House insurance broker says no insurance without redoing roof

sarkozy

I rang a broker today. I gave particulars of the house we wish to buy. It's over 100 years old (small 3-bed terraced) and she seemed to think that since the roof has probably not been redone within 20 years, it could be a problem.

Now, our structural survey concluded the roof has probably been done within the past 30 years and is unusual in that it has relatively modern tiles and also the roof is felted. Other people have had their house insured with the roof not having been done in over 60 years!

The house is not listed, we would redo wiring and it has been recently re-plumbed.

Also, unusually, the roof on the return is a flat roof but is only 2.5 x 4.5 metres - well under 50% of total roof surface.

Should I be worried?

djimi

Did you get a second opinion from a different broker? If this one is going against the findings of the structural survey and is trying to say that the roof is not up to scratch when you have a report saying otherwise then Id definately be looking to speak to another broker...

Rightadvice

sarkozy wrote: »

I rang a broker today. I gave particulars of the house we wish to buy. It's over 100 years old (small 3-bed terraced) and she seemed to think that since the roof has probably not been redone within 20 years, it could be a problem.

Now, our structural survey concluded the roof has probably been done within the past 30 years and is unusual in that it has relatively modern tiles and also the roof is felted. Other people have had their house insured with the roof not having been done in over 60 years!

The house is not listed, we would redo wiring and it has been recently re-plumbed.

Also, unusually, the roof on the return is a flat roof but is only 2.5 x 4.5 metres - well under 50% of total roof surface.

Should I be worried?

Hi,

You should be able to get this insured if all is in order with the structural survey. Most insurance comapanies will ask if the property has been re-roofed, re-plumbed & re-wired in the last 20-30 years.

I used Allianz a few years back for a property over 100 years old, you have to complete a questionaiire & you should prob send back copy of survey.

Otherwise are you taking a mortgage on the property? Does the mortgage lender off home insurance?

Regards,

Robert

sarkozy

Rightadvice wrote: »

Hi,

You should be able to get this insured if all is in order with the structural survey. Most insurance comapanies will ask if the property has been re-roofed, re-plumbed & re-wired in the last 20-30 years.

I used Allianz a few years back for a property over 100 years old, you have to complete a questionaiire & you should prob send back copy of survey.

Otherwise are you taking a mortgage on the property? Does the mortgage lender off home insurance?

Regards,

Robert

Hi, you're right about Allianz. The broker returned to say they were happy with the roof issue and quoted a price. However, the broker seemed insistent that they would not insure if the electrics have not been done within the last 20 years. The surveyor wrote that the electrical system is 'relatively recent' and servicable. Before we sign contracts, I'm insistent on knowing we can actually insure the place as house insurance/fire cover is one of the Condition Precedents for the mortgage. What do you think?

engineermike

sarkozy wrote: »

Hi, you're right about Allianz. The broker returned to say they were happy with the roof issue and quoted a price. However, the broker seemed insistent that they would not insure if the electrics have not been done within the last 20 years. The surveyor wrote that the electrical system is 'relatively recent' and servicable. Before we sign contracts, I'm insistent on knowing we can actually insure the place as house insurance/fire cover is one of the Condition Precedents for the mortgage. What do you think?

HI
A number of insurer's insist on certain periods of maintenance and a record of same.
I would not get too worried about it (from the sounds of things ) - if your engineer said its a recent install, then its likely to be a termination board ( as opposed to an older fuse board ) - Wiring will be up to code / and compliant with RCD / MCD devices protecting the circuits.

However for your protection - your family and future claims ( if any, hopefully not) - have an ETCI (ElectroTechnical Council of Ireland) registered contractor perform a periodical system check ( or periodical as their known in the industry ) - and get it in writing as to the current condition of the system in situ. - this leaves no recourse for your insurer or their underwriter should an event occur down the line ( and providing you maintain as normal ).
Also make sure the Electrical contractor performing the check is certified / insured and reputable.
Also it goes with out saying, if the electrician notes any defects - the onus is on you to make good on said defects.
Mike F

sarkozy

engineermike wrote: »

HI
A number of insurer's insist on certain periods of maintenance and a record of same.
I would not get too worried about it (from the sounds of things ) - if your engineer said its a recent install, then its likely to be a termination board ( as opposed to an older fuse board ) - Wiring will be up to code / and compliant with RCD / MCD devices protecting the circuits.

