Question about Catholic funerals

NaasPreacher

I am a non-Catholic who moved to Ireland in 1995. When I first started attending funerals with my Catholic friends I always felt kind of 'funny' because I would be nearly the only one not taking communion.

I attended a funeral in Tallaght last month and was surpised when probably half of the people did not take communion.

Is this the norm now? If so, what has happened to bring about the change?

Benny_Cake

NaasPreacher wrote: »

I am a non-Catholic who moved to Ireland in 1995. When I first started attending funerals with my Catholic friends I always felt kind of 'funny' because I would be nearly the only one not taking communion.

I attended a funeral in Tallaght last month and was surpised when probably half of the people did not take communion.

Is this the norm now? If so, what has happened to bring about the change?

It's a strange one alright. Perhaps there were a lot of lapsed Catholics there who didn't feel they could take communion? Or non-Catholics? I'm from a Catholic family myself, and although I believe in the central tenets of the Christian faith I'm well and truly lapsed at this stage, but when I'm at a service I don't take communion out of respect for the rules of the church. I'd like to be able to but I don't. It never seems to bother anyone else at these services though, regardless of their beliefs.

NaasPreacher

Benny_Cake wrote: »

It's a strange one alright. Perhaps there were a lot of lapsed Catholics there who didn't feel they could take communion? Or non-Catholics? I'm from a Catholic family myself, and although I believe in the central tenets of the Christian faith I'm well and truly lapsed at this stage, but when I'm at a service I don't take communion out of respect for the rules of the church. I'd like to be able to but I don't. It never seems to bother anyone else at these services though, regardless of their beliefs.

This particular funeral in Tallaght was in 'very Catholic' family. I just wonder if, like you mention, so many are no longer 'praticising Catholics' and don;t feel right talking cimmunion.

Benny_Cake

NaasPreacher wrote: »

Benny_Cake wrote: »

It's a strange one alright. Perhaps there were a lot of lapsed Catholics there who didn't feel they could take communion? Or non-Catholics? I'm from a Catholic family myself, and although I believe in the central tenets of the Christian faith I'm well and truly lapsed at this stage, but when I'm at a service I don't take communion out of respect for the rules of the church. I'd like to be able to but I don't. It never seems to bother anyone else at these services though, regardless of their beliefs.

This particular funeral in Tallaght was in 'very Catholic' family. I just wonder if, like you mention, so many are no longer 'praticising Catholics' and don;t feel right talking communion.

That's possibly it-if so, it's commendable that they have given it that much consideration.

As far as I know, partaking of the Eucharistic on a weekly basis has only been common in recent decades. In my grandparents time, it was only on rare occasions given the various restrictions regarding when you could eat and so on - it just wasn't practical, particularly if you were a farmer!

Onesimus

NaasPreacher wrote: »

I am a non-Catholic who moved to Ireland in 1995. When I first started attending funerals with my Catholic friends I always felt kind of 'funny' because I would be nearly the only one not taking communion.

I attended a funeral in Tallaght last month and was surpised when probably half of the people did not take communion.

Is this the norm now? If so, what has happened to bring about the change?

Hi there. There may be many reasons or that. as Benny pointed out some may not be Catholic. But others having not gone to confession will not receive due to them believing that they are in a state of mortal sin. To receive Our Lord in the Eucharist in a state of Mortal sin is another Mortal sin and not beneficial to the soul.

Venial sins are forgiven through receiving though but not Mortal sins.

Run_to_da_hills

Most funerals I would attend would be Catholic, most of the younger generation of family and relatives would probably fit the nominal 80% as on the census and wouldn't take the host. I wouldn't expect them to if they were not practicing.

martinedwards

In our church (united Methodist/Anglican) we had a service yesterday when our Methodist minister was moving on, and we had an open mic time when folks could say a few words about him.

one lady who spoke was a visitor. she said that she was RC and a real impact on her life was when she had attended a service in our church which happened to be Holy Communion.

the minister invited people to come forward, stating that it wasn't HIS table, it was GOD'S table and all believers were welcome.

she had been going through a difficult time with her own church at te time and this was a real lifeline to her faith.....

I wouldn't do it out of respect, but what would happen if a (known) non Catholic went up for communion in mass? would they be refused, or would the priest turn a blind eye to avoid a confrontation in the service?

