said at all. i don't think you can learn creativity from a book, i think you need to be exposed to it. surrounded by it, allowed the freedom to explore it, have it nurtured by good lecturers. and i'm not sure i agree with you either have it or you don't. everyone has some level of creativity in them. my sister couldn't draw a straight line or take a photo without chopping people's heads off[ if she remembers to take the lens cap off that is], but she's a florist, and some of the things she sculpts in flowers are stunning. that's creative. one of my best mates is a fantastically creative photographer and he's a scientist who's now doing a masters in engineering!

creativity when you boil all the crap out of it is just a different type of problem solving. when you're studying a creative disipline it's all about the problem solving. in our common first year, we were given a white A1 page, divided up into little 5*5 squares. we had to illustrate words like 'fast' 'deep' 'tired' and 'happy' etc using just glue and more bits of white paper. that's exactly the same type of problem solving as 'prove x=y using yadda yadda's theory of whatnot' you're just using a visual language to do it rather than a mathematic formula. what a degree/diploma taches you is that visual language.

and by the by talented and successful are such different cans of worms they're not even on the same shelf... but that's not for this thread

magicbastarder wrote: »

NCAD? i think i may know one of your lecturers. he may have retired a few years ago, though.

nah, went to an open day in NCAD when i was in 6th year and didn't like it, went for LSAD instead. glad i did, great place. my whole diploma show was photography based, not a chisel in sight!

EyeBlinks wrote: »

You're a sculptress ! Care to design a piece for me ?

the last commission i did was designing a carpark. you want something along those lines?

humberklog

artyeva wrote: »

i'll see your painting BA and raise you a BA in sculpture

I'll fold (hnd civil engineering).

But so glad someone mentioned that studying isn't always about financial gain. How odd a world would that be?


But I do think the thread has been trolled, and trolled well.

Promac

sineadw wrote: »

I'd disagree again here. A degree (diploma, masters..) is so much more than the stated learning objectives. I knew a lot about photography starting mine, and what i learned most wasn't in any book or on any website. It's confidence, a new way of seeing, a new vocabulary, a new network.. lots of other things..

One of the most important aspects of any field, regardless of the course content. Uni is an instant network and that's invaluable.

dave66

Is there any chance that some of the people who have completed diplomas, degrees etc related to photography would be able to share the list of the books which were considered essential reading or course books. I know that reading the books won't ever come close to the experience of complete learning & immersion in the subject(s)/course but perhaps their are others like me who might like to read them as they might be as close to such a course as I'll ever get.

Please & thanks

EyeBlinks

sineadw wrote: »

a new vocabulary

I suppose you could always feign sickness for that bit of the course :rolleyes::P

Ricky91t

I've not read the majority of replies but all I'll say is learn to drive!! I was offered a job with the local newspaper but couldn't take it as 40% of the time would be spent on the road getting to the places. This may be different if you're in a city, but I still think its a good idea.

I bailed out on doing photography in DIT(ill explain below) but it was an idea I'm happy with. I'm currently studying computer science and still doing bits and pieces for paid/non paid photography. At the end of College I'm hoping to have a decent photography portfolio and a decent degree so I have two options of what to do from there.

I decided not to do photography in the end because it starts out as a 'who you know' kinda thing. The people I knew in photography in the area weren't the most fondest of me, one because I was offered a job when they needed a photographer and I turned it down and the other because of an argument over pay. Things have blown over now though, but I thought at the time, trying to get experience in first year of college during the holidays wouldn't be easy, but I'm happy with the choice I made.

If there is another area you're interested in, then consider that too, but become an active member of the photography society in your college of choice and get on the committee. Until then focus on photography spend your holidays at events, taking photos look out for news paper type photographers and have a chat you never know what might come out of it!

melekalikimaka

dave66 wrote: »

Is there any chance that some of the people who have completed diplomas, degrees etc related to photography would be able to share the list of the books which were considered essential reading or course books. I know that reading the books won't ever come close to the experience of complete learning & immersion in the subject(s)/course but perhaps their are others like me who might like to read them as they might be as close to such a course as I'll ever get.

Please & thanks

check out 'ways of seeing' should be on the youtube

twinkiewinkle

I heard the New york Film Academy photography program was good...Found this review by a student named Marien De Moya.

I chose to study at New York Film Academy because it’s a good condensed program to start your career and a good first step for production design.

The best thing this school has is its hands-on teaching and allowing you to work right away. I recommend this program, especially for those interested in the cinematography programs.