Andrea Pirlo appreciation thread

The_Kew_Tour

Seaneh wrote: »

It's not the same team though. Different manager, players, tactics...

HazDanz wrote: »

In fairness it's a different team with a different mentality with Prandelli in charge compared to Lippi.

Much more emphasis on possession and some core elements of the team are coming off of a high from the Juve invincible team this season.

Of course.

Still just goes show can never write of teams with tradition in the game.

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

As much as I have enjoyed watching Pirlo this tournament, realistically he should be nowhere near the Ballon D'Or. Messi has just come off a season scoring 73 goals for club along with 29 assists, not to mention the 7 goals he already has since January for Argentina, you just can't compete with that. Ronaldo has also been incredible, but because they have been doing it for 2/3 seasons now it seems almost ordinary for them, they'll both finish comfortably above Pirlo in the Ballon D'Or, and rigtfully so. But that shouldn't take anything away from Pirlo, he's one of those special players that doesn't come around very often.

Corholio

Seaneh wrote: »

Pirlo fully deserves POTT.
He was robbed in 2006 twice.
First when Zidane got POTT at the world cup and then when Canavarro got the Balon D'Or the following December.
Hope he doesn't get mugged again.

Zidane fully deserved that POTT, no question in my mind.

grenache

Lads Pirlo is not doing anything different now to what he's been doing for Juve all season and Milan for ten years before that. He was the driving force behind Milan's European Cup victories in 03 and 07, as well as Italy's WC win in 06. He's consistenly been one of the world's best midfielder for many years now. Me and my Juve friend were at a loss as to why Milan did not sign him up for another few years. Without him Juve would not have won the Scudetto this year. I saw him live in the flesh in Rome last November, he made bits of Lazio that night. he was head and shoulders the best player on the field.

~Rebel~

THFC wrote: »

As much as I have enjoyed watching Pirlo this tournament, realistically he should be nowhere near the Ballon D'Or. Messi has just come off a season scoring 73 goals for club along with 29 assists, not to mention the 7 goals he already has since January for Argentina, you just can't compete with that. Ronaldo has also been incredible, but because they have been doing it for 2/3 seasons now it seems almost ordinary for them, they'll both finish comfortably above Pirlo in the Ballon D'Or, and rigtfully so. But that shouldn't take anything away from Pirlo, he's one of those special players that doesn't come around very often.

Yes, both have had better seasons, but Ballon D'Or pretty much always goes to winners of things. Remember Ronaldo (de Lima) winning it back in 2002 on the back of winning the world cup, despite barely playing any football that season?

Was Michael Owen the best player in Europe in 2001? No, but he won 3 cup competitions.

Ronaldo (C) as it is will get it because Real won the league. But you could just see Pirlo nicking it if Italy win the Euro's, especially if he gets player of the tournament (which he will if they win).

I will guarantee you Messi does not win it this year as Barca won neither the league nor champions league.

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Yes, both have had better seasons, but Ballon D'Or pretty much always goes to winners of things. Remember Ronaldo (de Lima) winning it back in 2002 on the back of winning the world cup, despite barely playing any football that season?

Ronaldo (C) as it is will get it because Real won the league. But you could just see Pirlo nicking it if Italy win the Euro's, especially if he gets player of the tournament (which he will if they win).

I will guarantee you Messi does not win it this year as Barca won neither the league nor champions league.

Messi won it in 2010 despite not winning the CL that year, both Xavi and Iniesta were exceptional for Spain in winning the World Cup but Messi still cruised to the Ballon D'Or. He's also had a much better season this time round.

~Rebel~

THFC wrote: »

Messi won it in 2010 despite not winning the CL that year, both Xavi and Iniesta were exceptional for Spain in winning the World Cup but Messi still cruised to the Ballon D'Or. He's also had a much better season this time round.

Yes, but he won the league.

Just look back through - noone wins the Ballon D'Or without winning something major.

It'll be Ronaldo or Pirlo I'm betting.

Jimmy Iovine

THFC wrote: »

As much as I have enjoyed watching Pirlo this tournament, realistically he should be nowhere near the Ballon D'Or. Messi has just come off a season scoring 73 goals for club along with 29 assists, not to mention the 7 goals he already has since January for Argentina, you just can't compete with that. Ronaldo has also been incredible, but because they have been doing it for 2/3 seasons now it seems almost ordinary for them, they'll both finish comfortably above Pirlo in the Ballon D'Or, and rigtfully so. But that shouldn't take anything away from Pirlo, he's one of those special players that doesn't come around very often.

In 1998 Zidane won it. In 2002 Ronaldo won it. In 2006 Canavarro won it.