Benny_Cake

martinedwards wrote: »

In our church (united Methodist/Anglican) we had a service yesterday when our Methodist minister was moving on, and we had an open mic time when folks could say a few words about him.

one lady who spoke was a visitor. she said that she was RC and a real impact on her life was when she had attended a service in our church which happened to be Holy Communion.

the minister invited people to come forward, stating that it wasn't HIS table, it was GOD'S table and all believers were welcome.

she had been going through a difficult time with her own church at te time and this was a real lifeline to her faith.....

I wouldn't do it out of respect, but what would happen if a (known) non Catholic went up for communion in mass? would they be refused, or would the priest turn a blind eye to avoid a confrontation in the service?

Great story Martin - I think that approach is Christian and admirable.

I think it would very much depend on the priest, I'd imagine that unless they are 110% certain the the person is a non-Catholic they give the benefit of the doubt. That said, I have heard of instances of people being refused communion. Some Catholics are affected by this policy too, for example, divorced Catholics who have remarried.

NaasPreacher

martinedwards wrote: »

In our church (united Methodist/Anglican) we had a service yesterday when our Methodist minister was moving on, and we had an open mic time when folks could say a few words about him.

one lady who spoke was a visitor. she said that she was RC and a real impact on her life was when she had attended a service in our church which happened to be Holy Communion.

the minister invited people to come forward, stating that it wasn't HIS table, it was GOD'S table and all believers were welcome.

she had been going through a difficult time with her own church at te time and this was a real lifeline to her faith.....

I wouldn't do it out of respect, but what would happen if a (known) non Catholic went up for communion in mass? would they be refused, or would the priest turn a blind eye to avoid a confrontation in the service?

In our church we would do the same. We explain that we believe that the Lord's Table is a remembrance for those who have truly trusted Christ for salvation and who are striving to live to please Him, but then we leave it up to the recipients to decide if they want to partake or not.

I appreciate the comments earlier. I think there is some truth to the comment that many of those who don't partake do so out of respect - they know they are lapsed, are happy enough with that, but are not so hypocritical that they would do it for the show.

Run_to_da_hills

martinedwards wrote: »

I wouldn't do it out of respect, but what would happen if a (known) non Catholic went up for communion in mass? would they be refused, or would the priest turn a blind eye to avoid a confrontation in the service?

In any Christian church no non believer should partake in our lords supper. The symbolic aspect of it would be totally meaningless.

Doctor DooM

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

In any Christian church no non believer should partake in our lords supper. The symbolic aspect of it would be totally meaningless.

It might even go further than that- I would certainly go (and have gone) to a Catholic funeral mass as a sign of respect to the deceased or as a comfort to the living, but it would be hypocritical, I feel, to take communion.

getz

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

In any Christian church no non believer should partake in our lords supper. The symbolic aspect of it would be totally meaningless.

the whole thing is strange anyway,christian churches hijacking a jewish religious ceremony [the celebration of the passover] changing the name to the last supper, LUKE 22:15 with fervant desire i have desired to eat this passover with you before i suffer.

NaasPreacher

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

In any Christian church no non believer should partake in our lords supper. The symbolic aspect of it would be totally meaningless.

I agree that no non-believers should partake, but I think it is up the individual, not the church to decide.

We make that clear every time we observe the Lord's Table

PDN

getz wrote: »

the whole thing is strange anyway,christian churches hijacking a jewish religious ceremony [the celebration of the passover] changing the name to the last supper, LUKE 22:15 with fervant desire i have desired to eat this passover with you before i suffer.

Yes, very strange since Jesus was a Jew. :rolleyes:

NaasPreacher

getz wrote: »

the whole thing is strange anyway,christian churches hijacking a jewish religious ceremony [the celebration of the passover] changing the name to the last supper, LUKE 22:15 with fervant desire i have desired to eat this passover with you before i suffer.

Not really that strange since Jesus Himself instituted it, and, if the Bible is to be believed, instructed Paul on how to the church should observe it - 1 Corinthians 11.17-30.

Slav

NaasPreacher wrote: »

I agree that no non-believers should partake, but I think it is up the individual, not the church to decide.