However for your protection - your family and future claims ( if any, hopefully not) - have an ETCI (ElectroTechnical Council of Ireland) registered contractor perform a periodical system check ( or periodical as their known in the industry ) - and get it in writing as to the current condition of the system in situ. - this leaves no recourse for your insurer or their underwriter should an event occur down the line ( and providing you maintain as normal ).
Also make sure the Electrical contractor performing the check is certified / insured and reputable.
Also it goes with out saying, if the electrician notes any defects - the onus is on you to make good on said defects.
Mike F

The house is old and it's a fuseboard installed, not a modern board with trip switches. However, shortly after moving in or immediately after purchase (and living with the parents until done), we intend to completely re-wire the house as the electrical system is totally inadequate. However, the plumbing system (water heater, boiler) were redone within the past 15 years.

What is yours or anyone else's experience of this scenario and what to do?

engineermike

Hi,
What you've proposed there seems like a satisfactory resolution, have the wiring & modern termination board put in to bring it up to code asap.
- If your not occupying the property - normal loads won't be applied to the old wiring / circuits & fuses.
- I'd be up front with your insurer that this is the schedule : Complete purchase, pay your premium to engage cover, not occupy property - (turn off water supply and carry out any maintainability required as per survey, roof etc. ) , have works carried out as quoted for by registered (insured) electrical contractors, They certify the job.
Also while they are rewiring - have them drop in some 1st fix for alarm cables - doesn't mean you have to install alarm immediately but cost of the 1st fix (running alarm cable) is minimal - at least to the ground floor doors and windows and a PIR on the upper floor. Insurers like to hear that the property will be secured etc.
Full disclosure is the name of the game in the insurance industry - there are a few insurers that will give cover for flat roof and the like - however its a ask no questions / higher cost cover & getting paid when you go to make a claim is horrendously difficult.
I'd get a broker to ensure your getting good cover to meet you requirements & budget. And shop around and put the request on a couple of brokers desks - let them figure out the policies and ensure adequate cover.

Give me a P/m if you want electrical contractors details - I've a good panel of contractors nationwide (I use for insurance claim repairs funny enough !)
Regards,
Mike F

sarkozy

engineermike wrote: »

Hi,
What you've proposed there seems like a satisfactory resolution, have the wiring & modern termination board put in to bring it up to code asap.
- If your not occupying the property - normal loads won't be applied to the old wiring / circuits & fuses.
- I'd be up front with your insurer that this is the schedule : Complete purchase, pay your premium to engage cover, not occupy property - (turn off water supply and carry out any maintainability required as per survey, roof etc. ) , have works carried out as quoted for by registered (insured) electrical contractors, They certify the job.
Also while they are rewiring - have them drop in some 1st fix for alarm cables - doesn't mean you have to install alarm immediately but cost of the 1st fix (running alarm cable) is minimal - at least to the ground floor doors and windows and a PIR on the upper floor. Insurers like to hear that the property will be secured etc.
Full disclosure is the name of the game in the insurance industry - there are a few insurers that will give cover for flat roof and the like - however its a ask no questions / higher cost cover & getting paid when you go to make a claim is horrendously difficult.
I'd get a broker to ensure your getting good cover to meet you requirements & budget. And shop around and put the request on a couple of brokers desks - let them figure out the policies and ensure adequate cover.

Give me a P/m if you want electrical contractors details - I've a good panel of contractors nationwide (I use for insurance claim repairs funny enough !)
Regards,
Mike F

Thanks. I'll get on to another broker or two. There is already an alarm installed, so things seem fine there.

sarkozy

The update is I got on to another broker through a family contact, and was quoted a price from Zurich. It's not the cheapest, but they're OK with the situation. But, they stipulated that we couldn't make any structural changes to the house. Specifically he said, we could only do plastering, painting, floor sanding, etc.

I put it back to the broker to check out whether they would change their minds on this and described the modest additions/changes we would want to make to the house (attic conversion, relatively small glass room extension, possibly knocking an ope between two rooms and installing a double-door and converting a rear window into a door, replace aluminium windows with sash windows).

IMO, it would not be a good use of our money to rewire and replumb now (we need to install some more radiators) only to take that all up in time to come.

So, my question is now a general one ...

How have people approached buying an older house and renovating it vis-a-vis insurance, works to be done, etc?

I'm really in the dark about this.