In every year, bar an odd few, that there is a stand out player in the tournament, said player generally wins. There is every chance that if Italy win the tournament that Pirlo might just get the nod.

kryogen

I have been saying this too, I think the league win puts Ronnie out in front, but a final appearance would have put him over the top imo

Don't think Pirlo will get it but if he does pull off another excellent performance and drives Italy to the Euros who knows

Rekop dog

Jimmy Iovine wrote: »

THFC wrote: »

As much as I have enjoyed watching Pirlo this tournament, realistically he should be nowhere near the Ballon D'Or. Messi has just come off a season scoring 73 goals for club along with 29 assists, not to mention the 7 goals he already has since January for Argentina, you just can't compete with that. Ronaldo has also been incredible, but because they have been doing it for 2/3 seasons now it seems almost ordinary for them, they'll both finish comfortably above Pirlo in the Ballon D'Or, and rigtfully so. But that shouldn't take anything away from Pirlo, he's one of those special players that doesn't come around very often.

In 1998 Zidane won it. In 2002 Ronaldo won it. In 2006 Canavarro won it.

In every year, bar an odd few, that there is a stand out player in the tournament, said player generally wins. There is every chance that if Italy win the tournament that Pirlo might just get the nod.

They're all World Cups though, not particularly fair if a player stakes a claim in a tournament that others like Messi aren't elligible. Don't think the Euros has ever had that big an affect on POTY.

Rekop dog

Also Measi is on another level to any player during the 90's and early 2000's in terms of superiority so don't think drawing previous examples from thst period is all that relavant.

~Rebel~

Rekop dog wrote: »

They're all World Cups though, not particularly fair if a player stakes a claim in a tournament that others like Messi aren't elligible. Don't think the Euros has ever had that big an affect on POTY.

In tandem with Pirlo being incredible all season in an unbeaten, league winning Juventus team, gives him a great shout. Without that, I don't think he'd really be in the running, but with the two competitions together, and his performances throughout, definitely a great shout for it.

At this stage, I'd agree that Ronaldo is still out in front. I'm very confident Messi won't win though.

Blatter

Jimmy Iovine wrote: »

In 1998 Zidane won it. In 2002 Ronaldo won it. In 2006 Canavarro won it.

In every year, bar an odd few, that there is a stand out player in the tournament, said player generally wins. There is every chance that if Italy win the tournament that Pirlo might just get the nod.

The thing is, during those years there was no one that was really of the standard of Messi.

At the end of the day it'll be a bunch of international coaches (and captains I think) that will be asked to vote and some will let the Euros/trophies be a large factor in their decision. But I'm willing to bet that a fair few of them will also say ''Best player in the world? Sorry, but I can't not say Messi''

Jimmy Iovine

Rekop dog wrote: »

They're all World Cups though, not particularly fair if a player stakes a claim in a tournament that others like Messi aren't elligible. Don't think the Euros has ever had that big an affect on POTY.

Van Basten won it in '88, Platini in '84 and Matthias Sammer in '96.

They all won their own leagues as well that year.

It hasn't had that much of an effect in recent years.

HazDanz

Italy win the final with Pirlo playing well it's his. Undefeated season in the domestic league in Italy with him being a large force in the Juve team paired with his performances in this tournament it would be hard not to give it to him.

Rekop dog

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Rekop dog wrote: »

They're all World Cups though, not particularly fair if a player stakes a claim in a tournament that others like Messi aren't elligible. Don't think the Euros has ever had that big an affect on POTY.

In tandem with Pirlo being incredible all season in an unbeaten, league winning Juventus team, gives him a great shout. Without that, I don't think he'd really be in the running, but with the two competitions together, and his performances throughout, definitely a great shout for it.

At this stage, I'd agree that Ronaldo is still out in front though.

Unbeaten means feck all, their points total wasn't special at all, drew lots of games, nearest rivals were completely ravaged with injuries too. He was very good this season but Messi and Ronni are operating on another level to everyone in the best league in Europe.

~Rebel~

Rekop dog wrote: »

Unbeaten means feck all, their points total wasn't special at all, drew lots of games, nearest rivals were completely ravaged with injuries too. He was very good this season but Messi and Ronni are operating on another level to everyone in the best league in Europe.

Point was that he'd have won the league and EC, and been high profile in doing both.

Again, I don't think it matters that Messi and Ronnie have been better. It really does seem to only ever go to majors winners, where said player drove their team to win, rather than just being excellent themselves. If you're ruling out Pirlo, then it's safely Ronaldo's.