Only the Eucharist for Roman Catholics and the Lord's Table for Baptists are actually different things in essence.

Slav

Onesimus wrote: »

Venial sins are forgiven through receiving though but not Mortal sins.

Just out of curiosity, is the same thing preached in your Eastern Rite parish? Are you expected to go to confession before every communion there?

NaasPreacher

Slav wrote: »

Only the Eucharist for Roman Catholics and the Lord's Table for Baptists are actually different things in essence.

Excellent point - and I think that is all the difference in the world. I think the original point was that someone preferred the option, but your post makes it properly clear that because of what the Eucharist is it should not be an individual option.

getz

NaasPreacher wrote: »

Not really that strange since Jesus Himself instituted it, and, if the Bible is to be believed, instructed Paul on how to the church should observe it - 1 Corinthians 11.17-30.

did he ? only according to some no other apostle even mentions it,and even paul stresses is what he teaches he receives from no man[galatians 1:11-12] the litiurgy of the last supper was from the religion mithraism,that was christainitys chief competitor up to the 4th century,mithraism communion liturcy ;he who will not eat of my body and drink of my blood,so that he will be one with me and i with him,the same shall not know salvation,the early church fathers justin martyr and terullian tried to say that mithraism copied the lords supper from christianity,but as it was said by the cult as early as 1400 bc,they said that demons had copied it since only demons could copy an event in advance of it happening. there is a lot of things that have been added into the bible that are untrue

NaasPreacher

getz wrote: »

did he ? only according to some no other apostle even mentions it,and even paul stresses is what he teaches he receives from no man[galatians 1:11-12] the litiurgy of the last supper was from the religion mithraism,that was christainitys chief competitor up to the 4th century,mithraism communion liturcy ;he who will not eat of my body and drink of my blood,so that he will be one with me and i with him,the same shall not know salvation,the early church fathers justin martyr and terullian tried to say that mithraism copied the lords supper from christianity,but as it was said by the cult as early as 1400 bc,they said that demons had copied it since only demons could copy an event in advance of it happening. there is a lot of things that have been added into the bible that are untrue

Paul did say in 1 Corinthians 11.23 that the instruction about the Lord's Table that he was about to pass on came directly from the Lord. I, for one, accept the scriptures by faith so accept that Jesus told Paul how to institute the Table observance.

Slav

NaasPreacher wrote: »

because of what the Eucharist is it should not be an individual option

I think for Catholics it's actually both. In practical terms a Catholic priest can make it clear to a parishioner that he will refuse to commune him/her if the priest knows that he/she is in the state of mortal sin (and that could include things like being divorced and living with another partner, so something not necessarily unusual or uncommon these days). That would be his pastoral duties. Similarly, if a Catholic feels that he/she is not the best place at the moment for the Body and Blood of Christ then they have a perfectly good reason not to come to communion: "Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath ought against thee; Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift." Matt 5:23-24.

So both the Church and the individual should ensure that the real temple, which is the individual's body (1 Cor 6:19-20), is clean and consecrated for the Sacrifice.

getz

NaasPreacher wrote: »

Paul did say in 1 Corinthians 11.23 that the instruction about the Lord's Table that he was about to pass on came directly from the Lord. I, for one, accept the scriptures by faith so accept that Jesus told Paul how to institute the Table observance.

good for you,i admire your faith,i take it you have read the early version of marks gospel [the oldest of the gospels] sinaiticus and vasicanus,and how its had additions to fit the church dogma.

Onesimus

Slav wrote: »

Just out of curiosity, is the same thing preached in your Eastern Rite parish? Are you expected to go to confession before every communion there?

I have never heard it preached but it should be. Not that we go to confession before every communion but that we should examine ourselves for any mortal sins and I would say venial sins to before receiving as it's always good practice to ask forgiveness for our faults all the time.

Run_to_da_hills

Woman in same-sex relationship denied Communion at mother's funeral,

"As her elderly mother was dying, Barbara Johnson lay next to her on the hospital bed, reciting the “Hail Mary.” Loetta Johnson, 85, had been a devout Catholic, raising her four children in the church and sending them to Catholic schools.

At her mother’s funeral mass at the St. John Neumann Catholic Church in Gaithersburg, Md., a grieving Barbara Johnson was the first in line to receive communion.