Blatter wrote: »

At the end of the day it'll be a bunch of international coaches (and captains I think) that will be asked to vote and some will let the Euros/trophies be a large factor in their decision. But I'm willing to bet that a fair few of them will also say ''Best player in the world? Sorry, but I can't not say Messi''

It's coaches, captains and the press. This may change it from previous years alright, where it used to be only press until 2010.

kryogen

I think they tend to vote, in the main, about who has made the biggest impact to a club/national teams success, so while Messi is the best player in the world, plenty will still vote for Ronaldo because he has led Madrid to a league title while having a phenomenal season and Portugal did make it to the semi's, Ronaldo had a fantastic season that ended with a winners medal, Messi had a fantastic season that ended empty handed.

That is why I think he is out in front, I may be wrong, but I suspect not.

They make odd decisions anyway, the WPOTY and EPOTY are different sometimes even if the WPOTY plays in Europe

HazDanz

Rekop dog wrote: »

Unbeaten means feck all, their points total wasn't special at all, drew lots of games, nearest rivals were completely ravaged with injuries too. He was very good this season but Messi and Ronni are operating on another level to everyone in the best league in Europe.

A new can of worms is opened in Mr Pirlo's appreciation thread

Rekop dog

HazDanz wrote: »

Rekop dog wrote: »

Unbeaten means feck all, their points total wasn't special at all, drew lots of games, nearest rivals were completely ravaged with injuries too. He was very good this season but Messi and Ronni are operating on another level to everyone in the best league in Europe.

A new can of worms is opened in Mr Pirlo's appreciation thread

I meant la liga

kryogen

That was clear

klose

LOL Milan must be hopping their heads off their desks!
What a beast though giving these performances in such a tight exhausting schedule that is the euros at 33 is phenomenal! The definition of pulling the strings in midfield, would imagine hell call it a day after this would be some way to do it if they won it.
Been at this for years though surprised a thread only popped up now.

~Rebel~

kryogen wrote: »

I think they tend to vote, in the main, about who has made the biggest impact to a club/national teams success, so while Messi is the best player in the world, plenty will still vote for Ronaldo because he has led Madrid to a league title while having a phenomenal season and Portugal did make it to the semi's, Ronaldo had a fantastic season that ended with a winners medal, Messi had a fantastic season that ended empty handed.

Yeah, I think you're on the ball here, and I wouldn't even be surprised if the question they're given is phrased along those lines.

The winner's performances always contributed to something greater than themselves, pushing their team to success.

kryogen

whippedcream wrote: »

LOL Milan must be hopping their heads off their desks!
What a beast though giving these performances in such a tight exhausting schedule that is the euros at 33 is phenomenal! The definition of pulling the strings in midfield, would imagine hell call it a day after this would be some way to do it if they won it.
Been at this for years though surprised a thread only popped up now.

He needed that move though, he had not been at his best there for a while, the move has regenerated him I think.

If Milan had been prepared to give him a longer contract/better money he would probably still be there and might not be playing at this level now

~Rebel~

kryogen wrote: »

He needed that move though, he had not been at his best there for a while, the move has regenerated him I think.

If Milan had been prepared to give him a longer contract/better money he would probably still be there and might not be playing at this level now

Juve have really built a team around him too to best utilize him.

kryogen

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Juve have really built a team around him too to best utilize him.

He has got the midfield there to let him do what he does best alright, didn't seem to enjoy the system at Milan in his final months there either, Juve is a better fit for him now so as a guy who has a soft spot for Milan its a little sad, but as a fan of the man himself I am delighted to see him really enjoying his football again

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Yes, but he won the league.

Just look back through - noone wins the Ballon D'Or without winning something major.

It'll be Ronaldo or Pirlo I'm betting.

Messi won 4 titles with Barca in the past season, Ronaldo 1. I'd stake anything on Messi collecting the Ballon D'Or this year again, it's an individual award given to the best individual, who more often than not tends to be on the best team that year. Considering all he has done, both with Argentina and Barcelona, only injury will prevent him from collecting his fourth consecutive Ballon D'Or. Him not having won the league or CL matters little in this instance. I'm more than willing to agree to friendly bet for anyone convinced otherwise.

kryogen

How friendly?

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

Name your stakes.

kryogen

THFC wrote: »

Name your stakes.

What odds are you offering?

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

I'm not a bookie, just make an offer.

kryogen

THFC wrote: »

I'm not a bookie, just make an offer.

Will you give me 5/1 on anybody bar Messi?

Seaneh

kryogen wrote: »

He needed that move though, he had not been at his best there for a while, the move has regenerated him I think.