What happened next stunned her. The priest refused Johnson, who is gay, the sacramental bread and wine.
“He covered the bowl with the Eucharist with his hand and looked at me, and said I cannot give you communion because you live with a woman and that is a sin in the eyes of the church,”


http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/02/lesbian-woman-denied-communion-at-mothers-funeral/

I have often heard 1 Corinthians 11:29 quoted at communion services. "For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body". I would imagine that this would be our Lords instruction to St Paul directed at unbelievers or to those that deliberately continue to sin.

NaasPreacher

getz wrote: »

good for you,i admire your faith,i take it you have read the early version of marks gospel [the oldest of the gospels] sinaiticus and vasicanus,and how its had additions to fit the church dogma.

I don't want to get dragged off topic about the ending of Mark, but not sure what the discussion about the shorter ending has to do with Paul's words to the Corinthian church.

Black Suir

NaasPreacher wrote: »

I am a non-Catholic who moved to Ireland in 1995. When I first started attending funerals with my Catholic friends I always felt kind of 'funny' because I would be nearly the only one not taking communion.

I attended a funeral in Tallaght last month and was surpised when probably half of the people did not take communion.

Is this the norm now? If so, what has happened to bring about the change?

I'm a Catholic and seldom recieve communion. I dont want to be seen in the same way as some of the hypocrits that i see going up pretending to be all holy and everything when i go to mass.

NaasPreacher

Black Suir wrote: »

I'm a Catholic and seldom recieve communion. I dont want to be seen in the same way as some of the hypocrits that i see going up pretending to be all holy and everything when i go to mass.

Thanks for that. It seems to be the general feeling. I asked a couple of friends I attended the funeral with and that seems to be their feeling as well.

georgieporgy

Black Suir wrote: »

I'm a Catholic and seldom recieve communion. I dont want to be seen in the same way as some of the hypocrits that i see going up pretending to be all holy and everything when i go to mass.

Mother Teresa of Calcutta had this to say about holiness

On being holy: You have to be holy in the position you are in, and I have to be holy in the position that God has placed me. So it is nothing extraordinary to be holy. Holiness is not a luxury of the few. Holiness is a simple duty for you and me. We have been created for that.

As for receiving Holy Communion, the catholic view could be explained like this; when one eats food one turns the food into oneself. But when you receive (eat) Holy Communion (which is Jesus), Jesus turns you into him!
That is why many catholics make it a priority to receive communion daily.

Black Suir

georgieporgy wrote: »

Mother Teresa of Calcutta had this to say about holiness

On being holy: You have to be holy in the position you are in, and I have to be holy in the position that God has placed me. So it is nothing extraordinary to be holy. Holiness is not a luxury of the few. Holiness is a simple duty for you and me. We have been created for that.

As for receiving Holy Communion, the catholic view could be explained like this; when one eats food one turns the food into oneself. But when you receive (eat) Holy Communion (which is Jesus), Jesus turns you into him!
That is why many catholics make it a priority to receive communion daily.

But the problem I see is that some only do it to be seen. I was recently at a months mine mass. Some family members of the person that had died seldom if ever go inside the church. Yet the priest had the key of the tabernackle door twisted and some of them were up at the foot of the alter from the back of the church, and when they were going back to their seat, you'd swear butter would not melt in their mouth, with the slow walk and hands joined etc.

Your correct about those that do believe and recieve as often as possible however.

georgieporgy

Black Suir wrote: »

But the problem I see is that some only do it to be seen.

That's true enough. But we shouldn't concern ourselves with the views or intentions of others. For all we know, they may recently have undergone a dramatic conversion.

I was recently at a months mine mass.
Some family members of the person that had died seldom if ever go inside the church. Yet the priest had the key of the tabernackle door twisted and some of them were up at the foot of the alter from the back of the church, and when they were going back to their seat, you'd swear butter would not melt in their mouth, with the slow walk and hands joined etc.

It's very tempting indeed to tell those people to refrain from receiving. On the other hand it often takes an occasion like the death of a family member to begin the conversion process in an individual's heart. So you don't really know their situation. It's just that they still look ugly on the outside .

Your correct about those that do believe and recieve as often as possible however.

But don't you be waitin till you're a saint before going to regular communion:)