If Milan had been prepared to give him a longer contract/better money he would probably still be there and might not be playing at this level now

This, Milan didn't need him in Allegri's first season to win the league, he was injured for most of it and the season before, so Galliani made a decision not to renew his contract at the same (insanely high) terms as he already had.

Milan made him a very generous offer (about 100k p/w) for one extra year, Juve offered less but gave him two years and pretty much guarenteed him game time, Allegri wasn't willing to do that and with good reason.

I would have prefered if he stayed at Milan, I love him, but it's not hard see why he was let go when you know the injury problems he has had the previous 3 seasons and the wage demands he made to Milan.

Oat23

Poor mans Endo to be fair :cool:.

I kid.




















He is just as good as Endo.

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

(@kyro) Nay chance, pick your player and I'll give you 3/1, and PM, this has been dragged far enough OT as it is.

kryogen

Seaneh wrote: »

This, Milan didn't need him in Allegri's first season to win the league, he was injured for most of it and the season before, so Galliani made a decision not to renew his contract at the same (insanely high) terms as he already had.

Milan made him a very generous offer (about 100k p/w) for one extra year, Juve offered less but gave him two years and pretty much guarenteed him game time, Allegri wasn't willing to do that and with good reason.

I would have prefered if he stayed at Milan, I love him, but it's not hard see why he was let go when you know the injury problems he has had the previous 3 seasons and the wage demands he made to Milan.

Didn't realise Milan had offered him such a good salary, I thought it was significantly less then that for some reason, I think it was the right move at the time for both parties that he moved on. Of course looking at things now you can have regrets but at the time it was the right choice.

kryogen

@ TFHC I'll consider it and let you know, via PM obviously.

Seaneh

kryogen wrote: »

Didn't realise Milan had offered him such a good salary, I thought it was significantly less then that for some reason, I think it was the right move at the time for both parties that he moved on. Of course looking at things now you can have regrets but at the time it was the right choice.

That was signigicantly less, he was on close to 150k a week!

It wasn't the money though, Juve offered less, it was 2 years and game time Juve offered him over 1 year and no promises.

kryogen

Seaneh wrote: »

That was signigicantly less, he was on close to 150k a week!

It wasn't the money though, Juve offered less, it was 2 years and game time Juve offered him over 1 year and no promises.

Oh I know that! I just thought Milan had offered him around 70-80k a week, maybe thats what Juve offered and I got them mixed up?

Vincent Vega

Jimmy Iovine

Paddy Power never miss an advertising opportunity.

kryogen

Hate Paddypower

thebaz

I hope Italy win , for Pirlo himself - after Messi best player in world - then again Ineasta and Xavi arn't half bad , but being brilliant can be boring ;-)

kryogen

thebaz wrote: »

I hope Italy win , for Pirlo himself - after Messi best player in world - then again Ineasta and Xavi arn't half bad , but being brilliant can be boring ;-)

He simply is not the second best in the world.

I love him though

thebaz

kryogen wrote: »

He simply is not the second best in the world.

I love him though

Right now I'd say he is

kryogen

thebaz wrote: »

Right now I'd say he is

I think his performances are clouding your judgement a bit too much then.

No harm in it I suppose

MRPRO03

This kind of thread really sums up the general 'supposed' football fan, they see Pirlo play very well in this years Euros, and then say how great a player he really is, where was this thread about 7/8 years ago, cause he is practically the same player then as he is now, but only getting praise now ?

kryogen

MRPRO03 wrote: »

This kind of thread really sums up the general 'supposed' football fan, they see Pirlo play very well in this years Euros, and then say how great a player he really is, where was this thread about 7/8 years ago, cause he is practically the same player then as he is now, but only getting praise now ?

He has been praised consistently for 10 years or so now, I agree with you in part alright, it is a trend that happens alot but I guess it is human nature in a way to only talk about stuff when they are reminded of it.

Pirlo has been recongised as one of the finest playmakers for years, these threads are a relatively new thing. Only going a couple of years I think

Son Of A Vidic

MRPRO03 wrote: »

This kind of thread really sums up the general 'supposed' football fan

Who are you to judge any thread contributor, or to provide any definition on what a football fan really is?


Back on topic......

Another midfield masterclass from Pirlo against the Germans the other night. He is by far the player of the tournament for me. Quite like he was back in 2006 when Italy won the World Cup.

Seaneh

thebaz wrote: »

I hope Italy win , for Pirlo himself - after Messi best player in world - then again Ineasta and Xavi arn't half bad , but being brilliant can be boring ;-)

He's not even the best player in Italy, truth be told...